I did realize that prior sexual abuse would be a motive for a) not calling the ambulance (if they thought she was dead) and b) staging the sexual assault to cover up old injuries.
Especially the acute injuries in her vagina have been too much to imagine that they would stage.
SD asked that because this thread is not supposed to be for discussions, and he probably wanted to discuss your post further. You don't actually have to MOVE it, just re-post it on one of the discussion threads or start a new thread.
Without prior abuse, you mean?
SuperDave:
Yes, considering them as normal, loving parents and an accidental death. Prior sexual abuse by a R would change everything.
I will be considering IDI and prior sexual abuse also, but now I have to go.
Yes, considering them as normal, loving parents and an accidental death. Prior sexual abuse by a R would change everything.
I will be considering IDI and prior sexual abuse also, but now I have to go.
About the stun gun, this would be for SuperDave. Why do you think Dobersen thought the stun gun theory was plausible? Here`s a bit from one story:
"He (Smit) also said it appears marks on her face and back were made by a stun gun. Police have discounted the stun-gun theory, but Arapahoe County Coroner Michael Dobersen now believes Smit may be right.
"This isn't rocket science," Dobersen said. "If it waddles like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a duck." He recently reviewed enlarged autopsy photographs shown to him by Smit and Newsweek magazine and says the marks are consistent with a particular kind of stun gun."http://extras.denverpost.com/news/jon031400.htm
Quite a while back, I had seen where Air Taser prongs were matched to the marks on JB. Not to her actual BODY, but I believe to the measurement span between the marks. The coroner used his ruler to measure the exact distance between the marks and noted it in the autopsy, and as I recall the comparison, the Air Taser did not fit exactly. There was a photo of it around that I had seen online, but I don't remember where I saw it.
Mysteeri, your point about the stun gun being just pressed against her skin, but not activated is a good point. That may have just made an abrasion, and not an electrical burn, as would be the case if she was actually stunned with it. I would hope that the coroner would have seen whether these marks were burns, as they were freshly made at the time of her death. He described them as abrasions, and so we have to assume he looked at them closely enough to determine that. I don't know what method would have had to be used to determine if they were burns, but I am thinking that unless he was told to see if they WERE burns, he may not have taken tissue samples of the marks to test for burns. Too late now.
I don't really know if they are burns or if a taser was used, but these marks, especially the one on the right, are rectangular. What else could have made them?
Why didn`t they take the body? Perhaps they got starteled by something or someone inside or outside the house and thought it would be risky to take her. They may have put her in the wine cellar just to buy time so that the R`s would be waiting for their call instead of finding the body-> calling the police.
I know this is not a discussion thread but if they got starteled why would they have spend time wiping JB and redressing her ?
When you return, consider that prior sexual abuse need NOT have involved a parent. JB had siblings, one of which the housekeeper had found under a blanket in his room with JB on more than one occasion (she was screamed at by the children who told her to "get out").
There was also an older, college-age half-brother who attended the University just blocks away and visited often on weekends. Remember, chronic (ongoing) sexual abuse requires regular, secluded access to the child. Both brothers meet that requirement.
Quite a while back, I had seen where Air Taser prongs were matched to the marks on JB. Not to her actual BODY, but I believe to the measurement span between the marks. The coroner used his ruler to measure the exact distance between the marks and noted it in the autopsy, and as I recall the comparison, the Air Taser did not fit exactly. There was a photo of it around that I had seen online, but I don't remember where I saw it.
Mysteeri, your point about the stun gun being just pressed against her skin, but not activated is a good point. That may have just made an abrasion, and not an electrical burn, as would be the case if she was actually stunned with it. I would hope that the coroner would have seen whether these marks were burns, as they were freshly made at the time of her death. He described them as abrasions, and so we have to assume he looked at them closely enough to determine that. I don't know what method would have had to be used to determine if they were burns, but I am thinking that unless he was told to see if they WERE burns, he may not have taken tissue samples of the marks to test for burns. Too late now.
Why didn`t they take the body? Perhaps they got starteled by something or someone inside or outside the house and thought it would be risky to take her. They may have put her in the wine cellar just to buy time so that the R`s would be waiting for their call instead of finding the body-> calling the police.
I know this is not a discussion thread but if they got starteled why would they have spend time wiping JB and redressing her ?
I just couldn`t stay away longer though I should have had the patience to look up more information.
First I have to say that in IDI scenarios I don`t have a reasonable explanation for the pineapple. The only innocent explanation I can come up with is that she and Burke ate it some time at night, but Burke didn`t talk about it because that was not what they were supposed to be doing. But I guess he would have told about it by now. There are explanations such that the intruders knew JB liked pineapple, brought it and perhaps it contained some drug. I`m not saying that`s not possible but I`m not going to include it in my scenario.
How about IDI and prior sexual abuse? The abuser would naturally have to be someone JB had contact with. Being in pageants made her a target for pedophiles but it also may have gotten the attention of say older boys in the neighbourhood or at school. The prior sexual abuse may not be connected to the crime in IDI scenarios, though the crime was in part sexual in nature.
I`ve been thinking about a more than one perpetrator scenario.
The 118,000 dollars have been a problem for me in IDI. I have to wonder who might have known about Johns bonus or gain access to this information. What if the perpetrators indeed were a small foreign faction/group who were in computer or telecommunications business and they hacked Johns or AGs information? They couldn`t completely keep it to themselves but put the 118,000 dollars in the RN to kind of brag about it- ha ha - we have your personal information. As for the long an kind of strange RN, I think they may have just "had a little fun" with it and John.
I believe they were planning to take JB away and molest her and perhaps even kill her, JB might have recognized one or more of them. But something went wrong- they couldn`t handle JB/she screamed/she got away. I have an idea about the stun gun. As I understand it, the marks on her body seem to fit "the spikes" of an airt taser stun gun held against her skin, but SuperDave has pointed out that they can`t be actual stun gun injuries caused by a working stun gun. But what if they had the stun gun, planned to use it and tried to use it but it did not work and that caused problems- they stroke her in the head and/or made the garrote to control her.
The crime was at least in part sexual in nature and the perpetrator/s molested her in the basement. They took off gloves and wanted to touch her clothes and body, the latter they wiped clean but did not realize that there would be touch DNA on her clothes. One of them kept guard in case someone would get up in the house.
Why didn`t they take the body? Perhaps they got starteled by something or someone inside or outside the house and thought it would be risky to take her. They may have put her in the wine cellar just to buy time so that the R`s would be waiting for their call instead of finding the body-> calling the police.
That`s about how I see IDI.
About the stun gun, this would be for SuperDave. Why do you think Dobersen thought the stun gun theory was plausible? Here`s a bit from one story:
"He (Smit) also said it appears marks on her face and back were made by a stun gun. Police have discounted the stun-gun theory, but Arapahoe County Coroner Michael Dobersen now believes Smit may be right.
"This isn't rocket science," Dobersen said. "If it waddles like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a duck." He recently reviewed enlarged autopsy photographs shown to him by Smit and Newsweek magazine and says the marks are consistent with a particular kind of stun gun."http://extras.denverpost.com/news/jon031400.htm