VERDICT WATCH MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #14

[lilyk]

Just a reminder because people keep saying it was an Apple Watch and IT WAS NOT - it was the Heath App on his Iphone.

Same mechanisms though.

 

[Aquarian]

I think they were not even close and lots of sparks flying in there. I am on the verge of thinking hung myself. I would think there would be a big incentive to stay and get it done if they thought they could.

I wonder what the sidebar was at the end today? If there was audible arguing noted by court fellas would the judge share that with the attys? Idk, but it just struck me.

 

[Chelly]

I find their leaving early today to be a signal that it is tough in that room and they are not close to a verdict. Most people if close would want to stay and try to finish this up today. I find this concerning and from the look on AJ's face so does he. His demeanor has really changed. Clearly there is disagreement amongst the jurors. I can't believe we start this again tomorrow. At this point I am expecting a note from the jurors.

I am hoping they reached a late afternoon verdict and are going home to sleep on it like so many juries tend to do.

 

[JenaTaoson]

One thing we can say, is that this jury has spent longer deciding her guilt than Trooper Proctor ever did.
ETA: sorry if someone has said this before....

 

[whitelilac]

Same mechanisms though.

But an iPhone is not worn, so if it was thrown it would not register steps.

 

[turaj]

I am hoping they reached a late afternoon verdict and are going home to sleep on it like so many juries tend to do.

one thing is certain something will happen tomorrow..either a verdict or a note.

 

[kittythehare]

I just don't believe there is anything that has been proven beyond a reasonable doubt other than she was drunk.

Debatable.
She had several drinks but what was her tolerance?

I had a phenomenal capacity when I used to drink and I'm tiny. People, men mostly could not keep up with me.
They would collapse.
I never did, unfortunately.

Her blood C2h5Oh levels were not tested at the time.

 

[MyJoey]

Closings are not evidence. We need to stick with the evidence here, even if we disagree on what it means.

 

[MyJoey]

Closing arguments are not evidence and cannot be considered such.
IMO.

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

Same mechanisms though.

Is it? Is a watch or phone more accurate? Are they both inaccurate in the same exact way for the same exact reasons? I have no Earthly idea but could you offer some insight? TIA

 

[turaj]

Debatable.
She had several drinks but what was her tolerance?

I had a phenomenal capacity when I used to drink and I'm tiny. People, men mostly could not keep up with me.
They would collapse.
I never did, unfortunately.

Her blood C2h5Oh levels were not tested at the time.

well true,,,no doubt better than than JO and she knew enough to get home to the children. It seems like these two drank a lot and fought when drinking..ie Aruba as one example. Neither seemed happy in the relationship at the end.

 

[Spectrix]

In the interest of science...

-She was there- she is not disputing this
-She was several fold over the legal limit- she is not disputing this
-She was driving her car- she is not disputing this
-Prosecution showed that her car made a highly unsafe backup maneuver recorded by the EDS system that she should know is unsafe; this is the intent (I don't buy the keystroke argument about the count, I trust the mileage argument)
-Her tail light is at the scene (disputed, but testified they were under the snow not on top of it which is difficult to fake without detection by bystanders)
-His DNA is on the tail light (I don't buy the touch DNA argument, nobody touches their girlfriend's tail light, and I don't buy the transfer from the blood in the cups argument. If someone planted this there would be micrograms of his DNA, not nanograms of his DNA). The fact that there is very little DNA is more incriminating, not less.
-Pieces of the tail light are on his clothes
-His phone GPS suggests he was in the exact same spot all night
-Karen Read even thinks hitting him was a reasonable explanation and shouted it in front of multiple witnesses.
-The FBI provided 3000 pages from their investigation to the defense, including Grand Jury Testimony and the only thing they found that they could use that might be exculpatory were some guys firing a glass at the tail light with a pneumatic cannon.
-After seeing what the FBI found the Judge allowed the trial to move forward, subjecting Karen to the possibility of conviction and prison.
-No dog DNA on the swabs from his clothes (you would expect some if he laid on the floor in their house or was attacked by the dog even if they didn't swab the exact spot where she bit)
-Chloe is only in Vermont and is apparently alive and well (it would have been easy for the defense to get a bite impressions but they didn't; it would have been foolish for the prosecution to do it because they would be handing the defense credibility and an easy way to confuse the Jury on cross examination, allowing upteen experts to come in and refute them)
-If they wanted to hide chloe they would have had her put down and cremated

@Curiousobserver, thank you, that is a thorough and well thought out list of evidence.

In contrast, all the defence managed to come up with was a couple of basic points

• The damage to the Lexus is not consistent with hitting a 220 pound man
• The damage to JOK is not consistent with being hit by a 7000 pound Lexus

Make of that what you will.

 

[LaineyJ]

Just randomly I checked my step count and stairs climbed on my Fitbit vs my iPhone. I don’t expect either are 100% accurate, there’s always room for error.

But my Fitbit, worn on my left wrist has 4x the amount of steps today than my phone does.
It has 3x the amount of flights climbed. (And these are actual stairs I did go up and down today)

Of course Fitbit is constantly worn whereas my phone isn’t, but today I was especially glued to my phone and carried it with me in my left hand probably 90% of the time I was moving today.

This means absolutely nothing especially since two different systems but I thought it was interesting.

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

Just randomly I checked my step count and stairs climbed on my Fitbit vs my iPhone. I don’t expect either are 100% accurate, there’s always room for error.

But my Fitbit, worn on my left wrist has 4x the amount of steps today than my phone does.
It has 3x the amount of flights climbed. (And these are actual stairs I did go up and down today)

Of course Fitbit is constantly worn whereas my phone isn’t, but today I was especially glued to my phone and carried it with me in my left hand probably 90% of the time I was moving today.

This means absolutely nothing especially since two different systems but I thought it was interesting.

Thank you! I really appreciate your experiment/the information.

 

[nodamselindistress]

Thank you for the link. I watched the first part and only saw KR's Lexus at JO's house, not at the sallyport. Lally mumbles so much I had a hard time hearing his questions but I never heard him say anything about how the taillight looked at the sallyport. Was it later on in the link, and do you know approximately where?

 

[mzmarymac]

As far as the "babysitter with benefits" thing. I don't think that was indicative of how she felt about the kids so much as how she felt about the relationship. I would imagine he may have made it clear those were HIS kids and HE decided their discipline and care and she had no say other than to watch over them with no pay. Maybe she would have liked to have been considered more of a step-mom or even a true mother to them at some point, but the relationship wasn't going anywhere. Sounds like JOK was a confirmed bachelor when he decided to take the kids and that may have never changed. JMO

 

[Odeto BJ]

I just don't believe there is anything that has been proven beyond a reasonable doubt other than she was drunk.

And it was snowing. Or it was about to snow.

 

[Moonstrawbs]

Just randomly I checked my step count and stairs climbed on my Fitbit vs my iPhone. I don’t expect either are 100% accurate, there’s always room for error.

But my Fitbit, worn on my left wrist has 4x the amount of steps today than my phone does.
It has 3x the amount of flights climbed. (And these are actual stairs I did go up and down today)

Of course Fitbit is constantly worn whereas my phone isn’t, but today I was especially glued to my phone and carried it with me in my left hand probably 90% of the time I was moving today.

This means absolutely nothing especially since two different systems but I thought it was interesting.

Any device that counts steps that is wearable is always more reliable compared to a phone in a pocket, even if you kept the phone in your hand the entire time.

 

[LaineyJ]

And it was snowing. Or it was about to snow.

Are you sure? Gonna need a source for that.

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

Any device that counts steps that is wearable is always more reliable compared to a phone in a pocket, even if you kept the phone in your hand the entire time.

Is there a reason it’s like that?