IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #7

[phantomthought]

Fairly new here too, but have read every thread I hope so as to not waste anyone's time. Motive seems to be implied here...LS meets new boy (CR) couple week ago, now LS is hanging out with CR and friends, (JR & MB), none of which are in the same circle of friends as boyfriend. LS goes not, can't be contacted, is sooo intoxicated forgets shoes and phones and is with this new fiend from 12:30 AM to 2:51, often alone and in back alleys. I agree with bessie that in todays 'texting' world, informaiton is much more real time....that fact that JW friends are 'waiting' at Smallwood and altercation, someone knew or strongly suspected there was something going on, as stated, "inappropriate attention" on the elevator. LS was likely allowing this attention by bringing CR into Smallwood. JMO!

Who were the friends? Why were they at Smallwood? Who let them in? Where there any other witnesses?

The one wildcard in this '2 sided' motive, is that roomate HT was friends with CR's friends (introduced LS & CR at Indy 500) and was at JR's prior to LS leaving for bar, but yet seems to be friends (gave keys to) with JW and defends him and his relationship with LS?

Very possible with the heart condition, alcohol and other activities, there may have been an accident, and someone (maybe driving white truck) to come and help dispose.

Eitherway, it's apparent that LE and Mom are on the right track trying to get the friends and other to talk, cause some knows more than they are leading on, most likely to protect themslves or someone close.

Correct me if I am wrong but my understanding is HT was not at JR prior to LS going to the bar with CR.The last time she saw LS was when she left smallwood to go to JR.Also I do not really understand if you are saying HT introduced LS to CR my understanding is JR introduced LS and HT to CR at the 500 and both HT and LS knew JR. Gee can I use more two letter acronyms in one sentence.

 

[ingra1327]

The keys....I was looking for MSM reports I thought I read from the person/student who found them and placed them on the rail. Can anyone help me out? I was just thinking that perhaps Lauren lost them in someones apartment and when they were found later they were then placed in the alley. Also maybe they needed an explanation for why their finger prints were on those keys.

This article talks about the student who found the keys.

http://www.lohud.com/article/201106...ppearance-DNA-taken-from-Rossman-his-roommate

Indiana University student AJ Amin, 19, told The Journal News on Friday that he saw a small purple pouch with a gold key shortly before 3 a.m. that morning on the sidewalk near that building. He said he left it there and that a friend of his put it on a railing when he saw it there a few hours later.

"I didn't know they were hers," said Amin, who had not yet given his account to police.

 

[cluciano63]

It seems like Lauren's roommate has had a lot to say, considering she says she was not with Lauren for most of the night. Hard to tell if she is just trying to help or muddy the waters...am hoping for the first option. But clearly Lauren's parents are feeling some resistance or lack of cooperation from someplace.

 

[nickel]

According to Tony Gatto this supposed witness was shown a line up, presumably of POIs and didn't recognize anyone. That should rule JR out as a possible man that supposed witness allegedly saw Lauren with.

I thought it was photos of a few of the POIs? And didn't JR skip town pretty quickly after the disappearance? If so, he probably wasn't available for the lineup.

 

[jjenny]

I thought it was photos of a few of the POIs? And didn't JR skip town pretty quickly after the disappearance? If so, he probably wasn't available for the lineup.

It was a photo line up. JR wouldn't have to be present in person.

 

[VeryVeritas]

This case is maddening. We can all agree that her disappearance was not planned in advance. So, how the heck do the drunk/high chucklehead POIs manage to dump the body without leaving enough evidence to make an arrest? This seems like an important question. Did the mysterious truck driver help? I'm frustrated.

This has long seemed a possibility that to maintain an alibi, for example if something happened to LS in the apts, that someone else may have been contacted to help. Perhaps the truck, perhaps another vehicle.

The 4:15 call might have been LS, or it might have been staged.

MB was studying and by all accounts was not drunk or high. We don't know the status of JR at all.

 

[coltsgal]

I wish LS just decided to stay home that night.

 

[WideOpen]

Thanks Ingra!

Indiana University student AJ Amin, 19, told The Journal News on Friday that he saw a small purple pouch with a gold key shortly before 3 a.m. that morning on the sidewalk near that building. He said he left it there and that a friend of his put it on a railing when he saw it there a few hours later.

Now who is this friend? I can't put my finger on it but something about the keys bothers me.

http://www.lohud.com/article/2011061...n-his-roommate

 

[phantomthought]

I work in the heart of the government district for a fairly large city. While both walking around at lunch today, and driving home from work yesterday, I passed a few City service trucks and a utility truck for the utility company that services the greater metropolitan area.

I noticed that several of these City service/utility trucks were white Chevy Colorados! The City trucks had no writing on the side, but rather the City's logo on the back, a City license plate and a "How Am I Driving?" sticker on the back. The utility truck had its logo and its company name on the side.

I just thought this was interesting that this particular car and color seems to be a favored service truck.

The problem I have with that is the police said this truck has custom rims on it.That is not something big company's or city government's have on their trucks.IMO this truck is personally owned by an individual or very small company.

 

[ingra1327]

I thought it was photos of a few of the POIs? And didn't JR skip town pretty quickly after the disappearance? If so, he probably wasn't available for the lineup.

The article says she saw 6 or 7 pictures. It does seem that JR would have been one of them, though, since he is allegedly the last person to see her.

Young adults are not known for their ability to plan ahead and rationally weigh out the consequences of their behavior.
It seems like the only way that JR could have pulled off something as sinister as hiding a body would be if he had help from someone from outside of the area that wouldn't be known by the other players, and that person immediately took Lauren far away.
I think this is also the one reason I can't rule out a stranger abduction.

 

[jabberwocky]

Does anyone know that link to the website that has many of the cams in Bloomington available to view?

There is this one-

http://www.bloomingtonsecuritycameras.com/map.html

 

[RR0004]

This comment I am going to make is just based on MY relationships in the past, and current, so please just take it for that.

Had I of had plans with anyone, I usually make plans up to reservations, places, times, because I am diligent as a person.... if I didn't show up... someone, especially my boyfriend/spouse/best friend/roommate would be making calls 2 hours after I hadn't responded.
(My old roommate from college DID in fact call police when I didn't come home at an arrived time via previous college era. Huge ordeal. Glad she did it though.)

I am not saying Lauren is the same as me, but when it's an affair of the heart, such as JW, I can't help but think he would be a little more paramount in his attempts of reaching her.

12 hours later has always concerned me. Always. That's just me though.

I am not placing blame, I have no real idea more than anyone else does. I am also in school again and I see how nonchalance everyone is in their relationships. I know they are young, I know they are "forming" so I'm not placing blame. Personally, however, I would be out on the streets at 1AM looking for my significant other. This is why the altercation on camera has stood out to me (IF TRUE).

I read that finals were not over till yesterday in Bloomington. That has even perked me more cause why would JW leave during finals week? Was there pressure from the school to "just go", or was it more of a personal choice?

So many questions here.

The Spring semester was over. Some kids hang around just to have some extra fun before coming home.
BTW...there are two summer sessions.

http://registrar.indiana.edu/scheofclass.shtml

 

[ingra1327]

Thanks Ingra!

Indiana University student AJ Amin, 19, told The Journal News on Friday that he saw a small purple pouch with a gold key shortly before 3 a.m. that morning on the sidewalk near that building. He said he left it there and that a friend of his put it on a railing when he saw it there a few hours later.

Now who is this friend? I can't put my finger on it but something about the keys bothers me.

http://www.lohud.com/article/2011061...n-his-roommate

I agree with you. If he saw the keys before 3 did he tell the friend about them later, or did his friend just randomly also see the keys and put them on the railing and then they talked about how strange it was that they both saw some keys the previous night? If they were up at 3 would they really be back out a few hours later? I couldn't find any mention of the friend's name.

 

[coltsgal]

The alley where Lauren lost her keys seems to have a few cameras. If those boys were walking before 3 and found the wallet/keys and then the friend saw them a few hours later and put them on the railing, I'm pretty sure LE would be able to verify that story.

 

[ingra1327]

I wish LS just decided to stay home that night.

I know. I keep thinking if she had only stayed home when she arrived at Smallwood after Kilroy's.

 

[VeryVeritas]

I am hung up on the alleged sighting of LS and the unidentified man at 3:38 am by the bartender who was returning home from work.

The alleged bartender's report stated, (and I paraphrase for lack of a link) that LS appeared to be 'out of it', and that her face hit the the ground, and at one point the unidentified male 'slung her over his shoulder' and said 'let me take you home'.

I am sorry to ask this, but could LS have already been deceased at this time and this mysterious male was just pretending to 'walk' her... 'carry' her, 'help' her'. (in order to get her out of there)?

This is only a theory....

wm

It's a valid theory. Why doesn't LE think this is credible?
Why would she (bartender) make this up?

The time 3:38, to me, is just barely enough time for her to have arrived at CR's, CR goes to bed, LS goes to JR's, Something goes wrong, Clean Up crew called, JR makes the 4:15 call to DR. So, I see nothing to disprove it yet at this point.

 

[SmoothOperator]

I totally find it believable that Lauren was not only visibly intoxicated at Kilroy's but that she was even heard making reference to her use of Xanax and Cocaine that very night.. This video of Kilroy's both indoor/outdoor and it has been previously mentioned that this is one of the Many videos they have of Lauren that night.. I would bet that the video corroborates her having been under the influence of Xanax, Cocaine, as well as possibly alcohol..

IMO if infact Lauren was in this state of mind, highly intoxicated on multiple substances as it certainly does seem to be the case.. Most likely where this level of intoxication and under the influence of multiple legal/illegal substances was reached was prior to her ever arriving at Kilroy's..

IMO it's most likely that the "party" is exactly what was going on in the hours leading up to Lauren going to Kilroy's.. Those same hours that roomie, HT has been so wishy washy on and giving multiple tales of the goings ons that night.. The "partying" is exactly why the stories are changing and/or don't really seem to add up or make sense.. Even contradicting her very own words from 24 hrs earlier..'IMO this is all because of the need to attempt to cover up or downplay or completely deny that this "partying" is what was truly going on during those hours..

IMO if it is true that Lauren at some point BEFORE going to Kilroy's was over at Jay's I would bet that their was either partaking in the "party" at Jay's(cocaine use) or that there would be "partying" going on later over at Jay's after hours of the bars closing..what I mean by that is that I believe there was cocaine use at Jay's.. Possibly BEFORE going to the bar, but even more certain that Lauren knew there would be "partying" going on after(if say Jay was expecting to get some coke later that evening)..

Mom's pleas IMO are 100% warranted in being directed at Lauren's "friends".. I believe there is quite likely alot being left out about what truly went down that night.. And this is pure speculation on my part but I have never since word one from roomie felt that she was being true and honest in what was being told and reported.. I have never felt comfortable with her being NOT INVOLVED AND JUST A BYSTANDER OR SECOND-TIER PLAYER IN THIS CASE!.. as I said MOO!! but my gut instincts have never felt "right" where she is concerned.. Again, I reiterate this is MOPO.. My opinion and that is what I am making these statements as.. MOO!!!

I think that Laurens parents are not keeping their heads buried in sand about what most likely risky behaviors that Lauren was taking part in that night.. I think they are fully aware and acknowledge such.. That they are facing this head on and taking it each step at a time with whatever new info or knowledge that may bring about further details of their daughters involvement in whatever that may be. I think they aren't denying or worried about reputations here.. They know things are dire and IMO could care less at this moment any negative connotations or stigma that could possibly be associated with any of these risky behaviors.. These precious and broken parents just want their daughter back.. I too feel as tho they are facing this from such a realistic point of view that they are even fully aware and therefor attempting as best as one could to even be prepared for the worst of outcomes.. That of course being that Lauren is deceased..

I pray that this momma's pleas reach the ears of those intended and for those words to prick the heart of the individuals involved.. To soften their heart.. To realize that their "friend" and her family at the VERY VERY LEAST deserve to have closure and Lauren to be buried with dignity and respect or however these parents so see fitting.. I pray that mom's words reverberate within the minds and thoughts of those involved and that they have zero peace or peace of mind and are plagued with these endless thoughts of mom's words and their friends face.. And that it drives them to do the only right thing there is to do at this point. Come clean 100% with EVERYTHING THEY KNOW AND PUT AN END TO ATLEAST THE PAIN AND ANGUISH OF THIS MOM AND DAD OF JUST NOT KNOWING!!

No rest for those who are guilty.. Zero peace of mind.. And that they find no joy whatsoever in anything they may do.. For them to be continually haunted and forced to do what is right for their "FRIEND"!

 

[JeannaT]

It's a valid theory. Why doesn't LE think this is credible?
Why would she (bartender) make this up?

The time 3:38, to me, is just barely enough time for her to have arrived at CR's, CR goes to bed, LS goes to JR's, Something goes wrong, Clean Up crew called, JR makes the 4:15 call to DR. So, I see nothing to disprove it yet at this point.

If JR didn't do something to Lauren (which this theory suggests) then he'd have no reason whatsoever to lie about Lauren calling Rohn at 4:15.

The man the witness describes isn't any one of the 10 suspects. It's kind of outside of believability that some unknown guy is carrying around Lauren's dead body and Jay is covering for him.

It doesn't work.

 

[Glaucon]

Let's try a thought experiment: You're a college guy late on a night of partying and the girl you're with suddenly dies (let's ignore cause of death for now). One or two of your friends (at most) are with you and know what happened. Somehow you decide/agree to ditch the body and never tell anyone anything. What do you do next? Here are some factors to get the experiment going ...

- One of you may be sober and able to think clearly. That guy would be able to prevent any drunk/high mistakes from the others.
- You and friends are not hardened criminals, not even close. You don't know the details of crime scene cleanup. But you do know they could take your computer so Google is a limited option.
- You're freaking out hardcore. She's DEAD man! (Which can actually make you more sober than you otherwise would be - flight or fight kicks in).
- Calling someone else for help expands the number of people who "know" and greatly increases the risk of getting caught.
- You may be involved with the drugs she was doing. You may fear getting caught with a stash.

What do you do?

 

[coltsgal]

Let's try a thought experiment: You're a college guy late on a night of partying and the girl you're with suddenly dies (let's ignore cause of death for now). One or two of your friends (at most) are with you and know what happened. Somehow you decide/agree to ditch the body and never tell anyone anything. What do you do next? Here are some factors to get the experiment going ...

- One of you may be sober and able to think clearly. That guy would be able to prevent any drunk/high mistakes from the others.
- You and friends are not hardened criminals, not even close. You don't know the details of crime scene cleanup. But you do know they could take your computer so Google is a limited option.
- You're freaking out hardcore. She's DEAD man! (Which can actually make you more sober than you otherwise would be - flight or fight kicks in).
- Calling someone else for help expands the number of people who "know" and greatly increases the risk of getting caught.
- You may be involved with the drugs she was doing. You may fear getting caught with a stash.

What do you do?

I watch Law and Order SVU regularly. Of course, I'm not naive enough to believe that everything happens in real life the way it does on Law and Order, but it does give you some insight as to how LE works.

I have seen many episodes where they offer immunity to someone if they snitch on the others. Presumably they do this to the one who appears to have the least amount of involvement, but just as much information.

If immunity or leniency is offered, I think that eventually, if there is more than one person involved, someone will crack. They will realize that telling the truth will work out for them in the long run. These people are all over 18 and could face significant jail time if they are proven to be involved and convicted of a crime.