Whew, somebody left the door open and a breath of fresh air arrived in this post! Thank you for describing those little bitty hints of character flaws, so disquieting no matter how many times weve heard them.
JR obviously doesnt look upon JMK as creep of the year; he looks at how this can be used to enhance his own virtuous persona in the media, as if to say, Look, he was targeted by the authorities, just like me. And its like watching someone perfecting their state of victimology. Still today, JR puts the BPD under the label of incompetence and emphasizes that they cruelly targeted him and his family. Ive noted this quote elsewhere, but it bears repeating. This is cited by profiler John Douglas in one of his books. From JR:
And if there is any lesson in all of this, it isnt that an innocent child was murdered because, unfortunately, that happens all too often but that the police persecuted innocent people.
Hi qft! Thanks. It's really nice to meet you here again!
It's like watching someone perfecting their state of victimology.
You've got it! That's exactly what he's doing!
Your post triggered some other thoughts, and Im going to wander around a little here. The following musings are not my own. I have simply read a lot. So in the event some readers here havent combed through the past observations by real psychologists who have appeared on the JBR forums, Ill summarize some stuff.
A lot has been written about Cluster B Personality Disorder and the Rs (in JRs case specifically narcissistic personality disorder, NPD. Google NPD for more detail.) I dont pretend to any professional knowledge of this disorder, but I do know that some (not all) with Cluster B issues also are sociopaths. From what Ive read about narcissism, JR pings soundly on the spectrum, but also seems to have a comorbidity of sociopathy. (Sociopathy is chiefly characterized as something really wrong with one's conscience.) The tipping point for me was the easy and comfortable combination of charm, lies and accusations against innocent friends. He doesnt 'feel' anything at all about the action of throwing someone under the bus if it furthers his goal.
There are cases where sociopaths appear to have the capacity for feelings, to have a seemingly normal capacity for affection. But there is a difference - they also appear to have an ability most people dont have, the capacity to 'compartmentalize' (i.e., wall-off) any emotional connection to their actions.
For me, when JR attempts to show how he is above it all, he simply highlights who he really is. At his core, theres a failure to recognize other peoples emotional responses to the horrendous death of his daughter and to believe that he is better than everyone else who would judge a killer. (Except, of course, when he occasionally switches course and says he would tear the killer apart. The changes in tone can make the head spin. Thank you, Ellie9.) JR wants to make sure everyone sees his sanctity and his recovery from being accused. He wants to be admired. Jmho, but it makes me want to barf.
a failure to recognize other peoples emotional responses to the horrendous death of his daughter
[believes] he is better than everyone else who would judge a killer
wants to make sure everyone sees his sanctity and recovery
wants to be admired
You've nailed it again -- especially the obtuseness about other people's expressions of feeling, which mirrors his own emotional stuntedness. I'm sorry for your discomfort but also happy for you. Wanting to barf is a normal, healthy response to narcissistically disordered behavior. Go for it!! :sick:
Since you mention Cluster B Personality Disorders, I hope you won't mind if I add to what you contributed. First, for those who may be less familiar with abnormal psychology, The Cluster B disorders include:
Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD)
Histrionic Personality Disorder (HPD)
Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD) and
Antisocial Personality Disorder (ASPD)
They are (if you'll pardon the expression in this context) incestuous. Two of the disorders occurring simultaneously (comorbidity) is not uncommon, but even more common than that is an overlapping of the disorders that reflects the boundary and identity issues present in all four. This results in such diagnoses as NPD with histrionic features, or Histrionic PD with borderline features, where there are observable elements of a second disorder but not enough to warrant a second diagnosis.
A word about Antisocial Personality Disorder, sociopaths and psychopaths -- ASPD is the actual diagnosis ("diagnostic entity"), with formal diagnostic criteria. As you say, qft, these are people with something seriously wrong with their conscience. Sociopaths and psychopaths present two different versions of the disorder. Both lack regard for the rights and well being of others. Both are characterized in part by deceit, lying, manipulativeness, law-breaking, and lack of empathy (ranging from callousness to total lack of remorse). There are different schools of thought about all of this but, short version, sociopaths are thought to be formed by a combination of social and intrapsychic dynamics, while psychopaths are born with different wiring.
Sociopaths tend to be more impulsive, more emotionally volatile, and less able to meet social norms for employment, relationships, family life, and so on, but able to form some attachments and experience regret for some actions (not that they change). Psychopaths, on the other hand, tend to be organized, make long range plans, can more easily blend in and appear normal, are educated/self-educated, can be quite successful, and are largely incapable of real emotional attachment or guilt/remorse. Sociopaths are more often caught breaking the law. Psychopaths plan ahead and are much better at avoiding detection. If JR is ASPD, psychopath would be the better description.
I don't think he necessarily is, though. A narcissist will also break the law, lie, manipulate people, fake deep attachments, blame/discard others, compartmentalize, and justify his actions. He just does these things for different reasons. (And this is a key thing to remember with these disorders: It's not just the behaviors, which are often similar. It's where are they coming from? For what deficit are they the compensation?) An ASPD will break the law because right and wrong to him mean doing/not doing what he wants; he's his own law. When an NPD breaks the law, he knows. He just decides it doesn't apply to him. He keeps the law when it suits him and breaks it when it suits him because he's special. Inferior people just don't get it, doncha know? :aktion1:
So, it's an interesting question whether JR would be more accurately characterized as both NPD and ASPD, or NPD with antisocial features.
Apologies in advance if this has been tedious. I'm responding to you and also wanting to include anyone interested who may have missed out on earlier discussions of the Cluster B disorders (not to be confused with the D.A.'s office and Cluster F).