Found Deceased Malaysia - Nora Quoirin, 15, from UK, special needs, missing on vacation, Seremban, 4 Aug 2019 #5

[MsBetsy]

Actually it could be relevant. Admittedly we often stayed in much more primitive accommodation in tropical areas with our kids. During the night I would get up several times to check, twice found a scorpion on my youngest's mosquito net, once found an ant trail leading into a bed, another time a cat leaving the entrails of some unfortunate creature in my shoe...

The Mam radar rarely switches off and IMO would be doubly switched on under new and different conditions.

Yes, I understand, but apparently they did not wake up and find Nora was missing until 8:00 am.

There has been no mention of them waking up in the middle of the night, so I'm not sure I understand how it could be relevant.

Everyone's experiences are different. I have slept through things that other people couldn't imagine sleeping through, and at other times I've woken to the slightest noise, that others would never awaken to.

Everyone is unique, so in what way could this be relevant?

How does the fact that they did not hear or see anything help to figure out what happened to Nora? Imo

 

[Chiatos]

no clothes because she was only sleeping in underwear

no sign of third party breaking in

No clothes as in no clothes. Her underwear is missing. I provided a link in my previous post. No underwear. So: naked.

 

[Chiatos]

The only question mark I would have regards the discovery of Nora being missing is that the time of discovery seems to me to be very late, given the cacophony that you are treated to from very early on, pre-dawn.

You may try to nap for a bit, but IMO would be very awake from this time onwards, apart from the obvious excitement at seeing the jungle wake up.

The time of discovery at 8am seems late, but maybe it has to do with the fact the reception opens at 8am. I.e. as from 8am there's personell.

 

[MsBetsy]

The time of discovery at 8am seems late, but maybe it has to do with the fact the reception opens at 8am. I.e. as from 8am there's personell.

That's true, the time may have been reported as the dad waking up at 8:00 am, when in reality that's the time he actually was able to alert the staff at the resort that his daughter was missing, as there would be no-one else around at that time to notify.
But still, I'm not sure it makes a difference, other than the fact that Nora would not have been able to get very far in the dark even if she did leave on her own.
The staff at the hotel searched the entire property, reportably, before police got there and saw no sign of her. Imo

 

[Eve71]

The main door had no lock, the ground level where the parents were sleeping was open. No need for an open window for the escape route.

My thoughts too. I struggle to understand why the parents have insisted she went through the window, on her own or otherwise. I believe they said the window was open , yet have stated Nora could not open the window by herself. Why would Nóra climb through the window or an abductor use that as means of entry/exit when the door was unlocked?

 

[Lilibet]

I don’t remember if I’ve already said this, but to me, the most important piece of information would be the condition of Nora’s feet, legs and hands (not to mention her entire body). One doesn’t wander around in the jungle unclothed, without proper footwear and show minimal injuries, especially when you have balance issues. Please feel free to fill in the blanks, but I don’t believe we have been told the condition of her body, other than scratches on her feet and no sign of sexual assault. What about the leeches other hikers have talked about? Cuts, bruises, even broken bones? If she was wandering, she should have been a mess! Amanda Eller certainly was after being lost in the Maui rain forest for over two weeks.

If significant injuries were absent, it would indicate to me that she was taken (carried?) to a location, perhaps told it was a game and that she was to stay hidden. We don’t know if she had a concept of time, so perhaps she didn’t wander off until the end. The injuries are very important.
IMO, JMO, MOO, etc.

 

[tresir2012]

Yes, the translation problems are also a factor. There were prints on the window (although we don't yet know if they were determined to belong to an outsider), and apparently it could be opened from the outside, although I'm not sure that was verified. Her mother said she would have never opened the window and propped it open. (She did not understand anything conceptual.)

She was wearing underwear and was barefoot when she went missing. No items were found taken from the resort.

She was found completely naked, her body was located at the bottom of a ravine 3/4 of a mile down to where the stream was. I'm not sure how close it was to the waterfall, but it was never stated it was found "at" the waterfall, as far as I know. At least not by police.
And yes, it had to be winced out by helicopter because it was in an inaccessible area. There were thick vines and steep slopes that were hard for the searchers even to get through.

Yet Nora, who had problems with mobility, did not go anywhere independently, and was starving, weak, exhausted and very ill, somehow managed to survive and walk 1.6 miles or longer, for 7 or 8 days before she died. Imo

This is from the Sun (no translation problems hopefully) that I posted two pages back. It states she died from a burst stomach ulcer. Stomach ulcers are caused by H-pylori bacteria. I had one for 7 years and they can cause severe stomach pains. Mine went undiagnosed for all that time, incorrectly diagnosed as IBS. She may have been woken up by stomach pains. The Grandfather also suspects she was taken to where she was found.


'TAMPERED WITH HER BODY'
A post-mortem examination found she died from internal bleeding in her intestine after a stomach ulcer burst, following a period of prolonged hunger and stress.

Grandad Sylvain Quoirin, 67, has claimed that “someone tampered with her body” believing she was dumped at the waterfall by sinister forces in an attempt to “get rid of her” and called for a fresh criminal investigation.

Retired businessman Sylvain told The Irish Times: "She wasn’t there yet [during previous searches]. Someone put her there.

“Can you imagine her walking 2.5km, naked and barefoot, over rocks, in the middle of the night? For me, that’s absurd."

He added: “Do you think she would go walking around at night? For me, it is obviously a criminal case, by default. She could not have wandered.”

Mr Quoirin insisted there were “dark areas that need to be cleared up for the family to be able to grieve in peace”.

 

[Lilibet]

I was. Someone said she discredited herself by saying things that weren’t accurate. I said if that is the case shouldn’t that work for all players in the case. Someone assumed I meant the media but I didn’t.

I believe a lot of the people who think the same things AB does feel the parents discredited themselves by not being forthcoming with the bit about Nora wanting to see the waterfall or with giving conflicting statements about her disabilities. The sudden new info and then she was found (LBT released a statement about her being found after new info came out) is what led to this. Prior to that I couldn’t find anything about their involvement, anywhere. Right, wrong, or otherwise, it gave people a pause. It doesn’t mean they did anything, but it does make AB and others question them. Again, I’m just trying to explain how or why people believe and are giving credence to what AB suggested. She may be totally wrong and probably a bit too aggressive with stating her opinion, but I’m a firm believer in exploring every angle.

The problem with AB is that she was making outrageous statements and implied accusations immediately, with no basis, just unfounded opinion. She obviously has an axe to grind. I do think it’s important to keep an open mind about what happened, but approaching it from a position of “guilty until prove innocent” and nasty snark as AB does has nothing to do with a reasonable consideration of reported facts. It’s just plain ugly.
JMO

 

[Alyce]

Yes, I understand, but apparently they did not wake up and find Nora was missing until 8:00 am.
There has been no mention of them waking up in the middle of the night, so I'm not sure I understand how it could be relevant.
Everyone's experiences are different. I have slept through things that other people couldn't imagine sleeping through, and at other times I've woken to the slightest noise, that others would never awaken to.
Everyone is unique, so in what way could this be relevant?
How does the fact that they did not hear or see anything help to figure out what happened to Nora? Imo

Exactly this. Everyone is different. I have seen people - children included -suffer from horrendous jet lag for up to 10 days - and the reverse - people who have not the slightest hint of jet lag at all, whether travelling east or west.

 

[Rosegold68]

i can see why this is veering off in the way it is....

no signs of restraint but kept safe for about a week.....lack of injuries, even minor would surely rule out living wild in the jungle for 10 days

im sure her post mortem threw up more than the stomach issue, but the hikers who found her said she was in good condition by sight

 

[HayLouise]

20 August 2019:

FACING YEARS IN PRISON
Nora Quoirin cops charge man for tweeting that the tragic teen had been raped before she died in the Malaysian jungle


A MAN faces prison after he allegedly tweeted that tragic teen Nora Quoirin had been raped by indigenous people before she died.

Muhammad Zikri Ibrahim, 29, is accused of committing intentional insult with the alleged post and could be jailed for two years if convicted.

Mr Ibrahim reportedly alleged local indigenous villagers from the Orang Asli tribe raped Nora, who went missing only a day after arriving with her parents and two siblings at the resort in a nature reserve near Seremban, 39 miles south of the capital Kuala Lumpur.


Shortly after his tweet, Mr Ibrahim has denied the allegation after appearing in a court in Kuala Lumpur in Malaysia.

Ibrahim could face up to two years in prison if convicted.

Nora Quoirin cops charge man for tweeting that the tragic teen had been raped before she died in the Malaysian jungle

 

[Sarahlou]

My thoughts too. I struggle to understand why the parents have insisted she went through the window, on her own or otherwise. I believe they said the window was open , yet have stated Nora could not open the window by herself. Why would Nóra climb through the window or an abductor use that as means of entry/exit when the door was unlocked?

It was the police who said she went through the window.

 

[Ardoch]

I saw a photograph of the downstairs of the villa on another website, if it's correct is there an open balcony area with no windows in the villa that the family were staying in?

 

[jiffajaffa31]

That's correct, it looks like the downstairs bedroom can be closed during the night but the rest of the house is all open to the elements.

From what I can see, the balcony does not look easily accessible from the ground - but I guess if a window is not locked then it wouldn't need to be.

 

[Ardoch]

So there are three possible ways to access the villa - the full length window (which was open/broken) a main door and an open balcony?

 

[Eve71]

So there are three possible ways to access the villa - the full length window (which was open/broken) a main door and an open balcony?

That’s how I understand it.

 

[Ardoch]

And yet the emphasis has been on the window?
Has there been any reports in the investigation on the possibility of the other accesses having been used by either N herself or by others on the morning prior to the alarm being raised at 8am?

 

[Sarahlou]

This is what was said about the window:

SEREMBAN, Aug 8 — The police today said that they are confident the only exit used in missing Irish teenager with specials needs, Nora Anne Quoirin, 15, was the aluminium glass window at The Dusun resort where she was staying with her family, here.


Negri Sembilan Police Chief Datuk Mohamad Mat Yusof said investigations by the forensic team confirmed that Nora Anne had exited from the premises through the glass window.



“Yes, only the glass window exit was used. We are certain about this,” he said this evening at a press conference in Pantai police station here.
Police: Only exit used in missing Irish teen case was glass window, other routes ruled out | Malay Mail

 

[MrJames]

Malaysia

 

[MrJames]

What happens next regarding this tragic mystery?

Will we just hear less and less until it completely goes away or will there be further reports and investigations?