MA MA - Molly Bish, 16, Warren, 27 Jun 2000

[Pettibon Junction]

Few other questions I have,

-Was Molly the 1st lifeguard there every day?

-Did she arrive the same time every day, or did her start times vary from day to day?

-What time was the rest of the staff due to arrive(if any were to) ?-IE how long would she be alone?

- In the days prior or after, were there any reports by staff of any suspicious persons in and around the pond area other than the individual her mother witnessed?

And about 10000 more, but those would suffice to start

I will say there's not enough personal info available on the victim to do a thorough Victimology report on this case unfortunately.

Molly Bish was a pretty, 16-year-old blonde girl from a small town who, despite working a job that required her to interact with strangers on a daily basis, was likely not worldly enough to recognize the mortal danger posed by the actions of a man approaching her with ill-intent. This is the kind of victim that a straight, white, male sexual predator would order from central casting if he could. But putting all that aside, the most significant aspect in Molly's becoming a victim, perhaps the central aspect, was the place where it occurred.

Looking again at that map of Comins Pond I posted a few days ago, I'm once more struck by how terribly isolated it is. That, and the fact that it was a municipal beach in a very small town, tells me that Molly's killer was a local and he was intimately familiar with this area. I worked at such a park when I was in college and in fact, grew up going there. I would see the same people, day in and day out: the walkers including it on their daily excursions, the older men who'd come in early in the morning to swim laps before the water became too crowded with the young, married women and their children who'd come before lunchtime to typically spend the day, older women (often retirees) who'd similarly show up to sunbathe and gossip, and the sportsmen (typically anglers) who'd leave with their catch by noon.

My point is this: whoever Molly's killer was, Comins was a part of his routine. When the weather was nice, he was there often. Look at the population I've listed above. We can easily discount the young moms and older women. That leaves the walkers, the early morning swimmers, the fishermen, and a fourth group I haven't mentioned: the parkers. Typically, these would be older men in cars who would hang out for a few minutes enjoying the view, reading a newspaper or enjoying a cup of coffee/cigarette before getting on with their day, or maybe stop by and eat lunch before heading back to work. (There are still active mills near my pond.) Magi Bish described just such a person the day before her daughter's abduction. Women's intuition counts for a lot and I am inclined to believe that this man was the killer. Molly may not have been too familiar with him yet, as it was still early in her summer job and she probably hadn't gotten much of an opportunity to get to know her regulars yet before her life was brutally snatched away from her.

It occurs to me now, brilliantly simple and tragically, likely too late, that the key to finding the identity of this man would lie with the young men and women who worked as lifeguards at Comins Pond during PREVIOUS summers: would any of them remember a man matching this description? The white car, the curious handlebar mustache? I'd bet they do, and could at the very least offer his first name and maybe several instances in which he looked or lingered too long and made them a bit uncomfortable.

This is not necessarily a guy who trolled around specifically looking to kill (though it is VERY possible he'd killed before) but nonetheless, kept an eye out for opportunity. In the unsolved CT River Valley murders up in NH and VT, profiler John Philpin compared that killer to a trapper, with the isolated rest stops, parking lots, and hiking trails where his victims were poached (to continue the metaphor) to a trap line set checked frequently for game. The guy who killed Molly Bish had to have been a similar sort, and Comins Pond is the key to solving her murder.

 

[Pettibon Junction]

I should also add that I wouldn't limit my scope to the staff of Comins Pond. Any similar recreation areas within a 20-mile radius should have been monitored, their past and present staff interviewed, and the description of the man Magi Bish saw distributed through the police and local parks departments. If this guy regularly trolled Comins Pond, then he would have a series of other locations that he also checked periodically, and someone would have noticed him.

 

[somequestions]

I should also add that I wouldn't limit my scope to the staff of Comins Pond. Any similar recreation areas within a 20-mile radius should have been monitored, their past and present staff interviewed, and the description of the man Magi Bish saw distributed through the police and local parks departments. If this guy regularly trolled Comins Pond, then he would have a series of other locations that he also checked periodically, and someone would have noticed him.

You make some good points. All I can say is that there is no book that can definitively say how a criminal will act in a given situation. If Magi Bish made eye contact the day before with her abductor, and he still chose to commit this kidnapping the next day then maybe he just did not care about an eyewitness who might remember him.

It is very difficult to say with any certainty how the kidnapper managed to kidnap Molly Bish without actually walking the layout of Commins Pond with this cemetery next to it. The part that is a bit strange to me is this path behind the pond. Is it a well-traveled foot path? It would look kind of weird to anyone who passes the kidnapper and Molly even if Molly were walking next to this person with her shoes off. I would take a stopwatch and see how long it takes to walk from the lifeguard chair to where the car was parked in the cemetery.

One thing Magi Bish said she did the day before was go out and sit with Molly on the beach for a while. I just thought the kidnapper might do a run through of his crime the day before and see her which brings me to another question. Other than the day of the kidnapping, did the cemetery worker see a white car parked in the cemetery on any of the previous days Molly Bish worked? What days did Molly Bish's schedule correspond to the cemetery worker? You can see the problem with the planning if the answer is no to the car.

 

[Kell1]

The one thing you have to remember , WAAAY before any theories can be constructed on this crime is that there's a chance LE has botched this case .

There's something to be said when you are filming a special on her and a TV crew along with the homicide detective are recovering potential evidence at the scene where she was found years afterward

If part of an investigation can be flawed the entire thing should be considered flawed , and you have to start back at square 1

EVERYTHING we know about this case can be wrong at that point .

Now does that mean it is botched ?... not necessarily, perhaps those pieces of material werent parts of her bathing suit, or perhaps they were buried and over time soil erosion exposed them, or even more tempting, ... maybe her killer returned them to the site

But because potential new evidence was found at the site where a search was most likely performed , which possibly indicates things were missed, the entire process has to be re-evaluated , you now have to go back through evidence and make sure procedures were followed , you have to make sure all the evidence was logged in this case, and you have to follow up on any reports . And since the case is cold you have to stop , and look back from the beginning to see if any other potential errors

I have looked at her case probably 200 times over the years, and though I have my theory , I'm hesitant to say much on it because of the very fact that at least one error in the case was possible.

I will give one piece of advice , not just in this case, but all cases, try to avoid speculation, I know its hard when you think you're on to something , but look at evidence from different angles.

I could probably give 5 different theories on this case , but without more personal info on the victim I would be speculating (albeit based on experience) myself

 

[Pettibon Junction]

I could probably give 5 different theories on this case , but without more personal info on the victim I would be speculating (albeit based on experience) myself

Respectfully, what else would you need to know about Molly that isn't already out there to be comfortable offering a theory regarding what might have happened to her? From the evidence at the scene (open first-aid kit) and the narrow window in which her abduction occurred, there's nothing to suggest she knew her killer (though he may have "known" her - which is supported by her mother's seeing a suspicious man at the park the day BEFORE) and that she was probably lured away under the auspices of her official duties as a caregiver. Everything so far points to a stranger crime, with Molly's prettiness, youth, and role of public liaison all being exploited by an experienced predator with a violent, esoteric sexual agenda. That right there IS the victimology.

 

[Kell1]

No it isnt ...plus youre not taking into account there may be errors in the investigation .

In order to investigate a cold case you sometimes have to go back and look at the evidence again , you have to step away from any preconceived notions and look solely at the evidence scientifically

 

[somequestions]

When it comes to the forum of discussion, I think most of what is written on Websleuths is speculation. Until you have the same information as police and the family, it is a lot harder to come up with solid conclusions and theories as to what might have happened to Molly Bish and who did it. I wrote on an earlier post that she might have had a blanket laid out, but I think that was wrong because I was guessing based on what I usually see at the beach.

Whoever the killer is in this case probably planned this crime out. I read somewhere that she was in a shallow grave. Where Molly Bish's body was found would require someone with some upper body strength to carry the body up the hill. Then there is the shovel. How do you carry both the body and the shovel without returning for at least one of them?

So maybe that answers the journalist's question on Dark Minds. Why did he not abduct Molly Bish on the day he saw her? Maybe it was because he had to dig the hole and leave his shovel. Then abduct her the next day, carry the body up the hill, and take his shovel.


On the Dark Minds episode, the ex-wife of the main suspect was interviewed and said he was always digging so it makes sense. That guy is currently in a Florida prison for murdering his girlfriend. With the way the crime was planned out it gave me the impression that whoever killed Molly Bish either knew her or knew digging. That is what I think, but I could be completely wrong. I am getting most of my information from shows like Dark Minds and Haunting Evidence and what I have read on Websleuths. All I can really do is guess.

 

[Kell1]

When it comes to the forum of discussion, I think most of what is written on Websleuths is speculation. Until you have the same information as police and the family, it is a lot harder to come up with solid conclusions and theories as to what might have happened to Molly Bish and who did it. I wrote on an earlier post that she might have had a blanket laid out, but I think that was wrong because I was guessing based on what I usually see at the beach.

Whoever the killer is in this case probably planned this crime out. I read somewhere that she was in a shallow grave. Where Molly Bish's body was found would require someone with some upper body strength to carry the body up the hill. Then there is the shovel. How do you carry both the body and the shovel without returning for at least one of them?

So maybe that answers the journalist's question on Dark Minds. Why did he not abduct Molly Bish on the day he saw her? Maybe it was because he had to dig the hole and leave his shovel. Then abduct her the next day, carry the body up the hill, and take his shovel.


On the Dark Minds episode, the ex-wife of the main suspect was interviewed and said he was always digging so it makes sense. That guy is currently in a Florida prison for murdering his girlfriend. With the way the crime was planned out it gave me the impression that whoever killed Molly Bish either knew her or knew digging. That is what I think, but I could be completely wrong. I am getting most of my information from shows like Dark Minds and Haunting Evidence and what I have read on Websleuths. All I can really do is guess.

I know and its wrong for me to expect those who havent been in law enforcement to understand some of what I write . I apoligize for that

Remember fiction isnt the best learning tool , if that were the case , Hannibal Lecter did it ... end of story. You are better off reading books from former Police, and FBI agents, studying the data that is out there etc...

The issue here is that the investigation, no matter what our initial feelings are on the case, may be compromised due to further evidence being found at a later date post investigation .

Just always take time to step away and look at the entire investigation (or any ) from different angles , it will make you a more thorough investigator, take time to read up from guys that have been there, youll actually start to hate TV shows because youll know whats BS and whats real...

Trust me

I will post an analysis shortly, its going to be long, because so little is known, but I will do my best

 

[Kell1]

Ok here goes

Before I start I will say that due to the fact that there were possible errors in the investigation, several possibilities could be possible in different aspects of this case.

I was unable to find much on the victim's background , but I believe the LE has cleared this , HOWEVER again it's possible that this aspect of the investigation may be flawed as well .

There are some things to understand before I review this case, I am doing this independently of any LE assistance or information available other than what is listed on the internet involving this case , therefore it cannot be considered anything more than speculative (hence why I'm reluctant to do so )

On a more human point I will say that this case is one that has bothered me for years, and Ill will state why in the analysis further down.

I will refrain from going into a bunch of possibilities of what could happen and will focus on what most likely did, who may have been responsible, and why.

There's good reason for alarm in this case,...... unlike MOST offenders who abduct and murder their victims, this isn't someone who had a bad , day, happened upon a kid walking home from school, and grabbed them, this isn't an opportunist, who most likely left a lot of evidence ....

This was a predator , even worse an experienced predator , who has most likely done this again , and has almost certainly had done (or attempted to do something similar) prior to this crime

IF he's not now , there's a very high likelihood this individual will reoffend multiple times, and could become a Serial Offender.

What tells us this ?

Comins pond sits back away from the road, isn't completely visible even from the parking area, and is not visible from the cemetery, which indicates this individual most likely wasn't just in the area by accident .

He was there for a reason.

This is the reason I asked if Molly was the 1st one there every day, I wanted to know if this individual was singling out Molly, or was he simply lying in wait for whomever arrived at Comins 1st.

Why do I want to know that? ....because it would explain a victim specification type for this offender, was he after a pretty blonde or would any female suffice ?

Why would that matter?, because if that's his preference he most likely has attempted this with victims who are similar in appearance IE he may have a victim type ..(Investigative consideration, look at similar abductions)- Its important to note i do not believe this individual is the same individual responsible for the abduction and murder of Holly Piirainen


This is a Sexually deviant psychopath, his psychological/psychosexual needs are met through forced sexual contact with an unwilling victim, it's unknown however if the murder of the victim itself is eroticized .

There was most likely some kind of triggering event prior to the abduction , it may have been employment related , or possibly an issue with an intimate , legal or financial .

I find it unlikely that this individual her mother saw, and the one that abducted her aren't one and the same, though it could be entirely coincidental, there was no apparent reason for someone to be at Comins that morning ahead of any staff, then to speed off when they encountered a protective parent .

And to make the story a little more eerie and sad, I FIRMLY believe the day Molly's mother saw the suspicious individual he planned THAT day to abduct Molly, it's important to note that once Magi saw the man she stayed with Molly and walked her into the beach area, when she returned THE INDIVIDUAL WAS STILL THERE SITTING IN HIS VEHICLE, he then met eyes with Mrs Bish again then sped off.

Its my personal belief he was diswayed by her protective instinct , and then altered his MO to approach from cover , knowing that her mother dropped her off, and that the parking lot was too risky.

This individual assessed risk and apparently altered his MO accordingly.. this is an experienced criminal.

What's more telling is though (if this was indeed the individual) was that he still committed himself to this crime even AFTER he was seen my Magi. This indicates a fixation, either on Molly, or the potential of being able to commit the crime itself because of the area ("good hunting ground") on the crime itself (the chance to abduct, rape and murder) a victim.

So was it the location and victim , or just the victim type ?

We can't be sure , it's my feeling that this individual was most likely familiar with Comins, he may have swam there, but had almost certainly conducted some type of surveillance on the area.

He knew someone would be there alone, I cant say for certain however he knew it would be Molly, but my feeling is that he did .

This is why I asked if the schedules remained the same at Comins , or did other lifeguards rotate start times . Or if Molly was the 1st one there every day

How did he approach?

Because he knew Molly's mother may be around I feel he waited in the woods near the cemetery where he could see the beach.

The beach area itself is out of view of the parking lot area (or at least it appears) once he was certain no one was around he approached Molly most likely in a friendly manner

From there I feel he produced a weapon of some type to get the teenager, to walk back barefoot through wooded area back to the cemetery where his vehicle was parked .

Why do I feel he had weapon?

He would need some way to force the victim to comply, he needed to get her out of there fast, but he also knew he had time , but he has to keep her from making noise or making a break for it , which is why I feel a firearm would be the most likely weapon to get her to his vehicle, its unknown however if the weapon was also used to cause her death.

From there we can only base what happens on studies done on abduction homicides and the data available due to those studies

It's MOST likely Molly was immediately transported to the vicinity where her body was found, that's where the sexual assault , and murder MOST LIKELY happened. Molly was most likely killed within the 1st 1-3 hours after she was abducted, and almost certainly within 24 hours post .

The most common cause of death in abduction homicides is manual strangulation

Theres a spatial relationship that exists between the body recovery site and the site where a victim is murdered, and its usually within 200 feet , meaning that its most often the same place.

Its not impossible that the rape/murder occurred in a vehicle with the body dump site being just that, but Id be willing to bet the car was near where she was found if it was.

The dump site is the most significant , this is a place the offenders are usually familiar with , because they need privacy to do what they intend to do then dump a body they had better be damn sure they are concealed.

He in all likelihood could have committed the crime in Comins, there's plenty of wooded areas surrounding the pond , but he knew he had to get her somewhere "safe"

So who was it ?

Most likely a white male older than 27 years old, my guess is mid to late 30's

would have most likely served time for violent sexual offenses in the past, possibly voyeurism, which would explain his age and criminal experience and sophistication

Triggering event prior to offense

Victim type in prior (and post) offenses may be similar in appearance to to Molly

Lives or works near Comins or the recovery site (Most likely a labor position)

Following the offense would expect to see an unnatural interest in the crime (following news, internet etc..)

Would expect to see an increase in the use of tobacco, or intoxicants such as alcohol or drugs post offense

May (Probably did) change appearance post offense

May alter appearance or get rid of his vehicle post offense (may have been seen cleaning the interior , painting the exterior) or gets rid of the car .

May have moved unexpectedly , with little or no explanation

May engage in "shedding" behavior-IE all the sudden getting rid of anything on his person the day of the abduction(many cases of people witnessing offenders burning belongings for no apparent reason until the offender is arrested)

May have taken trophies , such as clothing or pieces of clothing jewelry , or personal items

May return to the body dump site

Time of offense is early AM on a weekday, offender may have called out from work that day, or possibly arrived late. Possibly why the suspicious man in his car was reluctant to leave as well... he would need to account for that time the following day .

Someone close to him harbours suspicions (Co-workers/Intimate)
LE may have interviewed him already

Due to the factors governing this crime, namely his motives (Deviant sexual) and the success ha had with this crime there's a high likelihood his MO will remain static in subsequent crimes , this individual also has a HIGH likelihood of becoming a serial offender if he hasn't already

 

[CanManEh]

In my mind I cant say if he has done this before however i would bet on it and i would bet on him doing it more times after molly unless caught ..something that allways is in my head is that the pond was also a good fishing spot and if your like me and you know about fishing you know you wanna get a head start like 6am is normal and he could be out there every day she didnt start untill 8am so he would see her coming and no one would think twice about him as like i said it was a populour fishing spot..I have seen it mentioned about if it was owned by the town or was it just recreation..i do know that prety much the whole familly by that i mean molly and then her older sister and older brother all 3 had the same position as they were friends with the person who hired them they are good friends of the familly..I think this was a man that was a fisherman there for awhile and after knowing her routine he moved in on the oppertunitty that was there ..

 

[Pettibon Junction]

Ok here goes

Before I start I will say that due to the fact that there were possible errors in the investigation, several possibilities could be possible in different aspects of this case.

I was unable to find much on the victim's background , but I believe the LE has cleared this , HOWEVER again it's possible that this aspect of the investigation may be flawed as well .

There are some things to understand before I review this case, I am doing this independently of any LE assistance or information available other than what is listed on the internet involving this case , therefore it cannot be considered anything more than speculative (hence why I'm reluctant to do so )

On a more human point I will say that this case is one that has bothered me for years, and Ill will state why in the analysis further down.

I will refrain from going into a bunch of possibilities of what could happen and will focus on what most likely did, who may have been responsible, and why.

There's good reason for alarm in this case,...... unlike MOST offenders who abduct and murder their victims, this isn't someone who had a bad , day, happened upon a kid walking home from school, and grabbed them, this isn't an opportunist, who most likely left a lot of evidence ....

This was a predator , even worse an experienced predator , who has most likely done this again , and has almost certainly had done (or attempted to do something similar) prior to this crime

IF he's not now , there's a very high likelihood this individual will reoffend multiple times, and could become a Serial Offender.

What tells us this ?

Comins pond sits back away from the road, isn't completely visible even from the parking area, and is not visible from the cemetery, which indicates this individual most likely wasn't just in the area by accident .

He was there for a reason.

This is the reason I asked if Molly was the 1st one there every day, I wanted to know if this individual was singling out Molly, or was he simply lying in wait for whomever arrived at Comins 1st.

Why do I want to know that? ....because it would explain a victim specification type for this offender, was he after a pretty blonde or would any female suffice ?

Why would that matter?, because if that's his preference he most likely has attempted this with victims who are similar in appearance IE he may have a victim type ..(Investigative consideration, look at similar abductions)- Its important to note i do not believe this individual is the same individual responsible for the abduction and murder of Holly Piirainen


This is a Sexually deviant psychopath, his psychological/psychosexual needs are met through forced sexual contact with an unwilling victim, it's unknown however if the murder of the victim itself is eroticized .

There was most likely some kind of triggering event prior to the abduction , it may have been employment related , or possibly an issue with an intimate , legal or financial .

I find it unlikely that this individual her mother saw, and the one that abducted her aren't one and the same, though it could be entirely coincidental, there was no apparent reason for someone to be at Comins that morning ahead of any staff, then to speed off when they encountered a protective parent .

And to make the story a little more eerie and sad, I FIRMLY believe the day Molly's mother saw the suspicious individual he planned THAT day to abduct Molly, it's important to note that once Magi saw the man she stayed with Molly and walked her into the beach area, when she returned THE INDIVIDUAL WAS STILL THERE SITTING IN HIS VEHICLE, he then met eyes with Mrs Bish again then sped off.

Its my personal belief he was diswayed by her protective instinct , and then altered his MO to approach from cover , knowing that her mother dropped her off, and that the parking lot was too risky.

This individual assessed risk and apparently altered his MO accordingly.. this is an experienced criminal.

What's more telling is though (if this was indeed the individual) was that he still committed himself to this crime even AFTER he was seen my Magi. This indicates a fixation, either on Molly, or the potential of being able to commit the crime itself because of the area ("good hunting ground") on the crime itself (the chance to abduct, rape and murder) a victim.

So was it the location and victim , or just the victim type ?

We can't be sure , it's my feeling that this individual was most likely familiar with Comins, he may have swam there, but had almost certainly conducted some type of surveillance on the area.

He knew someone would be there alone, I cant say for certain however he knew it would be Molly, but my feeling is that he did .

This is why I asked if the schedules remained the same at Comins , or did other lifeguards rotate start times . Or if Molly was the 1st one there every day

How did he approach?

Because he knew Molly's mother may be around I feel he waited in the woods near the cemetery where he could see the beach.

The beach area itself is out of view of the parking lot area (or at least it appears) once he was certain no one was around he approached Molly most likely in a friendly manner

From there I feel he produced a weapon of some type to get the teenager, to walk back barefoot through wooded area back to the cemetery where his vehicle was parked .

Why do I feel he had weapon?

He would need some way to force the victim to comply, he needed to get her out of there fast, but he also knew he had time , but he has to keep her from making noise or making a break for it , which is why I feel a firearm would be the most likely weapon to get her to his vehicle, its unknown however if the weapon was also used to cause her death.

From there we can only base what happens on studies done on abduction homicides and the data available due to those studies

It's MOST likely Molly was immediately transported to the vicinity where her body was found, that's where the sexual assault , and murder MOST LIKELY happened. Molly was most likely killed within the 1st 1-3 hours after she was abducted, and almost certainly within 24 hours post .

The most common cause of death in abduction homicides is manual strangulation

Theres a spatial relationship that exists between the body recovery site and the site where a victim is murdered, and its usually within 200 feet , meaning that its most often the same place.

Its not impossible that the rape/murder occurred in a vehicle with the body dump site being just that, but Id be willing to bet the car was near where she was found if it was.

The dump site is the most significant , this is a place the offenders are usually familiar with , because they need privacy to do what they intend to do then dump a body they had better be damn sure they are concealed.

He in all likelihood could have committed the crime in Comins, there's plenty of wooded areas surrounding the pond , but he knew he had to get her somewhere "safe"

So who was it ?

Most likely a white male older than 27 years old, my guess is mid to late 30's

would have most likely served time for violent sexual offenses in the past, possibly voyeurism, which would explain his age and criminal experience and sophistication

Triggering event prior to offense

Victim type in prior (and post) offenses may be similar in appearance to to Molly

Lives or works near Comins or the recovery site (Most likely a labor position)

Following the offense would expect to see an unnatural interest in the crime (following news, internet etc..)

Would expect to see an increase in the use of tobacco, or intoxicants such as alcohol or drugs post offense

May (Probably did) change appearance post offense

May alter appearance or get rid of his vehicle post offense (may have been seen cleaning the interior , painting the exterior) or gets rid of the car .

May have moved unexpectedly , with little or no explanation

May engage in "shedding" behavior-IE all the sudden getting rid of anything on his person the day of the abduction(many cases of people witnessing offenders burning belongings for no apparent reason until the offender is arrested)

May have taken trophies , such as clothing or pieces of clothing jewelry , or personal items

May return to the body dump site

Time of offense is early AM on a weekday, offender may have called out from work that day, or possibly arrived late. Possibly why the suspicious man in his car was reluctant to leave as well... he would need to account for that time the following day .

Someone close to him harbours suspicions (Co-workers/Intimate)
LE may have interviewed him already

Due to the factors governing this crime, namely his motives (Deviant sexual) and the success ha had with this crime there's a high likelihood his MO will remain static in subsequent crimes , this individual also has a HIGH likelihood of becoming a serial offender if he hasn't already

I agree with 100% of this analysis. Thank you for sharing your insight.

 

[Kell1]

I agree with 100% of this analysis. Thank you for sharing your insight.

Again remember this could competely be wrong, but its based on what little evidence we do know .

I was unable to find out much about the victim, there were some things that stuck me as odd

I watched several interviews with her mother who explained the oddball circumstances of the day Molly went missing

-Friend is critically injured the day she goes missing in a car accident

Because Mollys father is a Parole officer, their background may include those who wish them harm , because of his LE ties. Therefore I can only hope an extremely thorough background check was done .

The one thing I can't express the most is this individual will most likely reoffend.


Unless hes dead, physically incapable, or incarcerated , this individual poses high risk to reoffend.

What to look for :

-Any abduction attempt in the area prior to, primarily those who were attempted by force.

-Any reports of suspicious individuals hanging around Comins pond, the wooded areas surrounding the pond, or the Cemetery in the days prior

-Any reports of an individual approaching female lifeguards at Comins, that made them feel uncomfortable (I know this is a broad ranging question, but there are reasons behind it)

REMEMBER this was only Mollys 5th day on the job, meaning that this individual would have to have been in that area within the 4 days prior .

Theres a good chance someone else may have seen him there.

Again I don't think this was an opportunity grab, which is the MOST common type of stranger abduction.

I could be wrong unless its common for those who fish the area to park in the Cemetery and walk down to the pond, but then id expect to see a some type of indication of such , perhaps even a rudimentary path from that area to the Pond, and that all depends on whether or not its even allowed to fish at the hours before the park is open .

This is partially why I was reluctant to speak on this case, it COULD be something else , because the potential of what what we don't know can change the entire course of the case.

This alone could change the profile of the individual responsible.

I will say that this may be what he used as a catalyst to commit the crime "I'm going fishing" , which would account for him not only not being home, or at work, but in the area as well, and provides an alibi for the day in question

Either way I believe he knew Molly would be there, Im not completely convinced that he may have passed up any other victims he may have come across that day if given the chance.

If he was a regular at that time, I feel someone would have questions about an individual who's always up at Comins (or the surrounding areas) fishing in the early am hours, or about someone who sneaks into the pond area before its open to fish.

When questioned about it , he may simply say he went elsewhere that day , as well as the day before.

Its my feeling that this is how he conducted surveillance on the pond area, he was doing so while conducting a seemingly normal activity.

AGAIN THIS ENTIRE ASSESSMENT COULD BE WRONG , but im basing it off what facts have been presented in this case.

We have to remember that there's still a chance the man in the car her mother saw was entirely coincidental , and may have had NOTHING to do with Molly's disappearance and murder.

 

[Pettibon Junction]

I could be wrong unless its common for those who fish the area to park in the Cemetery and walk down to the pond, but then id expect to see a some type of indication of such , perhaps even a rudimentary path from that area to the Pond, and that all depends on whether or not its even allowed to fish at the hours before the park is open...

If he was a regular at that time, I feel someone would have questions about an individual who's always up at Comins (or the surrounding areas) fishing in the early am hours, or about someone who sneaks into the pond area before its open to fish.

When questioned about it , he may simply say he went elsewhere that day , as well as the day before.

Its my feeling that this is how he conducted surveillance on the pond area, he was doing so while conducting a seemingly normal activity.

If it helps, when I was managing similar parks for my town's recreation department, fishing was allowed from sun-up to sundown and as long as anglers weren't trying to cast off too close to the designated beach/bathing area, we mostly left them alone. Typically, the beach was our priority and our dealings with fishermen and boaters was limited to making sure the parking stickers for their vehicles were up to date.

 

[Kell1]

If it helps, when I was managing similar parks for my town's recreation department, fishing was allowed from sun-up to sundown and as long as anglers weren't trying to cast off too close to the designated beach/bathing area, we mostly left them alone. Typically, the beach was our priority and our dealings with fishermen and boaters was limited to making sure the parking stickers for their vehicles were up to date.

It depends on the policies of the department at that particular location, if hes allowed to be there before the lifeguards

Again, theres a still the possibility this was a fisherman who saw Molly alone and decided to act on impulse.... IT cant be ruled out .

However Id ask why he chose to park at the cemetery, or if that was common amongst those who fished the area, or was this an anomaly ?

We cant say how Molly would have reacted if approached by a man with lets say a knife instead of a gun, .."Can you help me I cut my hand" then produce a the knife and tell her to walk .

But the location of where we "believe" his vehicle was parked and why is the most significant factor in this case.

Why not park in the lot out front and walk to the beach?

Could be he didn't want to walk that far? or as we surmise here that it provided a covert way to get his victim out of the park area unseen? .

Truthfully it could be either ....

If it was the latter at ALL, For ANY offense, even if it was simply a robbery, then you are dealing with forethought and planning, when you add in malice = Predatory behavior

This very factor (that it could be something else) coupled with the fact that errors were most likely made, in this case is why I was reluctant to post an analysis.

This could come back as 100% (though I tend to believe that most points are spot on) wrong

 

[somequestions]

Again remember this could competely be wrong, but its based on what little evidence we do know .

I was unable to find out much about the victim, there were some things that stuck me as odd

I watched several interviews with her mother who explained the oddball circumstances of the day Molly went missing

-Friend is critically injured the day she goes missing in a car accident

Because Mollys father is a Parole officer, their background may include those who wish them harm , because of his LE ties. Therefore I can only hope an extremely thorough background check was done .

The one thing I can't express the most is this individual will most likely reoffend.


Unless hes dead, physically incapable, or incarcerated , this individual poses high risk to reoffend.

What to look for :

-Any abduction attempt in the area prior to, primarily those who were attempted by force.

-Any reports of suspicious individuals hanging around Comins pond, the wooded areas surrounding the pond, or the Cemetery in the days prior

-Any reports of an individual approaching female lifeguards at Comins, that made them feel uncomfortable (I know this is a broad ranging question, but there are reasons behind it)

REMEMBER this was only Mollys 5th day on the job, meaning that this individual would have to have been in that area within the 4 days prior .

Theres a good chance someone else may have seen him there.

Again I don't think this was an opportunity grab, which is the MOST common type of stranger abduction.

I could be wrong unless its common for those who fish the area to park in the Cemetery and walk down to the pond, but then id expect to see a some type of indication of such , perhaps even a rudimentary path from that area to the Pond, and that all depends on whether or not its even allowed to fish at the hours before the park is open .

This is partially why I was reluctant to speak on this case, it COULD be something else , because the potential of what what we don't know can change the entire course of the case.

This alone could change the profile of the individual responsible.

I will say that this may be what he used as a catalyst to commit the crime "I'm going fishing" , which would account for him not only not being home, or at work, but in the area as well, and provides an alibi for the day in question

Either way I believe he knew Molly would be there, Im not completely convinced that he may have passed up any other victims he may have come across that day if given the chance.

If he was a regular at that time, I feel someone would have questions about an individual who's always up at Comins (or the surrounding areas) fishing in the early am hours, or about someone who sneaks into the pond area before its open to fish.

When questioned about it , he may simply say he went elsewhere that day , as well as the day before.

Its my feeling that this is how he conducted surveillance on the pond area, he was doing so while conducting a seemingly normal activity.

AGAIN THIS ENTIRE ASSESSMENT COULD BE WRONG , but im basing it off what facts have been presented in this case.

We have to remember that there's still a chance the man in the car her mother saw was entirely coincidental , and may have had NOTHING to do with Molly's disappearance and murder.

I agree with almost all of what you wrote except for the part about re-offending. What evidence is there to suggest that? Even if the victims have not been found they would be missing persons. So in a 10 mile radius of Commins Pond, how many unsolved female missing persons cases are there? How many other bodies are there buried on Whiskey Hill? Or the criminal left the area. This is about the only benefit of looking back at the past 15 1/2 years.

I agree completely about the tv shows although I know people that love them. There is this show called Castle where a writer helps police solve crimes. There is no way I would believe police would allow a writer into their investigation for fear of jeopardizing its integrity before a trial. So that is completely unbelievable to me.

Then there is CSI and NCIS. These shows the criminal is so brilliant that it takes brilliant people to catch him because his crimes have left so much evidence that he has actually outsmarted himself. Again I cannot watch it, but I have while others do because they love it.

As for Molly Bish's case the one thing that strikes me is the organization. Whoever it is probably is very organized so for example if you were to walk through the suspects house, yards, would that organization match up?

 

[Kell1]

I agree with almost all of what you wrote except for the part about re-offending. What evidence is there to suggest that?

The amount of planning in this case far exceeds that of a one off criminal. There is planning involved in this case, and the planning and forethought is all to obtain an unwilling victim, most likely to feed growing deviant sexual urges.

The recividism rates of sex offenders is well known , whether they are caught or not. Their urges dont stop, they may actually intensify over time as they go through a maturation process of their fantasies.

Abduction killers are no exception of all the criminal types are the MOST likely to become serial killers. In cases where the murder of the victim is eroticized, its even more likely, because now its not just sex....but the murder of the victim itself that feeds a psychological need to the offender



Even if the victims have not been found they would be missing persons. So in a 10 mile radius of Commins Pond, how many unsolved female missing persons cases are there? How many other bodies are there buried on Whiskey

I agree completely about the tv shows although I know people that love them. There is this show called Castle .

As for Molly Bish's case the one thing that strikes me is the organization. Whoever it is probably is very organized so for example if you were to walk through the suspects house, yards, would that organization match up?

Maybe nothing .....it doesnt always work like that, ive seen crime scenes that looked surgical, and the culprit lived like a hermit ...look at Ted Kaczynski...Meticulous in building his bombs, lived like a animal in a friggin shack .

His brother lived in a ditch he dug in the basement of their parents home....he was considered the "normal"one

 

[somequestions]

The amount of planning in this case far exceeds that of a one off criminal. There is planning involved in this case, and the planning and forethought is all to obtain an unwilling victim, most likely to feed growing deviant sexual urges.

The recividism rates of sex offenders is well known , whether they are caught or not. Their urges dont stop, they may actually intensify over time as they go through a maturation process of their fantasies.

Abduction killers are no exception of all the criminal types are the MOST likely to become serial killers. In cases where the murder of the victim is eroticized, its even more likely, because now its not just sex....but the murder of the victim itself that feeds a psychological need to the offender


Maybe nothing .....it doesnt always work like that, ive seen crime scenes that looked surgical, and the culprit lived like a hermit ...look at Ted Kaczynski...Meticulous in building his bombs, lived like a animal in a friggin shack .

His brother lived in a ditch he dug in the basement of their parents home....he was considered the "normal"one

I agree, especially about Ted Kaczynski. That is a great example. Most of what I write is not definitive. For example, I wrote before the suspect might have sand in their shoes on the day of the abduction, but there are many different reasons a person could have sand in their shoes, especially if they worked at the beach or they were dumping sand.

Organization, you already proved with your example, that a person can be brilliant and live in shambles. So that really does not matter either.

I just think in a case like this with no witnesses about the only thing to do is to try and come up with ideas that might help a person go in a certain direction towards solving it. I had another idea. I like re-creating a scene so I would try to get a sack filled with about the same weight as what Molly Bish weighed and try to take it up Whiskey Hill so I could see how difficult it would be.

I would then want a computer overlay of a human skeleton along with a map of where each bone was found on the side of hill since the predominant force you would think would be gravity. I think when a person would carry a body they would want their dominant hand to be under the heaviest part, the torso. So I would guess when the skull was found looking at the place where the shallow grave was that it was found to the right of that shallow grave if the person was right-handed. I know there are so many different factors that play into this, animals, wind, weather and soil erosion, or the killer dumping the body from a downward angle, but it is just another idea to see if something looks out of place. I think that is a unique aspect of the case, the body being found on a hill.

The last thing I would want would be all the files for female missing persons since June 27, 2000 within a 20 mile radius. I would want to see how many there are and whether any of them have any similarities to this case. I know that maybe the killer might have moved or maybe chose to kidnap from farther away, but it would be interesting to know. Maybe something leads to an interesting clue.

 

[Kell1]

=somequestions;12203389]I agree, especially about Ted Kaczynski. That is a great example. Most of what I write is not definitive. For example, I wrote before the suspect might have sand in their shoes on the day of the abduction, but there are many different reasons a person could have sand in their shoes, especially if they worked at the beach or they were dumping sand.

The problem is that everyone who visited that beach.. Staff, visitors, fisherman, even casual visitors , will have the same sand in their shoes, and as far as I know I don't know any way to match sand to an area without some type of anomaly evident in the sand itself that would make it able to match it

Organization, you already proved with your example, that a person can be brilliant and live in shambles. So that really does not matter either.

Organization does indeed matter, however it depends on what context you are applying it to . Organization tells us something a lot about the criminal, it means this wasn't a spur of the moment crime, it demonstrates sophistication that is most likely gained through experience, trial and error , but it also tells us he's going to be harder to catch.

I just think in a case like this with no witnesses about the only thing to do is to try and come up with ideas that might help a person go in a certain direction towards solving it. I had another idea. I like re-creating a scene so I would try to get a sack filled with about the same weight as what Molly Bish weighed and try to take it up Whiskey Hill so I could see how difficult it would be.

But what would that prove?.. remember he could have walked a living victim up there then killed her where she was found , as is usually the case , either way we know he took her up there whether or not she was alive when he did wouldn't change much . Unless, there was evidence to support a 3rd crime scene (Ie she was kept) but that's a rarity, in these types of cases.

I would then want a computer overlay of a human skeleton along with a map of where each bone was found on the side of hill since the predominant force you would think would be gravity. I think when a person would carry a body they would want their dominant hand to be under the heaviest part, the torso. So I would guess when the skull was found looking at the place where the shallow grave was that it was found to the right of that shallow grave if the person was right-handed. I know there are so many different factors that play into this, animals, wind, weather and soil erosion, or the killer dumping the body from a downward angle, but it is just another idea to see if something looks out of place. I think that is a unique aspect of the case, the body being found on a hill.

AS a human body decpomoses, there are physical changed the body itself will go through as part of the decomposition process. Chemical changes inside the decedent will sometimes cause the body to actually move sometimes (gas bloating can roll a body over etc..) in general a body will lay where it is until something disturbs it , usually its animals, and they can really do a number on a body in a short amount of time, let alone a long period where the body is exposed . Larger animals (Bear, Wolves etc..) can actually pulverize bone. They may take parts some distance from where the body lay .

The last thing I would want would be all the files for female missing persons since June 27, 2000 within a 20 mile radius. I would want to see how many there are and whether any of them have any similarities to this case. I know that maybe the killer might have moved or maybe chose to kidnap from farther away, but it would be interesting to know. Maybe something leads to an interesting clue.

This is where things can change a bit depending on what whether or not the investigation hasnt been compromosed, or if certain aspects of the crime have been withheld

Remember everything I wrote could be wrong

 

[somequestions]

The problem is that everyone who visited that beach.. Staff, visitors, fisherman, even casual visitors , will have the same sand in their shoes, and as far as I know I don't know any way to match sand to an area without some type of anomaly evident in the sand itself that would make it able to match it



Organization does indeed matter, however it depends on what context you are applying it to . Organization tells us something a lot about the criminal, it means this wasn't a spur of the moment crime, it demonstrates sophistication that is most likely gained through experience, trial and error , but it also tells us he's going to be harder to catch.



But what would that prove?.. remember he could have walked a living victim up there then killed her where she was found , as is usually the case , either way we know he took her up there whether or not she was alive when he did wouldn't change much . Unless, there was evidence to support a 3rd crime scene (Ie she was kept) but that's a rarity, in these types of cases.



AS a human body decpomoses, there are physical changed the body itself will go through as part of the decomposition process. Chemical changes inside the decedent will sometimes cause the body to actually move sometimes (gas bloating can roll a body over etc..) in general a body will lay where it is until something disturbs it , usually its animals, and they can really do a number on a body in a short amount of time, let alone a long period where the body is exposed . Larger animals (Bear, Wolves etc..) can actually pulverize bone. They may take parts some distance from where the body lay .



This is where things can change a bit depending on what whether or not the investigation hasnt been compromosed, or if certain aspects of the crime have been withheld

Remember everything I wrote could be wrong

It would be interesting to know what people's opinions are about the type of person who committed this abduction and murder.

In my opinion, I look at it the same way as most crimes. Most criminals do not plan, prepare, and perform surveillance. I think the murderer in this case saw her that day when he committed the crime. So it is probably someone who either knew her start time at work or someone who was already there(but by chance, not planned).

I think this person might have some type of fascination with looking at things from above or feeling comfortable they can see distance from afar. I think if they did return to the crime scene later they would look at it from above. I really do not know what that might mean. In terms of where they live, probably somewhere between Commins Pond in Warren and Whiskey Hill in Palmer. I do not think it is a stretch to say this person is comfortable with the area. The main suspect in a prison in Florida is probably a good suspect. Whether he is the person in the white car is another question.

That is my profile for this case. It is just a guess.

 

[somequestions]

I looked at a map about the locations in this case the other day. I probably should have done it earlier because it really cleared up some wrong impressions I had. I wanted to put this case of Molly Bish in perspective for others that might come across it. If I am wrong about some of the conclusions I make someone can correct me.

First when you look at the location where Commins Pond is, I was under the impression you entered the parking lot from a road where cars are passing. This is not necessarily the case. It is actually a dead end road called Commins Pond Road that is used to get to the parking lot. One way in, one way out, that is what it looks like.

Second now I think I understand why the main police officer the author interviews on Dark Minds is from West Brookfield. I was under the impression he was part of the original search effort because I thought police departments came together when they search. But after looking at a map it is probably more than just him being part of the search effort. It looks like Commins Pond is at the very southern end of the town of Warrens and St. Pauls Cemetary where it is thought Molly Bish was taken to is part of the town of Brookfield. That could be why the police officer is from Brookfield, because that is part of his jurisdiction.

Also I was under the impression that the cemetery where Molly Bish was taken was immediately behind Commins Pond. It is behind Commins Pond, but even if the white car was parked on the southernmost road of the cemetery it looks like from a map that the terrain of the cemetery is kind of hilly and that it would be at least a 500 ft walk to the car.

Finally there is where Molly Bish's body was found on a place called Whiskey Hill. There is a racetrack nearby, but what is interesting is that Ware Road seems to be the only direct route passing Whiskey Hill that takes you to the town of Ware. So the one thing I would change about my profile of this killer is that I think he lives between Commins Pond and the town of Ware. It makes more sense now. He buries the body because he thinks it will either never be found or if it is he will know about it, because he uses the road everyday and he has to because it is the best way. Nobody would question that.

But even that location does not make sense because the main suspect from Florida was from Southbridge which is southeast of Commins Pond and there is also a direct road to that town, Southbridge Road I think. More guesses but after seeing a map of the crime area, I think I understand it a whole lot better. There is still one last thing I could not understand. Whether the person knew the cemetery or whether they knew the pond, how did they know both? If the white car is part of the crime parked in the cemetery I am wrong about this not being planned. My point is in order to pull this off, how would the person know you could walk to the cemetery from the pond if there is no visual cue(because of the hill behind the lifeguard chair). Or how would they know you could get to the pond from the cemetery? Can you see either place from the other place? Or is it some type of shortcut people use to walk their dogs? The answer is that they have probably walked it before, but why? That is my question.

I hope this information helps others who look at this case.