Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #17

[Allusonz]

It's strange to me that it's okay for the bum and Nara to screw up their days, but when RS recounts the details of Halloween night to them as if it were Nov 1st, he's the liar. When RS calls the police 3 minutes before the postal police arrive, RS is still the liar. When they can't remember when precisely they ate dinner, RS and AK are the liars. But Nara can say she heard people gossiping about the murder and saw a headline about while at the same time, AK was doing the "bathmat buggie." the bum Curalato(?) doesn't hear this scream and he lives outside but Nara heard it? I just don't think that's believable.

Add in being stoned :giggle:

I am sorry I simply do not see the reasoning some use

 

[Allusonz]

True.

Let's say the scream is heard at 1130pm. When did the party start because n one saw lights in the cottage while the car was broken down. So they were partying in the dark? (satanic ritual?)

Then, I still contend that it makes zero sense for a scream to be heard and then running 2 minutes later. Just because MK screamed, doesn't mean her life was over or her fight was over. Doesn't even mean she'd been stabbed yet.

Is 2 minutes enough time to fatally stab her, leave her and run out the house? I'll go and ahead and grant a scenario that they return later for this instance, but still 2 minutes from the scream when there's no way to tell why MK's screaming? Is she screaming because she saw the knife? Is she screaming because she's about to be stabbed in the neck with it? What escalation to this is happening in the darkened house (according to the tow truck guy)?

Most importantly, when was there time for RG's sexual assault? Because if he did it at knife point, I'm seriously thinking MK would have screamed already upon being grabbed, threatened and forced to have some sort of sexual encounter. I doubt she went through ALL that and didn't scream.

So for Nara's scenario to work, RG ALSO had to return to the cottage to "fake" a sexual assault. So if everyone's fleeing and running in different directions as Nara claims, how do they decide to return later to concoct all this? None of them have phones.

Seriously. Who thinks it's feasible that MK ONLY screamed for her life AFTER already being tackled and sexually assaulted?

Please help me see what i'm missing, because like I said, if they faked it later, that means RG had to return with AK and RS to do all the faking, including going inside MK's vagina once she was already dead for a while. That's very sick, but does anyone think that happened?

BBM

I wish I could but honestly I can't take known facts and twist them around to enable a group to justify their perceptions.

You can't scream while drowning which in effect is what happened to her as I am sure oldsteve can attest to. She was aspirating blood thus her lungs etc were full.

The bottom line is she could not of screamed after her throat was cut

 

[Allusonz]

Just thinking about this scenario more. From the 1130pm scream, the clock is ticking, right? The three of them have 2-5 minutes while Nara's just standing there for 2-5 minutes listening by said window.

Imagine this. She heard and scream and she listens for 2-5 minutes. If you have two to 5 minutes, go stand by your window, listening, and then realize how long of a time frame that is.

Now, think about how the three of them in concert with each other now have to run out of the house, get over the gate, cross the road, and get to those metal stairs in 2-5 minutes without anyone else seeing them run and do that. Also imagine at that the same time, the other "ear witness" has to hear aruging first and then a scream.

Remember Nara does not hear arguing. The bumb at the basketball court sees NO ONE running. I think he said AK and RS were intently talking and looking toward the cottage, but that's not arguing. And he can't hear them arguing, so how does the other lady inside her house hear it? and what are they arguing about? How close is that other lady's window from where the bumb claims to see AK and RS talking? And again, why dos the bum not see AK and RS running, if Nara heard running?

I think the stairs that Nara heard them on isn't even near the basketball courts, but I'd need to see the pictures again to prove it. So anyone who wants to help me PROVE that all the ear witnesses are right, let's get going. And if we cannot prove they are right, well, then.....we all know what that means.

So anyone who believes in innocence, please take the challenge with me to prove that the ear witnesses are all correct according to the evidence.

From the testimony she gave, she was not even talking the night of the murder if she saw the headlines in the newspapers at 11:00am the next morning. The previous night was Halloween in which there seemed to be alot of partying. She could not even identify which direction the scream came from nor the time. As well remember it was again a reporter that got her to speak it was not PLE. Do you see a pattern here with the witnesses that came forward? I believe all but one came forward on the advice of a reporter most about 1 year after the event. Something is very smelly in the land of oz

 

[wasnt_me]

It seems to be that if MK drowned in her own blood, then it took her several minutes to die after she was last capable of screaming. I suppose it's possible her killer(s) ran before she was actually dead, but then that doesn't explain the towels used to staunch the flow.

Right. if the towels were used for that. I'm still on the fence about that one. I can believe that she was dying as they fled, but two to five minutes to all three in concert decide to run out the house and up the street somewhere isn't a lot of time, and it still begs the question of the staunching and when the sexual assault would have occured. I believe she would have screamed the moment someone stepped to her in a threatening way, so two to five minutes to stab, sexually assault and run? I don't know about that, Nara capprezilli....

 

[Allusonz]

How is their conclusion - that there is plenty of evidence leftover, after rejecting the knife and clasp as per the independent experts with which to convict AK and RS - true?:waitasec:

They keep repeating inaccurate information. You can see it posted on any blog in favour of them. They also attempt to discredit the experts or people speaking up on AK's and RS's behalf. You have recently just seen it happen with the independent experts of which they had no issues with to start with until the report came out. Then they had no credentials, they stated they used out-dated or non-European cites, they sent 2 patrols of PLE to retrieve a CD of which basically only showed parts of what they already had as they were the ones to record it. This seems to be the standard way they attempt to do things

 

[wasnt_me]

From the testimony she gave, she was not even talking the night of the murder if she saw the headlines in the newspapers at 11:00am the next morning. The previous night was Halloween in which there seemed to be alot of partying. She could not even identify which direction the scream came from nor the time. As well remember it was again a reporter that got her to speak it was not PLE. Do you see a pattern here with the witnesses that came forward? I believe all but one came forward on the advice of a reporter most about 1 year after the event. Something is very smelly in the land of oz

I agree. It had to be Halloween because the cottage was swarming with cops the next night after the murder discovery. THEY, the cops would have heard a scream that night (nov 2), if there was one to be heard. Amazing that Ms. Nara stared out her window at all the cops that evening before going for her bowel movement and did not think to go down there and tell them of the scream she'd heard 24 hours prior.

 

[Allusonz]

Right. if the towels were used for that. I'm still on the fence about that one. I can believe that she was dying as they fled, but two to five minutes to all three in concert decide to run out the house and up the street somewhere isn't a lot of time, and it still begs the question of the staunching and when the sexual assault would have occured. I believe she would have screamed the moment someone stepped to her in a threatening way, so two to five minutes to stab, sexually assault and run? I don't know about that, Nara capprezilli....

As well as attempt to strangle her

 

[Allusonz]

Oh, and notice one other thing. In picture 147, do you see rings on the toe print to the right of the ruler? Those "rings" look like rings from RG's shoes. Or am I imagining things?

http://www.friendsofamanda.org/miscellaneous/luminol/147.jpg

When I zoom out it appears that I can see some rings but when i zoom in I can't. I would think these have been overexposed but do not know for sure. I though would love to know the settings of the camera when they used it

 

[Allusonz]

Here's the front door, blocked off by police tape, but wide open as I was describing in my other post.

So, like I was saying, I believe that if the burglary were REAL, it makes sense that the front door would be wide open because RG would not have known that the trick door would come back open on him.

However, if the burglary were FAKE, I cannot see any reason that AK (who'd reported that the front door had been wide open when she arrived) would have actually left the front door wide open herself after staging the crime scene. she knew there were valuables in the house, as well as a dead body. So I think she'd lock the door properly before leaving, just to keep out any unwanted people who could discover the body prematurely or to keep out anyone who'd try to steal her computer and ipod, which were left on her desk per this photo:

So, since I believe she would have been prudent in locking the front door, I have to assume that she would have believed that the police would have assumed that the burglar entered and exited the window, not the front door. So this is why I do not understand why she would even tell the police the front door had been wide open, if she were staging it.

If the door is wide open, I'd assume it's because someone kicked it in or used it as a point of exit for large stolen items that couldn't go back out the window.

So if she were guilty, why does she tell police that the front door had been wide open? Her story without that detail would still be the same, and it could make more sense as to why she entered the house and showered without a clue to the murder. So that's why that detail leads me to believe the break-in is real.

In the same token, she could have said the front door was wide open, but I was too scared to go in the house, so I pulled it shut and locked it, and then went to get RS. Why does she have an elaborate story about showering etc, unless it actually happened?

Finding your front door wide open is probable cause to think something's in there, someone's in there, something dangerous might be about to happen. It could have stood on it's own as plenty of reason not to enter the cottage but still call MK and FR. AK was not caught in the act of a cleanup. She called everyone she did call of her own accord beginning an hour or so before the police arrived. So from 11am to 12pm or whatever was enough time for her to go over her cleaning job, get it right without interruption. So I see no need for the elaborate story about showering and blood and feces in the toilet.

Of course barring her being the stupidest crime scene stagger in history, I just think the stuff she said really happened. Imagine how easily she could have said that she'd arrived home to find the door open, and getting freaked out, she rushed to get RS so they could call the police. And she didn't walk around the scene so she could have an excuse for the stuff they found, because in truth, they didn't find anything that would connect her to the murder in the house. Apparently she'd done a good job "cleaning," So she just needed to set the discovery in motion.

Also if staging it, why not leave the front door wide open and not even bother to break a window? It's a proven trick door. AK and RS would have contended that the door had opened on its own in the middle of the night stranger sneaked in. No need for elaborate rock throwing stories, when all the residents could back up the claim that the front door did not lock. (side note, I heard many times on the news, 'and he got in through an unlocked door...')

Thanks again for these pictures. The one of the door being open again tells me that it was not AK that was in the cottage that night as they knew the lock was messed up.

It also appears the PLE did not realize the trick to locking this door properly as it was open and IIRC these pictures were taken on November 14

 

[wasnt_me]

When I zoom out it appears that I can see some rings but when i zoom in I can't. I would think these have been overexposed but do not know for sure. I though would love to know the settings of the camera when they used it

They had a lengthy talk over at the James randi board with some exposure numbers.

JREF Forum - View Single Post - Continuation Part 3 - Discussion of the Amanda Knox case

http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=215085&page=78

There's more talk over there around page 78 of that link about the technicality of the pics.

 

[wasnt_me]

I see a lot of extra things in that luminol mess, like extra toe prints, RG's shoe prints, folded, scrunched up prints that appear to come from the booties the techs wear, and at least one sideways foot print. What this is telling me is that it's a regular hallway with barefeet prints that were not cleaned up. They might have found more barefoot prints on top of more barefoot prints if they had applied the luminol correctly.

But you cannot tell me they applied it correctly if the ruler is glowing and if the booties of that man in the picture have luminol-glowing spatter on top of them. Why did the luminol react with the ruler and the booties? Turnip juice? You can't get a blood from turnips. do a glow from luminol is NO indicator of blood unless he did have blood on his shoes and the paper ruler was the murder weapon.

 

[wasnt_me]

BBM

I wish I could but honestly I can't take known facts and twist them around to enable a group to justify their perceptions.

You can't scream while drowning which in effect is what happened to her as I am sure oldsteve can attest to. She was aspirating blood thus her lungs etc were full.

The bottom line is she could not of screamed after her throat was cut

Of course, I have a song for you and the ear witnesses:

"Hush, hush...keep it down now; voices carry...." --aimee mann.

 

[SMK]

Latest Dateline report. They are saying the verdict is due next month, so hopefully still Sept.?:waitasec:

http://www.sbs.com.au/dateline/story/watch/id/601316/n/Justice-on-Trial

 

[SMK]

The more i read posts like this, the more i wish it would all be over soon:
:razz: ( i see they changed my razz; really bad:furious:

Acquittal? No. That's out of the question. There is too much remaining proof of their presence at the crime scene.

At least, there is too much proof of Amanda's presence at the crime scene. For Raffaele, apart from the bra clasp, there is clearly less; the footprint and that may be all. But Raffaele is sunk by his lies and weird, scary and suspicious statements.

 

[wasnt_me]

There is proof that Amanda, at some point in time, used her own bathroom. That's it.

 

[wasnt_me]

The more I think about it, the more I think MK came home, the house was dark, maybe there was a light on in that bathroom, maybe he turned it off when he heard her key in the lock. But I think she smelled RG in the bathroom. How could she not? It was a small house, and if he was sitting there, taking a dump, I sincerely believed she smelled it, realized something was up, and she went into that bathroom.

He fell off the toilet trying to get up and chase her after she screamed. That's gotta be how it started.

It's not a pleasant ordor to think about, but I can't believe he took a dump like that, and it smelled like roses.

 

[SMK]

The more I think about it, the more I think MK came home, the house was dark, maybe there was a light on in that bathroom, maybe he turned it off when he heard her key in the lock. But I think she smelled RG in the bathroom. How could she not? It was a small house, and if he was sitting there, taking a dump, I sincerely believed she smelled it, realized something was up, and she went into that bathroom.

He fell off the toilet trying to get up and chase her after she screamed. That's gotta be how it started.

It's not a pleasant ordor to think about, but I can't believe he took a dump like that, and it smelled like roses.

Possibly. :waitasec::sick: But as per Hendry's analysis, I can envision him hearing MK return home early, and sitting there, frozen. Getting up and not flushing, because he did not want her to hear. Trying the front door, realizing he was trapped. Going to her room, saying, sorry, I let myself in, I am a friend of Giocomo's. Her being upset, and then her finding the broken window and yelling, then the escalation.....

 

[SMK]

Same old same old from PMF. You would think there had been no refutations at all. :waiting::waiting: I wish the verdict would come in Sep, and convictions be overturned , and no appeal from Prosecution. Would like to see this case wrap...

The appeals don't hinge on the knife and bra clasp evidence. There are other key pieces of evidence: the mixed blood samples, Sollecito's bloody footprint on the blue bathmat, Knox's and Sollecito's bare bloody footprints which were revealed by Luminol, the three traces of Meredith's blood in Knox's room, the mobile phone and computer records that provide irrefutable proof that Knox and Sollecito lied, Knox's telephone calls and conversations with Filomena on 2 November 2007, Knox's false and malicious accusation against Diya Lumumba which she didn't retract the whole time he was in prison, the staged break-in, the testimony of Nara Capezzali and Marco Quintavalle and the testimony of countless forensic experts who testified that more than one person killed Meredith.

I think it will boil down to how Hellman and the jury view all: Either as PMF and TJMK do, or as Hendry et al do; there seems to be no middle ground. And their minds must be made up at this point.

 

[wasnt_me]

Possibly. :waitasec::sick: But as per Hendry's analysis, I can envision him hearing MK return home early, and sitting there, frozen. Getting up and not flushing, because he did not want her to hear. Trying the front door, realizing he was trapped. Going to her room, saying, sorry, I let myself in, I am a friend of Giocomo's. Her being upset, and then her finding the broken window and yelling, then the escalation.....

That's always an option, but I don't agree with it, based on RG's half lie half truth story. Like I said, I can't imagine him taking a crap and she not walking in the house and smelling it or noticing that he had the light on in the bathroom when all other lights were off. That crap in that picture we saw looking like it STANK. I'm just thinking she got in the door and smelt something.

 

[SMK]

That's always an option, but I don't agree with it, based on RG's half lie half truth story. Like I said, I can't imagine him taking a crap and she not walking in the house and smelling it or noticing that he had the light on in the bathroom when all other lights were off. That crap in that picture we saw looking like it STANK. I'm just thinking she got in the door and smelt something.

ugh, you may be right......:sick: