Lisa Irwin missing 3 months now - Poll

[Whisperer]

Gosh, such big words being thrown around. Le'ts see nefarious?

The opposite of nefarious is decent, honest, honorable, principled, pure, trustworthy, truthful, uncorrupt, upright....

I don't see her as the opposite of nerfarious.

 

[Whisperer]

I have no reason to believe DB has been truthful in anything she has said whether it be to police or the public. I certainly don't conclude a possible drug problem would be "small time." I didn't suggest she gave her child away, I think the child was taken in retaliation for an unpaid debt. Drug dealers are interested in making money and I really doubt they care whether the product is drugs or pretty babies.

JMO

Time will tell if there is a drug connection. I don't have the stats on that one

These two parents don't exactly scream "Big time Drug dealers". Their lifestyle doesn't support it. One must keep in mind that a cadaver dog hit in the house. Does that mean the Drug Lord/Dealer killed Lisa in the house? I don't think that is what is implied but that is the conclusion drawn by the evidence. There is a strong possibility that Lisa died inside the house.

Some want to ignore it because they say one dog isn't enough. That's is their right. I say the dog was accurate. I say LE took evidence from the home. I also believe LE took the clothing that DB said Lisa was wearing.

I suppose a scenario could be fostered that the perp either changed her or removed her clothing before leaving. And if people want to believe Lisa was alive, why wouldn't they take her binkie, bottle, blanket, clothing with them?

 

[Whisperer]

I have no reason to believe DB has been truthful in anything she has said whether it be to police or the public. I certainly don't conclude a possible drug problem would be "small time." I didn't suggest she gave her child away, I think the child was taken in retaliation for an unpaid debt. Drug dealers are interested in making money and I really doubt they care whether the product is drugs or pretty babies.

JMO

I definitely think they care about money, therefore stealing babies is whole new ball game that has escaped me. I have known dealers in my time and I can honestly say not one of them would want a baby as payday. A baby is trouble. They don't need that.

I have never made the connection between drugs and babies being trafficked. That's a whole new crime. I haven't any clue or ever heard of it. I have never known a baby trafficker...therefore, I am at a loss.

I don't see DB or JI involved with drug lords or big time dealers. I think their drug of choice is alcohol.

 

[Whisperer]

with all my respect whisperer ,baby traffiking is a big deal,unfortunately paedos,parents that want a child,sex slavery mafia,etc....would pay a lot for a beautiful american blond ,blue eyed baby,I do hope this is not what happened to baby Lisa


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3533349...iend-get-years-baby-trafficking/#.TwmbA3p-Rkg


http://gvnet.com/humantrafficking/Mexico.htm

I have stated before I know of ONE case personally where a three month old was kidnapped. The female infant was raped. The perp had raped two other children under the age of two prior to this one. That case is not the norm, thank goodness. It does happen but I hope I never have to know about it again. Having to live with that case, and having talked to the perp is enough.

lNOW, is it possible that this happened to Lisa? Yes, it is possible...but not probable. She could be trafficked by Drug Lords. Possible but not probable. It is probable that she was harmed by a member of her own family. It is over 90% certain that she was.

I stated I would leave a little wiggle room for the pedo/maniac/psycho stranger to have abducted Lisa. If that happened, it is not likely they would have hid her. Because I have worked with these types, they notoriously leave the child close to where they did the crime. They were not likely to hide a body well...in fact, they usually didn't.

Most BABY abductions by strangers are returned unharmed...Thank Goodness!

 

[4Jacy]

I have stated before I know of ONE case personally where a three month old was kidnapped. The female infant was raped. The perp had raped two other children under the age of two prior to this one. That case is not the norm, thank goodness. It does happen but I hope I never have to know about it again. Having to live with that case, and having talked to the perp is enough.

lNOW, is it possible that this happened to Lisa? Yes, it is possible...but not probable. She could be trafficked by Drug Lords. Possible but not probable. It is probable that she was harmed by a member of her own family. It is over 90% certain that she was.

I stated I would leave a little wiggle room for the pedo/maniac/psycho stranger to have abducted Lisa. If that happened, it is not likely they would have hid her. Because I have worked with these types, they notoriously leave the child close to where they did the crime. They were not likely to hide a body well...in fact, they usually didn't.

Most BABY abductions by strangers are returned unharmed...Thank Goodness!

I know you must have a strong heart, and a strong soul to work with these type of people. God bless you!

 

[Whisperer]

I know you must have a strong heart, and a strong soul to work with these type of people. God bless you!

Thank Goodness, I retired. Thank you for the compliment but not many go away unscathed. The job takes its toll. The system is difficult..and if one wants to make a difference, your health can take a hit.

 

[4Jacy]

Thank Goodness, I retired. Thank you for the compliment but not many go away unscathed. The job takes its toll. The system is difficult..and if one wants to make a difference, your health can take a hit.

I'm so sure of the above. All I can say is I hope your weren't too scared with you're involvement with these people. You are (in many peoples' opinions) the most treasured, level headed, and most informed poster on these forums.) Thank you for always sharing....I will always consider your posts with the upmost respect. Thank you, Whisp, for all that you do.

 

[hambirg]

Gosh, such big words being thrown around. Le'ts see nefarious?

The opposite of nefarious is decent, honest, honorable, principled, pure, trustworthy, truthful, uncorrupt, upright....

I don't see her as the opposite of nerfarious.

Here's another one. . .

adul·ter·er

: a married person who has sex with someone who is not that person's wife or husband : a person who commits adultery

 

[madge]

Where is Baby Lisa? I told my hubby this morning that for some odd reason I felt in my bones this is the week her body would be discovered.

Whisperer: You are indeed a treasure.

 

[KsStormy]

Time will tell if there is a drug connection. I don't have the stats on that one

These two parents don't exactly scream "Big time Drug dealers". Their lifestyle doesn't support it. One must keep in mind that a cadaver dog hit in the house. Does that mean the Drug Lord/Dealer killed Lisa in the house? I don't think that is what is implied but that is the conclusion drawn by the evidence. There is a strong possibility that Lisa died inside the house.

Some want to ignore it because they say one dog isn't enough. That's is their right. I say the dog was accurate. I say LE took evidence from the home. I also believe LE took the clothing that DB said Lisa was wearing.

I suppose a scenario could be fostered that the perp either changed her or removed her clothing before leaving. And if people want to believe Lisa was alive, why wouldn't they take her binkie, bottle, blanket, clothing with them?

(bolding mine) Exactly...why leave behind the binkie & bottle, especially, & risk the baby waking & crying? A planned kidnapping would never have been so sloppy. I live an hour & 20 min. or so south of the Irwin home & have been watching this case really closely. Does anyone else remember news coverage where they said that after the long search of the house, no evidence was found to support a kidnapping? I do, but can't find it online now. :banghead:

 

[Elley Mae]

I want to know what evidence is/was there to "support" a kidnapping.
Honestly, deborah did admit to leaving the window open and the screen was bent.
http://knue.com/missing-mo-babys-mother-admits-to-drinking-night-of-disappearance/
in the video at 17 seconds vinny states that the window was left open.
Again I ask what evidence of a "kidnapping" is there?

 

[Evan's Mom]

Time will tell if there is a drug connection. I don't have the stats on that one

These two parents don't exactly scream "Big time Drug dealers". Their lifestyle doesn't support it. One must keep in mind that a cadaver dog hit in the house. Does that mean the Drug Lord/Dealer killed Lisa in the house? I don't think that is what is implied but that is the conclusion drawn by the evidence. There is a strong possibility that Lisa died inside the house.

Some want to ignore it because they say one dog isn't enough. That's is their right. I say the dog was accurate. I say LE took evidence from the home. I also believe LE took the clothing that DB said Lisa was wearing.

I suppose a scenario could be fostered that the perp either changed her or removed her clothing before leaving. And if people want to believe Lisa was alive, why wouldn't they take her binkie, bottle, blanket, clothing with them?

Because if I was stealing a baby, I would want as few personal items that belonged to her as possible. The more items I took from the baby's room, the more items that can tie me to the crime were the police to eventually come looking in my direction.

I'm halfass on the fence, but in my heart, I still believe this was a crime of opportunity.
Someone in that neighborhood either knew someone else that wanted a baby and would pay a lot for her or they knew a baby broker that needed a baby for a black market adoption.
Since it would have been someone in the neighborhood, they just patiently waited until their chance arose.

As for the dog hit, since we don't know more about it, I'm content to wait that out before I say Lisa is dead. The house was pretty old, so we have no idea if they prior owners passed away in that master bedroom.

 

[Sparklin]

Because if I was stealing a baby, I would want as few personal items that belonged to her as possible. The more items I took from the baby's room, the more items that can tie me to the crime were the police to eventually come looking in my direction.

I'm halfass on the fence, but in my heart, I still believe this was a crime of opportunity.
Someone in that neighborhood either knew someone else that wanted a baby and would pay a lot for her or they knew a baby broker that needed a baby for a black market adoption.
Since it would have been someone in the neighborhood, they just patiently waited until their chance arose.

As for the dog hit, since we don't know more about it, I'm content to wait that out before I say Lisa is dead. The house was pretty old, so we have no idea if they prior owners passed away in that master bedroom.

I agree ~ I think it could have been someone that was po'ed with them and unfortunately didn't think it through

I think about Lisa every single day! My heart feels like it is going to explode with grief at times over these little babies! I wish we could get some answers!!!!

 

[Chris_Texas]

Stastically, when a child this age is killed the killer is most often... mom.

Not the babysitter. Not the evil stepdad. Not the weird neighbor. Not the random maniac breaking into random houses snatching random kids 9and cellphones). Not international baby smugglers. Mom. And in this particular case we don't need to rely on statistics alone, Deborah's own changing (and ridiculous) story, the HRD dog hits, and the partying tell us all we need to know.

It's not enough for a conviction. Without a body (and at this point a body with a signed and notarized confession) this case is going nowhere. For Deborah it's now "mommy time" all the time. It sucks, but there it is.

 

[cityslick]

Stastically, when a child this age is killed the killer is most often... mom.

Not the babysitter. Not the evil stepdad. Not the weird neighbor. Not the random maniac breaking into random houses snatching random kids 9and cellphones). Not international baby smugglers. Mom. And in this particular case we don't need to rely on statistics alone, Deborah's own changing (and ridiculous) story, the HRD dog hits, and the partying tell us all we need to know.

It's not enough for a conviction. Without a body (and at this point a body with a signed and notarized confession) this case is going nowhere. For Deborah it's now "mommy time" all the time. It sucks, but there it is.

I love statistics.

Flying is the safest form of travel. You probably have a better chance of hitting the lottery than getting in a place crash. Unfortunately the people who were on TWA 800, the Air France crash over the atlantic a few years ago, the Comair crash in KY, etc don't think the odds are that high. They think the odds are 1 to 1.

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

I love statistics.

Flying is the safest form of travel. You probably have a better chance of hitting the lottery than getting in a place crash. Unfortunately the people who were on TWA 800, the Air France crash over the atlantic a few years ago, the Comair crash in KY, etc don't think the odds are that high. They think the odds are 1 to 1.

While no one should put all their faith in statistics without thoroughly investigating their compilation and formula, they are an obvious tool in helping to make an informed decision.

Statistics and emotions are not even in the same ball park. An argument that diverts from one to the other misses the original point altogether, imo, and shouldn't dilute the significance of statistics.

 

[cityslick]

While no one should put all their faith in statistics without thoroughly investigating their compilation and formula, they are an obvious tool in helping to make an informed decision.

Statistics and emotions are not even in the same ball park. An argument that diverts from one to the other misses the original point altogether, imo, and shouldn't dilute the significance of statistics.

I agree, statistics are significant. I just don't believe they should be used as a primary tool to reach a conclusion. Especially a conclusion that determines ones guilt or innocence.

 

[RANCH]

I agree, statistics are significant. I just don't believe they should be used as a primary tool to reach a conclusion. Especially a conclusion that determines ones guilt or innocence.

I agree cityslick. I would hope that in determining ones guilt or innocence, that evidence be the primary source. I would rate statistics a more useful tool than peoples "hinkey meters" and "gut feelings" that I've seen some people use in this case. But statistics only help so much, they don't answer what happened to Lisa.

 

[iamnotagolem]

I was firmly on the fence for the longest time, kept looking at the information that allowed for someone other than the parents to be involved. But here we are months later and the parents don't seem to care, I feel like that changes everything. You look at other missing persons cases even going back 30 years and those parents still do everything they can to get the media to focus on their missing child, the Irwins & Bradleys seem to just want this to go away.

 

[Truthwillsetufree]

Thank Goodness, I retired. Thank you for the compliment but not many go away unscathed. The job takes its toll. The system is difficult..and if one wants to make a difference, your health can take a hit.

You know your my hero, heroine...(whatever), there is a special place in heaven just for you!!!!:blowkiss: