VERDICT WATCH MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #14

[MyJoey]

Any opinions on how Karen cracked her tail light? Since the defense expert ruled out from hitting John or John’s Car ? Keeping in mind Karen knew she cracked it and told officers (in front of her parents) it happened last night. Also telling Kerry and Jen that morning.
Just curious what you think happened if you to believe the expert.

 

[MyJoey]

Thank you.
What's the general sense here on WS in terms of:
- whether she is guilty
- whether she will be found guilty

Thanks in advance!

General sense is not guilty, however there are a few of us that feel she is.

 

[k-mac]

Any opinions on how Karen cracked her tail light? Since the defense expert ruled out from hitting John or John’s Car ? Keeping in mind Karen knew she cracked it and told officers (in front of her parents) it happened last night. Also telling Kerry and Jen that morning.
Just curious what you think happened if you to believe the expert.

Proctor! no reason or theory necessary

 

[KSwizzle]

I feel like we have no idea how the taillight was cracked, the FBI hired experts could only “simulate” a similar breakage by shooting the cocktail glass at the taillight but they also showed it could not have been done by reversing into a human arm

It is 100 percent pure speculation how the taillight got broken as there was literally no blood or fluid from JOK body on any pieces, only touch dna which could reasonably be assumed he is the partner to Karen and could have touched her taillight regardless if they were fighting or not

There’s just no way to say how it was broken, but I believe the FBI hired experts when they say it was not broken by a car backing up into an arm which is what the CW said happened

 

[abyquinn]

Thank you.
What's the general sense here on WS in terms of:
- whether she is guilty
- whether she will be found guilty

Thanks in advance!

I have not followed this bc it’s been a fluster cluck every time I tried to catch up. It seems like here and other places there is a group who thinks she’s guilty, a group that thinks she’s NG and a group that thinks that she’s guilty but that hasn’t been proved in court. I don’t know.

 

[Jber]

Thank you.
What's the general sense here on WS in terms of:
- whether she is guilty
- whether she will be found guilty

Thanks in advance!

My general sense from reading the posts is that most WSers think she is not guilty (particularly after the testimony from the FBI-hired experts). A few have posted they think she is guilty, though.

Some mixed feelings on whether she will be found not guilty, or whether it could be a hung jury. Seems mostly to be worry over just never really knowing what a jury will do.

 

[Seni]

I honestly confuses me why she hasn't been hit with just a basic DUI charge. I suspect the reason is that they'd have to charge everyone who was there that night, then.

They didnt take alcohol readings from anyone else, I believe. Not even from Higgins who was driving snow plough and returned to work whilst intoxicated

 

[Misy]

I think Dr Rentschler the one FBI hired expert said it best when he said and I'm paraphrasing, we literally don't know how he got it, it could be anything, asphalt, concrete, a baseball bat etc, there's not enough evidence to say what happened to his head, reasonable doubt

I can’t remember why I originally thought this but I believe it could have been that his head hit the stairs leading down to the basement. That he was pushed or shoved during the attack and his head hit the stairs.

But I also listened again AJ’s cross examination of BA again, and JA brought up the fact that there was workout equipment down in the basement. He mentioned things like weights, barbells I think. Suggesting that JOK may have been struck in the back of the head with something like that.

??

MOO

 

[sunspun]

Any opinions on how Karen cracked her tail light? Since the defense expert ruled out from hitting John or John’s Car ? Keeping in mind Karen knew she cracked it and told officers (in front of her parents) it happened last night. Also telling Kerry and Jen that morning.
Just curious what you think happened if you to believe the expert.

I thought the possibility raised by the expert witness of it having been cracked by a glass thrown at it sounded convincing to me. BUT as you noted, how would KR have known it was cracked then? If JO had thrown his glass, possibly in anger, at her vehicle, and it cracked her tail light, she could easily have heard/seen that, and been aware that the noise she heard was her tail light breaking. But if she knew that, why wouldn't she have told anybody this? Might be explained by her being drunk and possibly blacked out that part. Other than that, no explanation I can think of, which would mean there must be some other answer as to how it was cracked.

I do think the expert could be right about some things he said, but still be wrong about that part. And IIRC, he did say that was just his opinion that she wouldn't have cracked it backing into JO's vehicle. I don't think they studied that aspect of the case thoroughly either, so it's possible he would have a different opinion had they done so.

Does raise more questions though, I agree.

 

[KSwizzle]

It’s odd because I get so caught up in the botched investigation, lack of evidence, corrupt police, talking about Jackson that I do truly forget sometimes that this was a person who was maybe murdered, maybe not, and he had a family, he stood up and took guardianship over children, it’s just a very controversial case that is almost perfect for tv, YouTube, podcasts and whatnot

 

[MyJoey]

I thought the possibility raised by the expert witness of it having been cracked by a glass thrown at it sounded convincing to me. BUT as you noted, how would KR have known it was cracked then? If JO had thrown his glass, possibly in anger, at her vehicle, and it cracked her tail light, she could easily have heard/seen that, and been aware that the noise she heard was her tail light breaking. But if she knew that, why wouldn't she have told anybody this? Might be explained by her being drunk and possibly blacked out that part. Other than that, no explanation I can think of, which would mean there must be some other answer as to how it was cracked.

I do think the expert could be right about some things he said, but still be wrong about that part. And IIRC, he did say that was just his opinion that she wouldn't have cracked it backing into JO's vehicle. I don't think they studied that aspect of the case thoroughly either, so it's possible he would have a different opinion had they done so.

Does raise more questions though, I agree.

I think both could be true, he threw a glass at it and she backed up and into him. I don’t think all accidents can be explained, especially freak ones like this. Although the glass would have been found more in the road area, I would think.

 

[LvsAMystry]

just reading the room..what do you guys think?

NG all counts due to reasonable doubt

 

[TIGER0822]

So why is it included in the autopsy report

My guess is they were trying to show all the cuts and bruises

 

[Vaderman]

I finally got home and watched the exchange with the judge today. Unreal.

Has she been that unprofessional the entire trial?

 

[Misy]

If the death is truly an accident, why don’t you just call 911 and get him medical treatment?

IMO, JOK was in a fight, altercation, ambush, whatever in the basement. I don’t believe anyone ever intended to kill him. I believe it involved Colin and both Brian’s. Something really bad happened, JOK hit his head in the stairs or was struck in the head with a great deal of force. Then panic. Get rid of the victim. Get rid of the bloody basement flooring and concrete. Replace those doors leading outside. Get rid of the dog who was just trying to protect her owner. .

JOK’s injuries were from the neck up! He had a bruise on the back of his hand (defense wound?). His shirt had holes through it where the marks on his arm was. Lots of them. Couldn’t possibly have been caused by twilight fragments.

The Albert’s (all of them), Higgins, and definitely the mccabes went into protective mode. And probably without much worry. Very well connected, LE some of them, we can get out of this with little (to none) investigation or problem.

As someone here posted (sorry can’t remember who) it is so simple and obvious. I really don’t get how everyone doesn’t see it.

MOO

 

[keek]

I finally got home and watched the exchange with the judge today. Unreal.

Has she been that unprofessional the entire trial?

Yes, especially when the jury is not present, then it is sweet dolly talk to them. You were not alone.

 

[MyJoey]

I finally got home and watched the exchange with the judge today. Unreal.

Has she been that unprofessional the entire trial?

I think Karen had it coming. She was laughing, shaking her head and turning to her parents. I do believe there is a rule of conduct in court, that all should follow.

 

[PamCake]

This photo has been plaguing me. I don’t know why. It received very little attention in light of the other injuries. But it is intriguing nonetheless. Any opinions as to how JO gets this injury? Clearly not from a car.
View attachment 513525

Is it a puncture? What are people speculating about this wound?

 

[TIGER0822]

I finally got home and watched the exchange with the judge today. Unreal.

Has she been that unprofessional the entire trial?

She was clearly biased. To the point she admitted into evidence a fight KR and JO had in Aruba which had nothing to do with the trial. A Defense witness was asked to give her final conclusion three times. Each time Lally objected and the judge sustained. That judge did a *lot wrong.

 

[Aquarian]

Is it a puncture? What are people speculating about this wound?

It is not an IO insertion site , which is when the cardiovascular system is collapsed rescuers go into the bone marrow of the tibia ( lower leg). The side of the knee has nothing they could insert to, so it is an injury of other sorts. Looks like some kind of puncture vs abrasion , imo.