Intruder theories only - RDI theories not allowed! *READ FIRST POST* #2

[Anti-K]

Just a reminder that SBTC is not a small foreign faction. SBTC is a “group of individuals that represent a small foreign faction.”
...

AK

 

[Anti-K]

Welcome Tovarisch.

...

AK

 

[Mama2JML]

I did not read as offensive, just peculiar phrasing when referencing a group of which one is a part.

"We are a group of individuals," has received quite a bit if scrutiny over the years, as well. This just isn't a commonly applied definition, but there is at least one other self-described "group of individuals" known as SBTC:

"Friends of Sun Behind The Cloud Publications
Supporting SBTC's aims and guiding its future...

The Friends of SBTC are a group of individuals and organisations who support SBTV aims and provide help and guidance on religious issues as well as issues of importance in publishing. They read the books prior to publication and are regularly consulted for advice."​

Bizarre. Eh, to each their own...

Source:
http://www.sunbehindthecloud.com/about.html

 

[tovarisch]

Just a reminder that SBTC is not a small foreign faction. SBTC is a “group of individuals that represent a small foreign faction.”
...

AK

That`s tells t me they might be bi-languale, you can try hard as you can , some confusion may occur, wordings will betray you, because your brain works in two languages simultaneuosly. And the main thing- yes, they`d been self-organized ( in their heads) foreign faction STBC, and yes, they were group, not one. They are consistent. Just semantics. Young students.

 

[Anti-K]

Okay. I think I understand what you’re saying.

However if english was the author’s first language, or dominant language and if he was a member i=of a small foreign faction than he would have written “we are a small foreign faction” instead of “we are a group of individuals that represent a small foreign faction.”
...

AK

 

[tovarisch]

"We are a group of individuals," has received quite a bit if scrutiny over the years, as well. This just isn't a commonly applied definition, but there is at least one other self-described "group of individuals" known as SBTC:

"Friends of Sun Behind The Cloud Publications
Supporting SBTC's aims and guiding its future...

The Friends of SBTC are a group of individuals and organisations who support SBTV aims and provide help and guidance on religious issues as well as issues of importance in publishing. They read the books prior to publication and are regularly consulted for advice."​

Bizarre. Eh, to each their own...

Source:
http://www.sunbehindthecloud.com/about.html

Interesting. Good example of bi-languale use of English.

 

[tovarisch]

Okay. I think I understand what you’re saying.

However if english was the author’s first language, or dominant language and if he was a member i=of a small foreign faction than he would have written “we are a small foreign faction” instead of “we are a group of individuals that represent a small foreign faction.”
...

AK

AK,
from dictionary,
represent (ˌrɛprɪˈzɛnt) —vb: 1. to stand as an equivalent of; correspond to

They were not bachelors of journalism. the Note is rather primitive all the way, Enflish is almost perfect nevetheless. It`s repetition of the same. In my language we call it "buttery butter", unnessesory repetition of the same.

 

[StrayKat]

Interesting view, my first impression was that the note was written by someone older, knowledgeable in business. Fat Cat, foreign faction, country, grow a brain, etc... are the words that led me to that conclusion.

 

[tovarisch]

Okay. I think I understand what you’re saying.

However if english was the author’s first language, or dominant language and if he was a member i=of a small foreign faction than he would have written “we are a small foreign faction” instead of “we are a group of individuals that represent a small foreign faction.”
...

AK

AK,
I `ve got what you mean after couple of hours ))of thinking about the word "represent". What is interesting, as a foreigner, I would use this world if discribing myself, and myself only , not as a part of something bigger. And it`s wrong in your point of view, and others, and you all might be right. They, killers should say two time "we are" : we are group of individuals and we are small foregin faction. But I don`t want to say two times I am, I want to look smart, look here:
I am tovarisch and I represent crazy housewife who seats at the screen at the night time and thinks about little american girl , killed in 1996. ( husband does not know).
Please, help me to substitute "represent" with a proper word, I could not find any and I do not want to say Iam crazy housewife, and I mean myself only. Thanks in advance.

 

[Anti-K]

You wouldn’t say “we are a group of individuals” because “we” already infers “a group.” “We” is “more than one individual” and “a group” is “more than one individual.” you would simply say “we are a group of individuals.”

If a group represents a small foreign faction, than they may be acting on behalf of the small foreign faction, with or without the small foreign faction’s knowledge and/or approval; but, the group itself would not be the small foreign faction.

A group of individuals may hire a lawyer to represent them in court. The lawyer is not part of the group, he merely represents it.
...

AK

 

[Mama2JML]

AK,
I `ve got what you mean after couple of hours ))of thinking about the word "represent". What is interesting, as a foreigner, I would use this world if discribing myself, and myself only , not as a part of something bigger. And it`s wrong in your point of view, and others, and you all might be right. They, killers should say two time "we are" : we are group of individuals and we are small foregin faction. But I don`t want to say two times I am, I want to look smart, look here:
I am tovarisch and I represent crazy housewife who seats at the screen at the night time and thinks about little american girl , killed in 1996. ( husband does not know).
Please, help me to substitute "represent" with a proper word, I could not find any and I do not want to say Iam crazy housewife, and I mean myself only. Thanks in advance.

Me too! :scared:

So, we could say, "We are a group of individuals that represent a sizable domestic faction." :giggle:

One can claim to represent any number of groups with which they find commonalities. For example, we represent women, wives, websleuthers, Americans, etc. One may define themselves by the groups to which they belong, but the groups are not nearly defined by the individual.

Does that make sense?...:waitasec:

 

[Chewy]

I think that depends on how long the person was living here as to whether they had proper use of the language. Also I know that some people that come here and want to learn the language and phrases will watch TV or Movies to gather that info so I don't know if you can make a broad statement about it, Only offer your experience.

I don't think it was well planned. I think their original plan was to take her and hold her for ransom, Something went wrong and they killed her in the house instead.

Off topic but this reminds me of a cute story. Many many years ago I was staying with a German guy and a Pakistani guy as roommates. The Pakistani guy kept trying to push the German guy to apply for a job at his job because he'd been out of work for three months and he was sick of covering his portion of the rent. So after one especially stressful conversation the German guy just went OFF on the Pakistani guy. He leaned across the table and started ranting:

"I don't care what you say anymore this is MY LIFE, go ahead with your own life and leave me alone."


Turns out he was a huge fan of Bosom Buddies in Germany and Billy Joel's My Life was the theme song.

The Pakistani guy didn't catch it but I just started giggling like a mad woman which only made him more upset. The poor guy. I still chuckle when I think about it. :floorlaugh:

 

[tovarisch]

Me too! :scared:

So, we could say, "We are a group of individuals that represent a sizable domestic faction." :giggle:

One can claim to represent any number of groups with which they find commonalities. For example, we represent women, wives, websleuthers, Americans, etc. One may define themselves by the groups to which they belong, but the groups are not nearly defined by the individual.

Does that make sense?...:waitasec:

It`s HILARIOUS, about US !!!

Thank you for explanation of semantics.

 

[tovarisch]

Off topic but this reminds me of a cute story. Many many years ago I was staying with a German guy and a Pakistani guy as roommates. The Pakistani guy kept trying to push the German guy to apply for a job at his job because he'd been out of work for three months and he was sick of covering his portion of the rent. So after one especially stressful conversation the German guy just went OFF on the Pakistani guy. He leaned across the table and started ranting:

"I don't care what you say anymore this is MY LIFE, go ahead with your own life and leave me alone."


Turns out he was a huge fan of Bosom Buddies in Germany and Billy Joel's My Life was the theme song.

The Pakistani guy didn't catch it but I just started giggling like a mad woman which only made him more upset. The poor guy. I still chuckle when I think about it. :floorlaugh:

That`s funny and that`s exaclty us, English second language people.

 

[tovarisch]

Please, people, when you`ll get enough of me, say to shut up, untill than my next post.

The sum of 118,000 could be big or small, depending on the scales we are using and the contests taking into consideration when measuring and analyzing against other things.
When it`s big :
-When president and chief officer J. Ramsey received 118,000 as annual bonus for reaching over billion dollars in gross for his company. It`s respectfully big amount for bonus, back in 1996 and now, it`s the annual income of a good engineer or other well educated professional.
-When wife P. Ramsey had no idea about this money had been on their mutual checking account for 10 months in 1996 and had spent it (together with her mother) and had not even noticed it.
-When you had to pay ransom and you had not had sufficient amount in cash on your checking account “ to withdraw “ and the credit card line had to be open by your friend, the banker.
-When a 20 y. o. student Andrew Ramsey said into the face of investigator he could pay this ransom himself……. That was huge…. Powerful declaration.

The interesting thing that when he said it, no question had been asked. How come? How come that a student, son, had more than hundred thousands of dollars in his account? And wife even had no knowledge of the bonus? Why John had not been questioned where his annual bonus went to IN DEED? Which account? I think it`s a lot of big questions had never been asked about the major subject - $118,000..

When it`s small, only in one situation
When this amount asked for ransom in exchange for precious beautiful little girl, famous in town for her beauty contests, and strongly loved daughter of a local millionaires, one of the biggest in town. Not only it was small, it was an odd in number, for real ransom.

 

[lawstudent]

Interesting discussion.

I work as a verbal tutor, and now that I look at it from this perspective, there are things about it that are indicative of someone who is not a native English speaker. There's some awkward grammar and phrasing, but not the type I usually see from native English speakers who struggle with writing. It sounds like someone who is confident that he or she sounds intelligent and sophisticated. Then there's some weird words/phrases that sound out of place as though maybe they were taken from a book or movie - "fat cat", "attache" and "faction" is a strange group of words to use together in this context. It sounds like people I have worked with who are not native English speakers but are very educated and intelligent - they know a lot of precise words that most native speakers don't use, and then will throw in some weird colloquialisms and awkward phrasing.

"Group of individuals" is something I constantly see teens write. They think it sounds fancy and use way too many words to say everything.

 

[OEJ]

I want to thank all people on this treads for welcoming me.

I need to clarify about foreign faction in my theory. They were not registered political group of terrorists, ther were young people, students, self-organized and proclaiming they were foreign faction in their sick heads, who had different ideals and culture, including religious ideals. They had not respected the country ( they said so) and rich American Christians for their controversial style of life, like Ramseys, church going every Sunday, but living far from modest life, including pageants. That`s what Tsarnev terrorist said after he`s been caught and asked why they killed innocent people- he said -we hate the country and the people for their life style. Tsarnaev`s brothers, young students and athletes themselves, killed 10 y.o. boy and wounded innocent people at marathon, it was big sport event, it supposed to be joyful sport event, holiday for the whole city of Boston.
That’s` just my theory but I stick to it. For many years I thought killers were underpaid construction workers. I changed my opinion to the young terrorists ( self-proclaimed). No other explanation for killing a child on Christmas day for neither sexual assault, nor for money. It was not about money, my personal opinion. The note was staged for kidnapping to win the time. The crime scene in the wine cellar was not staged, it was what it was- brutal killing and torture.

I agree with you about the views of the offender. He wrote what he knew in the ransom note. I can't completely rule out a sexual motivation, though, because, well, she WAS sexually assaulted. Even the most ruthless of killers will often blanch at the thought of sexually assaulting a child.

 

[Chewy]

Interesting discussion.

I work as a verbal tutor, and now that I look at it from this perspective, there are things about it that are indicative of someone who is not a native English speaker. There's some awkward grammar and phrasing, but not the type I usually see from native English speakers who struggle with writing. It sounds like someone who is confident that he or she sounds intelligent and sophisticated. Then there's some weird words/phrases that sound out of place as though maybe they were taken from a book or movie - "fat cat", "attache" and "faction" is a strange group of words to use together in this context. It sounds like people I have worked with who are not native English speakers but are very educated and intelligent - they know a lot of precise words that most native speakers don't use, and then will throw in some weird colloquialisms and awkward phrasing.

"Group of individuals" is something I constantly see teens write. They think it sounds fancy and use way too many words to say everything.

That's an interesting observation. I also work with non native speakers of English and I know exactly what you mean. They often write many words to try to "sound smart" I often tell them, rule of thumb, don't use a $5 word when a 25 cent word would do.

But beyond that, I don't see this letter as being written by a non native speaker of English overall, but I do see sections where it would seem so.

 

[lawstudent]

That's an interesting observation. I also work with non native speakers of English and I know exactly what you mean. They often write many words to try to "sound smart" I often tell them, rule of thumb, don't use a $5 word when a 25 cent word would do.

But beyond that, I don't see this letter as being written by a non native speaker of English overall, but I do see sections where it would seem so.

Yeah - the whole thing baffles me. When I read the ransom note it doesn't really call anyone to mind for me. It's all over the place. And I don't know what the strategy behind it was. And apparently investigators were similarly baffled.

 

[tovarisch]

I agree with you about the views of the offender. He wrote what he knew in the ransom note. I can't completely rule out a sexual motivation, though, because, well, she WAS sexually assaulted. Even the most ruthless of killers will often blanch at the thought of sexually assaulting a child.

OEJ,
tank your for partly agreeing with my view of the killers. But, could you , please, provide the name of the most ruthless child killer(s) who blanched?
I do not know if I could consider assault of JonBenet`s body with an object could be classified as sexual. They made no biological or even tactile contact with her. They forfully inserted an object, and took a picture. That`s was the main reason- for finial humiliating pictures. For memorabilia, other than picture they took Nothing, neither from Jonbenet, nor from the house. And Jonbenet had several new pieces of gold on her. It tells me they were not cheap deranged drunkards or crack heads, who though that $118,000 somewhere in the range next to $1 million, those deranged cheap criminals would grab couple of gold items from the body, why not? Or something from the house? They took nothing. Instead, killers took pictures. Including with her hands tied up. Object and hands tied up were done for pictures. I do not know if humiliation of a body was for sexual gratification for them. I think for “victory”. I`ve already explained my theory that it was a political act. And it`s just my opinion.