Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #20

[Allusonz]

As I just noted on JREF, Hellmann did not take the opportunity to throw Michelle Moore out of court, which presumably Mignini's <modsnip> Massei would have done in a heatbeat. I think this particular judge has made up his mind, and this time in the right direction.

The interesting question to me will be whether any civil awards will be made. I suspect Hellman may acquit Knox and Sollecito; or give them a reduced sentence and release them on the basis of time served, which amounts to nearly the same thing. I suspect he may feel compelled to at least tip his hat to his colleagues, and not appear to be buckling to the Americans. So along with this, Amanda Knox might be assessed some financial damages.

Largely because of the "complexity" -- read: medievalism -- of Italy's legal system, the mind truly does reel over the vicissitudes.

I must agree with this. I believe he has made a decision. As for the civil cases I am not sure how he will rule on these but I must take into consideration the pattern which has emerged with respect to how PLE acts and I think he is allowing themselves to fall deeper into there own lies which will give him more ammunition if he so chooses to use it with respect to the civil cases.

 

[Allusonz]

She didn't know what was real so she told police that Patrick Lumumba raped and murdered her roommate? That's rather farfetched. On the surface, it looks like Knox thought that she could point the finger at Lumumba and be allowed to go free (that's also reported by Dempsey). Knox was trying to buy herself some time until Edda arrived (which was the following morning) and when she hoped to get out of town with the help of her mother and the woman in Germany.

Why would Knox have difficulties knowing what is real? Is she nuts?

It appears those goal posts are getting wider and wider

 

[Allusonz]

Exactly. Room mates will talk about one another. If you have never done it, you're probably the messy one! It is almost impossible to have a living situation where noone complains about anything. It doesn't mean anything sinister.

So true and it is not just roomates. It can be children, BF's, husbands etc. I am sure most of us has said/done something as some point in our life never dreaming it would be used against us

 

[sherlockh]

If she was led to believe that PL was guilty by PLE it cannot be a lie. She did admit to being confused, not knowing if what she said was real but then we have all read her statements

She admitted she lied but she doesn't remember why. No mention of any coercion.
http://www.libero-news.it/news/818162/C ... parla.html

"I'm sorry for Patrick Lumumba. I don't know what got into me, I was scared, I was disoriented: it's true, I lied, but I do not remember why."

Besides as Lumumba's lawyer pointed out today, Knox appeared in front of the judge on November 8th. She could have cleared up all the confusion right there but she refused to talk.

 

[otto]

I was referring to what Natalie said, not what the judge and jury decided.

Natalie said that it was the big picture of all the evidence together that convinced her of Knox's guilt.

 

[SMK]

Natalie said that it was the big picture of all the evidence together that convinced her of Knox's guilt.

I was referring to Natalie's original suspicion that Amanda acted strangely. Perhaps it was the double soul showing.

 

[SMK]

Update on schedule via word from Frank Sfarzo:

Tues , Th , Fri: Finish civil parties and closings for Knox and Sollectio
Sat: Rebuttal/reply
Mon Oct 3: statements from Amanda and Raffaele -- court goes to deliberate, and will come back with a verdict in the evening.

or another way of putting it:


Tues: Knox closing;
Wed.: Court closed ;
Th: Sollecito closing;
F, S: Rebuttal;
Mon Oct 3: Defendants speak; deliberation; verdict pending.

 

[OldSteve]

She admitted she lied but she doesn't remember why. No mention of any coercion.
http://www.libero-news.it/news/818162/C ... parla.html

Besides as Lumumba's lawyer pointed out today, Knox appeared in front of the judge on November 8th. She could have cleared up all the confusion right there but she refused to talk.

BBM
I think one has to very careful there in what they say there, especially as a foreigner, and an American one at that.
Imagine if she had said, something like - after the night I had with LE grilling me I would have said the Pope did it" - they would have given her a triple life sentence.

Look at what happened to her for saying she slapped on the back of the head.

 

[OldSteve]

Update on schedule via word from Frank Sfarzo:

Tues , Th , Fri: Finish civil parties and closings for Knox and Sollectio
Sat: Rebuttal/reply
Mon Oct 3: statements from Amanda and Raffaele -- court goes to deliberate, and will come back with a verdict in the evening.

or another way of putting it:


Tues: Knox closing;
Wed.: Court closed ;
Th: Sollecito closing;
F, S: Rebuttal;
Mon Oct 3: Defendants speak; deliberation; verdict pending.

Thanks for this update - got to wonder what AK/RS will say on Oct. 3rd?!

 

[Footwarrior]

BBM
I think one has to very careful there in what they say there, especially as a foreigner, and an American one at that.
Imagine if she had said, something like - after the night I had with LE grilling me I would have said the Pope did it" - they would have given her a triple life sentence.

Look at what happened to her for saying she slapped on the back of the head.

Amanda was kept in solitary from the time of her arrest on Nov. 6 until her first appearance before a judge. She met her lawyer for the first time during that court appearance.

Under such circumstances, any competent lawyer would advise their client to remain silent.

 

[SMK]

Thanks for this update - got to wonder what AK/RS will say on Oct. 3rd?!

You're very welcome: Only thing is, now someone is saying Sollecito will close before Knox, the rebuttals will be Fri---but I guess it all leads up to Oct 3....:crazy: yes, i am sure the 2 defendants will make impassioned statements....

 

[Salem]

I would truly have to ask myself did he make himself a party to this or was he ummmmm "coerced" into being a party to it

Interesting thought. Why do you think he might have been coerced? Just as additional pressure against AK and consequently more support for the prosecution?

How much weight will RG's statement, that both AK and RS were there, carry, do you think?

Salem

 

[SMK]

Also high drama in court today as Michelle Moore, the wife of Steve Moore, retired FBI expert and outspoken critic of the prosecution, (both in the courtroom as observers), decided it would be a good idea to let Mignini know she though he was "an evil person". She is now being detained. She may receive a costly fine for insulting (libeling) him. At this time she is not allowed to leave the building.

http://www.westseattleherald.com/2011/09/26/news/update-3-amanda-knox-court-today-prosecutor-migni

 

[SMK]

COURT SCHEDULE UNTIL VERDICT

Raffale Sollecito's defense team goes tomorrow, Tuesday, and Amanda Knox's defense team is up Thursday. Friday and Saturday is scheduled for rebuttals.
Then verdict should come Saturday or Monday.

http://www.westseattleherald.com/2011/09/26/news/update-3-amanda-knox-court-today-prosecutor-migni

 

[emyr]

Otto, I can cite other cases where relatives or close friends thought a suspect was guilty of a crime based on "suspicious behavior" that later tuned out to mean nothing when the actual culprit was found. It means very little in the long run.

Something I find curious though - if Meredith's friends thought Amanda knowing that Meredith "bled to death" was so suspicious, why on earth wouldn't their next question be "How do you know that?". It would be a natural, and easy question to ask.

Since you mention her testimony upthread, you probably know that she explains knowing this from everyone at the scene talking about it.

You know what bugs me? That she says Amanda knew things she shouldn't have known, and then goes on to say Amanda said the body was found in a cupboard. Well.... IT WASN'T.

So wouldn't that be Amanda NOT knowing the facts of the murder?

And based on this, she thinks Amanda is the murderer? And then she talks about how bad Amanda is for saying someone is a murderer who wasn't the murderer?

 

[ohiogirl]

Ah, I see what you are saying, yes. I am mixing up the civil and criminal cases. Even so, this sort of talk IMO is not ever appropriate, even within a civil case.

It is not you who are mixing them up. It is the Italian judicial system.
It is totally ridiculous that they allow the civil and criminal cases to be presented together. Some evidence being allowed at the civil case and not in the criminal case, but all being heard together is ludicrous. imo

 

[ohiogirl]

Natalie said that it was the big picture of all the evidence together that convinced her of Knox's guilt.

Natalie had no hard evidence to persuade readers of Knox's guilt – just a gut feeling that Knox was guilty.

Read more: http://www.thefirstpost.co.uk/85009...shut-up-meredith-kercher-murder#ixzz1Z5hEFiDw

 

[emyr]

They both knew Rudy and I think either one or both helped clean up the murder scene.

Neither A or R have alibis, in fact R would not even give Amanda an Alibi, backing up her claim that they were at R's place the night of the murder.

Both have lied repeatedly.......

and how would Amanda know that Meredith bled to death if she was not there as she claimed.

I hope she gets life over there.

She is guilty.......

We provided proof in previous threads that Amanda and Raffaelle got into the car with two of the people from the flat who then told them what they had seen in the room. Amanda's first statements (as confirmed by the article that everyone is linking here) was that Meredith was found in a cupboard with a blanket over her. Which isn't true.

It's the kind of story you would hear because someone is relating the "truth" third-hand from stories they misunderstood from people telling them things in the car.

And, because so far no one who believes that these guys are guilty has been able to explain to me this:

Please tell me why Rudy's fingerprints were on Meredith's ransacked purse. If Amanda had to stage a robbery, how does that explain the fact that Meredith's purse was empty and Rudy's fingerprints are on her purse? Did Amanda stage his fingerprints and Meredith's blood on the purse?

If Rudy was there because he was invited, and the result ended with Amanda having to stage the scene to appear like a robbery.... then how does that lead to him robbing Meredith?

Give me a plausible explanation. Any plausible explanation, and how it fits into the scene.

 

[SMK]

I posted this on JREF too. A picture tells a thousand words. May they go their separate ways, never to face eachother again: from Zimbio.com Sep 26

 

[Malkmus]

She admitted she lied but she doesn't remember why. No mention of any coercion.
http://www.libero-news.it/news/818162/C ... parla.html

Besides as Lumumba's lawyer pointed out today, Knox appeared in front of the judge on November 8th. She could have cleared up all the confusion right there but she refused to talk.

Is this another paper claiming an interview with Amanda when we recently established that she's not allowed any until she is released? Taking this "interview" with a grain of salt.