IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #23

[Pedrosmom]

JR would have to be the stupidest person alive to agree to that which is why I have trouble with him lying to cover for someone else. For him to lie about seeing Lauren last I feel like he would have to be literally scared for his life and that starts getting into movie dramatics for me.

I don't think he is.

 

[imkeylime]

The only continuing issue I have with that is just why would he go to JR's and somehow be able to pressure him into lying for both of them? Like, what would the leverage be? But, is it possible she started to OD and he picked her up and took her to JR's for some reason? Maybe JR is somehow seen as more experienced? Then, at JR's maybe she pukes or they think she dies and both end up panicking and somehow getting rid of the body together?

I guess the only real leverage would be if JR was her supplier and MB knew it. OTOH, maybe it's not that complicated ... maybe she passed out and he carried her to JRs, like you suggest, if he panicked or perhaps had his own hands full with CR? I guess it would depend on CR and LS' conditions ... and how they got that way.

 

[cspring]

I just sat straight up in my bed when i heard the news commercial say a body was found in a martinsville pond. My heart just about stopped in my chest. It was a man tho-God rest his soul.
Why cant we find Lauren????
Im still going with the thought that with everyone being back in town we WILL find out what happened. I refuse to believe that this beautiful girl didnt have real true friends that want answers....and they are prob the ones that will get them.

 

[phantomthought]

I am not sure what your quoting means-I will respond with what I think you are trying to say? If I am wrong I apologize in advance!

By helping, I don't think anyone means LS was carrying CR. It is possible he was able to propel his body forward, but not very efficiently and she just helped guide him home before entering where he would feel more comfortable collapsing in bed. I have helped my drunk boyfriend, my drunk brother, and, at times, low blood sugared brother before when they were having issues walking. I am 5'3 and not fat while they are 5'10 and muscular and 6'3 and muscular. It isn't absolutely unfathomable that she could have given up a shoulder to help him walk a bit especially since CR looks like a skinny dude to me.

Now, is that what happened? I am doubting it more and more every day. Can I say 100% it didn't happen? Nope. And if it did happen MB's story could stand.

Never a need to apologize.Actually my quote was in response to CR taking a lie detector test.Maybe you read it before I added the last line and it was unclear,

 

[Darcyline]

Phantomthought-I did, sorry! AH well, I will leave what I said up since people do seem to be questioning that part including her parents, ha ha.

 

[imkeylime]

JR would have to be the stupidest person alive to agree to that which is why I have trouble with him lying to cover for someone else. For him to lie about seeing Lauren last I feel like he would have to be literally scared for his life and that starts getting into movie dramatics for me.

OTOH, MB could also be lying about seeing her last if she never made it out of the alley. I'm assuming she made it to CR and MB's, and while CR's attorney says three witnesses saw her afterward, do we know who those three are? IDK ... it seems like they're all trying to protect either themselves, each other, or something they know? I guess that does sound dramatic, but something seems really off to me.

 

[bloom54]

And the gloves come off...

no wonder it was so quiet this summer... they were in "training" for the big fight...

my bet is they have a series of moves designed to irk the perp into doing/saying something stupid... it's already started with JR.

 

[Darcyline]

I am assuming the three witnesses were MB, JR, and JR's visitor. Or, at least that is what the attorney would like us to think.

 

[bloom54]

I think I'd have been really drilling my kid about this over the summer.....probably to the point where he'd have admitted to something he didn't even do, just to shut me up. :floorlaugh:

but... you wouldn't be drilling if you didn't want to know... and my bet is they just don't want to know... it's easier -- more comfortable -- that way

 

[Darcyline]

no wonder it was so quiet this summer... they were in "training" for the big fight...

my bet is they have a series of moves designed to irk the perp into doing/saying something stupid... it's already started with JR.

I am not sure I agree it is the best policy, but the other half of me sort of enjoyed seeing JR squirm a little. I am pretty ok with any method though if it leads to Lauren being found and that includes methods that my daddy would want to do, but would get arrested for

 

[Pedrosmom]

but... you wouldn't be drilling if you didn't want to know... and my bet is they just don't want to know... it's easier -- more comfortable -- that way

Taking the Range Rover away would be a start. That would cause a fit.

 

[Darcyline]

I have no doubts that all parents were easily convinced of their little baby darlings' innocence. That, or they have twisted it to make their baby angels' the victims in the situation.

I may be wrong and I will apologize if I am, but it is VERY hard to find a parent who will actually think their kid is guilty of murder or disposing of a body that died in his or her presence. Especially from what I have seen of these boys and their nice designer clothing and nice vehicles. These aren't hardened criminal type families.

 

[Esther]

Wouldn't JR have to be the stupidest person on earth to agree to "admit" he's the last person to have seen Lauren alive, though? There is one friend on earth that I'd consider doing something like that for, and I don't have the impression that MB and JR are so close that one would take a bullet for the other.

I tried to post (for the 1st time) yesterday, but it didn't work. Anyway, yes, it is altogether possible that JR may be the stupidest person on earth. One of the things I wanted to mention yesterday, was that JR's major, SPEA, is known to be the "fall-back" major for those who didn't get into the Business school. (I spent 3 years at IU some 25 years ago - left b/c the party scene became too much, and identify strongly with LS, and knew very well the types that LS hung around with.) Also, I'd like to add, that back in the day, Martinsville had the reputation as being the (state or natl'?) headquarters for the KKK, which would have made it a strange place for these former AEPis to hang around (the 6/3 late night "ping"), but the burned barn owner's name (Sam Cramer) is Jewish-sounding, and it's possible these kids had a connection to him.

Other random thoughts: to the person who thinks these kids' parents are worried that college is expensive - I'd like to remind you that (according to WS accounts), JR is tooling around town in a Range Rover. His parents appear hardly hurting for money. It's possible he really is just that dumb or delusional, if he thinks he can wish out loud that he speaks privately with the Spierers, and it wouldn't get checked out. I suspect that he won't be able to "protect" his case much longer. He and these other POIs (or, more accurately, POSs) will have a tough time adjusting to a life of non-partying, and the lies will overtake a miserable existence. They'll crack soon. Good on the Spierers for choosing to put the squeeze on them, at this time!

 

[amoncrieff]

Or it is possible that they are on board with the xanax/alcohol/cocaine thing. It's just that none of the boys gave that information and it is all from rumors. Maybe challenging CR about the amnesia is their way of provoking a little more truth out of the boys about what was really going on that night. The amnesia story does sound pretty ridiculous without the substance explanation...

All good points.

However, I find nothing "ridiculous" about CR's assertion of memory loss if he was concussed (by a punch).

Retrograde and anterograde amnesia are typical symptoms of concussions. Extent & duration depend on several factors, which include but are not limited to severity of initial injury, age (15-24 is considered a high risk group), and alcohol.

Though subsidence can be quick in alert patients, symptoms, including amnesia, may last for days, weeks, or "even longer."

Still, I really feel for the Spierers. Recent comments suggest they are not privy to undisclosed evidence and are, understandably, exponentially frustrated.

JR's outrageous lie regarding alleged "private" talks with the Spierers is, to me, an open invitation to more BPD pressure.

OTOH, I don't see the endgame with CR. MB already corroborated CR's version of events, including LS's 2nd arrival at 5 North and LS' departure from CR/MB's apartment. CR & MB also volunteered DNA samples to investigators unlike, as far as we know, JW or JR.

I understand & concur with the Spierers' general POV re POI noncooperation, but do the Spierers actually see a conspiracy between MB, CR and JR?

Because I don't. MB & CR, based on known whereabouts & DNA cooperation alone, appear exculpatory.

JW, perhaps not as clean nor clear as originally thought, isn't quite the shadow JR is.

JR, IMO, remains a ticking bomb.

 

[sv614]

i tried to post (for the 1st time) yesterday, but it didn't work. Anyway, yes, it is altogether possible that jr may be the stupidest person on earth. One of the things i wanted to mention yesterday, was that jr's major, spea, is known to be the "fall-back" major for those who didn't get into the business school. (i spent 3 years at iu some 25 years ago - left b/c the party scene became too much, and identify strongly with ls, and knew very well the types that ls hung around with.) also, i'd like to add, that back in the day, martinsville had the reputation as being the (state or natl'?) headquarters for the kkk, which would have made it a strange place for these former aepis to hang around (the 6/3 late night "ping"), but the burned barn owner's name (sam cramer) is jewish-sounding, and it's possible these kids had a connection to him.

Other random thoughts: To the person who thinks these kids' parents are worried that college is expensive - i'd like to remind you that (according to ws accounts), jr is tooling around town in a range rover. His parents appear hardly hurting for money. It's possible he really is just that dumb or delusional, if he thinks he can wish out loud that he speaks privately with the spierers, and it wouldn't get checked out. I suspect that he won't be able to "protect" his case much longer. He and these other pois (or, more accurately, poss) will have a tough time adjusting to a life of non-partying, and the lies will overtake a miserable existence. They'll crack soon. Good on the spierers for choosing to put the squeeze on them, at this time!

welcome! Welcome! Welcome! And well said!

 

[JeannieC]

I have no doubts that all parents were easily convinced of their little baby darlings' innocence. That, or they have twisted it to make their baby angels' the victims in the situation.

I may be wrong and I will apologize if I am, but it is VERY hard to find a parent who will actually think their kid is guilty of murder or disposing of a body that died in his or her presence. Especially from what I have seen of these boys and their nice designer clothing and nice vehicles. These aren't hardened criminal type families.

I think a mother of any status will believe their child, protect their child, and never admit their child could be involved in the death of another person whether an accident or especially murder and of course their child is always framed by LE.

 

[elmorejames]

I'd like to know three simple things...


1) How come in all this time there hasn't been a solid visual reference to MB in all of this.. If I was in Disney World and saw any of theses faces, I'd know who they were from following this case, but MB not a chance..

2) The white truck they dismissed early, around the same time they mentioned they searched the landfill, yeah ummmmm that landfill. I wonder if they went back to driver to see if maybe the "dogs" could pick up a scent. I wonder if the even still has the truck??? Nahmean.

3) "Walker" suggests earlier that in would take a professional or organized crime member to pull of something like that... Even a cop who knows the maps of security cameras in his backyard or all of Bloomington, let alone a college kid would be able to pull of some ninja like performance and make a 20 year old girl just straight up disappear and not show up on camera...

We know LE is withholding information to protect the strength of their case. We know they need/want to find love. What we don't know is why immunity hasn't been offered for any drug involvement. Are there possible civil manslaughter suits to come?

 

[Darcyline]

Good question about MB-have we seen him? I swear we did once, but since no one really suspects him regularly it was lost. His facebook page maybe??

I don't think a professional or criminal mastermind was needed. What frustrates me WITHOUT END is the fact that where she disappeared there was a lot less camera coverage. A few locals have said it would be very possible for JR/CR/MB or someone from that complex to drive out and not be caught by a camera. That isn't professionalism or ninja skills-it is dumb, stupid frustrating luck.

 

[Pedrosmom]

Good question about MB-have we seen him? I swear we did once, but since no one really suspects him regularly it was lost. His facebook page maybe??

I don't think a professional or criminal mastermind was needed. What frustrates me WITHOUT END is the fact that where she disappeared there was a lot less camera coverage. A few locals have said it would be very possible for JR/CR/MB or someone from that complex to drive out and not be caught by a camera. That isn't professionalism or ninja skills-it is dumb, stupid frustrating luck.

That's a good question. I only see 5 North from the gravel lot and there are no cars back there. Does that mean there is no parking in the gravel lot or it just happened to be empty at the time the photo was taken? I am assuming that the parking for 5 North is in front of the building and the rear faces the gravel lot. Are we sure that the front of the building has no cameras? What is adjacent to 5 North on the front? Are there cameras there? Check me if I'm wrong but it appears there are 2 entrances to 5 North and LS/CR were headed toward the back entrance. If someone were to leave in a car that night, would it be possible to leave unnoticed by any camera on the front side of the townhomes? I don't see any pics from the front side of 5 North, unless I am missing something. If there are no cameras, easily they could have taken her out the front. That is not to say I believe that is the way she left, just wondering if that was covered.

 

[elmorejames]

No Ninjas.. And the only luck these boys have had was post June 3rd. There's really only one thing that makes something like this with all the uniqueness and people involved that makes this a true version of CLUE. With respects to family and friends of LS, I've thought for sometime that there has been too many mistakes/fumbles/holes/ that LE isn't informing the public of. That one thing is $$$. I think the money chain involved in this goes something like that in terms of family net worth and I COULD BE COMPLETELY WRONG. 1 be the least 4 being the most.

1. CR
2. JR
3. ZO
4. DB (alleged house guest of JR)

Why haven't we heard anything about a lawyer representing ZO if he's been labeled a POI. Has LE officially labeled him a POI.

In terms of DB being rumored to be there and allegedly self-implicating himself in Bloomington the morning of June 3rd, how come we haven't heard a statement from him to clear his families name, or a lawyer clearing the family name.

There's some serious hush money being thrown around to protect the integrity of family names.

And what/who is keeping JR so hush?