MISTRIAL MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #16

[keek]

Everybody was butt dialing that night, all the involved parties. Wildddddd.

Or...friction?

STAWPPPPP.

 

[kittythehare]

This had to be it..

It was game over for me when the dog walker claimed she'd never been inside their house..
The rehearsal theme collapsed entirely..
Poor coaching.

 

[kittythehare]

and the other dude ploughing imaginary snow before it arrived..

If they make a movie, it needs to be on the lines of The Life of Brian, is all.

 

[jepop]

This had to be it..

So sad I hav to miss discusion re Butt dials. quicgly adding one of the nice things to emerge from butt dial analysis is alliteration derrière dialing, credit of @I am not Sherlock H.

 

[keek]

So sad I hav to miss discusion re Butt dials. quicgly adding one of the nice things to emerge from butt dial analysis is alliteration derrière dialing, credit of @I am not Sherlock H.

Yes, he is a southern enough gentleman.

 

[sassyblue]

My 80+ year old father butt dials me at least 4 times a week with his IPhone. Mostly in the middle of my night.

There is a time difference between us and apparently he takes his phone to bed with him. So mystery solved from earlier posts today.

But I'm not buying that group of people's butt dialing. No way...no how.

 

[Trebor5591]

dbm

 

[pavlovsdaughter]

My mom butt dials me a lot with her iPhone, but she always fills my voicemail inbox with dead air because she hasn’t realized. The combo of repeated butt dials and no voicemails is what doesn’t make sense to me.

 

[Sachi]

I have explained this ad nauseum. JOK had not come home. JOK had young children at home he was caring for. Since taking care of those young children, JOK ALWAYS came home. So lets not act like him not coming home was some normal occurance and she should assume he's sleeping at a house he doesn't even know how to get to. JMO

This.

I imagine frozen ground could cause such an injury, if hit with the right force, at the right angle. But, I don't know.



I know that a lot of newer vehicles turn on and off automatically when they to a stop, and I am really not sure how a key cycle is defined. I am inclined to assume that Trooper Paul's data somehow makes sense, but if it doesn't, then it just emphasizes perhaps that we really don't know enough about what happened, to reconstruct exactly what happened.



In theory, the initial impact at a low speed would not have propelled him backwards, but it would have been just enough to propel him forward onto the back of the SUV, to change his angle and maybe lift his feet off of the ground. He would have then been propelled backwards upon further acceleration.



You are right that I am saying this. I don't think I am working backwards. "Karen obviously hit him" is what the evidence, in its entirety, states to me. At least, the evidence clearly suggests to me that Karen's SUV was involved in some sort of accident which occurred at the same approximate time as and at the same approximate location where John suffered injuries that directly or indirectly caused his death. And I can't think of another reasonable explanation for what happened to John which would be plausible enough to establish reasonable doubt.

this article.

Opinion | Karen Read’s legal team has pulled off a rare miracle in criminal defense

Read’s team has pulled off a rare miracle in criminal defense: They have constructed an alternate theory of police cover-up that actually has some evidence to support it.

www.msnbc.com

 

[Spectrix]

I imagine frozen ground could cause such an injury, if hit with the right force, at the right angle. But, I don't know.

My understanding of the conditions is that at the time of the supposed accident, the ground is unlikely to have been frozen. IE it wasn't cold enough in the lead up and it had only just started snowing. It takes a long time for the ground to freeze.

I know that a lot of newer vehicles turn on and off automatically when they to a stop, and I am really not sure how a key cycle is defined. I am inclined to assume that Trooper Paul's data somehow makes sense

A key cycle, in this context, is defined as the start button being pushed. Auto start/stop doesn't trigger a key cycle. Trooper Paul miscalculated the amount of keystrokes between when the accident occurred and the vehicle was finally tested. Key cycle #1162 is the one which had the data of the car reversing at 24MPH. This key cycle happened after the car was seized by the police.

In theory, the initial impact at a low speed would not have propelled him backwards, but it would have been just enough to propel him forward onto the back of the SUV, to change his angle and maybe lift his feet off of the ground. He would have then been propelled backwards upon further acceleration.

If JOK was hit with enough force to propel him anywhere, he would have at minimum bruising on his body. Trooper Paul is suggesting he was hit so hard that he travelled 30 feet. This would cause bruising, broken bones, organ damage etc.

You are right that I am saying this. I don't think I am working backwards. "Karen obviously hit him" is what the evidence, in its entirety, states to me.

I'm curious how you think this accident played out exactly. How do you figure that a 7000 pound Lexus hit a 220 pound man hard enough to propel him through the air and deposit him on someone's front lawn, without damaging his body aside from a bump on the head and a dog bitten arm?
It's preposterous.

--

 

[fluffypaste]

Correct. Here is what she said:
“she didn’t feel prosecutors had convinced her beyond a reasonable doubt that Read was guilty of the charges, WBZ reported.”

Juror in Karen Read trial speaks out. Will we hear from others?

The names of the jurors who sat on Karen Read’s trial will not be released, though they may choose to speak publicly about the case.

www.boston.com

It's just not fair that this juror spent the whole trial taking hyper-diligent notes and then got excluded from the final result.

 

[TIGER0822]

Or...friction?

Yes, but in this case we had phones taking turns butt dialing each other.

 

[TIGER0822]

and the other dude ploughing imaginary snow before it arrived..

If they make a movie, it needs to be on the lines of The Life of Brian, is all.

Monty Python?

 

[Charlot123]

They were still in a relationship. Who cares if "he was leaving her?" (IF) Have you ever been a relationship where you broke up, got back together, broke up, got back together, etc.? It's a typical relationship pattern--even if it isn't healthy. To say she's not a victim because of what you perceive his intentions to be is a huge, huge, huge reach.

IMO MOO

She was not the victim of JO's murder. Funny, my friends in MA are unaware of the case and laughed at the statement that something out of Norfolk courthouse has split the CW. I surely miss names like Canton that I saw on driving by I-95 but now, it seems, the topic is exhausted and what is left is free advertising for a couple of lawyers.

Happy Independence Day, when the Declaration of Independence was printed by John Dunlap, the printer of the Continental Congress!

 

[kittythehare]

Monty Python?

I dunno.. Is there a Brian in it?

 

[Luna20]

It was game over for me when the dog walker claimed she'd never been inside their house..
The rehearsal theme collapsed entirely..
Poor coaching.

Was the dog walker under-cover?

 

[Forest_Wood]

Speaking about POK's interview, specifically his reasoning for suspecting Karen on Jan 29th. Per his statement, it was his wife Erin who put the doubt in play, due to KR's quickly leaving the OK residence after returning from the hospital. Was that around ten or eleven am? What is not mentioned in there however, is Jen McCabe's 'version' of events had already been swirling in the air by then. JMC had contacted EVERYONE she could think of, including JOK's family. That information is included in her call log history, as long as she didn't delete it that is.

Do you think KR felt that 'funny feeling' that everyone is looking at you, and thinks you are an alcoholic murderer by that time? I would have. IMO

Poor Paul...he just can't see the trees..

Karen probably would have been exhausted from lack of sleep, hung over if she had been drunk, and emotionally drained from all the morning events (driving around, finding JOK's body, police interviews, hospital). By the time she got to the OK residence, she just would have needed to get some sleep, and she wanted to get her belongings. It didn't sound like she knew the rest of John's family very well, so sticking around might have been awkward for everyone. If she had been "guilty", would she have even showed up at all? I doubt it!

Which leads me to wonder, why wasn't she arrested and taken into custody that very morning?

I do wonder if after the OK family have time to reflect on everything uncovered during the trial, if they will be able to see how the behavior of the McCabes, Alberts, Higgins and Proctor contributed to the chaos of understanding John's death. And those animal bites ... how does that get reconciled?

MOO.

 

[Marie_1957]

My biggest takeaway from his interview was he doesn’t care about the evidence, Karen did it and she didn’t act the way they wanted after and she did it, and she did it.

The family has been through an unimaginable amount of trauma it’s hard to blame them for their convictions, but I’ll just have to respectfully disagree with his opinion that Karen hit him with a car, I don’t think he was even hit by any car

What got to me about his interview was how incensed he was over Proctor's PERSONAL phone being seized, with all the nasty texts on it, like poor Proctor was another "victim" in all of this, his life being ruined. He was also strangely upset that the FBI was called in to investigate, and he wants answers as to why that was ordered.

 

[Marie_1957]

I have scoured the internet, and cannot find anything to substantiate the claim that Yannetti initially said publically that it was a horrible "accident" and they would prove it in court. Anyone?

 

[mrjitty]

Well, I'm saying it can't fit with state theory so we disagree on that I guess. If the prosecution had an expert witness who was willing to say JO could have crawled from kerb to where he was found they would have had them on the stand.IMO. The actual ME was not even willing to say that, or Lally would have elicited as much from her to support what I guess might amount to a slightly less fantastic theory, jmo. Although once again, minus any bruising and a blood trail from the kerb to the lawn and the fact of the essentially noncontested expert evidence on dog scratches and dog bite, even if someone was willing to testify JO was not rendered unconscious immediately, such a theory would be unreasonable imo and test the bounds of credibility. Jmo

What I am getting at is because they didn't do a good enough job on the original crime scene documentation, the analysis and the presentation at trial - I think we can't ever know what actually happened BARD.

A proper investigation in the first hours, together with proper analysis, should have identified what likely did, and what did not happen.

That's all lost to us.

I do think there is an implication from some state evidence that he was hit by a car - but not enough for us to know what event actually caused his death. And if they can't prove a part of the Actus Reus then NG is the correct verdict.

From post number 453

"Certainly it's not consistent with getting hit by the car and ending up where he did, even if the ground is somehow hard enough to cause that type of an injury," he said of O'Keefe head injuries. "We don't really have enough evidence in this case to determine what one specific event actually caused that injury."

MOO