Michelle Young ~ Pregnant Mother NC Part 2

[PolkSaladAnnie]

When this child gets older however, someone at some time is going to have to tell her the truth, that is going to be most difficult. I'm of the mind that I truly hope her father is not involved - she has already lost too much.

charlie - caring & major point! I think Cassie's family might just be compiling a complete album of *everything* that showed her and her mommy together - as well as the family unit as a whole; I'd suspect a lock of hair to every clipping, every minor to major detail will be covered and kept aside for Cassie to consume at a later time in her life. No doubt, they'll keep showing her pics now of her home, keeping a sample of mom's fave perfume; keep her clothing; her personal effects such as her favorite hairbursh (etc) along with photo's of pets (even adopting said pet/s), pics of whole family to keep a wholesome memory alive.... etc

(Witnessed the above directly in my time... but each to his own)

 

[PolkSaladAnnie]

Excellent points. BTW, I can tell you are a seasoned poster by your use of the word spatter and not splatter......lol.

Heh heh, BeeCharmer! eR, ... EHEM ... the latter is ALL OVER my kitchen, lol

 

[raisincharlie]

charlie - caring & major point! I think Cassie's family might just be compiling a complete album of *everything* that showed her and her mommy together - as well as the family unit as a whole; I'd suspect a lock of hair to every clipping, every minor to major detail will be covered and kept aside for Cassie to consume at a later time in her life. No doubt, they'll keep showing her pics now of her home, keeping a sample of mom's fave perfume; keep her clothing; her personal effects such as her favorite hairbursh (etc) along with photo's of pets (even adopting said pet/s), pics of whole family to keep a wholesome memory alive.... etc

(Witnessed the above directly in my time... but each to his own)

Hope so...sorry you have had to experience such, no one should IMO.

 

[raisincharlie]

I'm just catching up after being away a few days ~ and know that nothing much has happened in the case.

There have been so many other cases where the husband has been the perpetrator, including the current ones, Darren Mack and Neil Entwistle, pending trial; and another one that stands out in my memory of Frederick Tokars, in Georgia a few years ago, who had enlisted his "business partner" Eddie Lawrence to find someone to "take care of his wife", who subsequently shot her to death in front of their small children. So it has unfortunately become a natural assumption to think of the husband first.

panthera

Very good to "see" you again !

RC

 

[PolkSaladAnnie]

Last I checked, nanandjim, it had been made private.

The same thing has happened with Fussel's website .... word has got out for all family/friends to close down personal access. Not surprising .... I would, too. Imagine getting NE or People knocking at your front door for "int"... (not to mention whackos out there...).

BTW: I'm often quite amazed at how much personal DETAIL some people freely offer over the Internet: totally defies sanity. Esp kids/youth - but generally, too.

 

[PolkSaladAnnie]

Dear all: cut/pasted this earlier .... (Actually .... I've been moved to distraction reading some of these sites, believe me )

http://www.feministsforlife.org/news/serrinuvva.htm

{edited - bold, color & sizing mine...}

Today's victims are speaking loudly and clearly on this issue. We need to listen.

According to a recent two-year study by the Center for the Advancement of Women, run by Faye Wattleton, former president of the Planned Parenthood Federation of America, reducing violence against women is the number one priority of women. Women who are pregnant are at particular risk of being targeted for violence. In fact, recent studies by two different state health departments have shown that a leading cause of maternal mortality is not complications during pregnancy or childbirth-rather, it's homicide.

For example, according to the Journal of the American Medical Association, a Maryland study concluded that, "A pregnant or recently pregnant woman is more likely to be a victim of homicide than to die of any other cause."
We are hearing more and more horrible stories via mainstream media of pregnant women who are assaulted by those who do not want them to carry a child to term.

• A doctor was videotaped as he tried to poison his pregnant fiancée.
• Another doctor attacked his girlfriend's abdomen with a needle.
• A number of women have tried to kill the unborn child of another woman who is involved with the same man.
• Unwilling fathers have hired thugs to intentionally kill the unborn child.

For every story we hear, countless more that go untold, such as the story of Marion Syversen, a board member of Feminists for Life, who lost her unborn child when her abusive father threw her down a flight of stairs when she was pregnant.

Women who have survived such unthinkable violence are unequivocal: justice demands recognition of and remedy for both their assault and the killing of their unborn baby.

The Unborn Victims of Violence Act would support justice for women who lose children as the result of a federal crime of violence.

Many women do not survive such crimes, and their grieving survivors are equally unequivocal: justice demands recognition of and remedy for the killing of both victims, the woman and her unborn child or children.

And the above is but a fraction of all that I managed to pick up...

 

[PolkSaladAnnie]

What IF the entire computer is missing?:doh:

JMHO
fran

Granted :doh: LOLLLL ... but .... if the highly contentious, and central to discovery of MY's body, said fax was missing - that would deem JY deceptive; last thing he needs right now but sure: his word/her word...

Either which way if the fax/printout is missing - that's another dot to join to the dots CE case. Of course, everything is pure speculation, we know ZERO.

Let's pray it wasn't her man...

 

[fran]

Dear all: cut/pasted this earlier .... (Actually .... I've been moved to distraction reading some of these sites, believe me )

For every story we hear, countless more that go untold, such as the story of Marion Syversen, a board member of Feminists for Life, who lost her unborn child when her abusive father threw her down a flight of stairs when she was pregnant.

And the above is but a fraction of all that I managed to pick up...

Ahhh PSA, these are sad, sad, studies. This is why we're here, as we know this goes on and on, day in and day out. It's only recently, since Laci's case, that anyone even talked about it.

I had heard of men causing miscarriages, but murdering their pregnant wife and even LATE in the pregnancy was completely foreign to me. When I realized it had to have been SP, I did a search and the only study I found was the one quoted later by the MSM. It was an old case study too, a few years old.

One of the sad things is, many of these women didn't even see it coming.

JMHO
fran

 

[PolkSaladAnnie]

One of the sad things is, many of these women didn't even see it coming.
JMHO
fran

I know, fran ... I know (we know) ... :blowkiss:

Too sad ....and as per recent poster's words earlier - for these women to die at the hands of the person they love and trust ... ugh!

 

[raisincharlie]

PSA - thanks for the article. One thing that has caught my attention lately is the number of women who assault and often kill other women for their baby - you know the ones who actually steal a baby or even remove an unborn child from the mother's womb.

I quess this caught my attention not long ago when Lisa Montgomery killed Bobbie Jo Stinett and removed an unborn baby - this happened not to far from me and I followed the police pursuit of this lunatic on my scanner very closely. Several of the officers involved in the "woman hunt" and her apprehension are very good friends. I will simply say, that based on conversations with these officers, women in this mode are incredibly diabolical, ruthless, and brutal. Please don't take that wrong - I'm being very specific.

I don't know, it took me a very long time to be able to even accept that such things happen, especially against pregnant women. I do wish that once such people are convicted that there was a special place for them to be sent for their punishment. A place designed and staffed by persons capable of mentally disecting these individuals to determine what makes them tick. To discover the early warning signs of the patterns of behavior that may indicate a potential for such behavior. I quess I would rather see them used as guinea pigs to figure out just what the heck makes a person resort to murdering a pregnant woman than just having them being locked away or even sentenced to death. This may be their only contribution to society - I just wish society would allow it. ACLU be dammed.

 

[j2mirish]

Originally Posted by AlwaysShocked

Daniell Horowitz is a criminal defense lawyer himself, and when his wife was murdered he talked to police immediately, gave his fingerprints and blood samples, co-operated fully with LE and then some. Per Michael Cardoza (I think it was him), in the early days after his wife's murder some of Daniel's lawyer friends warned him that perhaps he should not be so open with the police, that they would likely be looking at him as a suspect. Horowitz knew he was innocent and he cooperated fully with LE.

Now, I ask you - if your own dear husband or wife was found murdered in your home, you mean to tell me you would instantly hire a criminal defense attorney and would NOT meet with police, would make them get an order to obtain your fingerprints and blood sample?

Something is NOT right here, that's for sure. The police will get his cell phone records, the bank records, etc. If he was in debt, they'll find it. If he turned his cell phone off for a period of time, they'll know it.

All of my adult life I have been adamant I would talk with the police but in the past couple of years I must admit I really dont know what I would do. To be faced with being a suspect in someone's murder, especially someone I love dearly, would terrify me to death. It has become a sign of the times when the airwaves just light up and even though innocent you are made to look very guilty anyway.

Do I think John Mason was a bad man when he obtained a lawyer when the police were breathing right down his neck trying to imply that he was guilty of harming Jennifer "dingbat" Wilbanks? No, I do not. Do I fault Sara Walker's ex for obtaining a lawyer when he was in the cross-hairs of LE even though innocent? No, I do not.

Imo, it is an individual choice afforded to all that do not want to be accused without evidence.

I do not know if Jason lawyered up because he is guilty or if he knows the police has him in the bullseye whether he is innocent or guilty.

Dan Horowitz is an amazing individual and yes he did everything right and what did he get in return for his openness........ on various message boards? He was demeaned and criticized daily and was accused of murdering his lovely wife. I think anyway a spouse goes they are damned if they do and damned if they dont.

IMO

Ocean

I agree 100%-- I use to think it was horrible- and I remember when ISP got an attorney, and wanted search warrants to go thru the house-- I was appalled-- my dh who use to be a sheriff, argued with me, and told me he had every right to get an attorney-- we had many discussions about this issue-- he said if anything ever happened to me, he would get an attorney= I am 46--never had a sepeeding ticket in my life, but if a policecar is behind me, i get nervouse, so I cant imagine what I would be like if I was being questioned about a murder that I was innocent of-- hell they could probably talk me into admitting I did it !!! so, I must admitt I have a knew tolerance for a relative lawyering up! I think
dan is an exception to alot of rules, He didnt ahve to Lawyer up-- cause he is a defense attorney!

 

[j2mirish]

Ocean, Strach mentioned that the plural was used as to 'persons' involved in the case when the sheriff was interviewed on Greta. That was a good take on her part.

That would imply there was more than one person involved in her murder. Putting that together with the fact LE soothed the minds of neighbors saying there was not a vagabond killer running loose in their neighborhood, do you think it is too presumptive to think a hit could have occured. If so do you have any idea who the other person would be?

I thought I read something here as to someone having an idea about who killed her. Back a page or two.

Thanks
Sweetie, Scandi

I have wondered if it has something to do with her profession- maybe had some horrendous goods on a client or company ?

 

[PolkSaladAnnie]

Originally Posted by AlwaysShocked



I agree 100%-- I use to think it was horrible- and I remember when ISP got an attorney, and wanted search warrants to go thru the house-- I was appalled-- my dh who use to be a sheriff, argued with me, and told me he had every right to get an attorney-- we had many discussions about this issue-- he said if anything ever happened to me, he would get an attorney= I am 46--never had a sepeeding ticket in my life, but if a policecar is behind me, i get nervouse, so I cant imagine what I would be like if I was being questioned about a murder that I was innocent of-- hell they could probably talk me into admitting I did it !!! so, I must admitt I have a knew tolerance for a relative lawyering up! I think
dan is an exception to alot of rules, He didnt ahve to Lawyer up-- cause he is a defense attorney!

Reasonable and valid ppoints, you make j2mirish. here's a cut/paste from Amazon.com on another defense attorney whose story was the opposite of D Horowitz...

Book Description
A promising young attorney and a dedicated family man, Michael Fletcher seemed to have it all. But in the summer of 2000, Michael found himself standing on trial for the murder of his pregnant wife, Leann. The verdict-guilty of second degree murder-would leave friends, family, and the public at large scrambling to make sense of a twisted and frightening series of events that had ended in the brutal killing of Leann Fletcher.

What could possibly have led Michael Fletcher to commit such a gruesome act? As a college student, Michael Fletcher married the girl of his dreams after a three-year courtship. It seemed like a fairy tale romance come true: a match made in heaven with one daughter, Hannah (aged 3 at time of murder).

So why would a man with no history of domestic violence murder his devoted wife right after he told her how much he loved her? Why would Michael shoot her in the back of her head, not only killing Leann but also the child that she was carrying inside her? According to prosecutors, Fletcher had been involved in an extramarital affair with a beautiful judge for two years.

Was his relationship with respected District Judge Susan Chrzanowski enough cause for him to murder his wife in cold blood? Raising even more troubling questions, the startling discovery colored Leann's already shocking murder with shadings of sex, political scandal, and deadly betrayal.Now award-winning reporter Tom Henderson goes behind the explosive headline-making trial to uncover the unbelievable truth behind one woman's murder.

AUTHORBIO: Tom Henderson is a Detroit News reporter. The winner of 25 state and national awards, Mr. Henderson has appeared in the Detroit Free Press, Toronto Globe and Mail, The Washington Post, and the Miami Herald. A DEADLY AFFAIR is his first book.

 

[j2mirish]

WHAT .... if .... the much-debated fax/print out is 'missing' ...?

could he just say , it "must not have been sent" ?

 

[otto]

Since there is a question about whether Jason doubled back to the house after he left, I wonder if the police are checking with businesses along the normally traveled roads to see if there is any camera surveillance footage. In the case of Liana White, a camera at a pub just happened to capture her vehicle (looked like her vehicle) with a bald guy that resembled her husband driving down the road at about 5 in the morning towards the place where her vehicle was found and then it captured a bald guy running down the street back towards the house shortly afterwards.

That's what happened with Porco too. There was a camera that saw Porco's vehicle leaving campus. Although he said he was just moving it off campus for the night, it still coincided with the time of the crime.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Hi Frannie!! Is there room in the boat with you and Packer Dog??? I got a gut reaction to the husband's actions after he
learned of the murder too. I would imagine that LE is overturning every
rock for information on this guy. I wonder if he, like all those before him, peterson, hacking, m. peterson, justin barber, neulander, greinenger....
thinks he is smarter then the police?

But we cannot lump all men in the pot just because some kill, can we? We dont do that when a woman's husband is murdered.

I could make as big a list Bee on female murderers as you have listed on male murderers but it doesn't mean that because some are sickening murderers (both male and female),they all are, imo.

It has been over two weeks now. I think the press is hoping this is another sensational Scott Peterson case. They are all about ratings. If there was smut out there imo they would have found it by now. They learned a lot in the SP case and that the early bird gets the worm. Yet we have heard nothing against Jason.

What I ponder is would a guilty man return to the very same county where the murder took place knowing that he could be arrested in front of the media at the graveside of his wife? Just doesn't make logical sense to me. If guilty he knows that if he stayed away and remained with his parents they would have to come there to arrest him.

I just dont think we can squeeze someone into a statistical box without knowing the evidence if any they have against Jason.

33% of female homicides are committed by their spouse, SO or someone known to them but what about the majority that arent killed by this group? Surely that has to count for something.

Unless the police is slow as pond water they have had more than ample time to check out his alibi in 16 days imo.

IMO

Ocean

 

[raisincharlie]

Since there is a question about whether Jason doubled back to the house after he left, I wonder if the police are checking with businesses along the normally traveled roads to see if there is any camera surveillance footage. In the case of Liana White, a camera at a pub just happened to capture her vehicle (looked like her vehicle) with a bald guy that resembled her husband driving down the road at about 5 in the morning towards the place where her vehicle was found and then it captured a bald guy running down the street back towards the house shortly afterwards.

That's what happened with Porco too. There was a camera that saw Porco's vehicle leaving campus. Although he said he was just moving it off campus for the night, it still coincided with the time of the crime.

Otto,

I read this article once about how the average person is photographed between 7 and 27 times a day when they are out in public. I can't recall where I read it but anyway, by this point in time I think it would be a good assumption that your thoughts have been pursued as well as review of credit card information relating to specific charges made on the 2nd and 3rd of November. And maybe at least a preliminary review of phone information.

I am curious about a couple of things as well. There has been no information about Enchanted Oaks being a gated community however I do wonder how many actual entrances there are to the community and if there is any kind of surveillance associated with the entrances.

The other thing I do wonder about is one poster has mentioned that on one of Greta's shows, Greta and Jim Hammer were talking about a sign in the yard for a burglar alarm. Of course we do not know that if there is a system in the house, if it was in use. But I do go back to this very early statement about the crime not being random and no forced entry. I am wondering if the alarm had been set, and I go back to Strach's observation about the ladder in the garage - sometimes the main control unit is located in the garage. These units typically can be down loaded to determine times when alarms are set, turned off and so on. Sometimes when a keyless garage or entry system is present - the data is routed through the unit as well - this would give times that keyless entry ways were opened. Hmmm....

 

[PolkSaladAnnie]

Since there is a question about whether Jason doubled back to the house after he left, I wonder if the police are checking with businesses along the normally traveled roads to see if there is any camera surveillance footage. In the case of Liana White, a camera at a pub just happened to capture her vehicle (looked like her vehicle) with a bald guy that resembled her husband driving down the road at about 5 in the morning towards the place where her vehicle was found and then it captured a bald guy running down the street back towards the house shortly afterwards.

That's what happened with Porco too. There was a camera that saw Porco's vehicle leaving campus. Although he said he was just moving it off campus for the night, it still coincided with the time of the crime.

Hi otto - long time!

Porco's crime was heinous. He had abso no blood, dna, etc - and his community were totally shocked (good upbringing, good education, father in LE - lovely home, friends etc ...)

All in your post are great examples - but then we have to tie up their timings/coincidence, etc, of the deceased to the relationship to the POI - and then see if those work with - or clash - into the POI's alibi.

That alibi then has to (er, make that "has to" ...) prove itself against any known/perceived motive the POI may have had to want the victim dead, eg:

Affair
Freedom of responsibility
Inheritance

Or, as dannyodie always wisely reminds us - but not direct translation of the above: sex, drugs, money

 

[PolkSaladAnnie]

33% of female homicides are committed by their spouse, SO or someone known to them but what about the majority that arent killed by this group? Surely that has to count for something.

Hi Ocean - I've long seen all your posts, stats, comments and posts, but that's 33% FEMALE HOMICIDES. (period)

FEMALE FETAL HOMICIDES being killed by their spouse or biological father is the actual crux of this issue.

You must have those horrific, unbelievable stats, yeah? Aren't they absolutely atrocious???? Makes the female homicide number pale into insignificance... tenfold if not more ...

PSA

 

[otto]

But we cannot lump all men in the pot just because some kill, can we? We dont do that when a woman's husband is murdered.

I could make as big a list Bee on female murderers as you have listed on male murderers but it doesn't mean that because some are sickening murderers (both male and female),they all are, imo.

It has been over two weeks now. I think the press is hoping this is another sensational Scott Peterson case. They are all about ratings. If there was smut out there imo they would have found it by now. They learned a lot in the SP case and that the early bird gets the worm. Yet we have heard nothing against Jason.

What I ponder is would a guilty man return to the very same county where the murder took place knowing that he could be arrested in front of the media at the graveside of his wife? Just doesn't make logical sense to me. If guilty he knows that if he stayed away and remained with his parents they would have to come there to arrest him.

I just dont think we can squeeze someone into a statistical box without knowing the evidence if any they have against Jason.

33% of female homicides are committed by their spouse, SO or someone known to them but what about the majority that arent killed by this group? Surely that has to count for something.

Unless the police is slow as pond water they have had more than ample time to check out his alibi in 16 days imo.

IMO

Ocean

Prosecutors like to win so they don't file charges until they think they have a winnable case. Even though there may be plenty of circumstantial evidence to charge someone, they won't do it until there's enough to convict.

I'm guessing there's still more to check in the alibi, perhaps including any video footage from nearby businesses. Also, there may be holes in the alibi along the lines of "I was alone sleeping at the hotel for 8 hours". Maybe the hotel didn't have cameras and they want to see if Jason would have known this because maybe he stayed at the same hotel in the past. Also, all the forensic evidence needs to be tested and sometimes that means sending it out of state. Turnaround time is probably a lot longer than we think, especially after watching shows like CSI where the testing and crime is resolved in what seems like a matter of days. They'll be tracking down all phone records probably for the last couple of months. They may even be requesting phone records for his mom's home to see whether he made any calls when he heard the news. That takes time with warrants and data collection.

I've heard recently that the leading cause of death amongst pregnant women is murder. That is a very significant statistic. Strangers usually don't have a reason to murder a pregnant woman, but the partner does.

As far as digging up dirt on Jason, what I would like to know is where he worked up until 3 months ago and why he quit that job. Sure there may be more money in software sales, but is software sales consistent with his education and career path?