GUILTY KS - Andrew Finch, 28, killed by LE in 'swatting' prank, Wichita, 28 Dec 2017 *civil trial 2022*

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JaxFlaGal said:
This is a horrible tragedy! I learned about this from an information security author's blog. He was the victim of a SWATter in 2013 after exposing a hacker, which gives him a unique perspective on this incident. He's also tracked down quite a few posts from the perpetrator, both before and after an account name change. I sure hope the arrest evidence sticks - the perpetrator's posts show no remorse or caring. Even given the police overreaction, if someone calls in a report of a domestic dispute turned murder+hostage situation, they surely don't expect the cops to walk onto the scene with lollipops drawn.

His article (very useful detail about the hoaxer's communications here): https://krebsonsecurity.com/2017/12/kansas-man-killed-in-swatting-attack/#more-42076





Question for our legal gurus, if any are following the thread. Is making such a fraudulent report a felony in both Kansas and in CA (where the suspected perpetrator was arrested)? Which state's law is applicable in this case - I'm guessing Kansas since that's where the false report was received and acted upon?


p.s. I have never been able to bring myself to type "swatting" or "swatter" - imo it trivializes the severity of the crime. I use "SWATting" and "SWATter" to reinforce the unnecessary jeopardy that the victims of these criminals are placed in. (MOO!)
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None of that excuses that policeman of shooting that young man. They are supposed to be the professionals;
 
They have a guy to blame and the waistband excuse, he will probably not even get fired.
 
Really? said:
They are professionals. Professionals who want to go home to their families when the day is over. Sorry.
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Very unprofessional behaviour. Members of the public want to stay alive and with their families too and have every right to do so. You do take on a bit of risk when you willingly join law enforcement and get paid for that risk. If you are too scared to do your job properly, you should not be in that job.
 
Jennifer17 said:
None of that excuses that policeman of shooting that young man. They are supposed to be the professionals;
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I agree with that, based on what I'm reading. I think there needs to be a whole heck of a lot of reform of both the laws against SWATters and the police response in these scenarios.

From the New York Times article (https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/29/us/wichita-shooting-swatting.html?smid=pl-share - posted upthread also), this was at night, and the victim heard unusual sounds outside and went to investigate. That's a completely reasonable action. IMO it would be reasonable if he chose to arm himself in order to investigate. He still should not have been shot and killed in the process of ensuring that his home and family were safe.

This info from that article is concerning - who in Wichita missed these hoax signs?
The Kansas shooting had some of the common markers of a swatting prank, including that the emergency call initially went to the security desk of City Hall, not 911, suggesting that the caller was not local.
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Update: local news here indicates the call was to a police substation (still not to 911: http://www.kwch.com/content/news/Two-critically-injured-in-W-Wichita-shooting-467049153.html)
 
Call of Duty player, 25, is arrested for swatting hoax where cops shot his 'online gaming rival' dead after he 'called 911 pretending to be the victim and said he'd shot his father and was holding his mother and brother hostage'

Los Angeles police on Friday arrested a 25-year-old gamer they say made a prank call that led a SWAT team to fatally shoot an innocent man over an online gaming dispute.

Tyler Barriss was detained by the LAPD hours after Andrew Finch, 28, of Wichita, Kansas, was shot dead by police.
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http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...y-player-25-arrested-fatal-swatting-hoax.html
 
Tyler is the one to blame here. Both the officer who fired and Andrew are victims and never should have been put in that situation.
 
I don’t see that cop as a victim. He didn’t do his job and now someone is dead.
 
What a sad situation. I feel for everyone but the suspect. jmo. This should never have happened.
 
HMSHood said:
This is the first time I heard of swatting resulting in someone getting killed. I know people have been injured.

Swatting is often committed by gamers.

I have seen videos of gamers getting swatted on YouTube.

Teen Reveals Motives Behind Swatting Celebs Like Justin Timberlake and Others
http://www.insideedition.com/entert...ting-celebs-like-justin-timberlake-and-others

Guerrero asked, "What’s the motive behind conducting these pranks?"

Lundeby answered “There could be some kind of rush or thrill out of it. There could be somebody that somebody doesn't like, you know and they decide this is how I’m going to get back at them and swat them.”

He says he's learned his lesson about "swatting" and will never do it again. But other swatters, like those who just sent cops to Justin Timberlake’s home, haven't gotten the message.


Those people who engage in swatting do it for revenge. They likely have deep seated issues.
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Profile Of People Who Engage In Swatting
Males
Teenagers To 20s
Driven By Revenge
Jealousy-They see someone who is successful and want to get revenge at them.
Thrill Seeking (Anti-Social)
 
That policeman is not a victim, what is it about the U.S and being so quick to pull the trigger?

It’s absolutely disgusting a innocent person has ended up dead due to police offices who are supposed to protect you.
 
Jennifer17 said:
And the policeman who shot an innocent and unarmed man.
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Police sometimes over react because they have been placed in dangerous situations so many times.

I have family members who are LE in the local, state and federal levels. They wear bullet proof vest but that doesn't always stop a bullet and most are totally ineffective against knives.

The stories they tell about how they answer a call, tell a suspect to place their hands over their head and the numerous times that the suspect either doesn't do it or charges toward the officer are too many to list on here.

I had a relative who once trusted a woman he had pulled over. He told her to step out of the car and place her hands on the hood. She stepped out but just stood there. He trusted her because she was an older woman so he walked toward her and reached to grab her arm. She stabbed him in the side through his vest.

So I know why they over react.
 
RAISINISBACK said:
Police sometimes over react because they have been placed in dangerous situations so many times.

I have family members who are LE in the local, state and federal levels. They wear bullet proof vest but that doesn't always stop a bullet and most are totally ineffective against knives.

The stories they tell about how they answer a call, tell a suspect to place their hands over their head and the numerous times that the suspect either doesn't do it or charges toward the officer are too many to list on here.

I had a relative who once trusted a woman he had pulled over. He told her to step out of the car and place her hands on the hood. She stepped out but just stood there. He trusted her because she was an older woman so he walked toward her and reached to grab her arm. She stabbed him in the side through his vest.

So I know why they over react.
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Which is why cops shouldn’t carry automatic weapons as they clearly can not handle the pressure. This happens way to often in American and it’s about time the public’s safety came first.
 
asyousay said:
Which is why cops shouldn’t carry automatic weapons as they clearly can not handle the pressure. This happens way to often in American and it’s abour time the public’s safety came first.
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BBM

Police officers go through almost continuous training. Long hours put in training. But since you obviously know what pressure they are under let's try this.

I will tell you what. You join the police force and when a man pulls a gun on you then you can just politely ask him not to shoot you.

How about you face a drug crazed person out of their mind with a knife and you stand there and politely try to reason with them.

Or let's try this. You face a man with a gun pointed at the head of a child and try to disarm him by politely requesting he let the child go and not kill anyone.

Ever heard the old phrase "don't judge me until you have walked a mile in my shoes"? Maybe you need to walk a mile in a police officers shoes or boots whatever the case may be.

JMO
 
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