MI MI - Julia Niswender, 23, EMU student, Ypsilanti, 10 Dec 2012 - #3

[FindHG]

It seems like everybody else would have to be lying for his advocates to be telling the truth, LE, the family members with suspicions, the parent's from the Do Jo, college friends, etc... on any given point, then child *advertiser censored* is excused, removing bathroom doors, nutty antics, odd lifestyle choices, and on and on, there's a good reason for everything.

What's the reason for the missing laptop, the run to the Do Jo and no accountability, no statement about where he was around the time Julia was murdered?

 

[dmc43613]

It seems like everybody else would have to be lying for his advocates to be telling the truth, LE, the family members with suspicions, the parent's from the Do Jo, college friends, etc... on any given point, then child *advertiser censored* is excused, removing bathroom doors, nutty antics, odd lifestyle choices, and on and on, there's a good reason for everything.

What's the reason for the missing laptop, the run to the Do Jo and no accountability, no statement about where he was around the time Julia was murdered?

I think these are my biggest reasons to flip flop on JT vs roommate drug angle.

 

[DazednConfuzed09]

Earlier in Thread #3 I mentioned tools available to LE and the Prosecutor to gather information regarding a case. For the past 20 years in Michigan there has been an Investigative Subpoena available to ask for (requiring proof of necessity). Does anyone know why this has not been used???

 

[black_squirrel]

IIRC, it's Jim Turnquist's defense attorney who has said there are "only 7 photos" so let's take that with a giant heap of salt. Not to mention that there is an entire laptop missing. Regardless of our differing opinions, the details will come out soon.

Usually with child *advertiser censored* cases, we see headlines that they found thousands of child *advertiser censored* pictures. In this case, LE and the prosecution has not said anything about the number of pictures. I think that if there were thousands of pictures, then this fact would have been brought up in the bail hearings and the hearing about where the youngest daughter should stay. If the number 7 is far off, then this soon will be revealed.

I am not convinced about the "missing laptop". Has LE been provided with evidence of the existence of a missing laptop? In any case, it seems to me that if there is indeed a missing laptop, then we will hear about it and JT will be charged with obstruction of justice for making it disappear.

 

[black_squirrel]

It seems like everybody else would have to be lying for his advocates to be telling the truth, LE, the family members with suspicions, the parent's from the Do Jo, college friends, etc... on any given point, then child *advertiser censored* is excused, removing bathroom doors, nutty antics, odd lifestyle choices, and on and on, there's a good reason for everything.

What's the reason for the missing laptop, the run to the Do Jo and no accountability, no statement about where he was around the time Julia was murdered?

A lot of parents from the Dojo showed up to support JT in one of the hearings. Your "ad populum" argument is generally considered a fallacy. In the middle ages, the majority of people believed the earth to be flat.

I think it is not so much about telling the truth, because most of the discussion in this forum is speculation. Are there any FACTS that are disputed, and if so, what are those facts?

 

[Trojan1966]

It seems like everybody else would have to be lying for his advocates to be telling the truth, LE, the family members with suspicions, the parent's from the Do Jo, college friends, etc... on any given point, then child *advertiser censored* is excused, removing bathroom doors, nutty antics, odd lifestyle choices, and on and on, there's a good reason for everything.

What's the reason for the missing laptop, the run to the Do Jo and no accountability, no statement about where he was around the time Julia was murdered?

I'm sure JT went to the Do Jo so he could call his lawyer since the Monroe police seized all their cell phones and they don't have a land line. Where is the "missing" laptop??? I'd like to know. Possibly KT would like to join WS so she can answer this question. I have suggested it to her. :thinking:

 

[Trojan1966]

A lot of parents from the Dojo showed up to support JT in one of the hearings. Your "ad populum" argument is generally considered a fallacy. In the middle ages, the majority of people believed the earth to be flat.

I think it is not so much about telling the truth, because most of the discussion in this forum is speculation. Are there any FACTS that are disputed, and if so, what are those facts?

Well, the next pretrial will be very interesting.... If the state continues to push for a trial based on more evidence, I wonder how many will still be showing up? Wow, they must be taking a lot of time off from their jobs just to go to these preliminary hearings. JMO

 

[Trojan1966]

A lot of parents from the Dojo showed up to support JT in one of the hearings. Your "ad populum" argument is generally considered a fallacy. In the middle ages, the majority of people believed the earth to be flat.

I think it is not so much about telling the truth, because most of the discussion in this forum is speculation. Are there any FACTS that are disputed, and if so, what are those facts?

FACTS AS I KNOW THEM:
1. Julia's murder was a homicide. She was found in her tub and her cause of death was asphyxiation associated with drowning.
2. The crime probably happened between Sunday night and early Monday morning. (Dec 9th & 10th)
Julia was found Tuesday evening after a roommate called LE for a welfare check. I was notified between 9:30-10:30PM that night that Julia was dead.
3. Julia's toxicology report was inconclusive but has not been released to the general public (this raises some questions in my mind).
4. Many, many students at EMU and Julia's friends have been interviewed and receive polygraph tests.
Julia's roommates have been checked out and as far as I know they and their boyfriends have been cleared.
5. JT is now a POI in Julia's murder. Not necessarily a suspect but a POI because of his refusal to provide formal statements to LE so they may "clear" him.
6. JT & KT liked the first detective but do not like the current lead detective.
7. JT did take a polygraph test, provide DNA sample and fingerprints early in the investigation.
8. His lawyer claims the State Police cleared JT early on but I have seen no public statement to that affect anywhere in the news media.
9. The first detective probably passed on too much info to KT & JT, thus causing concerns to the whole investigation process.
10. JT & KT provided statements early in the investigation but now refuse to provide formal written and signed statements. Early statements were possibly more of background info on Julia than direct questions to JT & KT concerning their alibis and such.
11. JT's lawyer says he was home with his family. If so, why not give a formal statement to LE stating this.
12. Current case against JT probably is a standalone item. Probably does not have anything to do with this case although if he is found guilty, it may be relevant. JMO

These are the facts that I can think of right now. I have been keeping quite a file of information on this case but I don't have in front of me right now.
I hope this helps. :thinking:

 

[MIMOMMY]

Okay FindHG, you made me smile
12/2014 LE had a search warrant and took Kim's computer.

02/2015 another search warrant served, they take 1 computer, camera, video recorder and cell phones. That is when JT got very angry, Kim was upset when Jim left saying that he was going to end this.... She went up to the State Farm at the corner had them call 911 she was very upset afraid of what JT might do... And that same day he barricaded himself in the Do Jo, LE brought him to the hospital, next day he was arrested on the child *advertiser censored*.
JT's computer that he received as a gift from Jennifer and Julia is missing in action, according to LE.

See that's not at all confusing right FindHG ;-)

My understanding is that the gifted laptop is the one that was taken in February.

 

[Trojan1966]

My understanding is that the gifted laptop is the one that was taken in February.

That laptop was not the one from December 2012 time frame but one that was purchased not too long ago! That is not too hard for LE to verify and that's what I have been told! This may have been a replacement for the one seized in December 2014. Yes, LE did have a search warrant at that time.

 

[MIMOMMY]

My understanding is that they seized the family laptop in December of 2012. The visit in February was to seize the laptop that was a gift from the twins.

 

[MIMOMMY]

It is also my understanding that LE has had the ability from the very beginning to be able to track which electronics are/have been in the home - the ISP can track all IP's being used?

 

[FindHG]

FACTS AS I KNOW THEM:
1. Julia's murder was a homicide. She was found in her tub and her cause of death was asphyxiation associated with drowning.
2. The crime probably happened between Sunday night and early Monday morning. (Dec 9th & 10th)
Julia was found Tuesday evening after a roommate called LE for a welfare check. I was notified between 9:30-10:30PM that night that Julia was dead.
3. Julia's toxicology report was inconclusive but has not been released to the general public (this raises some questions in my mind).
4. Many, many students at EMU and Julia's friends have been interviewed and receive polygraph tests.
Julia's roommates have been checked out and as far as I know they and their boyfriends have been cleared.
5. JT is now a POI in Julia's murder. Not necessarily a suspect but a POI because of his refusal to provide formal statements to LE so they may "clear" him.
6. JT & KT liked the first detective but do not like the current lead detective.
7. JT did take a polygraph test, provide DNA sample and fingerprints early in the investigation.
8. His lawyer claims the State Police cleared JT early on but I have seen no public statement to that affect anywhere in the news media.
9. The first detective probably passed on too much info to KT & JT, thus causing concerns to the whole investigation process.
10. JT & KT provided statements early in the investigation but now refuse to provide formal written and signed statements. Early statements were possibly more of background info on Julia than direct questions to JT & KT concerning their alibis and such.
11. JT's lawyer says he was home with his family. If so, why not give a formal statement to LE stating this.
12. Current case against JT probably is a standalone item. Probably does not have anything to do with this case although if he is found guilty, it may be relevant. JMO

These are the facts that I can think of right now. I have been keeping quite a file of information on this case but I don't have in front of me right now.
I hope this helps. :thinking:

Yes, this helps a great deal, as all your fair and well informed post have been a help, Trojan1966. Thank you for keep us clued in.

I'm sure JT went to the Do Jo so he could call his lawyer since the Monroe police seized all their cell phones and they don't have a land line. Where is the "missing" laptop??? I'd like to know. Possibly KT would like to join WS so she can answer this question. I have suggested it to her. :thinking:

You're a great dad to keep reaching out to her. I hope she realizes you have her best interests at heart, especially when it comes to your grandchildren. I'm sorry for the pain it causes to have such discord and turmoil, and I hope they realize it will keep tearing at them until the truth comes out, which in most cases eventually it does. The situation here, seems to me, way past the point of no return to prop a POI as victim.

 

[Trojan1966]

It is also my understanding that LE has had the ability from the very beginning to be able to track which electronics are/have been in the home - the ISP can track all IP's being used?

This is very true. I have checked with some IT people and what you are saying is relative easy to do and I'm sure it has been done by LE.

 

[Sassyspecs]

If K and JT are telling the truth, that JT fully cooperated with LE, had nothing to do with Julia's death, and is innocent of the child *advertiser censored* charges then I must ask why this is all happening? Why would LE lie about JT giving them a formal statement? Why not (accompanied by or thru your attorney) provide them with the information they say they need to continue with their investigation? If it's true that LE had already been given this information then what's the harm in giving it again?

When a person is accused of any crime of a sexual nature against a child, whether or not they're guilty, it's a bell that cannot be unrung. JT's attorney suggesting that there are only 7 photos of questionable age (if true) would most likely mean LE brought these charges in order to investigate JT further in regards to Julia's death. Why would they do this if he's been so cooperative, passed lie detector tests, submitted DNA and fingerprints, ect?? I can't accept that LE would go to such great lengths (child *advertiser censored* charges) in order to simply get a statement K & JT swear they already have anyway. Also, if what the attorney says is correct, why did he waive the preliminary exam on JT's behalf? Especially if the possibility exists that someone else downloaded these images & it was a shared computer. I am not an attorney so if anyone has a reason for an innocent person to waive this hearing, I would appreciate some clarification.

IMO one of two things is happening here, the *advertiser censored* charges were brought to investigate JT further in the death of his stepdaughter and if this is the case it's because LE most likely has more evidence against him than just the opinion of extended family & lack a simple explanation of his whereabouts. The second would be that the two cases are unrelated and there were more than just 7 images of questionable age found on the computer that points directly to JT especially if this is a shared computer.

I'm also not sure if it's been discussed but on the RIP Julia Facebook page there have been a couple postings from JT (under his minor daughter's name) that bothered me. IMO they were bizarre and inappropriate & I found it very strange that he would say things about family members owing him money, mental images he created of Julia on the night she was killed, a phone call from the IRS & the addition on his home he was now regretting on Julia's memorial page. Certainly not proof of anything but eye brow raising none the less.

 

[MIMOMMY]

Questions have been previously asked in regards to the identity of the twin's father - It has been confirmed that the individual was a few year's older than Kim, at one point lived in the family home and he recently resided out of state, and is currently deceased.

 

[Spellbound]

Excellent post, sassyspecs. I agree with most you have said. Not that I disagree with anything, just did not know some of it. You have asked good questions.

I have not seen them, but those FB postings seem very strange to me.

Thanks for sharing and being here.

 

[MIMOMMY]

I have spoken with KT for clarity on several items today after the events of last night: This is what she would like to be known:

There was not a laptop taken from the home at all in 2012.

In regards to them being home and not answering the door - yes they were home and participating in "adult activities" This was in March or April 2013. This was the same day they went to Grandma R's house and took her laptop. JT has only EVER had 1 lawyer. He did not get that lawyer until the March/April 2013 incident.

The first laptop from the home was given to the police willingly by JT and KT in December of 2014.

The day of the warrant - Taken from the home with that warrant were their new and old phones, camera, a video recorder, and a few cds that were hunting related.

JT did not "run away" to the Dojo - he went calmly to use the telephone as the police had taken their phones. Jim was not at home when LE arrived, KT did make contact with JT when LE began to arrive.

KT was fearful that JT could possibly harm himself, she was never concerned that he would harm someone else. It was proven in court, and agreed by the judge that he was never "barricaded" in the dojo.

 

[4ist]

Possibly she was accusing me of posting lies? If so, please join WS and correct my possible errors!

Trojan, I happen to know that Your children unfortunately treat both of their parents (Grandma Rose) with very little respect. You and I and many others don't understand how Kim can stand behind JT and not be concearned about Child *advertiser censored* being on her computer. When you recently talked to her in March, she never once waived in her standing behind JT and the Child *advertiser censored* or him being the only POI in her daughters death. And she and Jennifer are upset with those that aren't behind what she is supporting!!!! I will never ever understand how from the outer we all have observed the Turnquists marriage as not being the Traditional, loving & caring, it was filled with discord and frustrations, that why in earth she is losing her extended family, and ruining the relationship with her own parents for a bad marriage!!!! My heart breaks for you Trojan, you are my husband, I am very sorry that everyone is experiencing this nightmare in the family. But my concern is for our granddaughters safety in the Turnquist home and Justice for Julia.

It's the police, not the media, who is "telling us", and they do have inside sources. And we also have inside sources, as you can see on the thread. And Turnquist seems to have had some degree of rational motive, mental problems that could have magnified those motives in his head, means (martial arts training and knowledge of where Julia would be), and opportunity (the time between when the others in his house went to sleep, and when they woke up) to have murdered Julia. And LE appears to have cleared everyone else they could find to look at, and they aren't satisfied with Turnquist's lack of cooperation, and no one has provided an explanation for that lack of cooperation. That doesn't mean that we are in a position to judge Turnquist's guilt or innocence, or that we shouldn't keep looking for facts that could support alternate theories, but it does clearly qualify him as a POI.

The only POI in Julia's murder to date is Jim Turnquist. We need that formal statement. Why has he had at least two different attorneys (possibly 3 attorneys) since Julia died. If he was afraid in the beginning of LE coming across his childhood situation or the child *advertiser censored*, hey it's out ther now, so cooperate in your step daughters investigation now!

I'm sure JT went to the Do Jo so he could call his lawyer since the Monroe police seized all their cell phones and they don't have a land line. Where is the "missing" laptop??? I'd like to know. Possibly KT would like to join WS so she can answer this question. I have suggested it to her. :thinking:

Are you sure that Kim, Carrie and Jennifer hasn't joined a long time ago along with Melissa, Pam (that's who JT us supposedly living with) and perhaps even JT even though he is not suppose to be on any computers???

 

[MIMOMMY]

Trojan, I happen to know that Your children unfortunately treat both of their parents (Grandma Rose) with very little respect. You and I and many others don't understand how Kim can stand behind JT and not be concearned about Child *advertiser censored* being on her computer. When you recently talked to her in March, she never once waive red in her standing behind JT and the Child *advertiser censored* or the him being the only POI in her daughters death. And she and Jennifer are upset with those that aren't behind what she is supporting!!!! I will never ever understand how from the outer we all have observed the Turnquists marriage as not being the Traditional, loving & caring, it was filled with discord and frustrations, that why in earth she is losing her extended family, and ruining the relationship with her own parents for a bad marriage!!!! My heart breaks for you Trojan, you are my husband, I am very sorry that everyone is experiencing this nightmare in the family. But my concern is for our granddaughters safety in the Turnquist home and Justice for Julia.




The only POI in Julia's murder to date is Jim Turnquist. We need that formal statement. Why has he had at least two different attorneys (possibly 3 attorneys) since Julia died. If he was afraid in the beginning of LE coming across his childhood situation or the child *advertiser censored*, hey it's out ther now, so cooperate in your step daughters investigation now!





Are you sure that Kim, Carrie and Jennifer hasn't joined a long time ago along with Melissa, Pam (that's who JT us supposedly living with) and perhaps even JT even though he is not suppose to be on any computers???

JT is on a tether - I am pretty sure that he isn't SUPPOSEDLY living in anywhere and that the authorities are well aware of where he goes and where he lays his head at night. I can tell you for a fact that Kim is NOT a member of this site - last night and the day before were the first time she had visited the site in a very long time.