Malaysia Flight MH17 shot down in Ukraine. 298 aboard. 7/17/2014 - #3

[BJsleuth]

JMO, but I think there are many "respectable" entities in this world that owe money to many mafias

That's probable.

 

[BJsleuth]

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/jul/21/both-sydney-a-league-clubs-mh17-disaster

Western Sydney Wanderers will pay tribute to Jack O'Brien, 25, by wearing black armbands and holding a moment of silence before their match against Macarthur Rams at Campbelltown on Wednesday night.

 

[gramcracker]

I am so grateful that I have never had the misfortune to be in the middle of a war zone. :twocents:

there, but for the Grace of the Universe, goes every one of us

 

[BJsleuth]

Texx, you asked what kind of consequences there would be from this? It's just on Sky News now that it's "unclear what mechanism would be used to bring those responsible to justice."

Earlier, there was someone else on who said that had it not been declared an act of terrorism, then they would have been tried of committing war crimes but because it's been deemed terrorism, nobody quite knows who or how justice will be dealt with.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

I think they're getting us used to the idea that nobody will face justice for this IMO.

 

[BJsleuth]

I think they're getting us used to the idea that nobody will face justice for this IMO.

Considering Ukraine has Russian weapons and Russia (and the Russian rebels) has Russian weapons, how do you prove who actually fired the SAM?

 

[drsleuth]

Interactive seating chart for MH-17

The list of passengers that boarded Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 in Amsterdam headed for Kuala Lumpur included a Dutch senator, AIDS activists, a nun and families traveling together to visit loved ones. See where they were sitting, who they were traveling with and learn more about their lives before the plane was shot down, killing everyone on board.

http://graphics.wsj.com/documents/mh17-seatmap/#4f

 

[drsleuth]

Sky News Australia ‏@SkyNewsAust 2h

LIVE CH 601: @TonyAbbottMHR our understanding is the train is expected to arrive after 8:30am AEST but there are many uncertainties. #MH17

https://twitter.com/search?q=#mh17&src=typd

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Considering Ukraine has Russian weapons and Russia (and the Russian rebels) has Russian weapons, how do you prove who actually fired the SAM?

You can't and apart from that let's face it, this has happened before a number of times and nobody has ever been prosecuted. Perhaps that is right .. Perhaps the focus should be on making commercial flights safer and avoiding active war zones with these kinds of weapons. Considering the number of planes the rebels had shot out of the sky leading up to this eastern Ukraine should have been declared a no fly zone.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Now they're arguing that Putin should still come to G20 .. Sky News .. Looks like the commentators have started to chill ..

 

[drsleuth]

I hope that all the journalists/reporters are going to receive the help, that they will need, to come to terms with what they have seen & reported ( if they ever can :-( )

http://www.theguardian.com/media/20...-reporter-colin-brazier-crash-victims-luggage

But so is understanding the boundaries of decency and taste. And from time to time, we screw up.

At the weekend I got things wrong. If there was someone to apologise to in person, I would. While presenting Sky's lunchtime coverage of the flight MH17 disaster, I stooped down to look at a piece of debris. It was a child's suitcase. I put my hand inside and lifted up a water bottle and a set of keys. As I did so my mental circuit-breaker finally engaged and I apologised instantly on-air for what I was doing.

The crash site of flight MH17 is like the set of a horror story. Except that movies are never allowed to show what we saw over the weekend. As I type I can smell the nauseating scent of death that clings to me still.

<modsnip>

And so during that lunchtime broadcast I stood above a pile of belongings, pointing to items strewn across the ground. Out of the corner of my eye I spotted a pink drinking flask. It looked familiar. My six-year-old daughter, Kitty, has one just like it.

I bent down and, what my Twitter critics cannot hear - because of the sound quality of internet replays of the broadcast - is that I had lost it. It is a cardinal sin of broadcasting, in my book anyway, to start blubbing on-air. I fought for some self-control, not thinking all that clearly as I did so.

These poor people & the things they have seen, smelt, heard.............

 

[SilkySifaka]

I think this was either an act of terrorism, or a war crime and deserves punishing. There was no attempt to speak to the plane (unlike when the US shot one down after many attempts), these separatists are illegitimate whose only wish is to destabalize a sovereign nation and has the backing of a power that wants to take back a sovereign nation.The people involved aren't even Ukrainian but Russian citizens according to everything said on CNN today including by our secretary of state.

IT IS NOT OK TO BLOW A CIVILIAN PASSENGER JET OUT OF THE SKY. Worse Putin KNEW there were civilian jets up there.

 

[BJsleuth]

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/wor...ng-mh17-bodies-in-kharkiv-20140722-zvpyt.html

Train carrying bodies of victims of MH-17 expected to arrive five hours late. Train expected to arrive in Kharkiv at Midday local time.

 

[redheadedgal]

I think this was either an act of terrorism, or a war crime and deserves punishing. There was no attempt to speak to the plane (unlike when the US shot one down after many attempts), these separatists are illegitimate whose only wish is to destabalize a sovereign nation and has the backing of a power that wants to take back a sovereign nation.The people involved aren't even Ukrainian but Russian citizens according to everything said on CNN today including by our secretary of state.

IT IS NOT OK TO BLOW A CIVILIAN PASSENGER JET OUT OF THE SKY. Worse Putin KNEW there were civilian jets up there.

thanks silky for pointing out the clear difference b/w mh17 and flight 655.

 

[BJsleuth]

You can't and apart from that let's face it, this has happened before a number of times and nobody has ever been prosecuted. Perhaps that is right .. Perhaps the focus should be on making commercial flights safer and avoiding active war zones with these kinds of weapons. Considering the number of planes the rebels had shot out of the sky leading up to this eastern Ukraine should have been declared a no fly zone.

I did hear on Sky News that KO (whoever or whatever that is) had warned all countries back in April not to fly over it. The US, Australia and many others re-routed their flights. When there's a war zone, I don't believe we can trust that they will abide by the rules and you're right, maybe all we can do is learn from this how to prevent such incidents happening again.

 

[redheadedgal]

I did hear on Sky News that KO (whoever or whatever that is) had warned all countries back in April not to fly over it. The US, Australia and many others re-routed their flights. When there's a war zone, I don't believe we can trust that they will abide by the rules and you're right, maybe all we can do is learn from this how to prevent such incidents happening again.

ICAO -- the warning was b/c it wasn't clear who was controlling the air space over a very specific area in the ukraine, meaning two different sets of intructions could be given to an aircraft, not b/c the area was unsafe due to a "war zone". the area mentioned in the safety brief was nowhere near where mh17 was flying.

 

[drsleuth]

http://thenewdaily.com.au/news/2014/07/22/experts-board-mh17-disaster-id-team/

A mortuary technician and two odontologists (specialists in identifying victims from dental records) from the Victorian Institute of Forensic Medicine and a Victoria Police fingerprint expert will join Prof Ranson and the remainder of the Australian contingent.

He said the team will gather dental and pathology specimens, examine jewellery, personal effects and photograph tattoos and other marks, collect medical records and comparable DNA from the victims&#8217; home countries based on the MH17 passenger manifest and combine the lab and external records to make formal identifications.

The international forensic team will take care to manage the physical and psychological health of its members, he said.

&#8220;We are used to death and we are trained to deal with the families, deal with the medical practitioners, and the other people we gather information from,&#8221; he said.

 

[drsleuth]

http://www.newrepublic.com/node/118782

Did you know Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 was full of corpses when it took off from Amsterdam? Did you know that, for some darkly inexplicable reason, on July 17, MH17 moved off the standard flight path that it had taken every time before, and moved north, toward rebel-held areas outside Donetsk? Or that the dispatchers summoned the plane lower just before the crash? Or that the plane had been recently reinsured? Or that the Ukrainian army has air defense systems in the area? Or that it was the result of the Ukrainian military mistaking MH17 for Putin’s presidential plane, which looks strangely similar?

Did you know that the crash of MH17 was all part of an American conspiracy to provoke a big war with Russia?

Well, it’s all true—at least if you live in Russia, because this is the Malaysia Airlines crash story that you’d be seeing.


:facepalm: :gaah: :banghead:

 

[Elley Mae]

Russian Billionaires in `Horror’ as Putin Risks Isolation

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-...aires-in-horror-as-putin-risks-isolation.html

“The economic and business elite is just in horror,” said Igor Bunin, who heads the Center for Political Technology in Moscow. Nobody will speak out because of the implicit threat of retribution, Bunin said by phone yesterday. “Any sign of rebellion and they’ll be brought to their knees.”

Branding Russia, like Iran or Libya under Muammar Qaddafi, a “state-sponsor of terrorism,” as the British defense minister suggested, would be a major move that would have “a very significant impact on Russia and companies dealing with Russia,” Timothy Ash, an emerging-market economist at Standard Bank Plc in London, said by e-mail.

 

[BJsleuth]

Prime Minister Tony Abbott has suggested he would like to see a multinational force deployed to the Ukraine, including Australians, to secure the crash site of downed Malaysian Airlines&#8217; flight MH17.
Mr Abbott&#8217;s comments suggested came as he warned of a potential cover-up blocking the investigation and lashed "evidence tampering on an industrial scale".


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...-crash-site-20140722-3cd4c.html#ixzz38BVrVH2F