Leslie Van Houten up for parole again

[Paul B.]

Adults who get involved in cults have a choice. Children dragged into cults do not.

This is about the Branch Davidians and Jim Jones's mob, but it's rare to talk about the experiences of pre-teen children brought into a cult other than anonymous dead victims. I'll never forget reading an article about a movie on the WACO incident - it was filmed during the siege and they got news of the fire while shooting. The guy who played David Koresh told the AP that when they got the news on set, he looked at the child actors and actresses who were playing the children of the WACO compound and realized stingingly that all the real life children these kids were playing for the cameras were dead.

 

[AliceInPain]

Yeah whatever. This had a choice. Was just looking at pictures of Sharon, preparing for the little one. Little one never had a choice and there are no excuses.

 

[Paul B.]

I'm not defending Van Houten. I'm talking about PRE-TEEN children that get involved in cults by their adults. My father's first wife got my half-siblings involved with the Children of God cult.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

I just learned about this today.

I honestly don't understand Newsom's logic. At the time of the crimes she was at an age well before the age of 25 when current science indicates a person's decision-making ability is completely formed. And she was under the influence of a notoriously charismatic cult leader.

Today she's 71 and has been a model prisoner and Newsom finds her perfectly rational explanation of her teen self at the time "as a ‘very weak person that took advantage of someone that wanted to take control of my life, and I handed it over’” evidence that she's still a danger?

That would describe many who have experienced similar circumstances and done the same thing yet did not go on to commit horrible crimes.

I'm not excusing what she did in any way, shape, or form. But I think she's paid her debt to society. And if, hypothetically, she were released and moved in next door to me, it wouldn't bother me one bit. I just don't think she's a danger to anyone at this point in her life.

 

[Paul B.]

the Manson Family is too high profile. There'd be too much heat. Same reason Mark David Chapman's never getting out even if he adopted the personality of Mister Rogers.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

the Manson Family is too high profile. There'd be too much heat. Same reason Mark David Chapman's never getting out even if he adopted the personality of Mister Rogers.

You're right, but it strikes me as unfair that justice is meted out based on the notoriety of the crime. Some might call it mob justice. Satisfying public opinion being the primary motivation.

I don't have any concrete evidence to back it up, but I'd willingly wager that people who committed crimes equally as heinous, or worse, than Van Houten and Chapman have been paroled long ago.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Well looky here. BBM.

Being 38 at the time of the crime is a mitigating factor in this case, but being 19 at the time of the crime isn't a mitigating factor in Van Houten's crime?

Double standard, anyone? More at link.

Many of the inmates are serving sentences for murder or homicide convictions, and the list of actions by Newsom includes one prisoner whose previous clemency petition to Brown so infuriated the Tulare County district attorney that he launched a public campaign against his release.

Richard Flowers, 64, was sentenced to life without the possibility of parole 26 years ago after he was convicted of stabbing an elderly Tulare woman to death in her home and stealing her jewelry and car when he was 38, according to a 2018 news release from the District Attorney Tim Ward.

In his letter to Brown’s office, Ward wrote that the crime against 78-year-old Mary Garcia was deeply troubling. He noted that Flowers, married with four children at the time, was “willing and able to sneak into her house in the middle of the night, knowing that she would be very, very afraid … and knowing that she was alone and vulnerable.”

The clock ran out on his clemency petition to Brown, but the commutation from Newsom makes him eligible for a parole suitability hearing. The California Supreme Court and the Board of Parole Hearings recommended his application, a step required for an inmate with more than one felony conviction, according to Newsom’s office.

Newsom’s order released today notes Flowers “was 38 years old at the time of the crime and he is now 64,’’ and that the inmate has “resided on an honor yard and has been commended by his work supervisors,’’ and has “good prospects for community re-entry.”[unquote]

 

[Richard]

It might be a good thing to consider the victims before turning one of their murderers loose.



The victims:
Sharon Tate, 26 [8/9/1969]
Richard Paul Polanski (unborn child of Sharon Tate and Roman Polanski) [8/9/1969]
Abigail Folger, 25 [8/9/1969]
Voytek Frykowski, 32 [8/9/1969]
Jay Sebring, 36 [8/9/1969]
Steve Parent, 18 [8/9/1969]
Rosemary LaBianca, 38 [8/10/1969]
Leno LaBianca, 44 [8/10/1969]

LINK:

This Date in History: Charles Manson and followers convicted of the murders at the Tate residence and LaBiancas

 

[Catmommy]

But shouldn't that be the same for every case? Consider the victims first? Unfortunately, the dead have less rights than the living and that includes the murdered. The law and the punishment should be the same for everybody, not just "high profile" cases.

 

[Catmommy]

It also might be a good thing to remember that even though Leslie Van Houten was convicted for the LaBianca murders, a horror within itself, she did NOT participate in the Sharon Tate murders and did not know they had even occurred until the next day. I'm no fan of Leslie's but I insist on the Truth. She wasn't even present for that awful carnage.

 

[Paul B.]

Playing to emotions is not justice, it is revenge.
By the way, as a space buff i wish there wasn't so much obsession with Christa McAuliffe. What about the other people who died on Challenger?
Same with Manson, Ask someone if they know the name of the people killed who were NOT Sharon Tate....

 

[Richard]

Leslie Van Houghton, then and now.

LINK:

Governor nixes parole for Manson follower Leslie Van Houten who's spent nearly 50 years in prison | Daily Mail Online

 

[borndem]

Please remember, as has been said many times -- those involved in the Tate and the La Bianca murders were all sentenced to Death.
I still don't understand the California law that allowed those convicted murderers to go from Death to a sentence that would enable them to be eligible for parole and release. It's CA law, but it makes no sense to me -- they should have been given LWOP. IMO.

 

[Richard]

It also might be a good thing to remember that even though Leslie Van Houten was convicted for the LaBianca murders, a horror within itself, she did NOT participate in the Sharon Tate murders and did not know they had even occurred until the next day. I'm no fan of Leslie's but I insist on the Truth. She wasn't even present for that awful carnage.

Leslie Van Houten was indeed convicted of the murders of Rosemary and Leno LaBianca. In fact she participated by stabbing Rosemary many times during the attack on the couple in their own home.

Even if she did not participate in the killing of the Tate group the day before, her knowledge of those gruesome murders makes her that much more guilty of the LaBianca murders. She KNEW what was going to happen and still went along and participated in killing them.

She sat through the entire trial with a smirk on her face and laughed about all the murders. She showed no mercy for her victims and no remorse.

Leslie Van Houten deserved the death sentence she received for cold blooded first degree murder. How the California Parole Board determined that she now rates Parole is beyond comprehension.

California's Governor Newsom's denial of her parole is one thing that he did get right.

 

[Richard]

Bobby Beausoleil. Tex Watson, and Bruce M. Davis, - all of the "Manson Family" are also still incarcerated. Beausoleil and Davis (like Leslie Van Houghten) have also been recommended for parole by the California Board but have been denied parole by the Governor.

For some strange reason, Leslie is not included in the below linked list of longest serving/served inmates. Hopefully this can be corrected and hopefully she can go for the record.

LINK:

List of longest prison sentences served - Wikipedia

 

[IceIce9]

Playing to emotions is not justice, it is revenge.
By the way, as a space buff i wish there wasn't so much obsession with Christa McAuliffe. What about the other people who died on Challenger?
Same with Manson, Ask someone if they know the name of the people killed who were NOT Sharon Tate....

I’m a space buff as well and I have always had the same thought regarding Christa McAuliffe.

 

[IceIce9]

Leslie Van Houten was indeed convicted of the murders of Rosemary and Leno LaBianca. In fact she participated by stabbing Rosemary many times during the attack on the couple in their own home.

Even if she did not participate in the killing of the Tate group the day before, her knowledge of those gruesome murders makes her that much more guilty of the LaBianca murders. She KNEW what was going to happen and still went along and participated in killing them.

She sat through the entire trial with a smirk on her face and laughed about all the murders. She showed no mercy for her victims and no remorse.

Leslie Van Houten deserved the death sentence she received for cold blooded first degree murder. How the California Parole Board determined that she now rates Parole is beyond comprehension.

California's Governor Newsom's denial of her parole is one thing that he did get right.

Good post.

 

[IceIce9]

I'm not excusing what she did in any way, shape, or form. But I think she's paid her debt to society. And if, hypothetically, she were released and moved in next door to me, it wouldn't bother me one bit. I just don't think she's a danger to anyone at this point in her life.

I have never been able to wrap my head around the idea that someone who has committed horrific murders has “paid their debt to society.” How does a murderer pay their debt to their victims? How can a murderer repay years and years of life that will not be lived? How can victims be compensated for the abject terror and pain they felt?How can a murderer pay their debt to grieving family members, whose lives and hearts will never be whole again?

 

[SBops]

I'm not defending Van Houten. I'm talking about PRE-TEEN children that get involved in cults by their adults. My father's first wife got my half-siblings involved with the Children of God cult.

A little known fact, but Julian Assange's mother became involved with a man who belonged to the cult called 'The Family' and whom they eventually fled from, but he denies ever having met the founder of the cult.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

nm