ME ME - Ayla Reynolds, 20 mnths, Waterville, 17 December 2011 - # 5

[hambirg]

Thanks you guys. That's what I get for posting before I catch up. the question would still be does THAT Check E Cheese have a ball pit.

I was on the fence with JD. . .but I'm really starting to feel hinky about him. Don't even get me started on his mom!!! :banghead:

 

[katydid23]

Thanks you guys. That's what I get for posting before I catch up. the question would still be does THAT Check E Cheese have a ball pit.

I was on the fence with JD. . .but I'm really starting to feel hinky about him. Don't even get me started on his mom!!! :banghead:

IT would be so stupid for him to make up the ball pit story, if there wasn't really a ball pit. I mean he could say anything about how she might get hurt at a Chuck E Cheese, so why say something totally provably untrue.

 

[my_tee_mouse]

[/B]
BBM :floorlaugh:
If you look at some of the above posts, it looks like some franchises don't follow all the ball pit rules.

I remember telling friends about my trip to Knott's Berry Farm with my 4 year old (approx.). Knott's had a ball pit then (maybe it still does?). And I remember relaying that the scary rides didn't hold a candle to what was on the bottom and mixed up in those ball pits!
My daughter teased me by not coming out, so I had to go in to get her!
:gasp:
Yes..they are similar to petrie dishes in science experiments!

(It wasn't the ball pit that scared me at Knotts. It was the Snoopy Rope Bridge and the parachute ride! My son wasn't scared of either. Me...I attribute several grey hairs to each.)

I don't guess it occurred to my generation of moms to be worried about germs in those ball pits...but I did honestly worry about smothering. I watched my son like a hawk when he was in one and was always relieved when he'd had enough of the blame things.

I have to giggle a little at the "germ" posts. No one thought one thing about germs when I was little. So technically, I'm guessing that there should be no one over 50 posting on this site, because we were all "germed" to death!

 

[ThoughtFox]

(It wasn't the ball pit that scared me at Knotts. It was the Snoopy Rope Bridge and the parachute ride! My son wasn't scared of either. Me...I attribute several grey hairs to each.)

I don't guess it occurred to my generation of moms to be worried about germs in those ball pits...but I did honestly worry about smothering. I watched my son like a hawk when he was in one and was always relieved when he'd had enough of the blame things.

I have to giggle a little at the "germ" posts. No one thought one thing about germs when I was little. So technically, I'm guessing that there should be no one over 50 posting on this site, because we were all "germed" to death!

Thank you for writing that! :blowkiss: I'm not much of a germaphobe. I liked to play in the dirt, rocks and leaves when I was a kid, and actually I still like gardening better than housework. And even if I had never taken my kids to playgrounds like that, they would have gone there with friends anyway. The way I see it, we evolved along with germs, so we might as well accept it.

As my brother used to say, that's why they made kids washable.

 

[katydid23]

I never worried much about the potential germs in the ballpit when my kids were little. But one time when my son was about 10, he and 2 friends were with me at McDonalds. A young mom came and offered them 10 dollars if they could help her try and find her lost car keys in the ballpit. The boys jumped at the chance. They piled in, we took out the other kids, and they began digging deep. In moments they all came out really quick. They gave up and went and washed their hands and didn't finish eating even. On the way home they told me they saw two old dirty diapers...YUCKKKKKKKKKKK SO GROSS just thinking about it.

 

[Indy Anna]

While I agree that Ayla kicking her cousin in the head doesn't constitute "fighting" per se, she was playing rough. Watching that video has me worried because I wonder if Ayla might have injured one of the other children in the house and the parent of the other child became angry at her. I believe Trista said she didn't think Justin would do anything to intentionally hurt Ayla, but what about the other adults in the household? Especially if they were under the influence and felt they were only defending their little one? What if one of the adults did check on the children that night, and the children were awake and playing rough?

Maybe these young children were getting injured (bruises, sprains, etc.) by playing rough with each other (the boy looks big enough to push Ayla around). I know that such things happen occasionally when young children play together, but if it happened frequently due to lack of adult supervision, I can imagine that Phoebe (assuming she works for DHHS/CPS) wanted to conceal it and appear that she had the household under control (and thus the lie about being in the house the night Ayla disappeared).

Also, there's the possibility that Ayla was gone days before she was reported missing. Might PD be covering up whatever happened to her for fear of losing her job and being held legally liable? Especially if she overstepped her authority and was responsible for placing Ayla in her son's custody while she knew it was not the safest environment for Ayla?

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

(It wasn't the ball pit that scared me at Knotts. It was the Snoopy Rope Bridge and the parachute ride! My son wasn't scared of either. Me...I attribute several grey hairs to each.)

I don't guess it occurred to my generation of moms to be worried about germs in those ball pits...but I did honestly worry about smothering. I watched my son like a hawk when he was in one and was always relieved when he'd had enough of the blame things.

I have to giggle a little at the "germ" posts. No one thought one thing about germs when I was little. So technically, I'm guessing that there should be no one over 50 posting on this site, because we were all "germed" to death!

I AM a germaphobe, but it is one of my OCD things. I wasn't worried about HER in those ball pits...I was worried about ME!
DH has worked at Knott's for 30+ years, and he's been a mechanic for many of those years. (See? That puts me in the over 50 crowd, too!) He climbs on the OUTSIDE of ALL the rides wearing not much but his uniform, his tools, and a bungee cord. He loves to tell me about it..and I try to stay in denial.
I used to go on most all the rides. Now I figure driving the freeways are way more dangerous and way less predictable. So even though I refuse to go on the rides, I deserve some kind of award!:crazy:

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

Thank you for writing that! :blowkiss: I'm not much of a germaphobe. I liked to play in the dirt, rocks and leaves when I was a kid, and actually I still like gardening better than housework. And even if I had never taken my kids to playgrounds like that, they would have gone there with friends anyway. The way I see it, we evolved along with germs, so we might as well accept it.

As my brother used to say, that's why they made kids washable.

Even though I AM a germaphobe, I still agree with you and your brother. I love gardening and "playing in my back yard" way more than house keeping.
And DH and I feel that preventing kids from playing in child "infested" areas prevents them from building up resistance to germs. As a teacher I saw such pampering of sniffles, scratches, etc., where we would have NEVER even THOUGHT of telling the teacher, much less calling home for TLC and interrupting the classroom.

Sorry, that's my story and I'm sticking with it.... I hope I haven't offended anyone!:seeya:

 

[my_tee_mouse]

I AM a germaphobe, but it is one of my OCD things. I wasn't worried about HER in those ball pits...I was worried about ME!
DH has worked at Knott's for 30+ years, and he's been a mechanic for many of those years. (See? That puts me in the over 50 crowd, too!) He climbs on the OUTSIDE of ALL the rides wearing not much but his uniform, his tools, and a bungee cord. He loves to tell me about it..and I try to stay in denial.
I used to go on most all the rides. Now I figure driving the freeways are way more dangerous and way less predictable. So even though I refuse to go on the rides, I deserve some kind of award!:crazy:

Having lived out there...oh yeah...you definitely deserve a MAJOR AWARD for driving the freeways! (Floozie Leg Lamp headed your way!!! Snort!!!)

I will definitely have to tell my son about this post! He'll say, "Her husband does what?! Cool!" I say, "Your husband does what?! Someone give me a paper bag!"

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

While I agree that Ayla kicking her cousin in the head doesn't constitute "fighting" per se, she was playing rough. Watching that video has me worried because I wonder if Ayla might have injured one of the other children in the house and the parent of the other child became angry at her. I believe Trista said she didn't think Justin would do anything to intentionally hurt Ayla, but what about the other adults in the household? Especially if they were under the influence and felt they were only defending their little one? What if one of the adults did check on the children that night, and the children were awake and playing rough?

Maybe these young children were getting injured (bruises, sprains, etc.) by playing rough with each other (the boy looks big enough to push Ayla around). I know that such things happen occasionally when young children play together, but if it happened frequently due to lack of adult supervision, I can imagine that Phoebe (assuming she works for DHHS/CPS) wanted to conceal it and appear that she had the household under control (and thus the lie about being in the house the night Ayla disappeared).

Also, there's the possibility that Ayla was gone days before she was reported missing. Might PD be covering up whatever happened to her for fear of losing her job and being held legally liable? Especially if she overstepped her authority and was responsible for placing Ayla in her son's custody while she knew it was not the safest environment for Ayla?

Thanks, Indy Anna! I think you've raised some good points, and some that I have thought of, too!

1.) Multiple kids, multiple parents, multiple styles of parenting can lead to great conflict
2.) Ayla may very WELL have been missing day(s) before it was reported (like Sky). IIRC we have not had verified the last person who saw Ayla before she went missing (other than the reports that DP put her to bed and found her missing).
3.) There seems to me (MOO) that there is a great deal of covering/protecting each other if the lack of communication from the other people in the house that night is any indication.

 

[hambirg]

The problem with the bruises, or the hurt leg, or the broken arm; isn't each one individually. We know these things can happen even when there isn't abuse. BUT it's the totality of ALL those things happening within that short period of time that JD was visiting with and caring for Ayla. It starts to feel hinky within this context of her disappearing while she was in his care.

In TR's last interview, she talked about Ayla. . is she cold, scared. . .etc. And then when she said. . .and I'm her mother. . .I knew just how she must be feeling. I think she must be feeling some guilt. . .ultimately she should have been there for Ayla and she wasn't. Within this context I think it's normal to go back and look at things that maybe should have been red flags. I can understand that. When something bad happens, we beat ourselves up a bit with the "I should have knowns." In her defense, she does still say she's not sure if JD could hurt Ayla. But then there are all these little things, when looked at within the context of what has happened, would make anybody question their judgement. It's the shoulda, woulda, couldas and the guilt and insecurity that comes along with that.

 

[TxLady2]

(It wasn't the ball pit that scared me at Knotts. It was the Snoopy Rope Bridge and the parachute ride! My son wasn't scared of either. Me...I attribute several grey hairs to each.)

I don't guess it occurred to my generation of moms to be worried about germs in those ball pits...but I did honestly worry about smothering. I watched my son like a hawk when he was in one and was always relieved when he'd had enough of the blame things.

I have to giggle a little at the "germ" posts. No one thought one thing about germs when I was little. So technically, I'm guessing that there should be no one over 50 posting on this site, because we were all "germed" to death!

I'm over 50. We didn't worry nearly as much about germs back when I was growing up either, and we survived very well. So did my kids. I think some people are just a little too obsessed with germs these days. You are going to come in contact with germs, no matter what you do, they're in the air and there is no way to sterilize the air outside.
As far as these ball pits, I hope most moms would check a child's diaper before letting them go in to play. I wouldn't let a child that young play in one anyway... hopefully they're potty trained by 2, any child younger than that shouldn't be allowed in one.

 

[NFYIAMY]

I ran across the early Nancy Grace interview with Trista (and others). It's interesting, but long.

Trista says that Ayla did not sleep through the night, but awakened a couple times for diaper change, etc.

Ayla Reynolds: Nancy 12/19/11 - YouTube

Yet after that interview - on the 23rd (link available on pg1 of this thread) - she says:

Q: And Justin says he put Ayla to bed at 8pm that night, Thursday night, into Friday, and he checked her bed at 8am. Timeline, here, is very important as you know in a missing person's case. You have told us that Justin would apparently always check in on Ayla, before he would go to bed. Do you have any reason to believe that he didn't, in fact, do that?
TR: Uh, I don't know in this case right now, but yeah, he's told me numerous times before he'd go to bed he'd check on her. Why would this one time would you not check on her? So I'm not sure, like..



------
So which is it? She was ok with him checking on her before he went to bed - OR - Ayla woke up several times throughout the night and he needed to check on her more than just before after he went to bed (that he should've been checking on her not 'just this once' but throughout the night - every night???)


She's back and forth on her comments about Justin.

Justin has never (that I'm aware of) said one bad word about Trista?

I feel like we are kinda :deadhorse: on some of these issues --- but only because we have so little to go on!

Also - Trista has said that they (JD and her) were doing a lot of arguing/fighting prior to Ayla going missing. I would love to know the TRUE details about EVERYTHING they were fighting over.

 

[Donjeta]

I am reading it a little differently and it's not inconsistent or all over the place to me. There are two slightly different issues here IMO. One has to do with JDP checking on Ayla before bedtime and the other with Ayla waking up during the night.

The first thing is that we have been told that Ayla was put to bed at about 8 pm and that was the last that anyone saw her. (The stories have varied and it seems significant for that reason alone.) If Justin said he usually checked on Ayla before he went to bed himself, he must not have done so this evening if he didn't see Ayla after 8 pm. Trista questions why and I would ask the same question myself if I were in her shoes. In fact I have even though I've never been near her footwear. Was there something special about that "normal" night that made Justin forget the normal routine, if it in fact was the normal routine to check on Ayla?

The talk about how many times Ayla would wake up at night is important for another reason imo. I don't think TR or anybody expects that a parent should have an alarm clock on to wake them up at all hours to check on their baby but again, it's significant if there is a deviation from the normal behavior on the night a child disappears and if Ayla normally would wake up and wake the adult up several times per night it seems significant that she apparently didn't do so this night or if she did the adults didn't react because no one saw her after 8 pm. What time was she gone? Were the adults paying attention to the children?

There were two other toddlers in the home, did none of them wake up before 9 am either?

REYNOLDS: They`re telling me nothing. They`re telling me that we`re in the same place that I was on Saturday, that they don`t know what happened to her. They don`t know where she could be. And all that`s running through my mind is, I know my baby girl. I know Ayla, and Ayla doesn`t sleep through the night. She normally gets up once or twice for a diaper change, to have a bottle, to just, you know, like -- like, I would check on her all hours of the night. All hours.

GRACE: Well, Trista, I mean, mine are now 4. And you know, last night, they both got up. Lucy got up once, then got up again. John David got up a third time. So between them, I was up with them three times in one night. And they`re 4 years old.

Your baby is 20 months old. So I find it very hard to believe that she goes a whole night and doesn`t make a peep. And another thing, Ms. Reynolds -- everyone, with me is baby Ayla`s mother. If the night goes by, and say, I wake up around 2:00 or 3:00 o`clock and I haven`t heard from them, I go check on them because it`s so abnormal not to have heard from them by 3:00 o`clock in the morning, OK?

REYNOLDS: Right.

GRACE: So that`s how typical it is for children that age to wake up during the night.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1112/19/ng.01.

 

[matou]

Maybe Justin didn't really check on Ayla before he went to bed and just said these things to Trista to appease her? He didn't check on her before he went to bed that night and neither did any of the two other adults in that house. So I can't just blame Justin on this one. I thought Ayla was sleeping in the same room as at least one other child. So how come the mothers of the other two didn't check on their child that night? Or did they?

What was the date that Trista claims was the last contact she had with Ayla? Dec 9th? TIA

 

[NFYIAMY]

I guess I just find it difficult to believe he wasn't checking on her considering (according to Trista) - Justin WANTED Ayla. He sought to get custody of her - and had told her the week she went missing that he was going to file for permanent custody (she said that was what prompted her to go and file).....

Why would a dad - who WANTED custody of his daughter - not be checking on her? Clearly he was taking her out and doing things with her (CEC) - if he didn't want to have her with him - he didn't have to go get her in the first place - he could've returned her when Trista got out of rehab etc.

KWIM?

 

[Donjeta]

JMO but wanting custody does not necessarily correlate with parenting practices. You're probably more likely to be an observant parent if you're willing and happy to have the responsibility but there are examples of rather negligent or even abusive parents who fought for custody tooth and nail and people who had the child thrust upon them not by their own choice but were able to shoulder the responsibility and did everything the way they should.

Anyway, if he didn't check on her just that one night it could have been a deviation from the normal that had an understandable explanation. We can't draw too far-reaching inferences for just one instance of behavior. If it's even certain that no one checked on her all night. Maybe they did and that's why she's missing.

 

[SurfieTX]

JMO but wanting custody does not necessarily correlate with parenting practices. You're probably more likely to be an observant parent if you're willing and happy to have the responsibility but there are examples of rather negligent or even abusive parents who fought for custody tooth and nail and people who had the child thrust upon them not by their own choice but were able to shoulder the responsibility and did everything the way they should.

Sky Metalwala

 

[JeannaT]

IMHO, when you have a small house like that, and 3 toddlers who aren't related to each other and their various parents and a grandma all living there, you DON'T go checking on a toddler in the middle of the night to see if they're okay. You're grateful for every bit of peace you can find.

I personally didn't ever check on my 20 month old babies unless they cried during the night or I heard something alarming. If they were healthy, and sleeping, I let them be.

 

[ThoughtFox]

I guess I just find it difficult to believe he wasn't checking on her considering (according to Trista) - Justin WANTED Ayla. He sought to get custody of her - and had told her the week she went missing that he was going to file for permanent custody (she said that was what prompted her to go and file).....

Why would a dad - who WANTED custody of his daughter - not be checking on her? Clearly he was taking her out and doing things with her (CEC) - if he didn't want to have her with him - he didn't have to go get her in the first place - he could've returned her when Trista got out of rehab etc.

KWIM?

I don't think it's confusing at all. Wanting custody is sometimes just a power thing, and let's recall they never really had much of a relationship or even lived together that we know about. I don't give him as much credit for being mature, I guess.

Let's remember that Dad never lived with the child until recently, and he lived with his mother and his sister, who also had a small child. Don't you think sometimes the women checked on Ayla instead of Dad?

My husband, who is a natural Mr. Mom and tends to be overprotective, would usually be just as happy if I checked on the kids when they were babies, and he was always there from day one.

Wanting custody is idealistic, but reality is something else, and not every man can handle the demands of a toddler 24 hours a day. The shifting story about her bedtimes is a major clue that someone's not being truthful, I think. :twocents: