MO - Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011 - #12

[CN2Souls]

I hope LE did a very intensive examination of that window sill before they staged their breakin. If perp had of entered that window, there most likely would be some clothing fibers rubbed off into the side of house or sill. It would be a tight squeeze up and into that window. Fibers could be on the window itself (LE said window fell down onto his legs). Now, there will also be the officer's fibers. So, I hope they really examined it well first.

THANK YOU!!! THANK YOU!!! :clap:

 

[TexasLil]

That is what I was thinking. The parent found her in crib...freaked and called someone...parent felt guilty for some reason...left something in the crib...or baby got/fell out of crib...and died for some reason...so parent does not want cell phone found...evidence of late nite call. Parent is afraid the other kids will be taken because of neglect :twocents:...Only My Opinion...no suspects...not accusing.

I was leaning toward a fall out of the crib scenario this morning after I saw a picture of the actual crib and the height of the mattress. My granddaughter is 9 months old and not nearly as tall as Lisa. I had her mattress dropped almost to the lowest level two months ago when she began to sit up and pull up on things.

The picture wasn't very clear but it did appear the mattress was only low enough for the two tub containers (thinner kind) to reach the top of the rail. IMO Lisa was tall enough to have stood up and toppled over the rail.

After having these thoughts today I'm going home and drop my grandaughter's mattress all the way down!!!

 

[MissJames]

Couldn't agree with you more. I think all news sources lose alot in their translations. I try to watch Fox and CNN and somewhere, in between the two extremes, lies the truth of the matter.

Your comment about the quotes is really disturbing though, because when someone is quoted, I expect that to be accurate !

I don't blame you for choosing not to give interview if that is the case. I don't think that I would want to either.

BBM
It's true and happened repeatedly. I can't tell you how frustrating it is. Mostly stories about our family or medically fragile foster children. My son was in a fabulous program at our Children's hospital and I've been an advocate locally and now do some work in DC.
I love being an advocate for something that's efficient,saves taxpayer money and works for the kids!
But no more interviews . I see why bloggers do what they do.
I take all the news stories with a grain of salt.That's why I love the factual records WSers come up with.

 

[tlcya]

Thanks for the welcome!

Another issue that is bugging me is the photos released of the house with the items in the crib (tub & boxes). Does this mean that LE has already released the house and that family has already come in to change/clean. I just don't see how LE can be sure that they have collected all the forensic evidence already. Am I the only one that finds this strange? I would think that the house would remain sealed and/or off limits for evidence preservation purposes.

The video (the photos are still clips of the video) of the interior was taken after LE had had access to the home for a number of days. The footage of the crib most likely shows how it was left after LE's searching in the home and is not an accurate depiction of what it looked like when baby Lisa was in it.

We have all been puzzled by the recent renewed searching of the home as one would imagine that they had done all the evidence collection before releasing it for this video to be taken by MSM.

For what its worth, the parents have been to the home but are apparently not staying there. They are staying in a hotel, not wanting to be at the home right now. I believe they have been staying at a hotel since this whole thing started, but do not know that to be fact.

 

[curiousc]

It seems to me there would have been a shoe print outside that window... and inside the home... also, a fiber from the kidnappers shirt up against that widow sill....

Another good point! Were there any shoe prints in or outside the home?

 

[CN2Souls]

It seems to me there would have been a shoe print outside that window... and inside the home... also, a fiber from the kidnappers shirt up against that widow sill....

THANK YOU!!! THANK YOU!!! :clap:

 

[EllaMae]

That is what I was thinking. The parent found her in crib...freaked and called someone...parent felt guilty for some reason...left something in the crib...or baby got/fell out of crib...and died for some reason...so parent does not want cell phone found...evidence of late nite call. Parent is afraid the other kids will be taken because of neglect :twocents:...Only My Opinion...no suspects...not accusing.

We had a discussion about falls from cribs on here a few threads back. It is highly unlikely that a 10 month old would even be injured from a fall out of a crib, and even more unlikely that such a fall would kill her. It just doesn't happen.

I still say that unless a parent was drunk, on drugs,abusive or engaged in some kind of illegal activity.....a loving parent would call 911 in case of a serious accident.
Debbie and Jeremy are by all accounts good and loving parents. I just don't see that scenario happening as it stands now. If more information comes out about their habits and lifestyle that is damning, then I will certainly change my mind.

 

[uvamerica]

First post, but I've been reading for days... :seeya:

Has anyone in MSM released the description of the "man" with the baby that was allegedly seen by the neighbor?

I can't get past the fact that not even a general description of this man was released - height, build, direction of travel, nothing. It's seemed strange since day 1 to me.

:welcome: :welcome4: :wagon:

 

[dog.gone.cute]

It seems to me there would have been a shoe print outside that window... and inside the home... also, a fiber from the kidnappers shirt up against that widow sill....

BBM: Exactly ... and IMO, that is one of the first things LE would look for ...

IMO ... there would be some mud/grass traces from outside to inside.

MOO ...

 

[askfornina]

http://www.heycameraman.net/?p=1406

some pictures of the left side of the house here. shows the basement area and the metal building in the backyard. these pictures look to be from just a few minutes ago.

 

[goldringstx]

The video (the photos are still clips of the video) of the interior was taken after LE had had access to the home for a number of days. The footage of the crib most likely shows how it was left after LE's searching in the home and is not an accurate depiction of what it looked like when baby Lisa was in it.

We have all been puzzled by the recent renewed searching of the home as one would imagine that they had done all the evidence collection before releasing it for this video to be taken by MSM.

For what its worth, the parents have been to the home but are apparently not staying there. They are staying in a hotel, not wanting to be at the home right now. I believe they have been staying at a hotel since this whole thing started, but do not know that to be fact.

Do we know if the confiscated the sheets that were on the bed, etc as evidence?

 

[twiggles]

Another good point! Were there any shoe prints in or outside the home?

Maybe the child was passed out the window to someone as opposed to a person entering thru the window?

 

[vasportsmom]

When I was growing up we lived in a house that had a balcony just above my parents bedroom window. A pine tree grew to the side of it. My sister was 6 years older than me and had friends sneak in by the balcony. How did my parents not hear anything?
I was a real scaredy cat and made my dad chop the tree down.

Many years ago I moved into a condo that had a balcony right off the master bedroom. Having just got out of a bad relationship I was really worried about that part and had several cop friends check it out for me. They all assured me that there was absolutely no way anyone could climb up to that balcony and that I would be perfectly safe there so I put down the required money and moved in. My very first night there I awoke to someone knocking on the balcony door. My very petite little sister had climbed right up the side of the building and onto the balcony because I hadn't heard her knocking and she was worried I would be afraid my first night alone in a new place. I never felt safe there again and soon moved out of state with little word to anyone.

 

[panthera]

It seems to me there would have been a shoe print outside that window... and inside the home... also, a fiber from the kidnappers shirt up against that widow sill....

Exactly. Honestly, however, I believe this window is a red herring. First of all, the window screen was bent in from the outside, yet still in the window frame. If an intruder had actually gone into the house through this window, wouldn't the screen be somewhere on the ground, outside? Who would take the time to replace the screen?

:waitasec:

 

[JeannieC]

I don't understand what exactly they're unsuccessful at "reenacting". If they literally don't think someone could get in that window, go to the baby, and get the baby back out the window they're wrong. They're wrong.

But I do think it's unlikely, and it's requires a little bit of coordination and strength. I think someone walked in the door, turned on some lights, took the cell phones, took the baby, opened the window considering going out it, and then decided against that and went out the front door instead. If they need me to, I'd be glad to come show them how. ;D

WAIT A MINUTE, WAIT A MINUTE! LET ME GET MY CAMERA! I'll go with you!:floorlaugh:

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Ok, here is the video of LE going through a window several times.

http://www.kctv5.com/story/15647944/police-again-questioning-missing

I really wonder what the filming is about once the person is inside.

 

[IAM]

Has anyone heard how the crib was positioned upon finding the baby gone? A crib rail should be all the way raised up while child is in it sleeping. Now, was it still up when they found her gone? Any crib I have ever leaned over would creak a bit unless I let the rail down. The mom says she had baby monitor on. A creaking crib rail would surely come across on that monitor. Also, it would be difficult to lift a baby that size up and over the side of crib with rail up? This is just another thing that bothers me.

 

[CN2Souls]

BBM: Exactly ... and IMO, that is one of the first things LE would look for ...

IMO ... there would be some mud/grass traces from outside to inside.

MOO ...

Thank you, Dog.Gone.Cute.

I feel there are really good reason that LE is questioning the parents as hard as they are...JMO... MOO

 

[keeponsearching]

I do not think the parents are involved. But I like to hear all theories of what could of happen. Disposing the cell because of a late night call, would not make much sense since LE can pull up the account, or they themselves could pull up the account. Unless they do not understand that.
The lights on, I still can not figure out which lights. The only thing I can think of, the abductor did not feel threaten. Someone mention maybe the mom snores, which could put ease at a intruder.
Where did this kitten come from?

 

[tlcya]

Do we know if the confiscated the sheets that were on the bed, etc as evidence?

No. As seasoned case watchers, we would assume that LE would have collected sheets, dusted the crib for prints, etc. But we do not know that as LE is keeping that information to themselves. They often do, so we can only assume and speculate at this point.