GUILTY MA - Colleen Ritzer, 24, brutally murdered, Danvers, 22 Oct 2013 #1

[GutInstinct]

How would he have know she would go to the bathroom...and where? I am guessing, just speculating that PC observed her behavior for a long time. She may have had a routine at the end of her day. If it was a bathroom that she used to would be have too exposed, I'm thinking he went and locked it from the inside out somehow....directing her to the bathroom he needed and planned her to be in. JMO. I can't let this case go....it bothers me.

 

[LambChop]

How would he have know she would go to the bathroom...and where? I am guessing, just speculating that PC observed her behavior for a long time. She may have had a routine at the end of her day. If it was a bathroom that she used to would be have too exposed, I'm thinking he went and locked it from the inside out somehow....directing her to the bathroom he needed and planned her to be in. JMO. I can't let this case go....it bothers me.

If he was on the soccer team he would not have been in that class at 3pm. He would have been out on the field practicing so chances are he did not know what her routine was. And since she appeared to go to the faculty bathroom first, that would have been her routine and she would have locked the door. A lot of missing information to even guess why he would have done this to her and if she really was his target or just an opportunity that presented itself for him to vent his rage. jmo

 

[katinva]

Has it been reported that she went to the faculty bathroom first? I wonder if there is a map/layout of the school listed anywhere.

 

[katinva]

I found these floor plans but we dont know where her classroom was, do we?

http://www.danvers.govoffice.com/in...DB}&DE={A5469EA7-85EA-4EA6-9A59-ABF784D2C844}

 

[miimaa]

Interesting. So perhaps there is a very good and specific reason for the sealing of the record for now. I wonder what it is that these kids apparantly saw? And what was it about the killing that will be so upsetting to the victim's family? (more upsetting than what we already know?). I have a couple of suspicions.

My guess is something of a sexual nature

 

[PrairieWind]

My guess is something of a sexual nature

That certainly is at the top of my suspicions. But we really are just speculating. Once the grandjury wraps up and an indictment is formally entered we might learn more.

 

[CHERIE.T]

But how would he have known she would go to the ladies room?

Im of course guessing he was watching her. i read an earlier article that mentioned this being something the teen planned.

 

[PrairieWind]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...tudent-Philip-Chism-14-killed-say-police.html

According to this article, police and the DA still have no idea of a motive. It says they had been proceeding under the idea is was a romantic infatuation that was spurned, but that they have no proof of that. He isnt telling investigators anything.

 

[Foxfire]

=PrairieWind;9943403]http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...tudent-Philip-Chism-14-killed-say-police.html

According to this article, police and the DA still have no idea of a motive. It says they had been proceeding under the idea is was a romantic infatuation that was spurned, but that they have no proof of that. He isnt telling investigators anything.

Thanx for sharing, PrairieWind. For those who did not read the Illumination article that was linked in a previous post, please do so. It is very enlightening, imo. Although PC may or may not have been a victim of sexual abuse. His artwork may be a very revealing means of communication, imo.

http://www.illuminationsprogram.org/ Illuminations… artwork creating change… about being victim… about being a victimizer.

http://www.illuminationsprogram.org/gallery.html
Virtual Gallery Tour
'The Art Gallery' * Listen to a Gallery Introduction - Virtual Gallery Tour


It is the voice of a young man who took so long to find a voice…and then a voice that could speak the breadth of the truth of his experience…of deception, betrayal, victimization and ironically of beauty, innocence, and an imagination which gives birth to hope.

His critically acclaimed art, which lies at the heart of Illuminations, is his voice, his truth. All of the events and programs which Illuminations makes available to the public and to the professional community are based upon and make critical use of his important artwork and become the framework for his voice. And yet, as much as it is his voice that speaks, it is equally theirs….the voices of all victims.

____________________________________________

According to this article, police and the DA still have no idea of a motive. It says they had been proceeding under the idea is was a romantic infatuation that was spurned, but that they have no proof of that. He isnt telling investigators anything.[/quote]


* They may now analyze a number drawings Chism had scrawled in his note book during maths class on the day of the murder, in the hope the sketches give some kind of insight into his mind state at the time.

 

[GutInstinct]

How would he have know she would go to the bathroom...and where? I am guessing, just speculating that PC observed her behavior for a long time. She may have had a routine at the end of her day. If it was a bathroom that she used to would be have too exposed, I'm thinking he went and locked it from the inside out somehow....directing her to the bathroom he needed and planned her to be in. JMO. I can't let this case go....it bothers me.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/10/25/justice/massachusetts-danvers-school-killing/

Early info I had found first here on WS. This is where it was first described that Colleen went to the faculty restroom and it was locked...and so then proceeded to the girls restroom on the second floor...where PC followed her in. HAS to be evidence from video. So, I just keep wondering about that original locked door.

 

[ami]

http://www.cnn.com/2013/10/25/justice/massachusetts-danvers-school-killing/

Early info I had found first here on WS. This is where it was first described that Colleen went to the faculty restroom and it was locked...and so then proceeded to the girls restroom on the second floor...where PC followed her in. HAS to be evidence from video. So, I just keep wondering about that original locked door.

But why wouldn't the door just be locked because someone was in there? It makes the most sense to me. At my daughter's HS the faculty restrooms are just singles - not rows of stalls. So if the door is locked it's because someone's using it.

 

[Foxfire]

http://www1.whdh.com/news/articles/...-problems-revealed-about-chism-s-family-life/

In 2001, Chism's mother accused her husband of adultery in the complaint she filed for separation. A court document cited physical abuse, sexual abuse, or a pattern of emotional abuse as the reason for the restriction.
The document doesn't specify who was abused, but the father's time with his two children was restricted.


Read more>

 

[BeginnersLuck]

http://www1.whdh.com/news/articles/...-problems-revealed-about-chism-s-family-life/

In 2001, Chism's mother accused her husband of adultery in the complaint she filed for separation. A court document cited physical abuse, sexual abuse, or a pattern of emotional abuse as the reason for the restriction.
The document doesn't specify who was abused, but the father's time with his two children was restricted.


Read more>

He would have been around 2 years old at that time. Your bolded part sounds like the typical wording used in a legal document to establish a restraining order. This is very common in a messy divorce.

What we aren't seeing is the specific circumstances. In other words, what kind of abuse she is claiming happened, in order for the courts to rule in her favor to keep him out of the home. We also aren't seeing any followup.

I'm not insinuating that there wasn't any form of abuse going on, this "wording" from a document when she filed for separation is pretty standard though, so I don't really read anything into it.

 

[Foxfire]

Bumping- Article from 10/24/2013. I didn't notice that PC wore white gloves. This, combined with other of his confirmed actions indicates that he is forensically aware, and the attack/murder was obviously preplanned, imo. Imo, attending the movie was a feeble attempt of establishing an alibi.
Seems, PC would have been aware of the many security cameras, and using CR's credit cards at Wendys would have insured an indictment/conviction..
'Simply makes no sense to attempt to cover his tracks, while documenting his deviant behavior on security video'...

PC was described as an artist'.. "Tragically, sometimes life imitates art"... Imo, PC's art painted a very tragic, evil, & bleak picture.. "The answers to many of our questions will be hidden deep in the darkness of PC's sketch art, imo"..


http://www1.whdh.com/news/articles/...hool-remains-closed-grief-counselors-on-hand/

New details emerge in murder of Danvers teacher

Read more: http://www1.whdh.com/news/articles/...losed-grief-counselors-on-hand/#ixzz2jbKOSAGC

 

[Karmady]

He would have been around 2 years old at that time. Your bolded part sounds like the typical wording used in a legal document to establish a restraining order. This is very common in a messy divorce.

What we aren't seeing is the specific circumstances. In other words, what kind of abuse she is claiming happened, in order for the courts to rule in her favor to keep him out of the home. We also aren't seeing any followup.

I'm not insinuating that there wasn't any form of abuse going on, this "wording" from a document when she filed for separation is pretty standard though, so I don't really read anything into it.

Exactly. I think it's extremely irresponsible reporting to cite a boilerplate legal document from 12 years ago to suggest that the allegation is true or, if even it were, that it has something to do with this case. Also, like I said when it was posted the first time, unless the father's custody was restricted to supervised visitation, it wouldn't mean much anyway. A decade ago, and even still, the father of a toddler's custody is very likely to be "restricted" in the sense that it's less than the mother's parenting time. Especially if the father works f/t, is active military or otherwise travels a lot, etc., etc.

jmo

 

[Foxfire]

He would have been around 2 years old at that time. Your bolded part sounds like the typical wording used in a legal document to establish a restraining order. This is very common in a messy divorce.

What we aren't seeing is the specific circumstances. In other words, what kind of abuse she is claiming happened, in order for the courts to rule in her favor to keep him out of the home. We also aren't seeing any followup.

I'm not insinuating that there wasn't any form of abuse going on, this "wording" from a document when she filed for separation is pretty standard though, so I don't really read anything into it.

Yes, BeginnersLuck, the 'OR' in the bolded part of the restraining order could have meant any or all of the three stipulations. The visitation requirements, that she must be present is what leads me to this conclusion..

 

[Foxfire]

RE: What happened over the next five hours remains a mystery but when Chism was taken into custody by police in Topsfield, he was carrying Ritzer’s credit card and other forms of her identification.

Read more: http://www1.whdh.com/news/articles/...losed-grief-counselors-on-hand/#ixzz2jbUTBmQY

'Why would PC keep CR's identification, yet smash & discard her cell phone'? Were there other IDs of CR, or other personal items of her or others found during the search by LE of PC's home? Souvenirs?

 

[Karmady]

Yes, BeginnersLuck, the 'OR' in the bolded part of the restraining order could have meant any or all of the three stipulations. The visitation requirements, that she must be present is what leads me to this conclusion..

Where are you seeing the bolded part, please? I'm missing it completely.

 

[Foxfire]

Where are you seeing the bolded part, please? I'm missing it completely.

BBM for focus, Karmady...

Originally Posted by Foxfire View Post
http://www1.whdh.com/news/articles/l...s-family-life/

In 2001, Chism's mother accused her husband of adultery in the complaint she filed for separation. A court document cited physical abuse, sexual abuse, or a pattern of emotional abuse as the reason for the restriction.
The document doesn't specify who was abused, but the father's time with his two children was restricted.


Read more>

 

[BeginnersLuck]

Bumping- Article from 10/24/2013. I didn't notice that PC wore white gloves. This, combined with other of his confirmed actions indicates that he is forensically aware, and the attack/murder was obviously preplanned, imo. Imo, attending the movie was a feeble attempt of establishing an alibi.
Seems, PC would have been aware of the many security cameras, and using CR's credit cards at Wendys would have insured an indictment/conviction..
'Simply makes no sense to attempt to cover his tracks, while documenting his deviant behavior on security video'...

PC was described as an artist'.. "Tragically, sometimes life imitates art"... Imo, PC's art painted a very tragic, evil, & bleak picture.. "The answers to many of our questions will be hidden deep in the darkness of PC's sketch art, imo"..


http://www1.whdh.com/news/articles/...hool-remains-closed-grief-counselors-on-hand/

New details emerge in murder of Danvers teacher

Read more: http://www1.whdh.com/news/articles/...losed-grief-counselors-on-hand/#ixzz2jbKOSAGC

I agree that his art may be very useful in observing what may have been going on in his mind around that time period.

I'm just guessing, but if he was wearing white gloves, I'm thinking of disposable medical type gloves. The gloves just don't seem to fit in the picture. He made no other attempts to cover up this murder, other than move her body to another location. That doesn't really cover up much though, if there is a bloody scene in the bathroom. His behavior was very erratic. It's not like he left and went to practice or went home and just pretended like it was any other day.

If this was premeditated, he certainly didn't have a well thought out plan, if he didn't want to get caught.

Based on his actions, I do believe that there was psychosis involved. He was 14, this may have been his first episode.