The idea that PJ did a poor job at the beginning was largely briefed by the McCanns to the media
Did they really do a poor job?
In reality they faced a daunting puzzle under extreme media scrutiny and had to cope with a gazillion false leads.
Madeleine McCann - Netflix documentary on this case
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The idea that PJ did a poor job at the beginning was largely briefed by the McCanns to the media
Did they really do a poor job?
In reality they faced a daunting puzzle under extreme media scrutiny and had to cope with a gazillion false leads.
Crimes like this are extremely rare so don't have nightmares and do sleep well
One of the oddest aspects is she was only 3 years old. An extremely unusual age for abduction
Mrs Marple
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Not securing the crime scene, not following up leads, finding a palm print that turned or to be one if their officers, not setting up road blocks quickly enough.. these are available from sources other than the McCanns. Even Aramal admits mistakes were made.
Keine Engel
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Mrs Marple
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Oh and the Tannerman witness said he came forward years ago but no one listened
Why did Madeleine McCann cops waste years investigating GP sighting?
Why did Madeleine McCann cops waste years investigating GP sighting?
Where was the crime scene? For all they knew the kid had wandered off. Also - the McCanns and co already tromped all through the crime scene. But actually, the location was secured within a few hours. But most damage was done before detectives were on the scene
Where should road blocks to set up?
Do UK police set up roadblocks when kids go missing?
Of course there were mistakes.
The specialist dogs should have come in from the beginning.
But in any event we should be careful of the smears against PJ that run through the UK media
e.g the Tabloids still refer to "disgraced cop" Amaral
But in what was is he disgraced? He was promoted and eventually quit the force to write his book. He has never been disgraced anywhere except in tabloid smears
Very familiar with all that thanks!
It's why I think the doco is nonsense.
Because Jane Tanner positively identified Murat as the man she saw?
Anyway - we are never going to solve the mystery here.
But disappointing the way the doco doesn't delve into the real issues
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Keine Engel
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But NOT the official PJ (Police) Legal Summary
OFFICIAL INQUIRY FILES and DOCUMENTS LEGAL SUMMARY
Polícia Judiciária (PJ) in the resolution of the disappearance of minor Madeleine McCann, demanded from it the performance or coordination of several diligences as described in the various files,
namely: the preservation of the location of the fact (although it had already been rummaged by numerous people as we will discuss ahead); several collections and examinations on the existence of eventual traces;
a circumstantiated photographic report; the installation, in the first 24 hours of an extensive operational scheme, including the participation of several police and civil protection forces, in a total of over 130 elements; the reinforcement, in the next 24 hours of said operational scheme, with the mobilisation of over 300 members of police forces and public entities; the installation of control posts on roads and on the Southern terrestrial border with Spain; the use of sniffer dog teams; the use of exceptional search and rescue teams (aerial, terrestrial and maritime), alerts and diffusion all over the country and abroad.
As a mere example, during the following weeks and on a permanent basis, two helicopters, four vessels and several all-road vehicles, apart from private airplanes and boats, were employed; in the same manner, the investigation operations were coordinated with the specific search operations, with hundreds of diligences performed, like the identification and the formal and informal hearing of citizens, door-to-door searches, in the impressive number of 443, at the residences and tourist resorts of Vila da Luz and its surroundings, the identification and search of vehicles, and searches on the terrain, in an area that started out covering 15 Km2, and progressively grew to 30Km2 (where special attention was paid to locations like wells, passages, tunnels, reservoirs and lakes).
During the following days, more than 700 persons who might possess some relevant information about the disappearance were formally and informally questioned, with the PJ using more than 100 officers from several departments of Portimao, Faro and Lisbon, who worked on a consecutive base of 24 hours per day to accomplish the task......
(Snipped
)P.J. POLICE FILES: LEGAL SUMMARY
But NOT the official PJ (Police) Legal Summary
OFFICIAL INQUIRY FILES and DOCUMENTS LEGAL SUMMARY
Polícia Judiciária (PJ) in the resolution of the disappearance of minor Madeleine McCann, demanded from it the performance or coordination of several diligences as described in the various files,
namely: the preservation of the location of the fact (although it had already been rummaged by numerous people as we will discuss ahead); several collections and examinations on the existence of eventual traces;
a circumstantiated photographic report; the installation, in the first 24 hours of an extensive operational scheme, including the participation of several police and civil protection forces, in a total of over 130 elements; the reinforcement, in the next 24 hours of said operational scheme, with the mobilisation of over 300 members of police forces and public entities; the installation of control posts on roads and on the Southern terrestrial border with Spain; the use of sniffer dog teams; the use of exceptional search and rescue teams (aerial, terrestrial and maritime), alerts and diffusion all over the country and abroad.
As a mere example, during the following weeks and on a permanent basis, two helicopters, four vessels and several all-road vehicles, apart from private airplanes and boats, were employed; in the same manner, the investigation operations were coordinated with the specific search operations, with hundreds of diligences performed, like the identification and the formal and informal hearing of citizens, door-to-door searches, in the impressive number of 443, at the residences and tourist resorts of Vila da Luz and its surroundings, the identification and search of vehicles, and searches on the terrain, in an area that started out covering 15 Km2, and progressively grew to 30Km2 (where special attention was paid to locations like wells, passages, tunnels, reservoirs and lakes).
During the following days, more than 700 persons who might possess some relevant information about the disappearance were formally and informally questioned, with the PJ using more than 100 officers from several departments of Portimao, Faro and Lisbon, who worked on a consecutive base of 24 hours per day to accomplish the task......
(Snipped
P.J. POLICE FILES: LEGAL SUMMARY
Exactly
Maybe one day "disgraced detective" and his colleagues will actually be thanked for the time they pored into this case and sacrifices they made in terms of their own families
Mrs Marple
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There's no getting away from the crime scene issue and their contamination of it. It was covered in boot prints and dog hairs. This can only have come from GNR/PJ. Or why they chased a sighting, allowed it to become pivotal, when they could have disregarded it. Mass of resource, being well meaning, working all the hours possible, doesn't equate to competence. Or results, as they found absolutely nothing of any value.
They did do house to house the next day:
Bridget O'Donnell on her time with Madeleine McCann in Portugal
'Later, there was a knock on our apartment door and we let the two men in. One was a uniformed Portuguese policeman, the other his translator. The translator had a squint and sweated slightly. He was breathless, perhaps a little excited. We later found out he was Robert Murat. He reminded me of a boy in my class at school who was bullied.
Through Murat we answered a few questions and gave our details, which the policeman wrote down on the back of a bit of paper. No notebook. Then he pointed to the photocopied picture of Madeleine on the table. "Is this your daughter?" he asked. "Er, no," we said. "That's the girl you are meant to be searching for." My heart sank for the McCanns.'
I haven't mentioned anything about GA being disgraced, that came from you guys. I'm sure he did the best he could under difficult circumstances. Although his comments on it being an MI5 cover up are pretty off the wall imho.
They did do house to house the next day:
Bridget O'Donnell on her time with Madeleine McCann in Portugal
'Later, there was a knock on our apartment door and we let the two men in. One was a uniformed Portuguese policeman, the other his translator. The translator had a squint and sweated slightly. He was breathless, perhaps a little excited. We later found out he was Robert Murat. He reminded me of a boy in my class at school who was bullied.
Through Murat we answered a few questions and gave our details, which the policeman wrote down on the back of a bit of paper. No notebook. Then he pointed to the photocopied picture of Madeleine on the table. "Is this your daughter?" he asked. "Er, no," we said. "That's the girl you are meant to be searching for." My heart sank for the McCanns.'
I haven't mentioned anything about GA being disgraced, that came from you guys. I'm sure he did the best he could under difficult circumstances. Although his comments on it being an MI5 cover up are pretty off the wall imho.
Yeah I know - i was just commenting on how the media smeared him
I agree there were mistakes, and we also have to factor in that Portugal is not as wealthy a country as the UK
But much of the wild criticism was unfair.
Has anyone ever come up with a believable theory as to how they could have disposed of her body if it was the parents? and that body never being found in all the searching that's been done? Am I right in saying they didn't have a car with them while they were on the holiday? (only 20 odd days after they got the rental car right?) I would've thought it'd be pretty tricky to make a body vanish with no vehicle to use and all their friends in close proximity that day. And if you're suggesting that they're all in on it I have to say that sounds ridiculous that they would all do that. It would make each and every one of them morally inept which seems unlikely.
People sometimes get lucky with this.
According to the McCanns themselves in their book, they were out by themselves searching in the early morning with no one around. Possibly they stashed the body temporary and moved it somewhere better. The police case is they moved the body in the hire car at a later date (they were not under surveillance)
So unusual but possible.
HayLouise
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Yes (23 days) I think until they got a rental car
Body language as a 'science' isn't really thought of as anything as meaningful as it used to be. It isn't a reliable indicator of truth/lies/guilt etc. And think about it, if people were capable of killing their child, hiding the body and lying about it for a decade, then they'd certainly be able to hide the body language cues that so called 'experts' use to read them. It's pretty much junk science.
It isn't their job to be likeable though, and for people who want to dislike them or think they are guilty, there would be nothing they could do to appease them. They'd be playing a dangerous game trying to please people.
Comments were made early on about how they failed Maddy or something along those lines (hard to remember now). There's only so many times they can flagellate themselves publicly about leaving her before THAT becomes the sole focus and not Maddy. Could you imagine how much worse it would make it if they repeatedly expressed how guilty they felt about it all? I'm certain they feel it, but repeatedly talking about it to the media would not have helped Maddy one iota. It wouldn't surprise me if they were thinking along the lines of "Let people hate us, as long as they are looking for Maddy".
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Mrs Marple
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Well...they were on vacation and we can assume they had suitcases. We have a couple that are large enough to hold a 3-4 year old child. Would folks, that night, looking for this child think to open a suitcase and look in it? I wouldn't. My thoughts would be that she wandered off or is playing hide and seek so I'd look in shower and in closet, maybe under beds. I'd run around outside yelling her name. Check places she had fun at like pool or kid club room and the such. When that doesn't turn up child, my mind would go to kidnapping and I would not look in luggage or upper cabinets or behind sofa. Or in ANY cars there (friend's rentals). Did they look in friend's apartments? I'd only check ones with other little friends' of the missing child. But probably not even thoroughly search those...just walk in and see if the child went to visit her friend. They didn't have to be in an alliance with the whole party but maybe just one set of friends?????
Hmm..the whole theory seems so unbelievable to me. They would've known the police would be round almost right away to search the property and secure it for evidence (if they were fully competent) and then why wouldn't you wait until everyone has gone to bed and say it happened in the night?? You wouldn't raise the alarm in the middle of dinner knowing that everyone will suddenly be on the streets looking for her...sorry just don't buy it.