GUILTY NC - Jason Corbett, 39, murdered in his Wallburg home, 2 Aug 2015 #4

[stephanddoody]

It was said in court that LE suspected by SM behaviour on the day of interview that it was reherced/cohersed. And yes they can suggest that their statements were manipulated by others they are trained LE it's their job to highlight any attempts to manipulate evidence. Unless your MM of course then it's not their job their all corrupt and this is all a big conspiracy.

I think it's time everyone including the sleuths left these kids alone. They won't be called to testify and with question marks over all their statements I can't see them being admitted.





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Amen to that totally agree

 

[stmarysmead]

I'm linking to this article again. It's the one that describes the Judges original order, who talks about her right to a fair trial.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/irelan...betts-children-must-release-notes-425441.html

This is a link to the Hearsay rules in North Carolina.

http://www.ncleg.net/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/PDF/ByArticle/Chapter_8C/Article_8.pdf

Exception 803 (4) excepts statements of Hearsay that were made for purposes of Medical Diagnoses. This is why I think the children's' statements at Dragonfly House will be allowed because I'm sure there is case precedent for doing so.

Say what you will. It appears to me that in the time she had the kids prior to relinquishing them, she was being advised about her defense. These interviews with the children were set up by Law Enforcement so they can't be attributed to anyone's manipulation; and, in the eyes of the Law they are the truth. Even if you don't believe them. IMO

I agree with this part of your post:

"Say what you will. It appears to me that in the time she had the kids prior to relinquishing them, she was being advised about her defense."

And this would offer a reasonable explanation to the jury for why the children's story changed. She had them in her custody, under her control, and she was "being advised" what she needed for her defense. I can imagine her saying, as she did to Keith Maginn, "You are my only reason for living. You are the only ones who can save me."

 

[Truthalways]

https://www.researchgate.net/public..._Trauma_due_to_Baseball_Bat_Blows_to_the_Head

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[emmalpage81]

I would also be interested to see what the introduction of a second person into the scenario does in regards to the self defense claim. So one on one it is difficult to establish what force is being used...but two on one gives them both that breathing room that one of them should have recognised he was down and the threat had abated. (ie no need to keep hitting to be sure, there are two people who can take action if the threat resurfaces, one could call for help while the other protects them etc etc) Is there a case to be made that in the instance where two people are dealing with the threat that in essence there is a requirement for LESS force? Therefore the excessive force used in this case would have no basis as it was two on one?

Absolutely, the jury will be considering two different assailants and two distinct weapons. The search warrant states:

'Early in the investigation into Jason Paul Corbett's death, his wife, Molly Martens Corbett, and his father-in-law, Thomas Martens admitted to Davidson County Sheriff's Detectives that they struck Jason Corbett in the head with a concrete paving brick and an aluminium baseball bat .'

So they have both admitted striking him, in the head. Not to his body to disable him, to his head. There was no attempt by one of them to call the police whilst the other subdued JC, there was no attempt by SM to call the police whilst the whole assault was going on.

I would also think that if MM was being choked as alleged her involvement in the assault seems odd. It takes very little time for a person to lose consciousness when being choked (http://www.pottstown.org/DocumentCenter/View/211), if this occurred and she regained consciousness; she seemed very alert and no at all disorientated in taking part in the killing.

I do not recall from the autopsy any mention of scratches to JC that would indicate someone violently trying to release themselves whilst being choked nor do I recall any mention of marks to MM such as scratches etc as she tried to free herself.

I note her lawyers have commented that paramedics noted she had some redness to her neck and complained about a sore throat and trouble swallowing however i find this suspect. Firstly, she had been giving CPR to a man who was bleeding profusely from his head, how would her neck have been clean enough for a paramedic to notice this? Secondly, you can hear her talking to the 911 operator, she is not hoarse nor does she complain about talking or have any trouble with it. In fact her voice seemed perfectly fine.


All IMO

 

[Truthalways]

So we are looking at age 10 yes??

Just gives us an idea of the weight behind the swing

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[Truthalways]

Weights can be from 2.5kg to 30kg. In General they are shaped by arrangement or cutting but come usually in a square shape.but i am leaning to ruling "SLAB" out because of the statement from sheriff's dept so picture 1. Would be brick shape.

County Sheriff’s department report that:

*Ms Martens and her father admitted to striking Jason Corbett on the head ‘with a concrete paving brick and an aluminium baseball bat’.

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[Logic-lady]

Your right and especially with TM fbi training. But it's much like the CPR MM trained TM we can assume in some way first aid trained for job and they didn't even turn Jason over to clear airway or move to recovery position before being prompted several minutes into 911 call.

If you are first aid trained that's instinctive, roll over listen for breaths watch the chest clear airway, cpr

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Just listened to the 911 call again, its actually quite difficult to listen to...it is 4 minutes in before they even try to turn turn him over to begin CPR. http://www.spinalcord.com/blog/what-happens-after-a-lack-of-oxygen-to-the-brain

• At the one-minute mark, brain cells begin dying.
• At three minutes, neurons suffer more extensive damage, and lasting brain damage becomes more likely.
• At five minutes, death becomes imminent.
• At 10 minutes, even if the brain remains alive, a coma and lasting brain damage are almost inevitable.
• At 15 minutes, survival becomes nearly impossible.

IMO it is not made clear to the operator how severe the injuries were, it is not made clear to the operator that they needed help quickly, it is not made clear to the operator how much damage had been done.

 

[Truthalways]

Just listened to the 911 call again, its actually quite difficult to listen to...it is 4 minutes in before they even try to turn turn him over to begin CPR. http://www.spinalcord.com/blog/what-happens-after-a-lack-of-oxygen-to-the-brain

• At the one-minute mark, brain cells begin dying.
• At three minutes, neurons suffer more extensive damage, and lasting brain damage becomes more likely.
• At five minutes, death becomes imminent.
• At 10 minutes, even if the brain remains alive, a coma and lasting brain damage are almost inevitable.
• At 15 minutes, survival becomes nearly impossible.

IMO it is not made clear to the operator how severe the injuries were, it is not made clear to the operator that they needed help quickly, it is not made clear to the operator how much damage had been done.

Agree totally. It's especially shocking that between the time the beating stopped, 911 was called and minutes into the call CPR was initiated, nobody turned the man over they left him face down, naked lying in his own bloody and undignified and dying to the sounds of MM and TM

With the extent of his injuries he may never have survived but I often wonder would he have lived assisted just long enough for family to say goodbye.

Moo

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[Logic-lady]

Agree totally. It's especially shocking that between the time the beating stopped, 911 was called and minutes into the call CPR was initiated, nobody turned the man over they left him face down, naked lying in his own bloody and undignified and dying to the sounds of MM and TM

With the extent of his injuries he may never have survived but I often wonder would he have lived assisted just long enough for family to say goodbye.

Moo

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My understanding from a medical friend who read the autopsy is that the force of the skull fractures were so severe that it penetrated deep parts of the brain, parts that would never normally be affected by such trauma. My hope is that he died quickly, I think that will be of comfort to his family in the long run as they process all they will see during the court case.

I think TM knew he was dead, I think that is why he was so hesitant to perform CPR, he knew it was fruitless.

 

[emmalpage81]

My understanding from a medical friend who read the autopsy is that the force of the skull fractures were so severe that it penetrated deep parts of the brain, parts that would never normally be affected by such trauma. My hope is that he died quickly, I think that will be of comfort to his family in the long run as they process all they will see during the court case.

I think TM knew he was dead, I think that is why he was so hesitant to perform CPR, he knew it was fruitless.

Agreed, lets remember parts of his scalp and tissue were on the walls. That would suggest IMO a catastrophic brain injury and, I would think, death would have come very quickly especially coupled with the blood loss.

I find it very strange that despite being a trained FBI agent who would have undergone first aid as part of his training and we know MM underwent first aid training in her capacity as a swim coach, they never turned him over. it is the first thing you do. You check to see if they are alive, you cant do that when they are lying face down on the floor. The fact that they left him face down until instructed is telling. I also recall that there was blood in his nasal passage should that not have been cleared when doing CPR; are you not supposed to clear the airways?

All IMO

 

[Logic-lady]

I'm linking to this article again. It's the one that describes the Judges original order, who talks about her right to a fair trial.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/irelan...betts-children-must-release-notes-425441.html

This is a link to the Hearsay rules in North Carolina.

http://www.ncleg.net/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/PDF/ByArticle/Chapter_8C/Article_8.pdf

Exception 803 (4) excepts statements of Hearsay that were made for purposes of Medical Diagnoses. This is why I think the children's' statements at Dragonfly House will be allowed because I'm sure there is case precedent for doing so.

Say what you will. It appears to me that in the time she had the kids prior to relinquishing them, she was being advised about her defense. These interviews with the children were set up by Law Enforcement so they can't be attributed to anyone's manipulation; and, in the eyes of the Law they are the truth. Even if you don't believe them. IMO

There is precedent for medical records to be used as per the link you provided and so the information could in theory be used by the defense. The issue as I understand it is that there are two sets of interviews conducted by the same law enforcement teams with two sets of professional therapists with differing results. I am unsure how you can determine that one would be considered to be more truthful than the other. The defense will always claim that Jack was unduly influenced by his relations to recant his original statement, and equally, there is very large doubt regarding the initial statement when the investigating officers themselves suspected coaching. Who determines which is the more truthful?

Just on this point again, I have wondered about how the events of that night may have played a role in the children's statements. From the witness statements we have to hand, it appears Jason and the kids took part in an impromptu 'social gathering' with some neighbours on the street on the Saturday evening. All appeared relaxed and in good spirits. We know that Molly & Jason had had a disagreement the previous night, but there is no mention of Molly in relation to Saturdays gathering. I imagine there would have been tension between Molly & Jason from the night previously, particularly if something had arisen that had precipitated an emergency call to her folks to make their way to NC, perhaps they were giving each other space.

I wondered if Jason letting the kids sleepover at a friend's house was the ignition point for the later argument. If she felt as though she was losing them, the fact that Jason made that decision could have frustrated her, and the fact that she went and collected them out of the blue could have equally annoyed him. If Jack believed that what happened later that night started with an argument over the kids, IMO that would make him much more susceptible to trying to cover for Molly to make sure she didn't get into any more trouble. He would have felt an immense guilt that it was his fault. I sincerely hope I'm wrong, but the sudden collection of the kids has troubled me from the outset.

 

[kittythehare]

Did the children of Jason and Mags Corbett participate in the murder?
Which injuries are the charged with inflicting?
Are they in prison?
Are they to face charges next week?

Using a half story of alleged interviews from which no details have been disclosed in the sleuthing of a murder is IMO both unethical, immoral and poses a danger to the childrens' future well being.
This is a public forum.
These messages stay public.
Those children are not illiterate, nor are their school friends or those who do not wish them well.
Points of Law or clinical examination of the autopsy is appropriate.
Leave those kids alone, they have NOTHING to do with this case, and placing them constantly into discussions is willful child endangerment.

 

[Fairness71]

Just listened to the 911 call again, its actually quite difficult to listen to...it is 4 minutes in before they even try to turn turn him over to begin CPR. http://www.spinalcord.com/blog/what-happens-after-a-lack-of-oxygen-to-the-brain

• At the one-minute mark, brain cells begin dying.
• At three minutes, neurons suffer more extensive damage, and lasting brain damage becomes more likely.
• At five minutes, death becomes imminent.
• At 10 minutes, even if the brain remains alive, a coma and lasting brain damage are almost inevitable.
• At 15 minutes, survival becomes nearly impossible.

IMO it is not made clear to the operator how severe the injuries were, it is not made clear to the operator that they needed help quickly, it is not made clear to the operator how much damage had been done.

It is my opinion and nothing will change my mind that both MM & TM during the 911 calls were 'sitting on their hands' figuratively speaking, they did not perform CPR on Jason. They wanted him dead full stop.


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[searchinGirl]

There is precedent for medical records to be used as per the link you provided and so the information could in theory be used by the defense. The issue as I understand it is that there are two sets of interviews conducted by the same law enforcement teams with two sets of professional therapists with differing results. I am unsure how you can determine that one would be considered to be more truthful than the other. The defense will always claim that Jack was unduly influenced by his relations to recant his original statement, and equally, there is very large doubt regarding the initial statement when the investigating officers themselves suspected coaching. Who determines which is the more truthful?

It's more than theory really. The doctor at Dragonfly House diagnosed them with Child Abuse; it's the interviews from which a diagnoses was made that will make them acceptable for use as evidence in the trial. That is the difference in the Hearsay Exception Rule. IMO

It's the Law that is disputing them. In the "eyes of the Law", the children were manipulated. There will be testimony to that effect if the interviews come in.

If that interview comes in, so will the earlier conflicting interview. The jury will be asked to consider why, after two weeks isolated in the custody of their Fathers killers, the accounts changed.

In the eyes of the Law, the second interview is already considered discredited. It is not considered "the truth." The jury decides what is "the truth."

The Judge decides what the Jury will hear. Haven't the legal arguments about this been made and testimony to that effect already been given? Wouldn't the detective's comment also be considered hearsay? Seems like it might take a trial in itself to get to the truth on that one. Did the Dr making the diagnoses say she thought they were coached?

I mean. In ferreting out the truth, wouldn't denying a defendant certain evidence favorable to her, that has already been allowed in the "interests of justice" essentially mean she was being denied a right to fair trial if that motion was granted? IDK maybe I'm wrong; but seems like common sense.

 

[stephanddoody]

It's more than theory really. The doctor at Dragonfly House diagnosed them with Child Abuse; it's the interviews from which a diagnoses was made that will make them acceptable for use as evidence in the trial. That is the difference in the Hearsay Exception Rule. IMO



The Judge decides what the Jury will hear. Haven't the legal arguments about this been made and testimony to that effect already been given? Wouldn't the detective's comment also be considered hearsay? Seems like it might take a trial in itself to get to the truth on that one. Did the Dr making the diagnoses say she thought they were coached?

I mean. In ferreting out the truth, wouldn't denying a defendant certain evidence favorable to her, that has already been allowed in the "interests of justice" essentially mean she was being denied a right to fair trial if that motion was granted? IDK maybe I'm wrong; but seems like common sense.

Look I don't know if you understand this or not but we here on websleuths not on the jury . We don't have infulence on what the judge decides is admitted into evidence. We have minimal information at hand intentionally . Personally I think if one is admitted all should be with concerns raised by each party as to why they feel it was a coerced statement but preferably I would like NONE. You think only the dragon house interview should be admitted. I disagree . How many more times is this going to be rehashed . It's getting very tiresome . I think we should move on from this until/if it comes up in the trial . I for one think it is unnecessary

 

[searchinGirl]

Did the children of Jason and Mags Corbett participate in the murder?
Which injuries are the charged with inflicting?
Are they in prison?
Are they to face charges next week?

Using a half story of alleged interviews from which no details have been disclosed in the sleuthing of a murder is IMO both unethical, immoral and poses a danger to the childrens' future well being.
This is a public forum.
These messages stay public.
Those children are not illiterate, nor are their school friends or those who do not wish them well.
Points of Law or clinical examination of the autopsy is appropriate.
Leave those kids alone, they have NOTHING to do with this case, and placing them constantly into discussions is willful child endangerment.

The admittance of the Dragonfly House materials as evidence at trial are actually considered a Point of Law IMO... I have no idea if they contain information pertinent to the crime itself. I was under the impression the children slept through the ordeal. The brief "half story" I read (in the Irish Times) established that Molly and Jason had a troubled relationship and they witnessed their Dad getting physical with her in the past. This was a domestic dispute. They were members of the household. And, with that evidence they can probably put the provocation (Molly hissyfits), or who was the aggressor issue to rest. The children don't need to be any more involved. Hopefully they won't be. IMO

 

[peregrino]

Weights can be from 2.5kg to 30kg. In General they are shaped by arrangement or cutting but come usually in a square shape.but i am leaning to ruling "SLAB" out because of the statement from sheriff's dept so picture 1. Would be brick shape.

County Sheriff’s department report that:

*Ms Martens and her father admitted to striking Jason Corbett on the head ‘with a concrete paving brick and an aluminium baseball bat’.

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Excellent research! The one on the left could be wielded with one hand but the other two would require two hands, IMO. If the paving stone used was like the one on the left, then there would have to be some force used. Either way, if the injuries were caused by stones as shown in the images, they were wielded with malice IMO.

 

[Truthalways]

Excellent research! The one on the left could be wielded with one hand but the other two would require two hands, IMO. If the paving stone used was like the one on the left, then there would have to be some force used. Either way, if the injuries were caused by stones as shown in the images, they were wielded with malice IMO.

Thanks peregrino😊 I was just thinking too. No injuries to MM or TM swinging bat or brick at that velocity and to do that damage would surely have caused friction to the hands ?

If we think friction we may then think had the redness paled because the friction was caused earlier than 3am ? Or would it suggest abrupt aimed quick attack? - just thinking out loud - just thinking about everything.



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[Truthalways]

Back to the autopsy.

The arms are normally formed. No needle punctures, track marks, or ventral wrist scars are seen.
Smeared blood is on the hands. The fingernails are trimmed short and have blood underneath. The legs
are normally formed and without edema, amputation, or deformity. The toenails have overhangs of up
to 1/16" and have some blood underneath.

Smeared blood on the hands suggests to me that JC wasn't knocked out by the first blow and that he raised his hands to his wound/wounds.

We posted here mm and tm clothing was taken as evidence, will be interesting to see was Jason's bloody finger or handprints on either,

Watch out for it next week because in my opinion if not it may well prove he didn't touch her after first blow. It may also be the case this cast off blood from Jason's hands was smeared elsewhere between the pattern of splatters and the cast off blood it should give a picture of his movements if any and whether he tried to retreat


Moo

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[stephanddoody]

Just going back over a post that truth wrote it's states in the search warrant

In my law enforcement career I have seen “... several of what could be described as ‘uncontrollable fights’. In my opinion the struggle described was not consistent with the evidence at the scene, particularly the master bedroom.”

Does this mean the crime scene was not confined to the bedroom . Also it says

told through the initial interviews that Jason Paul Corbettwas choking Molly Paige Corbett inside the master bedroom door in the early hours of August 2nd 2015.”

Do they mean this literally. If so how did Tom gain access to the room. Maybe we need to go through these again .

http://bloximages.newyork1.vip.town...-11e5-80a2-cb827408349b/568fd60db6a63.pdf.pdf