VERDICT WATCH MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #14

[ObsessedNightOwl]

KR's car did not hit JO and his injuries were not caused by her car.

“You can’t deny the science and the physics,” Andrew Rentschler from ARCCA, testified at one point. ARCCA was hired by the FBI as part of a federal investigation into state law enforcement’s handling of the Read case.

Karen Read trial: Jury works through 3rd day of deliberations without verdict

Following 29 days of contentious testimony, a pair of hour-long closing arguments and another hour of instructions, 12 jurors are deliberating the fate of Karen Read.

www.wcvb.com

In my post I did not say that KR's car hit JOK.
I said that it hit "something. possibly the curb"
The point of the post was to offer a possible explanation
for the "did I hit him?" and "I hit him"
statements from KR that have been talked about.

 

[thebedbug]

"You can’t deny the science and the physics"

I got so excited when he said that in court. It seemed to me like the perfect way to end the trial. I was so sure that it would bring us to a full acquittal. Yet, here we are.

With all due respect to some guys who looked at some pictures, pretending like they are the indisputable final arbiters of what didn't happen is silly. They were taking their best guesses based on demonstrably incomplete evidence... and now, with their reputations publicly on the line, of course had no reason to do anything other than stick to their guns.

 

[Wishbone]

In my post I did not say that KR's car hit JOK.
I said that it hit "something. possibly the curb"
The point of the post was to offer a possible explanation
for the "did I hit him?" and "I hit him"
statements from KR that have been talked about.

I don't understand your point

 

[fluffypaste]

With all due respect to some guys who looked at some pictures, pretending like they are the indisputable final arbiters of what didn't happen is silly. They were taking their best guesses based on demonstrably incomplete evidence... and now, with their reputations publicly on the line, of course had no reason to do anything other than stick to their guns.

They're not indisputable. The science itself is indisputable. It's testable and repeatable. Anybody running the same tests would find the exact same results.

 

[kittythehare]

With all due respect to some guys who looked at some pictures, pretending like they are the indisputable final arbiters of what didn't happen is silly. They were taking their best guesses based on demonstrably incomplete evidence... and now, with their reputations publicly on the line, of course had no reason to do anything other than stick to their guns.

Are you including Dr Sheridan who had conducted 13000 autopsies in the 'silly'?

 

[Wishbone]

With all due respect to some guys who looked at some pictures, pretending like they are the indisputable final arbiters of what didn't happen is silly. They were taking their best guesses based on demonstrably incomplete evidence... and now, with their reputations publicly on the line, of course had no reason to do anything other than stick to their guns.

some guys an uninterested party(the FBI)retained to apply the LAWS OF PHYSICS not guesses to a situation that was purported to have happened but didn't.

 

[nightowl1975]

I am hoping they reached a late afternoon verdict and are going home to sleep on it like so many juries tend to do.

A lot of us said this Tuesday. And again yesterday. Waiting is hard. I can’t imagine for those actually involved.

 

[happy128]

I swore I would never get hooked on a trial again...let alone one that went this long....but I did....and so much of the rest of my life is on hold or getting accomplished very slowly. Now tomorrow I will be gone for llunch and early afternoon and bet something comes in. If this goes to next week I give up.

I'm glad we are in this together. I will be on a cruise next week...LOL I have invested way too much time in this not to see the verdict live.

 

[Giveusaclue]

Debatable.
She had several drinks but what was her tolerance?

I had a phenomenal capacity when I used to drink and I'm tiny. People, men mostly could not keep up with me.
They would collapse.
I never did, unfortunately.

Her blood C2h5Oh levels were not tested at the time.

I agree with this and also, when I was out with a group and wanted to “pretend” I was joining in I’d take shots and hide them in my main glass, then pour away (ground, plant pot). The fact she still had a glass while moving from place to place reminded me of doing the same (not chugging before leaving). Not that I’m saying she didn’t drink them, just a thing that made me think..

 

[fluffypaste]

I feel like if those guys had just been allowed to say "the FBI hired us to investigate and we determined that the victim was not struck by a car" then this would already be over. It's crazy to me that they're not allowed to just say who hired them; that we have this information, but the jury doesn't.

 

[waldojabba]

This just sucks. I was so confident that we were going to have a full acquittal by now, but now I have no clue what the outcome is going to be. I just hope that whichever jurors are pushing for an acquittal hold firm against any kind of compromise.

I suspect the NG jurors( I am one) are not likely to compromise bc science.
I am a broken record but those injuries on John are clearly not the result of a vehicle hitting him which was backed up by the two experts and many others.
So where does that leave things?
I would not read anything in to the jurors quitting at 345 vs 400 today. I was driving back to Mass today and any route that led to the shore or the Cape was jammed. So I am sure they are all exhausted and thinking about getting off the bus to their cars and then fighting traffic.
Tomorrow will be a worse traffic nightmare for them. Most jurors will want to be out of there as quickly as possible and hoping to be done and get away from that dreary courthouse forever and enjoy their fourth of july week.

So I think tomorrow is the day that we get a verdict or realize there is a holdout. I don't think we wil ever see a guilty verdoct but I do think if there is no verdict tomorrow that we could see a hung jury.
JMO

 

[nightowl1975]

RBBM -- BAM! That's how we know she's a murderer.

Clearly this is evidence she was planning to murder him even at the Waterfall earlier in the night! She kept her shoes on, just thinking of how glorious it would be to traipse through his house later with her shoes on in the house.

 

[waldojabba]

I agree with this and also, when I was out with a group and wanted to “pretend” I was joining in I’d take shots and hide them in my main glass, then pour away (ground, plant pot). The fact she still had a glass while moving from place to place reminded me of doing the same (not chugging before leaving). Not that I’m saying she didn’t drink them, just a thing that made me think..

So funny I have done the same thing.
I have clients that like to drink when they are in town. And they don't like to drink alone.
The plants at the bar I suspect have developed an acquired taste for fine scotch - bc the plants are always my place of choice when dumping a drink or more on the sly....
No one has ever been the wiser
JMO

 

[OldCop]

With all due respect to some guys who looked at some pictures, pretending like they are the indisputable final arbiters of what didn't happen is silly. They were taking their best guesses based on demonstrably incomplete evidence... and now, with their reputations publicly on the line, of course had no reason to do anything other than stick to their guns.

Respectfully, I don’t believe they looked at some pictures and took their best guesses. They studied the evidence provided to them by a federal law enforcement agency which included crime scene photos, (of which there were few), vehicle data analysis, the autopsy, other medical reports, and forensics data. They used this information and applied the laws of science, physics, kinetics and medicine and were able to conclude that JOK did not die because KR hit him with her SUV.
As a matter of fact, JOK was instrumental in providing the proof that KR did not kill him with her vehicle. His body showed absolutely no signs of being hit by any vehicle.
There was no guessing here.

 

[keek]

In my post I did not say that KR's car hit JOK.
I said that it hit "something. possibly the curb"
The point of the post was to offer a possible explanation
for the "did I hit him?" and "I hit him"
statements from KR that have been talked about.

Wasn't it pointed out that there was no curb on that side of the street?

 

[Knitty]

MOD NOTE:
- This is not a debate thread; it's a discussion thread.
- Everyone is allowed an opinion, even if it's different from yours.
- You don't have to reply to every post on the thread.
- Don't be a jerk, or I'll have to be a jerk. Being a jerk makes me cranky.

That's a repost so I can add:
- Talk about the case, not other members.
- If you start thinking that you just HAVE to make a snarky, ugly, demeaning, condescending comment aimed at another member . . . don't. Websleuths prefers that the members treat one another as if they are in Tricia's living room.

 

[nodamselindistress]

tricia, where is the microwave? We having popcorn now?

 

[Aquarian]

Wasn't it pointed out that there was no curb on that side of the street?

There was no sidewalk on Alberts side vs the across the street folk had a sidewalk.

 

[keek]

There was no sidewalk on Alberts side vs the across the street folk had a sidewalk.

Yes, that is right, I saw other side of the street.

 

[Giveusaclue]

Wasn't it pointed out that there was no curb on that side of the street?

From my understanding there was a kerb but no walkway. Could be wrong but moo.