MD - Phylicia Barnes, 16, Baltimore, 28 Dec 2010 #2

[georgiajean]

They said teenager so I assumed minor. It is very confusing and I think DB and KB were not so much in a cya mode, but rather being cautious and not naming someone not named by LE - not putting themselves in a position to impede the case kind of thing. I've worked with family and friends of missing persons and there is some information that simply can not be released to the public for reasons of both impeding the case and LE or others leaving themself open to a lawsuit.

It is very confusing because it has not been clarified who was there in the am, versus all the MSM info about who was there the evening before.........

This case can give me a headache with all the what if's. I wish LE would officially clear somethings up.... it leaves me wondering if the reason they have not cleared things up is because certain person known to be at the apt Tuesday have not been cleared.

jmo

I would like to think that everything we have learned has been checked by LE, and checks out. They know about the additional person at the house. They know about MJ leaving and returning and leaving and returning. They know the bro/cou was back at the house at 4:50 when MJ returned, and that PB was gone.
I hope they have combed PB's FB and MS and Twitter and Skype and whatever other technology she used. And the sisters.

What concerns me is that the families involved have been in the BMore area for a while, and have vast extended roots of family. I am not sure how LE is going to crack this anymore. I'm not even sure if they will ever.

 

[georgiajean]

also im thinking did i read pb was texting mj younger brother not texting but um talking back and fourth to each other on my space or facebook. i recall reading somewhere we he (mj's younger brother) criticize pb about something then recanted by saying sike. please foregive me im over 50. not into texting and crap. i also do believe pb may have had a crush on young bro. i believe pb may have gone willing with whom ever to get food. but person had other plans.

I also had read that PB was messaging on some social networking site with one of MJ's younger brothers. She has been friends (on FB and/or MS) with members of MJ's family since May of 2009, along the same time she got in contact with KB and DB. I believe, since DB and MJ had been together for such a long time, MJ's family may have been considered part of PB's extended family. She may have unconditionally trusted anyone who was associated with MJ. Even in light of him moving out of the apartment, she probably didn't see MJ or his family as a threat or a bad thing. Regardless of who they really are.

I also believe MJ's family cares about education, and is very close and supportive of each other. It's a tight knit group. I can see why PB would be enamored of them, as she was her Barnes' siblings.

My fear is that all of this lulled her into what (in hindsight) was a false sense of security. Someone took advantage of what JS described as PB's open, trusting nature. Who that person is? I don't know.

 

[georgiajean]

okay its me again im clueless i looked up mj and brother on myspace these guys look way to innocent to do anything that foolish they both work and attending school and i dont see written anywhere they look preppy to me okay who hasnt smoked weed or drank a 40. could be she was bascially abducted by a stranger breaking into apt.

I was going to respond to your post, and then I saw Belimom's post, which says most of what I would have written. I read further and found Cubby's post, which said most of the rest of what I would have written.

I just wanted to add, how people portray themselves on the interwebs is not always who they are in real life. There is a social creativity at work. So what I mostly look at is how people communicate with each other. What people say about themselves, the pictures they post, etc, are only as valid as the poster wants them to be. And people get lulled into a false sense of "knowing" people just because they've been "around" them for a while. (That's the second time I've used lulled into a false sense of security. Must be something my brain is working on).

Back to my point--what PB and MJ & Co write, in conversation with each other, is what I focus on the most.

 

[georgiajean]

Excellent points. IIRC PB never reported to her sisters she was going to sleep. The only person who reported this was MJ. Why would MJ report she was asleep if he didn't give DB the courtesy of letting her know what time he would be arriving in the am to move his things? Are we to believe he'd call or text to say your sister is sleeping on the couch when he was unwilling to let DB know in advance about what time he'd he arriving at the apartment? I mean, from the peas interview I understood it that DB knew MJ would be by sometime but not what time.

I too am still leaning towards MJ & Co or close associate.


Any thoughts or idea's on why LE is not releasing more info under the 'wanted for questioning and are not considered a suspect at this time' guise. We often see something along those lines from LE and we are not seeing that in this case.

You brought up something that has bugged me. DB knew MJ was at the apartment, as per PB telling DB, when they were talking on the phone. Both DB and MJ have described this happening, and the time it happened. What do you think about this scenario for how DB learned that PB was aleep: At 3, KB calls DB to ask about PB's whereabouts, because she isn't answering her phone. DB talks to MJ (text/call) and he tells her that PB was asleep at 1:30 when he left the apartment. DB relays this to KB, who decides to let sleeping teens lay, and goes about her business.

 

[georgiajean]

(respectfully snipped by me, and BBM)

3. I am too thru with KB because if you're coming to get someone, you're coming to get someone whether they are calling you back, texting back, sleep, taking a shower or what! I don't understand why she (allegedly) did not go check on that child. That is a BIG problem for me. Also there is a discrepency in their text activity. First, KB said that she too was receiving texts from PB at 10am (around the same time as DB) and said her last text from PB was at 11:08. Then later she changed up and said that she did not even attempt to reach her until 12-12:30 and was already on the way...

I really appreciated the points you brought up, and I wanted to respond to this part of what you wrote. The way I understood it was that the last text KB received from PB was 11:08. Then, when KB was getting ready to leave work, she texted PB back. I took this to mean that PB had texted her at 11:08, but KB hadn't answered because she was busy at work. It was the 12:30 text not being answered that raised KB's concern.

And, yes, why didn't KB just go by the apartment? I can't think of a reason why not. Especially knowing that the apartment gets bad cell phone reception. Especially knowing that PB had texted her to please come pick her up. I can imagine that KB is asking herself the same questions. It may not heave helped if KB had gone by, but I wish she had.

 

[georgiajean]

I think she was torn: on one hand she wanted to make the best of the visit she had so been looking forward to. On the other hand, she knew she was in over her head with bad company, but didn't want her mom to worry.

I saw another interview where JS stated that PB had reached out to her older sister "back home" and confided that someone in the house (a male) had made an advancement toward her (the night before) that she rejected. The sister kept quiet about this until it came out that she was missing.

I know police have interviewed all of DB's friends, but they should be interviewing this "other" sister because they were in constant contact with each other the entire time. Either by FB, Skype, or phone. I feel that she will have the most accurate picture of what was going on prior to 12/28/10. That information could aid the investigation.

Thanks was not enough. This is huge. How much time has LE spent with PB's older sister SS in NC?

 

[Cubby]

I think she was torn: on one hand she wanted to make the best of the visit she had so been looking forward to. On the other hand, she knew she was in over her head with bad company, but didn't want her mom to worry.

I saw another interview where JS stated that PB had reached out to her older sister "back home" and confided that someone in the house (a male) had made an advancement toward her (the night before) that she rejected. The sister kept quiet about this until it came out that she was missing.

I know police have interviewed all of DB's friends, but they should be interviewing this "other" sister because they were in constant contact with each other the entire time. Either by FB, Skype, or phone. I feel that she will have the most accurate picture of what was going on prior to 12/28/10. That information could aid the investigation.

I agree. imo, PB would have especially wanted to fit in as it has been reported she wanted to attend college in Baltimore. Part of me has an uneasy feeling that perhaps her half sisters in MD were a bit careless and over estimated PB's 'maturity level' (for lack of a better word) due to her being only a few months shy of graduating early and being onto adult college life in a few short months. I'm unsure if that relates to the case or not, but it has left me with an uneasy feeling as to the responsibility DB and KB felt to their half sister despite JS's wishes and clear guidelines.

I think JS did the best she could... we can't shelter our kids forever. We need to allow them room to grow. I don't believe she could have forseen how casually DB took her responsibility as a 'guardian' for PB while PB was in her company.

JMO

 

[Cubby]

You brought up something that has bugged me. DB knew MJ was at the apartment, as per PB telling DB, when they were talking on the phone. Both DB and MJ have described this happening, and the time it happened. What do you think about this scenario for how DB learned that PB was aleep: At 3, KB calls DB to ask about PB's whereabouts, because she isn't answering her phone. DB talks to MJ (text/call) and he tells her that PB was asleep at 1:30 when he left the apartment. DB relays this to KB, who decides to let sleeping teens lay, and goes about her business.

IF DB first learnt from MJ PB was sleeping at 3'ish then I can't see why KB didn't arrive at the apartment when she was expected. I think DB found out from MJ sometime earlier PB was sleeping....

I'm still trying to pick my jaw up off the floor that no one found it odd that they were expected by PB and when she didn't answer everyone just decided to wait to hear from her. I've only ever experienced that with casual friends - that I called party friends - you know the ones you go out with to parties or clubs but never really develop a true friendship. I can't figure out why KB would show PB such little respect. I just don't get it... other than to think she had probably experienced a number of friends not following through with plans rather than distinguish which friends to not count on, she made a decision to not show unless she could confirm ahead of time. I still have a hard time justifying that with family......

jmo

 

[Cubby]

Was it ever reported if DBs apartment had a land line or did they all have cell phones despite the poor cell reception at the apartment. I'm wondering if there was a land line PB would have known to answer if she saw family on the caller id. And if there is a landline in the apartment did anyone try reaching PB via the landline?

 

[MsOh]

I listened to the "Peas" interview of the half siblings and was surprised that it was completely different from statements made by the mother, JS. Here are my thoughts after reviewing it twice

1. I counted 4 x that DB referred to the other gentleman as her ex's "little brother", then changed to "cousin" before she exited the call.

2. When DB was asked for an age on the bro/cousin, she just said "he is young". But later KB was asked if he was younger or older than PB and she said "older". So if he is older than PB, but considered young to DB, I'm guessing he is around 18-21ish.

3. I am too thru with KB because if you're coming to get someone, you're coming to get someone whether they are calling you back, texting back, sleep, taking a shower or what! I don't understand why she (allegedly) did not go check on that child. That is a BIG problem for me. Also there is a discrepency in their text activity. First, KB said that she too was receiving texts from PB at 10am (around the same time as DB) and said her last text from PB was at 11:08. Then later she changed up and said that she did not even attempt to reach her until 12-12:30 and was already on the way...

4. I don't appreciate that everyone received a phone call except mom, who had to call up there (herself) on instinct. Why would you not notify her mother if she is missing? Could it be that you need more time to get your lies straight???

I think you are probably right re: Little Brother's age range. That is what I picked up from the interviews/the Find PB FB page as well.

Regarding KB, my guess is that she was worn out and didn't mind not having to pick up PB. MJ tells DB that PB is having a nap. So DB accepts it as truth and passes along the information. Thus KB proceeds with her day. I always have a mental list of to-do's (errands, chores, etc.) on the mind, and perhaps she did too. Or maybe she wanted to go home and rest. Whatever the case, I'm sure the guilt in hindsight is overwhelming for these sisters. We can see the signs now, but in "ordinary day" mode they had little reason to suspect that an unanswered phone call or text would be the first signs of such a terrible event.

As for calling the mother... obviously she should have been contacted immediately. My guess? They were hoping this wasn't what it was... and didn't want to freak her out if PB was just down the street. Again, I think the guilt for dropping the ball so hard is probably incredible.

 

[georgiajean]

I agree. imo, PB would have especially wanted to fit in as it has been reported she wanted to attend college in Baltimore. Part of me has an uneasy feeling that perhaps her half sisters in MD were a bit careless and over estimated PB's 'maturity level' (for lack of a better word) due to her being only a few months shy of graduating early and being onto adult college life in a few short months. I'm unsure if that relates to the case or not, but it has left me with an uneasy feeling as to the responsibility DB and KB felt to their half sister despite JS's wishes and clear guidelines.

I think JS did the best she could... we can't shelter our kids forever. We need to allow them room to grow. I don't believe she could have forseen how casually DB took her responsibility as a 'guardian' for PB while PB was in her company.

JMO

Good points. I hadn't thought about PB's coming "early adulthood." Add to that, perhaps KB and DB were on their own and independent at an early age, and bestowed similar expectations on PB. If DB had been in a relationship with MJ for 10 years, and she is 27, that means she was PB's age when she started "seeing" MJ. So maybe DB and KB felt it was high time PB started dating and becoming a woman, so to speak.

Does anyone remember from some media report, DB saying something about rescuing PB from her home. I can't find the article or the statement. But it sounded like DB felt PB needed to get away from her mother? I could have mis-interpreted,. but I hoped someone remembered it. Maybe it was in the Peas interview...

 

[Cubby]

I think you are probably right re: Little Brother's age range. That is what I picked up from the interviews/the Find PB FB page as well.

Regarding KB, my guess is that she was worn out and didn't mind not having to pick up PB. MJ tells DB that PB is having a nap. So DB accepts it as truth and passes along the information. Thus KB proceeds with her day. I always have a mental list of to-do's (errands, chores, etc.) on the mind, and perhaps she did too. Or maybe she wanted to go home and rest. Whatever the case, I'm sure the guilt in hindsight is overwhelming for these sisters. We can see the signs now, but in "ordinary day" mode they had little reason to suspect that an unanswered phone call or text would be the first signs of such a terrible event.

As for calling the mother... obviously she should have been contacted immediately. My guess? They were hoping this wasn't what it was... and didn't want to freak her out if PB was just down the street. Again, I think the guilt for dropping the ball so hard is probably incredible.

BBM, I agree. It's very possible KB went onto any errands she had to do with a break from working two jobs. It's possible her errands didn't take her in the direction of the apartment despite living 10 min or so from her sisters. If KB was not at the apartment Monday night and her cell phone pings indicate she left work and was not in the vicinity of the apartment they may be able to rule her out as a possible POI quickly.

jmo

 

[Cubby]

Good points. I hadn't thought about PB's coming "early adulthood." Add to that, perhaps KB and DB were on their own and independent at an early age, and bestowed similar expectations on PB. If DB had been in a relationship with MJ for 10 years, and she is 27, that means she was PB's age when she started "seeing" MJ. So maybe DB and KB felt it was high time PB started dating and becoming a woman, so to speak.

Does anyone remember from some media report, DB saying something about rescuing PB from her home. I can't find the article or the statement. But it sounded like DB felt PB needed to get away from her mother? I could have mis-interpreted,. but I hoped someone remembered it. Maybe it was in the Peas interview...

I don't remember the article, but it is possible both DB and KB felt JS was far too overprotective and believed PB should be treated more as an adult or young adult versus what they perceived as PB being treated like a child.

I really don't believe DB or KB are involved. I honestly think they have differences of opinions and or ideals and acted accordingly but never intended to be negligent in any way. Also, if they were accustomed to any of the men they socialized with being a bit disrespectful (in a condescending type of way), they may have under estimated PB's ability to handle the situation herself.

I'm still leaning towards MJ & Co until we have good reason to rule them out.

jmo

 

[MsOh]

I hadn't thought about PB's coming "early adulthood." Add to that, perhaps KB and DB were on their own and independent at an early age, and bestowed similar expectations on PB. If DB had been in a relationship with MJ for 10 years, and she is 27, that means she was PB's age when she started "seeing" MJ. So maybe DB and KB felt it was high time PB started dating and becoming a woman, so to speak.

I really don't believe DB or KB are involved. I honestly think they have differences of opinions and or ideals and acted accordingly but never intended to be negligent in any way. Also, if they were accustomed to any of the men they socialized with being a bit disrespectful (in a condescending type of way), they may have under estimated PB's ability to handle the situation herself.

I'm still leaning towards MJ & Co until we have good reason to rule them out.

Excellent points, completely agree.
I believe I'm going to start working on a timeline, this evening, using available info from LE as well as the individuals closely involved (via the Peas interviews, etc. basically adding to the timelines already created here). Hopefully it will help organize my thoughts a little on this! Also want to add what a pleasure it is to communicate here. Everyone is so respectful.
And lastly, a newb question: What does "MSM" refer to... and what does BBM mean?

 

[paris_paris]

And lastly, a newb question: What does "MSM" refer to... and what does BBM mean?

MSM = main stream media
BBM = bolded by me

Now to re-read the thread. The initials are making me crazy.

 

[MsOh]

Timeline - Sourced from Peas interviews with family and Facebook interactions w/ family (should note that the FindPB page has been scrubbed... info regarding FB was taken from summaries kindly provided in this and the first thread)

8:45 AM
DB leaves for work. PB is asleep.
*DB on Peas 1-18-2011

9:00 AM (About)
MJ arrives to pick up younger Bro/Cou, who stayed overnight.
*MJ on FindPB FB (see Cubby's post #177, pg. 8 of this thread)

10:00 AM (About)
PB and DB communicate over phone (text and voice) to discuss skincare products and hair.
*DB on Peas 1-18-2011

PB and KB text message to coordinate time to hang out later that afternoon.
*KB on Peas 1-18-2011

MJ returns to wash clothes and pack.
*MJ on FindPB FB (see Cubby's post #177, pg. 8 of this thread)

11:08 AM
Last communication between PB and KB.
*KB on Peas 1-18-2011

11:30 AM
PB leaves message on Facebook stating that she is hungry.
*RB on Peas 1-2-2011

12:23 PM
Last communication between PB and DB
*DB answers Q's on FB (see NatLock's post #488, pg. 20 of first thread)

12:30 PM
KB prepares to leave work, texts PB to see is she is dressed. No answer.
*KB on Peas 1-18-2011

1:00 PM
KB calls PB. No answer.
*KB on Peas 1-18-2011

1:04 PM
MJ informs DB by phone that PB has fallen asleep on the couch.
*DB answers Q's on FB (see NatLock's post #488, pg. 20 of first thread)

1:20 PM
KB calls PB. No answer.
*KB on Peas 1-18-2011

1:30 PM
MJ leaves.
*MJ on FindPB FB (see Cubby's post #177, pg. 8 of this thread)

3:08 PM
KB texts DB to inquire if PB is with her. DB says no and relays information given by MJ (PB taking a nap).
*DB on Peas 1-18-2011

BB arrives to work (fireman).
*BB on Peas 1-2-2011

4:50 PM
MJ returns to apartment, and finds his Bro/Cou there.
*MJ on FindPB FB (see Cubby's post #177, pg. 8 of this thread)

6:00-7:00 PM
DB arrives home. PB is nowhere to be found.
DB calls KB to see if she picked PB up. DB calls BB, MJ and MJ's brother.
*RB, BB on Peas 1-2-2011 and DB on Peas 1-18-2011

MJ responds to DB (6:11 PM)
*DB answers Q's on FB (see NatLock's post #488, pg. 20 of first thread)

DB calls BB again. BB suggests DB call RB.
DB texts RB.
DB calls uncle (LE?)
*RB, BB on Peas 1-2-2011 and DB on Peas 1-18-2011

7:30 PM
DB calls LE
*DB on Peas 1-18-2011

8:00-8:30 PM
JS calls PB multiple times. No answer.
JS calls DB and is informed of situation.
*JS on Peas 1-3-2011

LE arrives.
BB arrives.
*BB on Peas 1-2-2011 and DB on Peas 1-18-2011

 

[belimom]

....
4:50 PM
MJ returns to apartment, and finds his Bro/Cou there.
*MJ on FindPB FB (see Cubby's post #177, pg. 8 of this thread)
.....

Thank you so much for the timeline! BTW, I must have missed the part about MJ returning at 4:50pm.... I know originally it was posted that he was there around 5:00pm, then various other things were reported, such as PB wasn't there, PB was up/moving, etc. But it seemed that the last I checked the timeline, it was believed MJ left at 1:30 and then no one else arrived there until 6:00 when DB got home.

I guess this has changed and MJ *was* there later in the afternoon afterall?

(To those of you have may have this catalogued in your mind, was the text that MJ supposedly sent that said PB was up/about -- was that sent to DB, or just reported by DB but sent to someone else?)

 

[Cubby]

Here is a link to WS Lingo which includes the meanings of the many abbreviations we use.

NEW Websleuths Lingo - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

hth

 

[Cubby]

Timeline - Sourced from Peas interviews with family and Facebook interactions w/ family (should note that the FindPB page has been scrubbed... info regarding FB was taken from summaries kindly provided in this and the first thread)

Respectfully snipped and BBM. By scrubbed do you mean sanitized and the J family posts have been removed? If so, I thought they might. Hopefully LE got screenshots.....

 

[Cubby]

Thank you for the time line MsOh, it helps.

Does anyone beside me think perhaps the info MJ posted at FB about the little bro/cousin is a red herring? By that I mean not that he wasn't there overnight, but since DB had spoken with PB in the am after MJ would have left with his cousin after picking him up PB would have communicated to DB MJ came by to pick little bro up (which I will abbv LB/C)

I find myself wondering if after MJ left with LB/C he was expected back to pack and do the laundry.

I am envisioning a scenario where he was not expected back that day, had a key, walked in while PB was just getting out of the shower and she did not expect him. Thinking she was alone in the apartment may have been in only a towel or not quite dressed. MJ, like *some* men mistaken this as a sign she wants me.... He claims to be there for hours. Are we to believe between the time PB posted she was hungry and the time MJ claims he left and PB was sleeping (which I don't buy) they had little to no conversation between them? Why wouldn't either of them be talking about lunch between 11 and 1:30? I can only invision MJ taking PB out of that apartment -which would coincide with the dog tracking her back to a parking spot in the apartment parking lot and MJ doing whatever he wanted to do with her - or thought she wanted to do with him away from the apartment knowing the possiblity KB might show up and he didn't want to be seen 'with' PB. If they were in the car and he took her somewhere she could have resisted him, possibly told him to stop and she would tell her family..... Perhaps he couldn't risk that and had to ensure he could stop her from talking.... Perhaps he called LBC and asked him to meet him back at the apartment as part of an attempt at an alibi of somekind with the attempt at making it appear LBC was the person who found the apartment empty.


The above is speculation and a possible theory and jmo.