GUILTY MA - Vanessa Marcotte, 27, murdered, Princeton, 7 Aug 2016 #8 *Arrest*

[ForensicMass]

The victim in the Northborough case saw the attacker and should be able to identify if he is the same person who is accused of attacking VM.

Correct and I figured that this might have been a contributing reason to them not releasing his image for the first several days because they wanted to show the other victims a lineup. exposing his identity immediately upon his arrest would have compromised this effort

 

[ForensicMass]

So he went on lunch break to attempt a rape and maybe murder. If it was him

The attack occurred around the end of his typical working shift so it would not have been a lunch break for him but would have been after wor The attack occurred around the end of his typical working shift so it would not have been a lunch break for him but would have been after work . Or perhaps even on a day when he did not work.

 

[Evey]

The attack occurred around the end of his typical working shift so it would not have been a lunch break for him but would have been after wor The attack occurred around the end of his typical working shift so it would not have been a lunch break for him but would have been after work . Or perhaps even on a day when he did not work.

I was mainly joking about going on lunch and doing it since I wasn't aware of when his lunch or breaks are. But I agree that after work or maybe a day off when he comes back for something at his work but had planned to attack females there because he's noticed them using the area. Not sure if this lady was targeted or not but I think VM was. But I don't see him finding a specific girl for each attack unless he has way more free time than we know

 

[Rocky1]

https://www-nbcbayarea-com.cdn.ampp...t-Contractors-270081981.html?amp=y&amp_js_v=9

Check this article out. It is an accident involving a fedex 3rd party contractor. Informative on what the situation might be here with regards to AO job. Basically, Fedex Smartpost is a freight forwarder, uses 3rd party vendor for transport services from the fedex warehouse to the post offices. Look at the map of Northborough where the attack happened and as FM pointed out there is a fedex warehouse there. Specifically there is fedex ground warehouse, but there is also a fedex smartpost warehouse. The smartpost one is at the end of Talbot rd, which is where the attacker was seem running off to after failed attack.

Btw, how do i reply specifically to someone's post?thanks

To respond to someones post. Instead of clicking "Reply", click "Reply with quote"

 

[Rocky1]

The reason the cases do not compare in my mind is in the very nature of the two deaths. "Accidental Fall" murders are often the most difficult cases to prove since there is an inherent ALTERNATIVE EXPLANATION as to why the person died- they fell- off a cliff while hiking/ taking photos, down the stairs, or tripped and fell out a window.

In VMs case, she was jogging. And ended up half naked and strangled to death in the woods. There is no parallel to a "fall" death in her case. There is NO ALTERNATIVE EXPLANATION to murder, as I see it.

Those other cases lacked credible witnesses and physical evidence. Plain and simple.

Not the case here.

I agree with everything except your last sentence.
The witness put AO at the scene. The Dentist admitted he was at the scene. At the time of death in both cases, there were only two people there.
There was physical evidence including DNA at both scenes.
Two more things to add to the list of comparisons rather than differences.
I agree that it was and will be the facts in both cases that did/will determine the outcome, and not politics of some kind because some may think Princeton is a wealthy town. In comparison to a few other towns in Worcester County, (Bolton, Harvard etc) Princeton is like a 3rd world country.

 

[Blackcurrant]

To respond to someones post. Instead of clicking "Reply", click "Reply with quote"

I think I finally got it. I clicked on the "+ button before and it gave me a check mark and then I replied with the back arrow and the quote wasn't there. But now i pressed the other " in addition and I think it's working. Thanks Rocky!

 

[Dot#5t]

So do you think he's done it before?


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Absolutely!
JMO


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[Dot#5t]

Another job description and posting for FedEx Delivery Driver (likely 3rd party) posted March 2017 on Worcester Craigslist. Posting was for Full/Part-Time/Seasonal Schedules.

1. Posting states, "We are working in (Worcester County, MA) and dispatching out of the
Northboro, Massachusetts terminal. We will work with you and your schedule."

Description:
- No CDL or special license required. If you have driving experience and have driven a van, truck, limo in the past for work, then consider joining us.
- You must have either one year of driving experience for a business within the last three years or five years of driving experience for a business in the past ten years.
- Examples of driving experience can include: driving landscaping equipment or trucks, food service delivery, florist delivery, airport shuttle van driver, limo driver, driving construction equipment or trucks, taxi.
-Make extra money.
- We are working in (Worcester County, MA) and dispatching out of the
Northboro, Massachusetts terminal.
-WE WILL TRAIN YOU and WE WILL PAY while you are training.
-Compensation: Paid training and immediate pay increases with experience. Living wages and incentives. Join a great team!
https://worcester.craigslist.org/lbg/6047259698.html

Now, compare the 3rd party posting from Worcester Craigslist to the Courier/Driver job description from FedEx Careers, working DIRECTLY for FedEx. FedEx Corporate is much more stringent in its requirements AND emphasizes "Good verbal and written communication skills, human relations, and team player. Must be 21 years old or over. Customer orientated with good organizational skills."

2. "Courier/Driver"
Purpose of the Position:
To provide courteous and efficient delivery, sorting, and pick-up of packages and ensure shipment of packages by completing all necessary paperwork and checking shipments for conformance to FedEx Express features of service.
Minimum Requirements:
High School degree/Equivalent. Must possess appropriate license for vehicle assigned in accordance with specific country regulations. Good driving record. Good verbal and written communication skills, human relations, and team player. Must be 21 years old or over. Customer orientated with good organizational skills. Ability to lift 70 lbs. (32kgs) and to maneuver any single package weighing up to 150 lbs. (68kgs) with appropriate equipment. Must be able to work variable shifts including weekends and holidays when needed. Must be able to successfully complete mandatory training for this position."
http://www.fedex.com/co_english/contact/jobs.html

I definitely see a difference in tone and requirements of courier/drivers working for FedEx subcontractors and FedEx corporate. Blackcurrant's post about the fatal accident involving the FedEx third party driver (unlicensed) and information about the problem of negligent and loosely screened FedEx subcontractors really illustrated the problem and shows how AO could have obtained his job.
JMO


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[Dot#5t]

I am a special education teacher who serves 6 schools in a large inner city school district in Western MA that has a predominantly Hispanic population of Puerto Rican origin. Although large, the community is tightly knit and migration between PR and MA is common among singles and families. AO could have easily been talking to a friend or an extended family member in Spanish. The Worcester PR community is also large so I do not assume that he was isolated to speaking Spanish only with his brother or wife. It's highly likely that friends and associates from his area of PR also live in Worcester, Springfield, Holyoke, or Boston. In my opinion, we should not jump to conclusions that his brother is an accomplice without some lead or evidence from LE.
JMO


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[tlcya]

Some posts have been removed about a person not sleuthable.

 

[Evey]

I wonder if he ever asked his mom about things related to her job as if he wants to know because he's into true crime and then used the info she said for reasons she wasn't aware he planned to use it for. Like asking a harmless question about such and such case and then taking the thing she says to use to his advantage. I also wouldn't be surprised if he talked to her about the case because I'm sure she heard of it and worried for his safety and especially with the rest of the family heading there and maybe they even waited to move the wife and kids there because of it. And maybe he even made them wait more and said he wanted to wait so they hopefully caught the monster so they'd all be safe and waited for his wounds to heal first. I know if it was my mom she would be looking at the news for the area I moved to and would see that and worry so I wonder if his mom did.

I wish we knew the exact work hours and if it's in pairs and always the same pair as well and if it's work phones that they can look st records for(since I'm sure they use handless Bluetooth mostly for work) to see who it is he was speaking to when he talked to the post office lady and then ask them if he ever spoke about the murder. If the hours of work people said are correct then I don't see him being on the phone with anyone else because at 4am-11am most are working or sleeping or preparing for work and most can't sit and talk on the phone but someone else working with him could because of the handless Bluetooth. And I find the idea it's a friend from PR who got him the job possibly being who he talked with because most coworkers wouldn't be cool with creepy talk by some guy they barely know.

I really wonder what was in the pond. And I also wonder if he ever posted on here or made an account and if we'd find he made one here around the time of the crime and with how arrogant he is he probably talked the killer up but in reality was talking himself up but maybe so arrogant he didn't even try to point us in the other direction. It'll be ironic if he does turn out to have someone he did this with and we find he was posting theories about that back before he was caught. I never thought those to be likely but it would be very ironic. And maybe even on Reddit also. And he probably would use some stupidly obvious email with his name in it that we wouldn't think twice about back then before he was caught.

 

[Fred52]

So what's next? What happens on May 24th? Does the monster appear in court in shackles? Is this case already in front of a grand jury? Do they have to wait for murder charges?

 

[Cem75]

So what's next? What happens on May 24th? Does the monster appear in court in shackles? Is this case already in front of a grand jury? Do they have to wait for murder charges?

Just hoping that sketchball Jose Baez does not take on this case! He seems to have a knack for saving evil forces.


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[Rocky1]

So what's next? What happens on May 24th? Does the monster appear in court in shackles? Is this case already in front of a grand jury? Do they have to wait for murder charges?

What we saw in the last courtroom appearance was the arraignment where the charges are read, bail is set, the plea was entered, and the accused went from suspect, to defendant.

The next step on May 24th will be either a Preliminary Hearing in Leominster District Court, or a Grand Jury Indictment.
If a Preliminary Hearing takes place, A judge will hear from the Prosecuter, the witness that saw AO standing near the SUV and any other witnesses or evidence that the state has. He/she will then determine if there is enough to bring the case to trial. The Defense will also argue.
The same will happen if this case is bound over to a Grand Jury. The only difference is that the outcome will be determined by a selected jury, rather than a Judge, and only the Prosecution presents the case.
The objection is only to determine if there is enough probable cause to go to trial, and not to determine guilt or innocence.
If either determines there is not enough evidence, the proceedings are over, and AO walks.
If it is determined that there is enough probable cause, then a Bail reduction may be discussed. If you noticed near the end of the Arraignment the Judge said "Bail will be revisited either here, or in Superior Court" (Preliminary Hearing, or Grand Jury Proceedings.)


If in either case it is determined there is enough evidence, the next step will be Pre Trial Motions, where both the state and defense will argue what evidence can be used and what can't.

Then the case moves to trial.

No, AO won't appear in Shackles unless it is determined that he is a safety risk, nor will he appear in a prison uniform.
He has the right to maintain the appearance of innocence, aka "Garb Of Innocence" no matter how much evidence, or how gruesome the crime until convicted. That means..
A) He has the right to stand trial free from restraints.
B) He has the right to wear regular clothing, over prison clothing.
C) The courtroom can not appear to be overly guarded.

Some defendants wear a Stun Vest under their clothing, where they can be tased remotely. I believe Jodi Aries wore one, but I am not sure.

As far as murder charges go, The Prosecuter said they expect to file.
Nothing to base this on, but I assume that will happen before or on May 24th, if Ice/Homeland security is through running his background check.

 

[Rocky1]

This is not related to the proceedings, but I thought it was a nice thing to post.


https://www.boston.com/culture/heal...honor-slain-princeton-jogger-vanessa-marcotte

 

[Fred52]

Rocky1 thank you very much! Wouldn't the Grand Jury be the easier way to go? What's the benefit of a Preliminary Hearing? Also how much of this hearing will be open to media? Can the judge prosecution or defense bar the media from the proceedings? Thanks again for that great information.

 

[Cem75]

This is not related to the proceedings, but I thought it was a nice thing to post.


https://www.boston.com/culture/heal...honor-slain-princeton-jogger-vanessa-marcotte

Thanks Rocky1. This is a link to the Colleen Ritzer 5K for this Sunday:

http://www.stepupforcolleen.com/

Colleen was the Danvers teacher murdered by her minor student. The race has raised a lot of money in the past and I know some of the folks who organize it. Sad story but a wonderful cause for education scholarships.


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[Rocky1]

Rocky1 thank you very much! Wouldn't the Grand Jury be the easier way to go? What's the benefit of a Preliminary Hearing? Also how much of this hearing will be open to media? Can the judge prosecution or defense bar the media from the proceedings? Thanks again for that great information.

It's not a question of easier.
Not every state has a Grand Jury. About half the states in this country do not. Ma. does, and most of the time the Preliminary Hearing is held first, after the Defendants request, and then the case is bound over to the Grand Jury. The Preliminary Hearing must take place in Ma. within 30 days. If you recall in the Arraignment, the date was set beyond 30 days the Defense Attorney said it was in agreement with the Prosecution.
A case cannot be held in Ma.Superior Court without an indictment by a Grand Jury.
If there is a Grand Jury indictment before the Preliminary Hearing Due to the Prosecution requesting a Grand Jury Proceeding before the Preliminary Hearing, then the Hearing doesn't take place. "Indictment" means nothing more than the case has moved forward. There are some cases where an indictment takes place before an arrest is made.

If the Grand Jury returns "No Bill" or if in the Preliminary Hearings the Judge doesn't find enough evidence, the case is dismissed, and the Defendant walks on that charge. If the Prosecution then wants to continue because they feel they have enough evidence to convict, then they have to then get an indictment with another Grand Jury seating.
The benefit of a Preliminary hearing for the Defendant is that his Defense Attorney will argue the evidence against him.
In a Grand Jury, the panel of Jurors (23) only hear evidence from the Prosecution and witnesses. if the Defendant wishes to testify, he/she may but the Defense Attorney can not. Unlike a trial jury, not all jurors have to vote for the indictment/no bill. Only 12 out of the 23.
95% of the time an indictment is handed down.

Hearings may be open to the public/media, Grand Jury Proceedings are held in secret. It is up to the Judge whether he/she wants to allow cameras in Hearings or Trials although with the exception of the Grand Jury Proceedings, the courtroom must be open to the public even if Cams are not allowed.
In most federal courtrooms, live streaming is not allowed, nor is the media, but a member of the court may film the proceedings and release that at a later date.

 

[Rocky1]

Today in my travels, I decided to take a short detour through Worcester. Woodland St, past the home of Angelo Ortiz to be exact.
Although I assume AO's SUV was impounded, what I was really looking for was a "small black car."
Parked directly in front of the house was a black Honda Civic.

 

[Evey]

Today in my travels, I decided to take a short detour through Worcester. Woodland St, past the home of Angelo Ortiz to be exact.
Although I assume AO's SUV was impounded, what I was really looking for was a "small black car."
Parked directly in front of the house was a black Honda Civic.

Well remember they said someone who may have had access to a black or dark one so could it belong to his brother? I mean if he's lived here longer then I'm sure that's why he had a place and a car set up and Angelo maybe didn't yet but used his brothers car. It would make sense if he borrowed it since they added in the may have had access to t part when they told us about the SUV and personally I can't ever tell what kinda car one is so someone passing could think SUV if it wasn't one.