Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #20

[SMK]

Amanda Knox's Innocence Is No Technicality

http://www.groundreport.com/Business/Amanda-Knoxs-Innocence-Is-No-Technicality/2941571

 

[SMK]

Mignini, Patrick, Curt Knox, Amanda, Raffaele, Madison Paxton, et al:

[video=youtube;0O3V6wzNMJs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0O3V6wzNMJs&feature=player_embedded[/video]

 

[SMK]

Amanda Knox's Grueling Day: Called 'She Devil,' Shown Roommate's Wounds

VIDEO:

http://abcnews.go.com/International...opsy-photos-victim-suffered/story?id=14596941

The stakes are excruciatingly high for the former Seattle college student. While Knox and Sollecito are hoping that will be let out of the Italian prison where they have been confined for the last four years, prosecutors have asked the appeals court to increase their sentences to life in prison.

Maresca was the third lawyer to speak today and he presented the jury with a second look at autopsy photos that had been shown earlier in the appeal. While the court was cleared when the grisly photos were originally shown, spectators were allowed to remain in the courtroom today.

The lawyer held up a lovely photo of Kercher when she was alive and said, "I don't know why such a happy girl was killed."

 

[otto]

VIDEO:

"The stakes are excruciatingly high for the former Seattle college student. While Knox and Sollecito are hoping that will be let out of the Italian prison where they have been confined for the last four years, prosecutors have asked the appeals court to increase their sentences to life in prison.

Maresca was the third lawyer to speak today and he presented the jury with a second look at autopsy photos that had been shown earlier in the appeal. While the court was cleared when the grisly photos were originally shown, spectators were allowed to remain in the courtroom today.

The lawyer held up a lovely photo of Kercher when she was alive and said, "I don't know why such a happy girl was killed."

http://abcnews.go.com/International...opsy-photos-victim-suffered/story?id=14596941

What makes the stakes in this murder trial any different from any murder trial? Freedom or prison, those are the options in most countries. If the options were freedom, prison or death ... now that would be excruciatingly high.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

Interesting thought. Why do you think he might have been coerced? Just as additional pressure against AK and consequently more support for the prosecution?

How much weight will RG's statement, that both AK and RS were there, carry, do you think?

Salem

The PLE had a great deal of power over Lumumba; they kept his place closed for months after the crime. They also were no doubt aware that he had initially said that he was mistreated. Those things might give them some leverage with him. From PLE's perspective the fact of running the civil trial concurrently with the criminal case was enormously beneficial to the prosecution, in that it allowed Ms. Knox's statement(s?) into evidence. Once it is in, it is in all the way, IMHO. How the same jury is supposed to take a statement into account for one legal proceeding and pretend it does not exist for another is beyond me.

I think Guede's statement will be taken every bit as seriously as everything else that has come out of his mouth.

 

[wasnt_me]

I find this interesting:

"Lumumba made himself a party to the case, as is permitted under Italian law, and his presence at the trial and appeal has had an important bearing on both."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/sep/26/amanda-knox-enchanting-witch?newsfeed=true

It is interesting that PL has made himself a party to this case. He knew both girls, they both worked for him.

Salem

What is interesting to me is that his lawyer is allowed to comment on anything OUTSIDE the bounds of the "confession." PL has no relevance in the actual murder case, but amazingly, his lawyer can comment on it in open court. It's also amazing that the civil suits continue to run concurrent with the trial when the judge said that her "confession" couldn't even be used as evidence in her trial. RS definitely has SC appeal grounds on that, I would think, because he had nothing to do with said "confession," yet it's impacting his trial.

 

[otto]

The PLE had a great deal of power over Lumumba; they kept his place closed for months after the crime. They also were no doubt aware that he had initially said that he was mistreated. Those things might give them some leverage with him. From PLE's perspective the fact of running the civil trial concurrently with the criminal case was enormously beneficial to the prosecution, in that it allowed Ms. Knox's statement(s?) into evidence. Once it is in, it is in all the way, IMHO. How the same jury is supposed to take a statement into account for one legal proceeding and pretend it does not exist for another is beyond me.

I think Guede's statement will be taken every bit as seriously as everything else that has come out of his mouth.

There is only one report of Patrick claiming he was mistreated and that is the Dailymail article that has been discussed here often. The entire article is filled with untruths.

 

[SMK]

What makes the stakes in this murder trial any different from any murder trial? Freedom or prison, those are the options in most countries. If the options were freedom, prison or death ... now that would be excruciatingly high.

personally, I would pick death over prison, any time.

 

[wasnt_me]

this is also strange to me:

BLNadeauBarbie Latza Nadeau
Maresca reiterating the request for damages from those who are ultimately found responsible for #meredithkercher murder. #amandaknox

I do not understand why the civil suits are allowed at this time, just by this statement above. It is appropriate for Maresca to ask this ONCE guilt has been established and all appeals exhausted. Such as in RG's case. In my opinion, it's not proper to ask for this at the same trials that are still establishing guilt. I'm just befuddled by it.

 

[wasnt_me]

personally, I would pick death over prison, any time.

"Give me liberty or give me death."

 

[Chris_Halkides]

There is only one report of Patrick claiming he was mistreated and that is the Dailymail article that has been discussed here often. The entire article is filled with untruths.

otto,

I agree that the article is not trustworthy. However, it is odd that Patrick has not gone after the Daily Mail, suggesting perhaps that they have a record of what he said. Even if we ignore his (real or made-up) allegation, PLE still closed his bar for several months. It would be interesting to know the relative timing of his bar reopening and when he decided to bring the civil suit.

 

[Salem]

KNOCK IT OFF or you all are going on TO's. With all the new developments and the closing arguments, etc. there is no reason to be spending your time bickering and wasting my time to moderate it.

Knock it off!

Salem

 

[wasnt_me]

This is strange, too:

@BLNadeauBarbie Latza Nadeau
Perna: cuts on palm of #meredithkercher hand were made by point of knife as a threat, not defense wounds which would be deeper. #amandaknox

I'm trying to imagine how the wounds on her hands were "threats" and not defense wounds. How does this happen? She's holding her hands up in a defense manner and one person is just lightly slicing them? Makes no sense. Sounds like torture. If two people are holding her down, how do the "light" torture marks occur? I can only assume that those "holding her down" are holding her hands. So they made her hold her hand out for these "light" threatening slices?

In my opinion, they should have just left them as defensive wounds.

 

[SMK]

"Give me liberty or give me death."

Yup, that's what I meant. Some things are worth dying for, such as autonomy and dignity.

 

[wasnt_me]

Did we ever know or discuss if MK's door locked automatically? My front door does that if I set it to.

BLNadeauBarbie Latza Nadeau
Maresca: whoever killed #meredithkercher locked the door and threw away the key in #amandaknox appeal.

8 hours ago

Sorry, all these i'm posting are tweets from Nadeau as she reported what she heard in trial.

 

[Salem]

This is strange, too:



I'm trying to imagine how the wounds on her hands were "threats" and not defense wounds. How does this happen? She's holding her hands up in a defense manner and one person is just lightly slicing them? Makes no sense. Sounds like torture. If two people are holding her down, how do the "light" torture marks occur? I can only assume that those "holding her down" are holding her hands. So they made her hold her hand out for these "light" threatening slices?

In my opinion, they should have just left them as defensive wounds.

Is there more info on this or only the tweet? I too think this is strange. Surely they could tell at the beginning that the cuts were not defensive wounds?

Salem

 

[wasnt_me]

Yup, that's what I meant. Some things are worth dying for, such as autonomy and dignity.

Well, maybe not dignity.....:crazy: I'd just fight to get that one back. BUT, if we look at the West Memphis 3, maybe we ought to think about this liberty and death thing, because Liberty could return, even some 20yrs later.

 

[Allusonz]

Interesting thought. Why do you think he might have been coerced? Just as additional pressure against AK and consequently more support for the prosecution?

How much weight will RG's statement, that both AK and RS were there, carry, do you think?

Salem

Chris has aptly stated my sentiments with respect to this. I would just like to add a few additional thoughts.

The first being that he ensured himself from being constantly harassed by PLE. If he had of continued with his claims he would be going through much of what Frank has been.

As for Rudy Guede, there is another reason I would not hold much weight to what he states simply since he has managed to escape being cross examined by the defense. In fact it was Mignini that real aloud his statement of which he did not even understand some of the terminology.

 

[wasnt_me]

Is there more info on this or only the tweet? I too think this is strange. Surely they could tell at the beginning that the cuts were not defensive wounds?

Salem

There's so much to recall, so hopefully others will help me. As I remember, they have claimed that they weren't defense wounds, even though they appear just as defense wounds would, on the palms. THey had surmised that maybe her hand had falllen on the piece of glass in her room, but that was dismissed because it was only one piece of glass over by the door, presumably carried in by RG after he broke in or by AK or RS during the staging.

I think they are defense wounds that occured when her neck was getting gashed and she was bringing her hands up to shield her neck, but the knife was in motion as she grasped for her neck. She had three gashes on her neck, one fatal, the other two I think were just gashes, but if she kept putting her hands in the way, then that might explain the sloppiness of the jabs and the slices on her hands. Might also explain the slices on RG's hands as he tried to keep control of her and the knife. But just my opinion. I think he could have cut himself, lost grip of her and that's how she ended up on the other side of the room, because she rushed forward and hit her chair at the desk. Then I think he grabbed her by her hair, pulling some of it out as evidenced on the floor, to get control of her again. from there, he stabbed her that last time, right by the wardrobe. Again, I'm totally theorizing based on the evidence i see.

 

[OldSteve]

There is only one report of Patrick claiming he was mistreated and that is the Dailymail article that has been discussed here often. The entire article is filled with untruths.

He knows what happens if he says he was mistreated - he'd be up for slander, just like AK is for saying she was slapped on the back of the head.