LE wants to interview the parents separately

[dizzychick]

I think lie detector is only as good as the tech that adminsters it and who is paying him. I can take a poly that might say my grandma and i rob banks in our spare time and Ted Bundy passed one I think. They are wortless IMO and used only to aid the police in putting pressure on a witness in an attempt to turn them into a suspect. Thank God they are not allowed in court. At our law offices we told all our client not to partake in this game with the police cause if they " passed" it the cops would just call it " inconclusive" and if they fail you they just report that to the media and go even harder against you at trial.

 

[mlc9852]

OK, so I see you have very strong feelings about this, lol. BTW, I am very glad your little guy survived! What a thing!

My theory--working theory that is, and it can change--is this:

Mom drinks. A lot. JI hates it and tells her she needs to knock it off. She says she will, but keeps on drinking. They quarrel over it sometimes. He is sick and tired of dealing with her drunk a$$ night after night and having to deal with the kids at bedtime and everything else because she is getting tipsy by then. He doesn't want to kick her out because then she will take the baby and he *knows* what a custody struggle will be like, from past experience. And she might get full custody and keep on drinking. Better he keep her there where he can at least keep an eye on the situation.

He is a little worried about working that evening shift because he doesn't know what she will do while he is gone. She promises she won't get drunk, and he trusts her and goes ahead with the night shift because they need the money.

She tells JI she needs to go to the store just to buy some baby food and wipes. She pays with the joint debit card for that, and borrows money from her brother to buy the wine that she isn't supposed to have. That's why he got the change. She'll pay him back later. She hides the wine somewhere and JI takes off before she brings it in. He has no idea she plans to get drunk that night and she knows he would be furious if he saw the wine.

She goes ahead and drinks with her neighbor, figuring she will be fine by morning and he'll never be the wiser. She'll get the neighbor to throw the box away at her house, or just hide it somewhere.

Later, after the neighbor leaves, Lisa wakes up and is soiled. DB decides in her drunken state to go ahead and give her a quick bath then give her a bottle and put her back to bed. She draws the bath and puts the baby in and gets distracted or nods off. She comes to and realizes the baby has drowned. She knows JI will totally blame her. She can't let anyone know what happened because for sure JI will toss her to the curb with her son and she will have no place to live and no way to support herself. She has burned too many bridges and has little in the way of family/friend support. They may not be rich, but it is pretty comfy and she doesn't want to lose it.

She has to come up with a plan to hide this terrible thing she has done. She is not thinking clearly. She wraps the baby up and tapes her well and drives down to the river and throws her in along with the phones. It was an accident, but her husband, and probably the police won't see it that way. If she calls 911, the result will be either jail or homelessness. Either way, the baby is gone, and calling 911 and telling the truth won't bring her back.

I haven't fully figured out the phones yet. Obviously something is on them that she doesn't want anyone to see. That's my theory du jour. Go ahead and pick it apart and let's see what works and what doesn't. You won't offend me. Just be nice.

JI was originally to be home a little after 10:00 pm and DB didn't go to bed until 10:30pm so she should have been expecting him at any minute.

I'm confused as to why JI didn't call her to say he was going to be working later than planned. The cell phones could receive calls and he had his work cell. Why wasn't she worried? I would love to know what the drinking buddy has told the cops.

Also, I have a heard time believing DB would be giving Baby Lisa a bath while she was supposedly drunk. Why not just baby wipe her?

This case is baffling, that's for sure.

 

[frankie069]

I would be utterly appalled if LE violated DB and JI's rights.

Of course Lisa has rights, and of course I want her found ASAP. But if DB or JI is responsible for whatever happened to Lisa, if LE violated their rights, any chance of a conviction would be shot to hell.

IMO

I can promise you that interviewing them separately is normally how it is done, it is not a violation of their rights. They dont want to do anything to ruin this case especially after all the manpower they have used. I am quite sure they are crossing all their "T's" and dotting all their "I's. I have complete faith in LE there until they prove otherwise..

 

[watchinginky]

Can anyone share more with me about JI work schedule that night? It bugs me that:

1. JI left for work at 5:20pm
2. Expected to work until 10:00pm
3. JI returns home and makes 911 call at 4:00am

So, instead of working a 4-4.5 hour shift that night, he works until 3:00 or 3:30am, assuming a half-hour or so drive home.

Did he get a lunch or dinner break during his shift?

Was there really not any communication between DB and JI about his working an additional 5 or so hours that night/morning?

I mentioned before how pizzed I would be if my baby daddy showed up 5 hours late from work!!!! Well, worried, and then pizzed.

Am I off-base here?

Check out the Haleigh Cummings case....it's just like Ron Cummings. There's a lot of question regarding his work hours and time to drive home.

 

[Donjeta]

Why is she so angry about being shown burnt clothing? If I had a daughter missing and LE found some clothing I would absolutely want to see it. If I can identify it as her own it's an important lead. If it's not hers it can be eliminated. It might be upsetting to see her outfit burnt and wonder what may have happened to her but knowing for sure is better than guesswork ("maybe it's related maybe not we don't know and we won't find out because the person who might recognize it won't take a look at it for fear of being upset").

I'm betting if LE found burnt clothing and they didn't show her the attorneys would be complaining that LE are keeping her in the dark about important leads. JMO.

 

[Abby Normal]

Can anyone share more with me about JI work schedule that night? It bugs me that:

1. JI left for work at 5:20pm
2. Expected to work until 10:00pm
3. JI returns home and makes 911 call at 4:00am

So, instead of working a 4-4.5 hour shift that night, he works until 3:00 or 3:30am, assuming a half-hour or so drive home.

Did he get a lunch or dinner break during his shift?

Was there really not any communication between DB and JI about his working an additional 5 or so hours that night/morning?

I mentioned before how pizzed I would be if my baby daddy showed up 5 hours late from work!!!! Well, worried, and then pizzed.

Am I off-base here?

It just depends on your family dynamic. My husband goes to china for weeks at a time, because of the time difference and phone charges, we usually only email during this time. And then sometimes he stays longer than he planned, or gets home earlier than he planned. I really don't worry about it too much. I would not at all worry if my husband wasn't home when I went to bed. Likewise, if I go out with friends he doesn't wait up for me. He figures I'm a big girl and I can get myself home and into bed. Now if he wasn't there still when I woke up, then I would worry.

But to your point, I would usually at least get a text that he was working late if he were in town.

 

[PlainJaneDoe]

She was supposedly drunk, taking anxiety medication and sleeping pills according to BS on Joy Behar. I don't think anything would make someone on that cocktail jump out of bed 5 hours after "passing out". And yet JI says she did.

MOO

Where did you hear or see sleeping pills? Just asking because I usually keep my eyes open for that stuff but I can't recall it.

 

[~n/t~]

Why is she so angry about being shown burnt clothing? If I had a daughter missing and LE found some clothing I would absolutely want to see it. If I can identify it as her own it's an important lead. If it's not hers it can be eliminated. It might be upsetting to see her outfit burnt and wonder what may have happened to her but knowing for sure is better than guesswork ("maybe it's related maybe not we don't know and we won't find out because the person who might recognize it won't take a look at it for fear of being upset").

I'm betting if LE found burnt clothing and they didn't show her the attorneys would be complaining that LE are keeping her in the dark about important leads. JMO.

I don't think that's how it went down. I believe they were very aggressive in their interrogation. They were being treated as suspects rather than victims. That's the feeling I got from how DB described it.

 

[Abby Normal]

I keep reading that constitutional rights shouldn't be on your mind when your child is missing. I don't disagree, but food for thought: if you've already lost one child, and you are sincerely innocent (just for the sake of argument) and you perceive that LE is attempting to railroad you into a confession, you MAY start caring about your rights because you have other kids who also need you. At some point you are going to start attempting to protect what you have left. When you have multiple kids, every decision weighs the needs of everyone.

IMO- they should sit down and talk. I agree that if you have lawyers there, to make sure your rights aren't abused, you just need to suck it up for your child. JMO. That said, I don't think a different set of interrogators is a bad thing. I think that would be a good thing for both sides! If they couldn't get it without a lawyer in so many hours immediately following, then they do need a new tactic!

 

[Sigh Sister]

Why is she so angry about being shown burnt clothing? If I had a daughter missing and LE found some clothing I would absolutely want to see it. If I can identify it as her own it's an important lead. If it's not hers it can be eliminated. It might be upsetting to see her outfit burnt and wonder what may have happened to her but knowing for sure is better than guesswork ("maybe it's related maybe not we don't know and we won't find out because the person who might recognize it won't take a look at it for fear of being upset").

I'm betting if LE found burnt clothing and they didn't show her the attorneys would be complaining that LE are keeping her in the dark about important leads. JMO.

When did she say she was angry about being shown burnt clothes? I did hear her say they showed them to her and she hoped they weren't real.

 

[Bemsmom]

I agree with you n/t. I also think the very fact that LE went to the news rather than the attorneys to say they wanted to interview them separately tells me a lot. It isn't very professional, they know how to ask the attorneys for interviews with their clients and going public doesn't accomplish that..if anything it makes them dig in heels more.

I don't think LE is stupid but they are showing ego here cause they have to know that attacking them publicly is going to make it look like they only want to focus on the parents which is why there is tension in the first place.

I don't think its unprofessional. I think that they hit a loggerhead with getting the parents to come in and sit down and talk with them (and with the boys too). We have no idea if they have contacted Attys and if they are being turned down. I think they put it out there in the court of public opinion (using the media) to prompt them to cooperate. They are using whatever means they can to get information. If they said "the parents did it, we know they did, we just get prove it" - THAT would be unprofessional.

 

[cachmo]

I agree with you n/t. I also think the very fact that LE went to the news rather than the attorneys to say they wanted to interview them separately tells me a lot. It isn't very professional, they know how to ask the attorneys for interviews with their clients and going public doesn't accomplish that..if anything it makes them dig in heels more.

I don't think LE is stupid but they are showing ego here cause they have to know that attacking them publicly is going to make it look like they only want to focus on the parents which is why there is tension in the first place.

Do we know that LE did not go the attorneys? Or to DB or JI?
I havent read that before. Sometimes these threads go fast and I miss something. Do you have a link please?

 

[frankie069]

Splitting DB & JI up for more questions would be SOP. I'm sure that this was done to a point the first day, but may not have happened until the second day. I would have thought it would have been done even in the beginning in their front yard. That is SOP as well to compare each of their statements as to what happened.

LE and the FBI have had time to develop more evidence and clues since having sat down with the both of them. Computer forensics have been done now and maybe there are questions for each of them that need to be asked concerning computer usage. Deborah may have extensive computer footprints. I can understand how LE/FBI might want to ask each DB and JI about that out of the others' presence.

I think JI has become reliant on DB to answer questions. He seems to defer to her all of the time, or either she talks over him when he is asked a direct question.

There could be people Deborah has been in contact with online and LE wants to see what his/her individual reactions are to certain names and what that person may mean to each.

At any rate, LE has reasons for wanting to question each individually and should be allowed to do so, IMO. Let their lawyer sit in on the questioning if Cyndi or JT has to.
I cannot understand DB & JI's reluctance to do so at all unless they each have something to hide.

This may not be the right thread for it, but I feel LE is about to bring the hammer down. There is a monumental amount of work in preparing a case to give to the DA/Prosecutor, and I feel it is in the works.

I honestly feel LE should charge Deborah with child endangerment and neglect due her own admission of being drunk. That admission is on video. Plus there are all of the other videos that could show deceptive statements. Get her for those charges, then finish the bigger case of a possible accident/murder. There are no time restraints on murder charges. Of course there may not even be an accident or a murder here.

All of my comments are my own opinion and thoughts only.

I agree that LE is getting all their ducks in a row and hopefully soon we will see her or both of them arrested. In my heart and with all the evidence that DB herself is putting out there, her lies really have me knowing this is her doing and JI knows about it which makes him an accomplice. They do need to be questioned again alone. I think its time for JI to get a different lawyer because very soon it is going to be a conflict of interest having the same lawyer as DB. Thats not going to work. I think when we see him (if he is smart enough) get or announce he has his own lawyer is when you know something is going down.

By law the police can arrest them, mirandize them, question them and let them go. There isnt a statute of limitations on murder like you said and they can be re-arrested again when more evidence is found or until one of them confesses or flips.. I still say someone is going to flip. IMHO

 

[Donjeta]

I don't think that's how it went down. I believe they were very aggressive in their interrogation. They were being treated as suspects rather than victims. That's the feeling I got from how DB described it.

It is very possible IMO. I think a drunk mother who reports her infant mysteriously missing is invariably going to be suspect number one until she can be eliminated or other leads developed. Usually it's her, or she's covering for the father or her boyfriend.

A softer approach might have worked better in this case to keep them talking but IMO it's not wrong as such to interrogate aggressively. LE is there primarily to solve a crime and not to tiptoe around difficult questions and make parents feel good.

 

[frankie069]

I keep reading that constitutional rights shouldn't be on your mind when your child is missing. I don't disagree, but food for thought: if you've already lost one child, and you are sincerely innocent (just for the sake of argument) and you perceive that LE is attempting to railroad you into a confession, you MAY start caring about your rights because you have other kids who also need you. At some point you are going to start attempting to protect what you have left. When you have multiple kids, every decision weighs the needs of everyone.

IMO- they should sit down and talk. I agree that if you have lawyers there, to make sure your rights aren't abused, you just need to suck it up for your child. JMO. That said, I don't think a different set of interrogators is a bad thing. I think that would be a good thing for both sides! If they couldn't get it without a lawyer in so many hours immediately following, then they do need a new tactic!

Abby, I would agree with you totally. The problem is that everything being said about their constitutional rights is wrong. They havent had their rights trampled on in the slightest. I am not sure why that was even brought up all last night.

And remember, you only get a lawyer when you ask for a lawyer... They can questions you forever and if you continue talking and dont lawyer up, they are going to continue asking (LE that is). Its not a violation..

DB and LE need to concentrate on finding their child..

 

[Donjeta]

When did she say she was angry about being shown burnt clothes? I did hear her say they showed them to her and she hoped they weren't real.

It's probably my own interpretation from the context. Why did she bring it up to explain why she won't talk to the police any more if she's not angry?

 

[Magnifying Glass]

I believe in rights. I believe in LE's good will to bring Lisa home. Therefore I don't understand the sympathy I read for the way the parents are handling this when they are the ones who've publically shown they can't keep a timeline straight and prefer "me time" over parenting (DB, by her own admission)

It's a stretch to blame LE and even if they've been complete a-holes (the source is questionable to me, since they can't even keep stories straight) to the parents, that still doesn't erase nor excuse the story changes and the drunkenness.

I respect that people here try to remain sympathetic but I don't understand it one bit. But I suppose that works vice versa as well.

All my opinion :twocents:

 

[PlainJaneDoe]

IMO, if someone is being spoken to in a stern tone, and if that person is dodging uncomfortable questions regarding "gaps" in their timeline, and if that person (for whatever reason) is unable to fill in those gaps, then that person might interpret a stern tone as "yelling".

Having raised 2 teenagers, I'm familiar with this defense. Teenagers will cry "Stop yelling at me!" (even when you aren't) in an attempt to manipulate you & in an attempt to take the focus off themselves.

Until I see it confirmed on video, or hear it confirmed by LE, I will remain unconvinced that DB was actually "yelled" at, especially since her timeline has had notable changes these past 3 weeks. If she isn't capable of providing logical, consistent information concerning the timeline of events on the night of Oct. 3 when her precious baby went missing, I'm skeptical of much of what she says (especially given what I know with regards to addicts' behaviors).

Her defiant attitude in interviews, where she defended her right to her so-called "grown-up let's get black-out drunk" time (complete with eyeball rolling), during which she practically dared anyone to challenge her, reminded me of rebellious teenagers who don't want to be held accountable for their actions.

IMO, her demeanor was not that of a concerned parent whose priority is finding her precious missing baby girl.

Eek! I know! The first time I saw the video of that interview I was actually taking a break at work, and you know how you hear about people spitting out their drinks because they're so surprised? Well, I used to think it was an exaggeration but I swear that's what I did! I took my headphones out and called over my labmates to listen cuz I couldn't believe what I was hearing! They aren't following the case, and thought it was a joke (We watch Colbert and the Daily Show a lot, and on both those shows there are a lot of totally serious looking gag interviews so I guess that's what they were thinking about). None of us have kids, but those of us with fur babies came to the conclusion that if that was her attitude, we didn't want DB in charge of them.

O/T but...sorry if I talk about school/lab/work too much. :waitasec: It's just that lab is my life, work and social, so I'm not trying to show off or anything. Just happens to be my life, like some people's families are their lives. :waitasec:

 

[CharlestonGal]

It is very interesting to me that LE is pushing to reinterview people, following up on tips and leads, and conducting searches in order to find out what happened to Lisa, and the parents are doing.......??? Absolutely nothing that I can see except sending their attornies out to spin for them and avoiding LE at all costs. I mean seriously, what are the parents doing? No pleas for their child, no hanging flyers, no calling in missing child organizations. Nothing. Nada. Zip. Zero.

And LE are the bad guys? Really?

 

[In da Middle]

Can anyone share more with me about JI work schedule that night? It bugs me that:

1. JI left for work at 5:20pm
2. Expected to work until 10:00pm
3. JI returns home and makes 911 call at 4:00am

So, instead of working a 4-4.5 hour shift that night, he works until 3:00 or 3:30am, assuming a half-hour or so drive home.

Did he get a lunch or dinner break during his shift?

Was there really not any communication between DB and JI about his working an additional 5 or so hours that night/morning?

I mentioned before how pizzed I would be if my baby daddy showed up 5 hours late from work!!!! Well, worried, and then pizzed.

Am I off-base here?

In the world of contracting, sometimes you just have to stay until the job is done. It is not uncommon in remodel work to run into problems at all. This job was one that probably was needed for the store to be inconvenienced for the minimum amount of time. In the world of remodel contracting the rule of thumb is to always be prepared double the materials and the time. If he ran into problems, he had to stay until they were resolved.