VERDICT WATCH MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #14

[TIGER0822]

I will say this again. The drunken texts are exactly what I would expect from someone who just dropped her BF off at a party, and as she drove away she thought he is partying, I am not watching his kids for him. In an alcohol induced rage, she calls him ‘John where are you’ ‘John pick up the phone’ ‘John I F n hate you’ John where are you.

Whether or not guilty, I think the VM are exactly what I would expect in that scenario.
This is ugly behavior but typical in the circumstances.

 

[Aquarian]

Could a drunk (lot of them in the area) have tossed a mini one shot glass in the yard and it shattered?

Anything is possible , have no idk.

 

[Pipersand]

TBH I'm angry. All these weeks of testimony, and I cannot say with any degree of moral certainty how JO'K died. I blame the CW for failing to meet their burden. For not responding adequately to the science. This woman's life is in jeopardy and there is no question, JO'K deserved better.

I'm angry because no matter what the jury decides, the truth will remain elusive. That is not justice.

 

[ch_13]

I'm rather bemused that among the folks who think she hit him, no one can agree on the exact circumstances of how the collision occurred. It seems everyone has their own pet theory:

• It was on purpose/an accident
• The taillight hit John in the head/the arm/the knee/he kicked it/he threw a glass at it
• John fell on the road and crawled onto the lawn/was thrown onto the lawn by the collision
• John's head wounds come from the taillight/the asphalt/the curb/the fire hydrant/the frozen ground/a plow
• the arm lacerations were from the taillight/the wheel well/the underside of the SUV/Karen's nails/a stray dog/a thornbush

Pick one from each category and you too can have a bespoke theory of the crime that's just as good as anyone else's theory. It won't match the scientific evidence, but no matter, no one else's does either.

And I haven't heard anyone who agrees with Trooper Paul, the state's "expert" who claims John was sideswiped with his arm extended, spun counterclockwise, had his head hit the pavement and then was propelled 30' backwards. Not even Lally was in agreement, as he argued something different during his closing.

I don’t think all accidents can be explained, especially freak ones like this.

rsbm.

I think @MyJoey hit upon the prosecution's true theory of the case: "It's a complete mystery but somehow, in some way that we can't explain she definitely did it."

 

[louvillian08]

Any opinions on how Karen cracked her tail light? Since the defense expert ruled out from hitting John or John’s Car ? Keeping in mind Karen knew she cracked it and told officers (in front of her parents) it happened last night. Also telling Kerry and Jen that morning.
Just curious what you think happened if you to believe the expert.

The defense expert ruled out the damage causing an entirely shattered taillight. Not the cracked taillight that an MSP trooper testified to that was backed up with 3 different examples of photographic evidence. Which was remarkably different once in police custody

 

[louvillian08]

repost (dbm)

 

[clearskies1]

problem with this is that he winds up further away splayed out on the lawn... how? (I have also thought esp. with the storm, that he could have slipped and been hit by a vehicle backing up but it does not explain where his body winds up.)

Could he have staggered to where he wound up?

 

[k-mac]

I have to disagree on this. JO would have died by the head injuries. I’m not getting the feeling he ever had a pulse when EMT arrived. Yes, eventually hypothermia took place, but it was contributory not the initial COD, imo.

yeah your right Aquarian.
I always visualise him laying there aware of his predicament for hours.
Very cruel.

moo

 

[pavlovsdaughter]

Could he have staggered to where he wound up?

yeah your right Aquarian.
I always visualise him laying there aware of his predicament for hours.
Very cruel.

moo

Medical experts testified he would’ve been immediately incapacitated/unconscious.

 

[geevee]

Could he have staggered to where he wound up?

Both MEs agreed he would have been unconscious within seconds after the blow to the back of his head.

 

[nightowl1975]

I’m not getting the feeling he ever had a pulse when EMT arrived.

I suspect this is true. But the saying in the ER goes something like “you’re not dead til you’re warm and dead”, so I am not at all surprised it took a while after arriving at the ER for him to be pronounced dead.

 

[nightowl1975]

I think @MyJoey hit upon the prosecution's true theory of the case: "It's a complete mystery but somehow, in some way that we can't explain she definitely did it."

100% this. It’s absurd to think such a “theory” is sufficient in the US to send someone to prison. Sort of a “we don’t know how exactly, and the evidence doesn’t support any of our whackadoodle theories, but just trust us on this.”

Just, no.

 

[Warwick7]

I honestly believe that they were fighting on the drive over there and she was pissed he was insistent on going to the party and she didn't want to and/or was mad because she wasn't "invited." I think when he got out of the vehicle and got just past the vehicle, he slipped or fell due to either weather or just being drunk and he was down on his knees or crouched or what have you and she was so drunk and so pissed that she either already had her vehicle in reverse from her attempts to park or she thought she had it in drive, but had it in reverse by error because of drunkenness and after she finished looking at her phone, gunned the car to leave, but it went backward and hit him while he was already somewhat down and trying to get up. My dad hit the gas on his vehicle in reverse by mistake and you would not believe the damage that he did in a short space and span (luckily no people were involved). I don't think she intentionally hit him or killed him. But even in accidents a person who is culpable has some measure of punishment.
I don't believe the conspiracy cover-up theory.
Who knows what kind of animal attacked his arm while he lay dying. I think it was an animal that did the damage to his arm and that was not caused by the vehicle. As for the defensive wound to the front of his hand... He was drunk - he could have hit his hand on anything that night. I've hit my arm on doorknobs as I'm walking or hit the back of my hand on a corner of a table, etc. that left a bruise - and not because I've been drinking, but it can happen.
I believe it will be a hung jury.

BBM
This is just not possible, and this why:

Excellent quest asked by a member earlier:

Why is the key cycle associated with the infamous fast backup event? It happened only ONE time! And it was at a time when KR was nowhere near her vehicle and could not possibly be near her vehicle, since LE had already towed it away and taken it in to the Canton PD as evidence in the investigation.

KR did not back up and hit JO in any way shape or form.

 

[mrjitty]

As an aside, how can it be that police and their partners are driving to bars, getting smashed, and driving to parties? This feels like something out of the 1970s

 

[turaj]

Lally brought in photos of him way back in the beginning when family members were testifying. Photos of him in his convertible, etc. I believe it was an attempt to do what you're referring to (but as with everything Lally did, not very skillfully).

I missed that. Glad at least there were some..usually a prosecutor will end on that note to bring it all back to the real reason they are there. Lally may have intended to do that but he "ran out of time".

 

[Lilbirdie]

The FBI witnesses said the blunt force trauma to the head would have left him unconscious and unable to move. I still cannot believe that if it happened inside, their best plan was to carry him outside and leave him on the lawn. No matter how drunk they were, thats the best cover up they could come up with? That leaves me to believe that whatever happened, it happened outside. But it wasn’t the car.

 

[mzmarymac]

Good morning folks! Is it verdict day? We will see.

I do have something bugging me and has been for a while. I don't think it has been answered by anyone who believes he died in the house.

According to the defense theory that the flights of stairs on the health data were inside the house recorded on his phone, that would mean his phone was in the house. Then he died in the house and was brought outside later on. His phone was found under him. But there was apparently no data of movement after 12:30ish or whatever, correct? Wouldn't the phone have registered movement of some sort during the time when his body was moved outside, along with the phone?

 

[Moonstrawbs]

The FBI witnesses said the blunt force trauma to the head would have left him unconscious and unable to move. I still cannot believe that if it happened inside, their best plan was to carry him outside and leave him on the lawn. No matter how drunk they were, thats the best cover up they could come up with? That leaves me to believe that whatever happened, it happened outside. But it wasn’t the car.

Stranger things have happened. They haven't been investigated fully, the house wasn't searched. The fact his body was outside on their property didn't lead to any of that, so really if they were involved, it was a good idea. jmo.

 

[kittythehare]

The FBI witnesses said the blunt force trauma to the head would have left him unconscious and unable to move. I still cannot believe that if it happened inside, their best plan was to carry him outside and leave him on the lawn. No matter how drunk they were, thats the best cover up they could come up with? That leaves me to believe that whatever happened, it happened outside. But it wasn’t the car.

His body temp was 80 F when paramedics arrived. Had he been on the lawn for 5 or 6 hrs his body temp should have been a lot lower.

 

[kittythehare]

As an aside, how can it be that police and their partners are driving to bars, getting smashed, and driving to parties? This feels like something out of the 1970s

They clearly have a sense of entitlement and believe they are untouchable.