IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 #27

[bx2]

I am talking about the scenario about her leaving JR's and meeting up with this acquaintance. How would this acquaintance know when she was going to leave JR's?

They wouldn't have to know when she was going to leave if a crime wasn't premeditated. She could have run into anyone along the way and taken the party elsewhere.

 

[jjenny]

They wouldn't have to know when she was going to leave if a crime wasn't premeditated. She could have run into anyone along the way and taken the party elsewhere.

Well if she could have run into anyone why would it be more likely for her run into an acquaintance as opposed to a stranger? If she was in condition as described, it would not take much for anyone to pick her up.

 

[Jacobite]

I am talking about the scenario about her leaving JR's and meeting up with this acquaintance. How would this acquaintance know when she was going to leave JR's?

Jenny, I do not know where Lauren went missing. I do know though where the dogs lost her scent. It was not at 5 N. It was closer to 10th and College Village. So, now my question would be about the dog's training. Different dogs are used for different kinds of tracking. Your scent is only in the air for a few days. A dog trained for air scent may have been used too late to give the right answer.
As we travel particles of skin fall from our bodies and fall to the ground. There are dogs that can detect these particles and find your path one month later.
If the dog was such a tracking dog? I'd have to say Lauren was not on College Avenue and did not go missing at 5 N. Need to know about the dog before I can say where she went missing.

 

[jjenny]

I think people vastly overestimate what dogs can or can not do.
Obviously she didn't go up into the air at the place these dogs supposedly lost the track of her.

 

[bx2]

Well if she could have run into anyone why would it be more likely for her run into an acquaintance as opposed to a stranger? If she was in condition as described, it would not take much for anyone to pick her up.

I don't think its more likely, just that its a scenario different then random abduction if she went off with someone willingly.

I think people vastly overestimate what dogs can or can not do.
Obviously she didn't go up into the air at the place these dogs supposedly lost the track of her.

Yeah, and not to mention that all "dog losing scent of her at place X" is complete unsubstantiated rumor.

 

[Fashionista_Gal]

I am talking about the scenario about her leaving JR's and meeting up with this acquaintance. How would this acquaintance know when she was going to leave JR's?

I have a hard time believing she left to go meet someone she knew. I guess anything is possible, but unless she had already established a meeting time and location with someone, how would they know when and where to go meet if she did not have her phone to contact that person? It seems like she was so wasted and/or drugged that I would almost think she wouldn't even have remembered to go meet someone!

 

[Jacobite]

I think people vastly overestimate what dogs can or can not do.
Obviously she didn't go up into the air at the place these dogs supposedly lost the track of her.

No, dogs are smarter than people. My dog has never made a mess this big. And, maybe they needed to send for another dog.

 

[Jacobite]

I have a hard time believing she left to go meet someone she knew. I guess anything is possible, but unless she had already established a meeting time and location with someone, how would they know when and where to go meet if she did not have her phone to contact that person? It seems like she was so wasted and/or drugged that I would almost think she wouldn't even have remembered to go meet someone!

I doubt she planned to meet anyone else. Someone may have had plans for her though.

 

[Jacobite]

I don't think its more likely, just that its a scenario different then random abduction if she went off with someone willingly.



Yeah, and not to mention that all "dog losing scent of her at place X" is complete unsubstantiated rumor.

I don't consider it a rumor since I got the information from the girl's father and from a lawyer in Bloomington, both of whom were told the same location from the Bloomington Police. I don't think BPD lied to them. So, I believe I do know.
<modsnip> The info may be worthless? We'll see.

 

[AbbeyR]

Jenny, I do not know where Lauren went missing. I do know though where the dogs lost her scent. It was not at 5 N. It was closer to 10th and College Village.

I don't really understand what that would mean... especially if she walked by both places that night. (I don't really know how the dogs work). What would that imply?

We did hear stories about cadaver dogs hitting behind 5 N at one point, but I don't think the source was very reliable.

 

[AbbeyR]

I've wondered about that as well, although I'm not sure of the implications. ZO's reference to "pure as NY snow" could have been prompted by Bette Davis Eyes (from which the line is taken) being used in the movie Take Me Home Tonight during the introduction of the beautiful blonde who captures the male lead's heart. Take Me Home Tonight played in Bloomington in mid-March last year, recently enough for ZO to make the association with LS if that's how he felt. Again, even if that's the case, what does it mean?

ZO wasn't the only one with that status update, and I believe he had a serious girlfriend at the time. I don't think the reference had anything to do with Lauren. JMO.

 

[AbbeyR]

Side note: An article someone posted claimed a homeless man heard a woman scream (too lazy to go back and quote it)...Around the time Lauren was last seen....what was THAT about?!? I don't think that is something someone would lie about, though maybe it wasn't her.

I think the source was Chickjustin and IIRC, this bit of info came wrapped up in some kind of conspiracy theory about the BPD, so it wasn't a very credible story (In my opinion, at least)

 

[Jacobite]

I don't really understand what that would mean... especially if she walked by both places that night. (I don't really know how the dogs work). What would that imply?

We did hear stories about cadaver dogs hitting behind 5 N at one point, but I don't think the source was very reliable.

I really don't want to believe what this likely means. Hopefully, they sent for another dog, the kind that tracks skin particles, a dog that can follow your trail a month later. Hopefully, there's another dog report that tells the truth that I'm not aware of. Let's hope they did this! They could have. They should have done this.

 

[imkeylime]

I've wondered about that as well, although I'm not sure of the implications. ZO's reference to "pure as NY snow" could have been prompted by Bette Davis Eyes (from which the line is taken) being used in the movie Take Me Home Tonight during the introduction of the beautiful blonde who captures the male lead's heart. Take Me Home Tonight played in Bloomington in mid-March last year, recently enough for ZO to make the association with LS if that's how he felt. Again, even if that's the case, what does it mean?

I'm not sure if he meant anything by the "pure of NY snow" reference or anything about the movie. I've always thought ZO would have known the cover of "Bette Davis Eyes" that Brandon Flowers (lead singer of The Killers) did.

IDK much about ZO or how well he knew LS, even ... I was just grasping.

 

[midwestgirl]

Well, I certainly would not call him a friend. At least not in how I would define friend. And, Lauren's father told me he does not think it could be a stranger.

So basically...you think after Lauren left the last apartment she went to, was walking home, (or wanted to) and a certain "friend" (I'm presuming you are referring to someone she was with earlier) either met her at the door or followed her then raped, and killed her? because this person knew Lauren had a boyfriend, and he was jealous? And he's kept everyone else in the dark about it?

Just trying to get on the same page here...

 

[jjenny]

I don't think its more likely, just that its a scenario different then random abduction if she went off with someone willingly.



Yeah, and not to mention that all "dog losing scent of her at place X" is complete unsubstantiated rumor.

The condition she was described in (falling down, CR having to carry her) she could have gone with anyone "willingly" because she didn't appear to be in the control of her facilities. But since her phone was gone, and assuming she left JR, I think stranger abduction becomes much more likely than her meeting someone she knew, since that someone had no way of knowing when she was going to leave JR's.

 

[imkeylime]

Have not followed this case too closely despite being local. But I just came home from running my daughter to work, and heard the IU President on the radio discussing the case as the anniversary approaches.

I'm DISGUSTED that all he talked about was security cameras and the IU police force. I understand political correctness and all, but where was the discussion about underage drinking and it's contribution to this mess? The pervasive culture of 'let's get high'?

And yes, I have kids in this age group.

I know. It's so pervasive, on so many campuses. My son just finished his freshman year, and he said there was an ambulance on his campus almost every weekend because someone partied too hard. That's a lot of partying. And he goes to what I thought WASN'T a party school.

I don't blame LS for anything that happened that night. I never, ever would. But I do worry about girls walking alone, in any circumstance. And I worry about the partying, for both females and males. IMO, education has to start at the HS level, though. Because the culture starts there. JMO.

 

[RR0004]

In no way did I intend to blame the victim - only to point out that I felt the focus of his remarks was off-base. However, the question must be asked - were she not impaired, would we be discussing her case on Websleuths?

We would absolutely have been discussing it...or at least I would have.

 

[bx2]

The condition she was described in (falling down, CR having to carry her) she could have gone with anyone "willingly" because she didn't appear to be in the control of her facilities. But since her phone was gone, and assuming she left JR, I think stranger abduction becomes much more likely than her meeting someone she knew, since that someone had no way of knowing when she was going to leave JR's.

I'm probably not doing a very good job of painting the scene of this area. It is upwards of 2000 19-23 year olds' living spaces in the span of 3 blocks. When I say that it could be likely that she ran into an acquaintance, what I mean is that there are generally a fair amount of people that travel along this stretch both after grabbing food post-bar close or bringing parties back to their place post-bar close or returning home post-partying. Albeit it was summer and close to 430a (and no one that has claimed to see her) so clearly far less than the typical fall night.

It wouldn't strike me as unusual if she came across someone or a group of someones that were familiar and decided to walk with them to their car, apartment, friend's place is all I meant. It would strike me as very very unusual if someone decided that they would like to prey on an unsuspecting victim on arguably the busiest street downtown.

 

[Jupiter812]

Well if she could have run into anyone why would it be more likely for her run into an acquaintance as opposed to a stranger? If she was in condition as described, it would not take much for anyone to pick her up.

Because it's mostly a community of students and student-age kids. They live close together and see each other in passing, at parties, at Kilorys, etc.