Mystery couple murdered in South Carolina, 1976 - #6

[Joyce Josette]

I have to agree with youshouldveknown. Cocaine and Heroin was definitely around. Pot was clearly more ubiquitous. No matter what drug trade or no matter what criminal enterprise someone is involved in, there are plenty of reasons to kill someone (i.e. robbery gone bad, elimination of snitches, reprisal for robbery, debt owed, reprisal for another murder, knew too much, etc.) I tend to lean towards the elimination of snitches or knew too much scenarios.

Just 6 years later there was a ton of cocaine that was intercepted at the Sumter County airport. It was the 3rd largest drug bust in US HISTORY! The individuals involved in this operation were related to organized crime in the area. This organized crime group was responsible for other murders in the area. One of the murders happened in 1978 only two years after the mystery couple murders. It is not much of a stretch to think they might also be responsible for mystery couple's murders.

I believe this is drug related. I know there is not enough evidence to say that this is NOT drug related.

Look, my entire family is made up of junkies and drunks, with the exception of my mother, who was a bartender. I am telling you that cocaine and heroin were not prominent or popular in Sumter, SC in 1976! Yes, it was intercepted, but it wasn't the intended final destination. This just wasn't a drug deal gone bad. Could it have been caused by criminal and/or drug activity that occurred elsewhere? Absolutely, that's a big possibility, but you don't get shot three times at close range for a drug burn. I think he was young to be a draft dodger. I also think that the dental records are the key here. I think the reason no-one is because the person\s who performed the dental procedures were in the couple's country of origin and never learned of the case.

 

[carbuff]

He'd only have to be about 25 if he left the country at 18, which many young men did.

Not that it's much use in helping identify him.

 

[rob525]

Which could mean that we are looking at two seperate missing persons from different areas. If Jock Doe was a draft dodger and was never reported missing by a family that had disowned him and jane doe was a canadian citizen possibly who was never connected to this case because everyone has been looking at couples reported missing from Canada. Just throwing out ideas.

 

[carbuff]

Which could mean that we are looking at two seperate missing persons from different areas. If Jock Doe was a draft dodger and was never reported missing by a family that had disowned him and jane doe was a canadian citizen possibly who was never connected to this case because everyone has been looking at couples reported missing from Canada. Just throwing out ideas.

I'd like to know more about the thing in the early reports where they thought they had identified jane doe as a local woman, but her family couldn't agree on an identification. It would make a lot of sense if a local girl was chatting up a stranger and her jealous boyfriend killed them both.

 

[Joyce Josette]

I'd like to know more about the thing in the early reports where they thought they had identified jane doe as a local woman, but her family couldn't agree on an identification. It would make a lot of sense if a local girl was chatting up a stranger and her jealous boyfriend killed them both.

I say they're too similar, and in a small county like Sumter people talk too much. If it was a local girl someone would have recognized/missed her.

 

[carbuff]

I say they're too similar, and in a small county like Sumter people talk too much. If it was a local girl someone would have recognized/missed her.

Well, the one guy DID recognize her, he said. She was from a couple of counties over -- which is actually about the right distance for a body dump. I've read that the vast majority are between 15 minutes and an hour from the murderer. Her stepfather also thought it was her, but her mother said it wasn't. Her name isn't given in any of the accounts so I can't tell whether she might still be missing, or what.

 

[youshouldveknown]

Look, my entire family is made up of junkies and drunks, with the exception of my mother, who was a bartender. I am telling you that cocaine and heroin were not prominent or popular in Sumter, SC in 1976! Yes, it was intercepted, but it wasn't the intended final destination.

Sumter and in particular WHERE the couple were found murdered is right off of I95. I can only speak for my own opinion but I never suggested this was just a drug deal gone bad. What I think happened is that the couple may have been traffickers. They were in Sumter to pick up and pay for a load to carry back up (or down or west) to sell. Seeing as they'd been in the area the year prior would make sense. This time, however, something went wrong.

I'm not suggesting the drugs were to be sold in Sumter. I also don't think this couple just wanted to buy an 8 ball of coke for personal use. But where else would it be safer and easier to access than a little town right off of I95 to do a big drug drop?

 

[carbuff]

Sumter and in particular WHERE the couple were found murdered is right off of I95. I can only speak for my own opinion but I never suggested this was just a drug deal gone bad. What I think happened is that the couple may have been traffickers. They were in Sumter to pick up and pay for a load to carry back up (or down or west) to sell. Seeing as they'd been in the area the year prior would make sense. This time, however, something went wrong.

I'm not suggesting the drugs were to be sold in Sumter. I also don't think this couple just wanted to buy an 8 ball of coke for personal use. But where else would it be safer and easier to access than a little town right off of I95 to do a big drug drop?

Yes, this is more or less the scenario I was thinking, too.

There's no surer way to get yourself killed than to have a disagreement between supplier and dealer about how much stuff was to be delivered and how much was to be paid.

Making a pass at your supplier's girlfriend is another good way.

 

[rob525]

Well, the one guy DID recognize her, he said. She was from a couple of counties over -- which is actually about the right distance for a body dump. I've read that the vast majority are between 15 minutes and an hour from the murderer. Her stepfather also thought it was her, but her mother said it wasn't. Her name isn't given in any of the accounts so I can't tell whether she might still be missing, or what.

Wow, that is kinda mind boggling to think that two family members would not be able to agree on an identification for her! If it was not immediately after death or there was damage to the UIDs face I would understand. Although I guess I am assuming that the step father knew the UID for along time and had extensive contact with her. I guess that could be completely not the case. Also I have never been in a position to have to ID a loved one so I guess I do not know how difficult it might be. I would definately think the mother would be the one to know if it was her daughter.

 

[carbuff]

Wow, that is kinda mind boggling to think that two family members would not be able to agree on an identification for her! If it was not immediately after death or there was damage to the UIDs face I would understand. Although I guess I am assuming that the step father knew the UID for along time and had extensive contact with her. I guess that could be completely not the case. Also I have never been in a position to have to ID a loved one so I guess I do not know how difficult it might be. I would definately think the mother would be the one to know if it was her daughter.

Yeah, it makes me wonder whether that other girl was ever located and whether they ever followed up later with more modern identification methods or they just took her word for it, or what. You'd think they could have asked for something from her room to get fingerprints, or something. It doesn't sound like they even viewed the body directly. Here's the article: http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/10/22wedaug181976florenceuu3.jpg/

This is the only woman in Doenet missing from Georgia in the time frame. http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/210dfga.html I doubt she's the girl they tried to match, but Cassandra does bear quite a resemlance to this Jane Doe. She fits a lot of the characteristics, but doesn't match others -- tattoos, for instance.

Also, she's missing from Union City, which is nowhere near Brunswick. Brunswick, however, is only 3 hours south of where the body was found: https://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=...lpgBcxlNfkiDFe6Y2Tx5idNg&oq=br&mra=ls&t=m&z=7

 

[rob525]

I read the article and am even more confused.It says several family members where at odds as to the identity of the UID. I wonder why that is? The moles on the left and right side of the face seem to be pretty distinctive. So either the UID and the missing girl from Georgia had moles in similar locations or there is something else going on. I would love to know the answer to that question.

The only other things I can come up with are that the mother and some family members where in denial over the death.

Or, it had been a long time since the family had contact with their daughter and the moles developed later in life. But I don't know if that is even possible!

 

[carbuff]

I read the article and am even more confused.It says several family members where at odds as to the identity of the UID. I wonder why that is? The moles on the left and right side of the face seem to be pretty distinctive. So either the UID and the missing girl from Georgia had moles in similar locations or there is something else going on. I would love to know the answer to that question.

The only other things I can come up with are that the mother and some family members where in denial over the death.

Or, it had been a long time since the family had contact with their daughter and the moles developed later in life. But I don't know if that is even possible!

Yes, it is possible for moles to develop, especially in a pregnant woman. So if a missing person has moles and the UID doesn't, that's a problem, but if the UID has moles and a younger missing person doesn't, it could still be a match. As far as I know, they don't disappear except by medical intervention, which can leave a mark, so if the UID has a scar where the missing person had a mole, that could also be a match.

Your thought that they were in denial seems logical. Maybe she had left home and was living a dangerous lifestyle that they disapproved of, and couldn't bear to admit she might have died like that. If you read the other early articles (there's a separate thread that points to a bunch of them), several of them mention the young man from Brunswick who was absolutely convinced this was his girlfriend.

 

[rob525]

I really hope this works. I have no idea how to attach photos.

I am not saying I think this could be a match but I just wanted to get opinions. I know that LE is sure that this girl was a victim of Bundy but the only thing I have found that supports that is Bundy's confession. I read where Bundy told police where he buried Nancy Wilcox but they did not locate the body.

I started going back and looking at older missing persons for thinking that the reason the SC Jane Doe had not been identified was possibly due to an extended time between when she was reported missing and when the couple was found.

Like I said I haven't even begun to think about how this could be remotely possible. I just thought the picture of Nancy looked alot like images of the SC Jane Doe.

 

[rob525]

I guess I should have titled the photos. The first one is Nancy Wilcox.

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/1385dfut.html

The other two are drawings of our unidentified female found in South Carolina.

 

[Lanie]

Wow, that is kinda mind boggling to think that two family members would not be able to agree on an identification for her! If it was not immediately after death or there was damage to the UIDs face I would understand. Although I guess I am assuming that the step father knew the UID for along time and had extensive contact with her. I guess that could be completely not the case. Also I have never been in a position to have to ID a loved one so I guess I do not know how difficult it might be. I would definately think the mother would be the one to know if it was her daughter.

A friend and I were loading an accident victim into an ambulance. We were both in a position to be looking straight at her face, but we didn't recognize her until I found her work ID and it was my friend's sister.

She was unconscious/in a coma, and there were no facial injuries. I don't know how to explain how she looked different, but even figuring out who she was and looking at her again, it was still very difficult to see it. It's almost like the complete slackness of the musculature caused her face to take on a different shape and appearance.

 

[Swamp Fox Trot]

Ebook exploring Argentine angle: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00ASQ80P8

 

[Swamp Fox Trot]

I found someone living one hour away from the crime scene at the time of the murders, who
* was a former CIA agent;
* had a longstanding hatred of communists;
* whose brother met with Michael Townley a week before Orlando Letelier was assassinated;
* whose other brother also worked for the CIA and helped mislead the press following the Letelier assassination, and also helped Pinochet with PR;
* who had a long history of conflicts with revolutionaries in Mexico City . . .

oh wait a minute, that sounds too much like a spy novel, it can't possibly be relevant . . .

 

[rob525]

I wonder if there is any other evidence that Bundy killed Nancy Wilcox. The more I look at the first two photos the more they look identical. The doe page for Bundy says she was seen riding in a volkswagon van similar to Bundy's. Could it have been a different van? Could LE at the time have been too hasty in assuming the van and the disappearance meant Bundy was responsible?

 

[elliottness]

Hi everyone! It has been awhile since I posted on these boards. Today I went online and looked up some old newspaper articles from the late 1970s/early 1980s about these two missing people. One article from the early 1980s said that a man who was a mechanic believed he had done some auto work on a vehicle driven by John Doe and that it had an Oregon or Washington license plate.

Also, the red t-shirt that John Doe was wearing reportedly had Snoopy on the back of it. This wasn't mentioned anywhere else on here before, to my knowledge.

I am 95% sure that the missing Oregon couple is our John and Jane Doe.

 

[elliottness]

I'm going to be posting some old newspaper articles on here with links to them. Here is one from August, 1982 where the sheriff's Lt. Hugh A. Mathis says, "These kids smacked of money and influence."

http://news.google.com/newspapers?i...5,2388204&dq=missing+couple+sumter+1976&hl=en