Malaysia airlines plane may have crashed 239 people on board #9

[shygrl]

Not sure how true it is just because things change daily, but on fox they said it was confirmed the co-pilot was the one who said goodnight....not that it means anything really because they changed the story about the timing.

 

[AlwaysShocked]

CNN talking about reports of pilot's very strong ties with the opposition political group in Malaysia. Has been a member of an opposition group for "many years".

 

[LambChop]

When posting information unless you care to verify as an insider you must provide a link otherwise it will be considered a rumor.

Thanks

 

[popsicle]

Zaharie had planned to attend a community event this week to chaperon needy children on a mall shopping trip, Chong said.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...cea-11e3-a49e-76adc9210f19_story.html?hpid=z2

I don't think I knew that.

 

[Nova]

I'm sorry for offending anyone by bringing this map in here. I posted the map after listening to several days of conflicting stories regarding the facts surrounding the disappearance of MH370.

Is was not posted in a 'HAHAHA this is so funny' way.

My thoughts when I posted the map 'oh my word, they really have no idea where to look for this plane.'

I was frustrated and I'm sorry for offending anyone.




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It was clear to me, at least, that you were satirizing the conflicting and ever-broader description of the search area, not the potentially tragic loss of the plane or the suffering of passengers or their loved one.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

What I can't figure out is how the hijackers were so confident that the Malaysian military would NOT check out this "blip" in their radar? Because the whole thing seems to have been planned out so well, so I would think they would have planned that part out very well, instead of just taking a "chance." A chance that Malaysia would just ignore the blip. A chance that they and Vietnam ATC wouldn't notice the flight was "missing" on radar early on and start the search for the flight much earlier.

Hi, I'm only a whole thread plus posts from this thread behind!

Your post reminds me that at some level, and I really hate to say this, the authorities of Malaysia are in on this and knowlegeable about what happened to the plane. Nothing else makes sense at the moment imo.

We have a small library of books on topics related to SE Asia. Figure the odds that I boxed most of them up within the past year. A title left on the shelf is, Asia's New Little Dragons (The Dynamic Emergence of Indonesia, Thailand, and Malaysia), written by Steven Schlossstein (yes, three s's), copyright 1991.

Here's what's written on the jacket of the back cover ~

"Malaysia's bottom line is that it should have done much better. With its political system corrupt to the core, its people suppressed by a government that is moving ever closer to totalitarianism, and its social stability threatened by clearly racist policies, Malaysia is a nation with an inferiority complex."

Here's an interesting paragraph about Anwar Ibrahim (sodomy trial guy) ~ (pg. 256)

"In October 1987 Mahathir's Ministry of Education, headed then by Islamic fundamentalist Anwar Ibrahim, promoted a hundred non-Mandarin-trained Chinese teachers as senior assistants in Chinese primary schools throughout Malaysia. The Chinese community took this as a serious affront, which it clearly was, and acted unanimously in opposition. They held a rally to protest the appointments and called for a boycott of classes at affected Chinese schools. ...."

When the foreign press criticized Operation Lalang, Mahathir in turn charged that the foreign media simply censored comments that weren't critical of the ISA arrests. '"There is no free Western press,"' he said at the time. '"The only free press is in Malaysia"'.

Inbetween the words written above, there is a long explanation describing Mahathir's invocation of the Internal Security Act as a result of the people protesting. Mahathir's ISA police arrested 112 key political opponents and detained them without trial. He excluded several UMNO leaders who had contributed to the escalation in tension. The sweep and detention effort was named Operation Lalang.

UMNO alone, and later the New UMNO, is the group that dominates Malaysian politics. In other words, they rule as they please.

Do you trust this government?

 

[txsvicki]

I got an interesting share on FB but didn't know if it can be linked here or not. Someone researched and saw that another jet was on the exact same path and believes the missing one may have shadowed it due to getting SIA68, then branched off undetected and flown to the countries previously mentioned. Sorry if this has already been discussed.

 

[~n/t~]

Okay, now I'm worried- I have family living in Israel.lease:lease:lease:

I wouldn't worry. They have one of the best airport security and air defenses in the world.

Anyway it's just for precaution.

 

[MsFacetious]

I got an interesting share on FB but didn't know if it can be linked here or not. Someone researched and saw that another jet was on the exact same path and believes the missing one may have shadowed it due to getting SIA68, then branched off undetected and flown to the countries previously mentioned. Sorry if this has already been discussed.

Jon Ostrower ‏@jonostrower 1h

If #MH370 was going to shadow any other jetliner, it would have to be done visually in the middle of the night with no TCAS display.

https://twitter.com/jonostrower

 

[Nymeria]

As if the CIA/FBI/US hasn't looked into each person who was on that flight...

Also, what us the logic in holding the families hostage in hotel rooms? How long are they planning to keep them there with NO new information other than the plane is missing? Were they gathered immediately to collect data from them regarding their loved one that was in the plane?

This may have been answered, I am still catching up.
When the airline offered to fly whatever families wanted to go home, the families went ape poop on the airline.
They were extremely insulted that it seemed like they were trying to "get rid of them". They want answers, not a free ride home.

ETA- I just went and looked for a link. I found info about the offer, but not the families reaction (I heard they were angry on TV, so I guess I shoule make it "IMO"?).
"The airlines said that it would respect the will of the family members and make further arrangements for their accommodations whether they want to fly for Malaysia, stay in Beijing or go back to their home towns."

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/special/2014-03/17/c_133190644.htm

Either way, these families are really getting frustrated. This article talks about how they removed chairs from a PC so no one would throw them...then the families were angry because elderly relatives could not sit-

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...b78642-a862-11e3-b61e-8051b8b52d06_story.html

 

[kincaid]

What I can't figure out is how the hijackers were so confident that the Malaysian military would NOT check out this "blip" in their radar? Because the whole thing seems to have been planned out so well, so I would think they would have planned that part out very well, instead of just taking a "chance." A chance that Malaysia would just ignore the blip. A chance that they and Vietnam ATC wouldn't notice the flight was "missing" on radar early on and start the search for the flight much earlier.

I wonder if they could check if the pilot had ever flown a similar route with the transponder off before, experimenting what would have happened without transmitting.

At the same time, I hope investigators look at what should have been expected, not just what happened. Maybe the hijacker or pilot wanted to be intercepted and shot down.

 

[~n/t~]

Wondering if this is just out of extra caution or they received some sort of intelligence on this.

Precautionary measures but........

http://www.timesofisrael.com/ex-el-al-expert-iran-likely-involved-in-mh-370/

 

[kincaid]

I got an interesting share on FB but didn't know if it can be linked here or not. Someone researched and saw that another jet was on the exact same path and believes the missing one may have shadowed it due to getting SIA68, then branched off undetected and flown to the countries previously mentioned. Sorry if this has already been discussed.

Slate addresses that theory here.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/business_insider/2014/03/17/malaysia_airlines_flight_370_the_craziest_theory_yet.html?wpisrc=burger_bar

 

[lawstudent]

I feel like someone else must have posted this earlier, but I haven't seen it mentioned.

People seem to be interpreting "opposition party" as meaning some sort of radical or rebel group. That's not my understanding of what that term usually means.

From Wikipedia (so not sure if perfectly accurate):

"The Opposition in Malaysia is the group of political parties represented in the Parliament of Malaysia that are not in government either on their own or as part of a governing coalition. Note that this article uses the term government as it is used in parliamentary systems, i.e. meaning the administration or the cabinet, rather than the state.

Theoretically, according to the system of Westminster Democracy upon which the Malaysian political system is loosely based, the Opposition is seen as the alternative government and prepared to assume office should the incumbent government be defeated at a general election. Due to the domination of the Barisan Nasional (and its predecessor, the Alliance) coalition of the parliament since independence, this perception is generally not acknowledged and recognized by Malaysians, though the recent elections in 2008 have caused Anwar Ibrahim to declare the Opposition the "government in waiting"."

They have a coalition system - lots of minor parties, instead of two like the U.S. has. They don't have the power to make decisions, but they are a legitimate part of the government that may come in and out of power. So opposition status can come and go if they get enough votes - it's just whoever is not in power. It's like whoever happens to be the minority in Congress at the time. Am I interpreting this right? If so, it hardly points towards radicalism.

 

[AlwaysShocked]

This is from an article written the day after the plane disappeared:

"Retired pilot Capt Lim Khoy Hing, in his walk-through of the first hour of the flight, said a "transfer process" would take place once it reached the boundary marking Malaysia and Vietnam airspace.Lim, who flew the B777-200 model for MAS from 1997 to 2006 and has clocked 25,500 flying hours in a 44-year career, said Kuala Lumpur ground control will contact Ho Chi Minh to say that the aircraft is entering Vietnam's airspace and that the pilot will be contacting them."If this is not done within several minutes, alarm bells will ring, meaning an aircraft cannot go 'missing' for more than 10 minutes," the veteran pilot said.
- See more at: http://www.relax.com.sg/article/int...t-happens-in-the-cockpit#sthash.Np5FSjx2.dpuf

This is interesting information because we have never heard what happend after the Vietnam ATC was unable to contact the plane. I believe I read there was a delay of an hour or so in reporting it missing to the Malaysian government authorities, however. As I recall, they waited until the flight failed to show up in Bejing to report it?

 

[sleuthasaurus]

I'm so bothered by the fact that we may never have answers. We've read that background checks are being carried out on all of the passengers but that some countries are slower to get those back (sorry I can't remember where exactly but I read that several threads back) But unless someone has a conviction, how can they say that someone is capable of running amok or threatening the pilots? Everyday people are quietly mad all of the time. There are three in my immediate family for example, total certifiable nutters, two of them violent, but no criminal history or medical history. And what mother/father is going to volunteer, the information that, oh, yeah, we always knew he was a bit weird, maybe it was him..

 

[Nova]

Yes, that one. Thanks.

Can't people in the media read maps?

There is no 20 countries it would have to pass through. It does not pass over India, Pakistan, or Afghanistan - not even Bangladesh. That is - if and big IF these "satellite pings" info. is correct.

Also it is very interesting how the plane seems to to right above Bangladesh and Myanmar, making sure not to cross into those countries - instead making sure to stay inside China.

aa, they estimate that the plane still had at least an hour's worth of fuel when the 8:11 "handshake" took place. So it could have turned at 8:12 and flown 200 miles or more from the "arc".

So the original search area included not just the arc (which you'll recall is NOT a flight path, just a range of places the plane could have been at the last ping) but 200 miles on both sides of it. That's how the theoretical search area comes to include India, Afghanistan, etc. It's really a 400-mile-wide swath, not just a simple arc.

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

Much to my surprise, CNN explained this rather well yesterday afternoon.

ONE satellite sends a "handshake" (i.e., automatic signal) to ONE plane and the plane responds. The time it takes for the signal to get to the plane and return gives them the distance ("X miles") between the satellite and the plane. (Signals travel at a constant speed: the speed of light.) (This process is repeated hundreds of times per hour with hundreds of planes.)

But one ping can't tell them the direction the "handshake" travelled. So they are left with a circle around the satellite of X miles in all directions.

That circle has been narrowed down to the two arcs based on factors like time travelled, amount of fuel, speed capacity of the 777, etc. But there is nothing (except human hunches) to say whether the flight went north or south. (It didn't have enough time or fuel to reach the east and west quadrants of the circle by 8:11.)

It would take a SECOND satellite to enable them to triangulate (remember Pythagoras) and pinpoint the actual location of the plane at the time of the ping. GPS uses three satellites and, with a fourth one, can also give altitude of the plane (or your car).

Bottom line: if the "ping" info is correct, then the plane was somewhere along one of those arcs at 8:11 a.m. It does NOT tell us anything about which way the plane was headed or how it got to that point. They estimate MA370 had about an hour of fuel left at the time of the ping, so they are searching an area about 200 miles on both sides of the arcs.

Thank you, Nova! Great post, and most comprehensive writing I've read on CNN for 2 weeks (at least).

 

[ElleElle]

I'm not going to lie, I love the simulator on cnn.

Eta: anyone else watching just now realized the guy in the simulator just said you have to go down to the electronics bay to unplug the ACARS and then Wolf was like "yeah it can be turned off from the cockpit" or something to that extent?


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I just caught the FSX on CNN, and I really hope they are able to dig something up to at least give us something.

 

[Hatfield]

I believe it's an extra little drop-down seat in the cockpit (behind the pilots, sitting sideways) that is a courtesy seat available for other (non-piloting) pilots from the airline to use when needing to go to the intended destination to pilot an aircraft from.

Hope that convoluted sentence made sense.

Thank you for replying. I somehow missed your reply earlier and wanted to thank you. And someone else also replied that stewardesses sometimes have those little drop down seats too.

Thanks so much because I never heard them called "jump seats" and that term was being thrown around a lot yesterday and I was confused what it was.