Malaysia airlines plane may have crashed 239 people on board #14

[ToutCa]

Quote:
Originally Posted by trigger
So confused. So the two fisherman were right seeing a low flying plane? Right?

From what I've gathered, yes.
I wonder now if any of the other sightings are credible.
What with this "new" information...

Yep. Investigators have said all week the Northern Malaysian people who saw a low-flying plane probably saw MH-370. This isn't new.

The only credible sightings occurred in Malaysia from 1:20-1:45am or so, as the plane made the known altitude-shifting maneuvers reflected on military radar.

There are no credible eyewitness sightings of MH-370 after it left the Malaysian peninsula about 1:45am. Thus our struggle to locate it.

 

[ilovepierre]

We may have to wait awhile before it's clear WHEN the "left turn" was programmed.

Malaysia, no doubt concerned about liability, insists no "left turn" was shown on the 1:07am ACARs message. If true, that makes the pilots less likely as suspects.

A puzzling and tardy denial, as earlier reports had claimed the 1:07am ACARS message showed the "left turn" already programmed, casting suspicion on the pilots.

This is a high-stakes debate. We'll have to wait for more definitive, specific ACARS details from investigators.

Some reports are now saying the left turn was programmed after the last ACARS message. In between the time when MH370 left Malaysian airspace and entered Vietnam airspace. The flight path can be programmed/reprogrammed right in the cockpit and it only takes a couple of keystrokes to change everything.

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

This has been bugging me.

500 miles NORTH?

Can pieces of this plane actually be that far apart?
I mean, can ocean currents carry one piece that far away from another piece in 14 days (or so)?

Another source I just read said that the satellite sighting by France was 830 miles north of the current (Australian waters) search zone. Even crazier.

 

[JaimeSommers]

The Malaysian government better get its act together. There are people risking their lives to search for debris in the hellish Indian Ocean. If the plane never turned, they need to open their mouths and stop this before more innocent people lose their lives. My opinion only. (End rant.)

 

[jmcgladr]

I think the confusion comes from the fact that Malaysia has asserted that the flight plan was changed after the last voice and ACARS transmissions, while there was some American source which insisted it was before.

Unsure which is fact.


IMO and fully OT - Canada should be deploying most of her naval assets to the Arctic, because eventually Putin will be making a move there, and they’re not really in much of a geographic, or technological position to add much to the already heavy international presence involved in the search. Perhaps we could lend some of our SAR soldiers to spell the other crews which are sure to begin suffering fatigue if they aren’t already.

Re: your OT - scary thought! I hate to think of any part of Canada coming under control of that nutcase Putin!

 

[TracyLynnS]

When articles quote Malaysian authorities, who are they talking about?

This is the info I have so far. Anyone who wants to add to this short list or correct any errors I've made, please do so.

---

Malaysian Prime Minister - Najib Razak

CEO of the airline - Ahmad Jauhari Yahya (I think this is the man who said there was no dangerous cargo on board, just fruit. Then days later had to admit there was a cargo of lithium ion batteries.)

Acting Transportation Minister Datuk Seri Hishammuddin Tun Hussein (frequently called Hishammuddin Hussein or just Hishammuddin in news reports)

Malaysia's official news agency is Bernama

Inspector General of the Royal Malaysian Police force - Khalid Abu Bakar

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

Malaysian officials were already asked about this and said MH-370 plane did NOT have this System installed:



I don't see any info on if Boeing retro-fitted any other pre-2009 planes with the new anti-hijack remote control system.

Ah, thanks, ToutCa--just saw this post in catch-up reading. (I'm reading backwards, lol, these threads go so fast.)

 

[alioop]

And two passengers boarded using stolen passports: Pouria Nourmohammadi Mehrdad, 19, and Seyed Mohammed Reza Delavar, 29, Iranian men described by Interpol as migrants being smuggled into Europe.

Mohammad Mallaeibasir, 18, an information technology student in Kuala Lumpur, said the pair stayed in his apartment the night before they left. Mr. Mehrdad, a friend from high school in Tehran, told him he was starting a new life in Hamburg, Germany, where his mother was waiting. “He was quite nervous,” Mr. Mallaeibasir recalled. “I could see it on his face.”

The next night, he drove them to the airport and offered to help them check in, but they insisted on entering separately, Mr. Delavar first. The two high school buddies waited in the car for five to 10 minutes, smoking cigarettes, before Mr. Mehrdad got out to leave.

Mr. Mallaeibasir gave him a hug, told him to have a safe flight and watched as his friend carried a large backpack and a laptop computer bag into the terminal. That was the last he saw of him.
.

BBM
It makes sense that they would want to enter separately at the airport and if I was them I would have stayed well away from the other the whole time.

Looking at the second photo of them with their jackets on, looks to me like they are entering the airport TOGETHER. One is right behind the other coming through a door.

Edit. Maybe that is not from them entering the airport but well inside it. They are together though.

 

[Hatfield]

From what I've gathered, yes.
I wonder now if any of the other sightings are credible.
What with this "new" information...

I agree and think where they are looking now for the satellite images is just way too far south and is going to turn out to be a wash.

There was 1 fisherman I think who said he saw a fireball or something. I would like to see him reinterviewed and would like to have debris looked for in the area he said he saw the fire ball.

 

[Brightbird]

The Malaysian government better get its act together. There are people risking their lives to search for debris in the hellish Indian Ocean. If the plane never turned, they need to open their mouths and stop this before more innocent people lose their lives. My opinion only. (End rant.)

The left turn hasn't been disputed. The question is whether the turn was programmed before or after the last ACARS transmission at 1:07am. Very confusing.

 

[alioop]

Some reports are now saying the left turn was programmed after the last ACARS message. In between the time when MH370 left Malaysian airspace and entered Vietnam airspace. The flight path can be programmed/reprogrammed right in the cockpit and it only takes a couple of keystrokes to change everything.

I have always thought that it didn't make sense for anything obviously unusual to ATC to have happened until after the goodnight to Malaysian ATC if it was the pilot/s or others. Why possibly alert them to a change of route if the purpose was to then turn off communications in the gap between ATC's and then carry out a nefarious plan.

 

[Hatfield]

I have been watching CNN and Don try to be the mediator between the expert guests and the flight simulator people. Everyone is doing good except Don who keeps messing up and confusing the heck out of everyone. CNN needs to let the guests talk directly to the simulator guys. Don has made mistake after mistake as he tries to make any sense out of anything.

And this whole "Breaking News" every time they come back is ridiculous because there hasnt been any real breaking news since the plane disappeared. CNN needs to stop doing that because it is de-sensitising us to what breaking news really is.

 

[QueenD]

But CNN is reporting the plane turned and dropped to 12000 ft?..............

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

That's what I've been thinking for a while now.
In fact we don't even know if it was "All right, goodnight" or "Alright, goodnight." I stated a few threads back, that both those words are grammatically different.
And if this is a translation thing, we could very well have an incorrect translation of those final words.

Add to that the fact that journalists will write "all right" instead of "alright" in any case, as it is in the AP Stylebook now to do so.

I'll still use "alright" out of being an uncooperative stinker (and b/c I think it means something different than "all right")...but will switch if writing for publication. ;D

 

[Forensics]

This has been bugging me.

500 miles NORTH?

Can pieces of this plane actually be that far apart?
I mean, can ocean currents carry one piece that far away from another piece in 14 days (or so)?

Just a couple of quick comments which could help explain the different locations is that the plane could have exploded in flight, the debris therefore could be scattered over a large area. Another is that the currents move quickly in this stretch of the ocean, a report several days ago in the SMH said that strong westerly winds whip up giant swells and waves. The currents also extend through the water column as the region is so deep.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/national/miss...ndian-ocean-20140320-355yo.html#ixzz2wpoyZ8kQ

"It’s been [13] days that things have been drifting, so whatever is found now has moved a fair distance from where it originally struck, and that distance could be 500 to 1,000 kilometres," said Brad deYoung, professor of oceanography at Memorial University in St. John's on Thursday.

"But beyond that, the individual objects that fell would have moved apart, and so there could be pieces spread over a debris field now of tens or many tens of kilometres. The predominant winds and ocean currents in this part of the Indian Ocean would generally move the debris in an easterly direction from the crash site. The speed at which the debris would move would depend on the strength of the winds and the speed of the various surface and subsurface currents active in that part of the ocean. Curl, assuming a speed of about two to three knots for 13 days, estimates that, as of Thursday, a good place to start looking for the crash site would be around 1,100 kilometres west of where the suspected debris was spotted."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/malaysia-airlines-mh370-the-challenges-of-a-remote-ocean-search-1.2580125

 

[Forensics]

Just a couple of quick comments which could help explain the different locations is that the plane could have exploded in flight, the debris therefore could be scattered over a large area. Another is that the currents move quickly in this stretch of the ocean, a report several days ago in the SMH said that strong westerly winds whip up giant swells and waves. The currents also extend through the water column as the region is so deep.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/national/miss...ndian-ocean-20140320-355yo.html#ixzz2wpoyZ8kQ

"It’s been [13] days that things have been drifting, so whatever is found now has moved a fair distance from where it originally struck, and that distance could be 500 to 1,000 kilometres," said Brad deYoung, professor of oceanography at Memorial University in St. John's on Thursday.

"But beyond that, the individual objects that fell would have moved apart, and so there could be pieces spread over a debris field now of tens or many tens of kilometres. The predominant winds and ocean currents in this part of the Indian Ocean would generally move the debris in an easterly direction from the crash site. The speed at which the debris would move would depend on the strength of the winds and the speed of the various surface and subsurface currents active in that part of the ocean. Curl, assuming a speed of about two to three knots for 13 days, estimates that, as of Thursday, a good place to start looking for the crash site would be around 1,100 kilometres west of where the suspected debris was spotted."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/malaysia-airlines-mh370-the-challenges-of-a-remote-ocean-search-1.2580125

SORRY ABOUT THE LIME:facepalm:

 

[ElleElle]

So confused. So the two fisherman were right seeing a low flying plane? Right?

I believe fishermen before I believe anything else at this point. :moo:

 

[Tiepos]

Ok, I'm questioning whether Malaysian officials ever said anything about the turn west being pre-programmed. This is from the New York Times a week ago.



http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/18/world/asia/malaysia-airlines-flight.html

Thank you. I think this might be one area where the Malaysians haven’t backtracked at all. It’s been the Americans who have insisted all along that the new route was entered before ACARS was disabled.


Regarding all of this “gliding” business - please, someone correct me if I’m wrong, but an un-piloted plane isn’t going to smoothly glide on its own, is it?

The oft-cited cases of a plane gliding in for a water landing, whether there were survivors or not, involved a pilot actively working the controls to control descent, yes?

 

[Forensics]

This may have been already commented on but the following article is well worth a read. It is in point form and a quick read.

Amazing Facts Highlighted by Malaysian Airliner Mystery

http://abcnews.go.com/International...-malaysian-airliner-mystery/story?id=23019264

 

[JaimeSommers]

The left turn hasn't been disputed. The question is whether the turn was programmed before or after the last ACARS transmission at 1:07am. Very confusing.

I misunderstood posts #756 and #757 then. Thank you for clarifying. They still need to get their acts together, IMO.