Lloyd Welch is Person of Interest

[RichardLewis]

What if Lloyd was first initiated into pedophilia(with females) by his father and/or uncle Richard? Just a theory. I am also increasingly of the mind that depraved-looking uncle Richard was involved from day one. His security guard badge and uniform may have very well helped in the kidnapping.

Good question, and a plausible theory. Extensive research by scientists on the etiology of pedophilia indicates a genetic predisposition as well as environmental factors. When you add other factors such as limited education, diminished intellect, an environment of alcohol abuse and domestic abuse (LLW2’s own stepmother admitted that LLW1 frequently drank too much and the police often came to their house for disturbances); the confluence of all these factors creates a dangerous recipe for cyclical aberrant human behavior. Also add the fact that LLW2’s biological mother and unborn sibling were killed by his own father, LLW1, and you can see it would be a miracle if LLW2 had turned out alright. I wonder if; but would doubt there was any early intervention or psychiatric help provided to a young LLW2.

Researchers have found that pedophiles lag behind the average IQ by 10 points, a discovery that is consistent with developmental problems, whether before birth or in childhood. Certainly, LLW2 is not particularly bright, and RAW1’s own attorney stated that RAW1 has difficulty reading and writing. I’ve seen numerous publicly available documents related to these and some other relatives, and sadly several of them looked like they had difficulty scrawling out their own names.

Although scientists estimate that possibly up to 1 in 20 men may have pedophile sexual desires, not all pedophiles molest children and not all child molesters are pedophiles. Certainly LLW is a pedophile as his criminal record has proven. Others involved in this crime may have been either pedophiles and / or child molesters. It seems like a dubious distinction, but according to the American Psychiatric Association they technically are different medical disorders / diagnoses.

To your last point, I don’t think that LLW2 was a mastermind of anything. I strongly suspect he was initiated into a sad intergenerational legacy under the tutelage of elder male clan members.

 

[WaynezWorld]

To your last point, I don’t think that LLW2 was a mastermind of anything. I strongly suspect he was initiated into a sad intergenerational legacy under the tutelage of elder male clan members.

That is the theory I am working with. RAW is not bright, LLW2 maybe even less so.

I think LLW2 hung out with RAW and saw him as his "cool uncle"as he was just around ten years older and probably more similar to LLW2 than his father. My thoughts are maybe RAW brought LLW2 into the world of sexual assaults using the security guard gimmick.

Perhaps LLW2 "messed up" the Lyons girls crime and was supposed to leave them alive somewhere or dispose of the bodies somewhere else besides Taylor Mountain.

 

[siriunsun]

Good question, and a plausible theory. Extensive research by scientists on the etiology of pedophilia indicates a genetic predisposition as well as environmental factors. When you add other factors such as limited education, diminished intellect, an environment of alcohol abuse and domestic abuse (LLW2’s own stepmother admitted that LLW1 frequently drank too much and the police often came to their house for disturbances); the confluence of all these factors creates a dangerous recipe for cyclical aberrant human behavior. Also add the fact that LLW2’s biological mother and unborn sibling were killed by his own father, LLW1, and you can see it would be a miracle if LLW2 had turned out alright. I wonder if; but would doubt there was any early intervention or psychiatric help provided to a young LLW2.

Researchers have found that pedophiles lag behind the average IQ by 10 points, a discovery that is consistent with developmental problems, whether before birth or in childhood. Certainly, LLW2 is not particularly bright, and RAW1’s own attorney stated that RAW1 has difficulty reading and writing. I’ve seen numerous publicly available documents related to these and some other relatives, and sadly several of them looked like they had difficulty scrawling out their own names.

Although scientists estimate that possibly up to 1 in 20 men may have pedophile sexual desires, not all pedophiles molest children and not all child molesters are pedophiles. Certainly LLW is a pedophile as his criminal record has proven. Others involved in this crime may have been either pedophiles and / or child molesters. It seems like a dubious distinction, but according to the American Psychiatric Association they technically are different medical disorders / diagnoses.

To your last point, I don’t think that LLW2 was a mastermind of anything. I strongly suspect he was initiated into a sad intergenerational legacy under the tutelage of elder male clan members.

If a low IQ is a symptom of pedophilia, how would you explain all the priests, teachers, and other authority figures who abuse children sexually?

 

[helpfulcharlie]

If a low IQ is a symptom of pedophilia, how would you explain all the priests, teachers, and other authority figures who abuse children sexually?

Because the smart ones aren't detected as frequently.

 

[siriunsun]

Because the smart ones aren't detected as frequently.

Lets not overlook that it took almost forty years to figure this one out, yet we continue to call LLW "unintelligent" and "slow". But being detected isn't fundamental to the state of being a pedophile: the symptoms are still the symptoms whether the person is detected or not. I just don't think that IQ can really determine such a problem, since that particular crime seems to be represented by members of all walks of life.

 

[Ernest t]

Low IQ doesn't mean that stupid people can't possess a great deal of animal cunning. Luck of the devil and that family has it in spades.

 

[siriunsun]

Low IQ doesn't mean that stupid people can't possess a great deal of animal cunning. Luck of the devil and that family has it in spades.

Maybe, but not everyone in that family feels extremely lucky about this whole matter. Had LLW2 been brought up by people who could have encouraged him to do his best at something constructive, he would have been just as "intelligent" as one of those priests or high school teachers who have been charged with sex crimes.

 

[RichardLewis]

There is a lot of intellectual horsepower on this site, and I hope we can best use it constructively in substantive conversations. You could spend years working towards a medical degree or a PhD in psychiatry or psychology, and still not unravel the mysteries of the mind of the human animal. So low IQ is not a "symptom" of pedophilia, rather it is a commonly found trait. It is a generality as opposed to an absolute, so of course there are exceptions. btw, another interesting trait of some pedophiles is that 30% of them are left handed, as opposed to roughly 10% of the general population. Also, they tend to be about an inch shorter than the average height. These are interesting factors that scientists have identified, and there probably is something to them, however we just don't understand it all yet. Now, if LLW2 and RAW1 were +6 feet tall, right handed and very intelligent, that does not mean they could not be pedophiles. However, I do conclude that LLW2 is a pedophile, and his criminal record proves it. Is he left handed, below average height, and intellectually dull? I don't know about the first two, but I think we can be reasonably confident of the third.

Fellow sleuths, we'd be splitting hairs trying to discern which out of the dozens of paraphilias (atypical sexual interests, including pedophilia) the perpetrators of this crime may suffer from. I doubt they are all exclusively pedophiles.
Recall that LE has said there will be more crimes linked to this case. We may learn that some perpetrators of this and other related crimes have exhibited characteristics of ephebophilia, which is where a grown adult has a sexual interest in mid-to-late adolescents (usually between ages 14 to 18) who are at least 5 years younger than them.

As for sexually abusive priests and teachers, they have hidden behind the institutions that have historically protected them. Based on what LE has stated, the perpetrators of this crime have hidden behind the insular and clannish bonds that would keep outsiders from knowing the truth.

 

[siriunsun]

Understood. My piqued responses have a lot to do with reaction to the tendencies of a few defense attorneys when defending suspects in cases involving pedophilia. Attempts to sell juries on the notion that a defendant "has a low IQ" and therefore "can't help it", or "was only following someone else's orders", or "has an addiction problem", and many other excuses, are nauseating. If LLW2 drove all the way from Maryland to Bedford County while committing this crime, he had plenty of time to consider what he was doing. I really do not want to see this case get dismissed, or see another verdict similar to the Casey Anthony verdict.

 

[beachlvr0810]

Low IQ doesn't mean that stupid people can't possess a great deal of animal cunning. Luck of the devil and that family has it in spades.

Have you made your trip up to the mountain yet, Ernest t?

 

[Ernest t]

Have you made your trip up to the mountain yet, Ernest t?

Unfortunately my sister has been busier than usual(unlike myself) so we haven't made the trip. Fortunately the learned folks on this site have kept my interest in the case strong. I would like to start a thread re the killing ground, but alas I remain a noob.

 

[Historydetective63]

That is the theory I am working with. RAW is not bright, LLW2 maybe even less so.

I think LLW2 hung out with RAW and saw him as his "cool uncle"as he was just around ten years older and probably more similar to LLW2 than his father. My thoughts are maybe RAW brought LLW2 into the world of sexual assaults using the security guard gimmick.

Perhaps LLW2 "messed up" the Lyons girls crime and was supposed to leave them alive somewhere or dispose of the bodies somewhere else besides Taylor Mountain.

No, I think LLW2 did just as he was instructed to do by taking the bodies to Taylor's Mountain, no where else seemed like a safe place to dispose of them with all the news coverage going on regarding the case and everyone looking for the girls', a station wagon, a Tape Recorder Man (TRM), etc. The Mountain was miles and miles away, and the location was on private property. I'm sure RAW and LLW2 and the other family members involved in the abduction and sexual assaults thought this was the best way to try and conceal this horrendous crime. And it worked for a period of 40 years!

I do not think RAW and LLW2 were going to assault the girls' and then release them alive somewhere because the girls' would have been able to identify them and give descriptions to LE. Unfortunately, I believe these perps saw these young girls' as disposable items. Perhaps when coming up with the plan for this crime they were originally going to dump or dispose of the bodies closer to home, but like I said above, with all the TV and newspaper coverage in the Washington, DC area, they may have felt it was too risky to dispose of the bodies in that area and that's when they decided to take them to family property on Taylor's Mountain. Even then, they didn't just bury two bodies, but dismembered them and burned them thinking this would destroy all evidence linking them to one of the biggest crimes we've ever seen in Montgomery County, Maryland.

 

[bessie]

Attacking WS Moderators & Administrators

Posting in a thread to comment on, question, or criticize moderator or administrator action is not allowed. Please utilize the board’s Private Message function or email to contact staff if you wish to discuss these issues. As long as you bring up your concerns maturely and civilly to the moderator or administrator in question, we will do our best to address your concerns fairly and promptly...

Realize that a lot goes on behind the scenes. If you are thinking to yourself "Those moderators are either total idiots or they know something I do not", it's safe to assume we know something you do not.

RULES: Etiquette & Information

 

[beachlvr0810]

Unfortunately my sister has been busier than usual(unlike myself) so we haven't made the trip. Fortunately the learned folks on this site have kept my interest in the case strong. I would like to start a thread re the killing ground, but alas I remain a noob.

Maybe yall can visit before all the fall colors are gone. The mountain is truly beautiful in the fall.

 

[gregjrichards]

Update

"A Delaware prisoner charged in connection with the 1975 disappearance of two Maryland girls could appear in Bedford Circuit Court “in the next ten days or so,” a prosecutor said Tuesday.

Lloyd Lee “Michael” Welch Jr., 58, was indicted July 10 by a Bedford grand jury on two counts of first-degree felony murder in the deaths of 10- and 12-year-old sisters Sheila and Katherine Lyon. The pair went to a mall in Wheaton, Maryland, on March 25, 1975, but never returned home."

http://www.newsadvance.com/news/loc...cle_b2423fca-66d1-11e5-b178-e7b2cdfde285.html

 

[beachlvr0810]

Update

"A Delaware prisoner charged in connection with the 1975 disappearance of two Maryland girls could appear in Bedford Circuit Court “in the next ten days or so,” a prosecutor said Tuesday.

Lloyd Lee “Michael” Welch Jr., 58, was indicted July 10 by a Bedford grand jury on two counts of first-degree felony murder in the deaths of 10- and 12-year-old sisters Sheila and Katherine Lyon. The pair went to a mall in Wheaton, Maryland, on March 25, 1975, but never returned home."

http://www.newsadvance.com/news/loc...cle_b2423fca-66d1-11e5-b178-e7b2cdfde285.html

He will be appearing Thursday morning.

 

[foureyes]

According to the Hyattsville Life & Times' report back in October, at the time of the Lyon girls' disappearance, Richard and Patricia Welch lived in a rental house at the corner of Jefferson St. and 42nd Pl. in Hyattsville. Richard's mother and a brother (now deceased) lived upstairs in the duplex.

Can this revealing post for RichardLewis, former member, be linked to an Oct issue of the Hyattsville Life & Times, or is this information specifically of Richard's mother and brother living in the duplex, a memory for you? Any short reply will be appreciated, as this rental house and its 1975 residents is a subject in another thread here.

 

[crcurrie]

Can this revealing post for RichardLewis, former member, be linked to an Oct issue of the Hyattsville Life & Times, or is this information specifically of Richard's mother and brother living in the duplex, a memory for you? Any short reply will be appreciated, as this rental house and its 1975 residents is a subject in another thread here.

The Life & Times reported on the Welch family residents having lived at that address at the time of the Lyons' sisters disappearance. I was not in Hyattsville in the 1970s; however, a friend who is a life-long Hyattsville resident does recall the extended family living in that house at that time. The house is somewhat infamous in Hyattsville for other reasons over the past few decades; probably nobody was surprised to find it connected to a murder investigation ...

 

[gregjrichards]

HYATTSVILLE, Md. — A cousin of the man charged with the 1975 murders of Sheila and Katherine Lyon believes that investigators should be focusing on family members who live in rural Virginia where police believe the two sisters were taken and killed, and who might know more about what happened to the girls.

“I just think it’s a real big cover-up in Bedford,” Patricia Ann Welch, 49, told WTOP and NBC Washington, in a joint interview. “It may have started here in Montgomery County, but it ended up there.”

A year ago, Lloyd Lee Welch, Jr. was indicted in Bedford County, Virginia, on two counts of first degree felony murder for the deaths of Sheila, 12, and her sister Katherine, 10, Lyon. A few months before his trial is set to begin, his cousin Patricia Ann Welch spoke about the toll the ongoing investigation has taken on her family and she stressed that her own father, Richard Welch, was not responsible for the girls’ deaths.

http://wtop.com/local/2016/07/cousin-100-percent-sure-lloyd-welch-murdered-lyon-sisters/

 

[foureyes]

I can understand her being protective of both parents, but if her mother's future testimony conflicts with this newscast, and shows she has previous knowledge , it's obstructing justice.( Does the gag order not apply to today's newscast?) I repeat, it's a group. May justice prevail this year without any more delays.