GUILTY NC - Laura Ackerson, 27, Kinston, 13 July 2011 #2

[NCEast]

... this prosecution is in a NC court under NC law (imo, that's why).

Amanda's sister lived in Texas and (AFAIK) did not set foot in NC during the time period in which AH's and GH's premeditation, Laura's death, and the cover up occured.

Perhaps someone here could tell us whether she might be subject to prosecution under NC law, if NC LE and prosecutor had solid evidence of her participation in a conspiracy before the death (ex: email: "Amanda & Grant, you're going to kill Laura and would like to bring the remains here? Count me in. I'll help to put the remains in our creek w. the alligators in it. Your loving Sister in TX" w. digital, electronical, technical corroboration).

With that evidence, could TX prosecute her (for ?)?
Seems like logistics would be complicated, expensive, etc.

Federal law? Ditto.

JMO :twocents:

I don't think the sister was aware of the murder before it occurred. And I don't think anybody has said that she was aware prior to the act.
I think the prosecution charges would stem from her knowledge of why they drove to TX, finding out about the murder and body parts, and then helping Grant and Amanda facilitate a means of disposing of the body part. The charge would be accessory after the murder or something along those lines, but I do think there is an agreement in place that if she helps the State convict Grant and Amanda she will not be charged.

 

[swanna]

I don't think they had a 'plan' until after the murder and then everything they planned was off the cuff. I think that's why it took them so long to make the trip to TX. IIRC, in addition to the furniture they sold on Craig's list on the spur of the moment, GH also sold some sort of Apple computer on Craig's list at the same time for pretty decent $$. I think that's how they financed their trip once they made the decision to take the remains to TX.
I don't understand why they brought another child into the world if finances were so tight they had to sell furniture and a computer to get to TX. I just don't understand a lot of things about these people.

:goodpost: I agree.....also they obviously planned to stay on the schedule of the Friday drop off of the children and LA not showing up to pick them up. This was for the alibi that they didn't know where she was if/when she was reported missing. Not sure but the trip to Texas must have been planned after that as they were asking about getting a trailer hitch installed Friday night from Sha's boyfriend.:moo:

 

[NCEast]

I don't think we'll get much truth from GH, either, 'East, not a whit of it. If he testifies to something he saw, then he was there & that's not good for him. A witness id'd him as the one who bought the items from the HD in Tx; his car was used; he rented the Uhaul, etc., etc. Boz would burn him up with questions just about that hour in the HD alone; and about the time he was at Sheetz waiting to meet her; and Boz's questions about GH's questions to the Berry brothers about alligators and so on.

If the jury were to buy something like, "I came home from the grocery store and AH said they had had a fight and she killed LA who was lying in the bathtub dead. She would not let me call 911. AH had a plan for us to go Tx with the body..." etc., etc., then that would buy him accessory after the fact and possible conspiracy, which would be about 15--20 years.

I just don't see him taking the stand to testify -- but I would love to see it.

------------------

And one more thang -- Is there any way AH could be watching this trial? Is there anyone who has been watching it and it visiting her to give her details of it? Grrrrrr.

I think in the defense's opening statement, he said that Grant was not in the room, he was getting the boys ready for their visit with Laura when the murder occurred. Of course, we may never know if that's true. And that's why I think Grant H. wants to testify so he can (insert big EGO here) convince the 8 women on the jury that he had nothing whatsoever to do with the actual murder but that he was only guilty of being stupid and not calling the police and trying to cover up the murder to protect Amanda. He and his attorneys are shoving all of the guilt into Amanda's lap and my personal observations and the testimony of others about him has me convinced that he wants to get on that stand. He thinks he can stave off anything the prosecution throws at him. I may be wrong--lord knows, I don't always read people and situations correctly.
I, too, have wondered if Amanda has a means of watching Grant's trial. I would think the ADAs would have instructed the prison personnel about not allowing her to watch but we know how that works out at times. If she is watching, I bet she is taking copious notes like the mad woman she is.

 

[NCEast]

A thought just occurred to me that went over my head yesterday. As Judge Stephens was releasing the jury for the weekend, he said he hoped this was the last time he would have to give them instructions about not discussing the case with anybody over the weekend, etc. He then said, 'hopefully, next weekend you will have the case and will be in deliberations', or something to that effect. So a moment ago when I recalled his words, I began to think of who else the State may call. We know Deborah Radisch, the State's Chief Medical Examiner, maybe Karen Berry?, some other odd and end folks to tie up loose ends, perhaps. So that doesn't leave much time for the defense to put on much of a case. I am wondering if they will even have a case in chief. They may simply rest, citing the State hasn't proven that Grant Hayes was guilty of murder....or they may call only him to defend his position regarding the actual murder. Who can the defense call in their case in chief--I can't think of anybody who can testify that Grant Hayes is not guilty of murder because he was..............fill in the blank. There isn't anybody who can testify that he was somewhere else because it's been stated he was there, in the apartment, but busy getting the boys ready. A lie, he was probably doing everything he could to prevent the boys from knowing their mom was there. Anyhow, I'm just thinking out loud as I try to clean up this gypsy camp we call home.

 

[swanna]

A thought just occurred to me that went over my head yesterday. As Judge Stephens was releasing the jury for the weekend, he said he hoped this was the last time he would have to give them instructions about not discussing the case with anybody over the weekend, etc. He then said, 'hopefully, next weekend you will have the case and will be in deliberations', or something to that effect. So a moment ago when I recalled his words, I began to think of who else the State may call. We know Deborah Radisch, the State's Chief Medical Examiner, maybe Karen Berry?, some other odd and end folks to tie up loose ends, perhaps. So that doesn't leave much time for the defense to put on much of a case. I am wondering if they will even have a case in chief. They may simply rest, citing the State hasn't proven that Grant Hayes was guilty of murder....or they may call only him to defend his position regarding the actual murder. Who can the defense call in their case in chief--I can't think of anybody who can testify that Grant Hayes is not guilty of murder because he was..............fill in the blank. There isn't anybody who can testify that he was somewhere else because it's been stated he was there, in the apartment, but busy getting the boys ready. A lie, he was probably doing everything he could to prevent the boys from knowing their mom was there. Anyhow, I'm just thinking out loud as I try to clean up this gypsy camp we call home.

I heard that as well and was thinking the same thing. This will be wrapped up for both the State and Defense next week. I also believe the Judge is following the time very well in this case.

 

[borndem]

I agree they ambushed her, and there was blood by the front entry. But IMO GH first got her to sign that agreement. I feel like there was some urgency to this agreement thing, not sure what/why. Whether it was a real agreement or something Laura signed because she was in fear and forced to go along with it, I can't figure out.

I hope the State makes their hypothesis clear next week. Something about those text messages ("the business day ends in two hours...you're putting me in a *advertiser censored***'d situation...") and agreement are important, IMO.

Maybe he wanted her to call her attorney and say "we figured it out so call off all legal proceedings" to have that on record so GH could claim "no motive b/c we had worked it all out." But that's stupid because they killed her the same day...

Were they maybe trying to make it appear that she didn't care about the kids (see? She gave them away for $25K!) and took off after closing this agreement and (they would have alleged) receiving $25K? That would "explain" her sudden disappearance.

Anyway, back to the blood. I think something may have been placed by the entryway which leaked or smeared blood there.

I think they killed her (with the kids in the other room like was said earlier), then put her in the bathtub, where she remained overnight. GH then went to Walmart in the middle of the nite to get supplies: tarp, goggles, saw.

After Sha got the kids the next morning, G & A went to work in the kids' bathroom sawing. That was Thursday. GH didn't buy the coolers and ice until Sat, IIRC. So I won't speculate about where the body parts were kept Thursday, Friday and Saturday before they got the coolers. But they had duffel bags (which would allow liquid to leak/soak through).

Then they cleaned the bathroom with bleach (maybe used one of those pressurized sprayers), completely covering the bathroom floor, thus the bleach leaching into the hallway carpet. And they had the tarps and shower curtain to help contain the mess.

They cleaned (using Sha's vacuum), sold furniture, etc. to remove physical evidence and get $ for the trip. Probably dumped stuff in random dumpsters around North Raleigh or even en route to TX.

They got to TX and couldn't figure a way to go shark fishing or gator searching. (What if Shelton had said "yes" to GH's request?? Were they going to implicate him, too??). They thought acid would destroy the remains. Then they took the boat into the creek and the rest is history.

That's my theory at the moment.

bbm

Excellent, Boodles, I'll say again.

Only one comment -- why didn't they dump her body parts, too? It would've made their lives easier and it would have made that Texas trek unnecessary. All they had to do was cruise out of the Raleigh city or Wake Co. limits to any lonesome, out-of-the-way place, maybe Lake Wheeler or Lake Johnson, etc., here in Wake Co., & toss a part over a bridge into the Neuse or into some swamp on some country road, avoiding Walmarts, Targets, etc., or similar places where there would be security cameras, etc.

 

[Boodles]

A thought just occurred to me that went over my head yesterday. As Judge Stephens was releasing the jury for the weekend, he said he hoped this was the last time he would have to give them instructions about not discussing the case with anybody over the weekend, etc. He then said, 'hopefully, next weekend you will have the case and will be in deliberations', or something to that effect. So a moment ago when I recalled his words, I began to think of who else the State may call. We know Deborah Radisch, the State's Chief Medical Examiner, maybe Karen Berry?, some other odd and end folks to tie up loose ends, perhaps. So that doesn't leave much time for the defense to put on much of a case. I am wondering if they will even have a case in chief. They may simply rest, citing the State hasn't proven that Grant Hayes was guilty of murder....or they may call only him to defend his position regarding the actual murder. Who can the defense call in their case in chief--I can't think of anybody who can testify that Grant Hayes is not guilty of murder because he was..............fill in the blank. There isn't anybody who can testify that he was somewhere else because it's been stated he was there, in the apartment, but busy getting the boys ready. A lie, he was probably doing everything he could to prevent the boys from knowing their mom was there. Anyhow, I'm just thinking out loud as I try to clean up this gypsy camp we call home.

Seems they have a lot to pack in next week to get the case to the jury. The following are people I'm wondering about as witnesses: forensic anthropologist, the Chapel Hill ME (Radish?), Ginger Calloway (psychologist for the custody case), witnesses who saw G & A loading the U-haul at the apt complex, Laura's attorney (would that be allowed with client privilege and all?). And then the big question: what about Karen Berry??

I still think the prosecution is holding her back b/c the defense wants her to be called so they can twist things to blame it all on AH. But certainly they could call her themselves, yes? There's some strategy around Karen Berry testifying (or not) which I can't totally figure out. But if the defense doesn't get to question KB, then GH has zero defense! Who else could say "Amanda did it" other than KB or GH? And I don't think GH wants to testify, b/c he's a coward. But according to peeps, he does thunk he's smooth and smart. Sha even said he was charismatic. But that jury's gotta despise him by now. By the way, I don't believe (yet) the alleged AH version of what happened ("I hurt her bad," implying accident). If she said that, it was just a cover story so she didn't appear to be an intentional murder and to get her sister's sympathy and help.

Also, where is Detective Jerry Faulk? He was the lead RPD detective, yet we have not heard from him. Isn't that odd?

And then there is the defense case. Supposedly they will have some kind of psych witness (remember the defense struck a juror who didn't buy into "psych stuff"). Is that Calloway or someone else?

I can't imagine who else could testify for GH.

 

[NCEast]

bbm

Excellent, Boodles, I'll say again.

Only one comment -- why didn't they dump her body parts, too? It would've made their lives easier and it would have made that Texas trek unnecessary. All they had to do was cruise out of the Raleigh city or Wake Co. limits to any lonesome, out-of-the-way place, maybe Lake Wheeler or Lake Johnson, etc., here in Wake Co., & toss a part over a bridge into the Neuse or into some swamp on some country road, avoiding Walmarts, Targets, etc., or similar places where there would be security cameras, etc.

I rescued a baby pot bellied pig about 15 years ago that had been dumped at Lake Wheeler and left to forage/die so I know that's a good 'hiding' spot. I think G & A, who are not brilliant, thought getting her body parts as far away from anything related to them in the Raleigh area would keep them safe.
Born, this is such a simple case and we know the actors and the roles and the acts and the stage and the ending.... but why is putting the pieces together so darn difficult!

 

[Boodles]

I think in the defense's opening statement, he said that Grant was not in the room, he was getting the boys ready for their visit with Laura when the murder occurred. Of course, we may never know if that's true. And that's why I think Grant H. wants to testify so he can (insert big EGO here) convince the 8 women on the jury that he had nothing whatsoever to do with the actual murder but that he was only guilty of being stupid and not calling the police and trying to cover up the murder to protect Amanda. He and his attorneys are shoving all of the guilt into Amanda's lap and my personal observations and the testimony of others about him has me convinced that he wants to get on that stand. He thinks he can stave off anything the prosecution throws at him. I may be wrong--lord knows, I don't always read people and situations correctly.
I, too, have wondered if Amanda has a means of watching Grant's trial. I would think the ADAs would have instructed the prison personnel about not allowing her to watch but we know how that works out at times. If she is watching, I bet she is taking copious notes like the mad woman she is.

bbm. In the opening statement, when Durham said "and we don't know what happened..." (when AH supposedly killed Laura), I thought, "give me a break!"

I mean, seriously, G is in the same apt, they are married, and they devise this extremely l-o-n-g and convoluted evidence disposal plan over the following week, but G doesn't know what happened? What a crock. Right then, it was clear to me this defense would have zero credibility (not that I was very objective!). And I also inferred from this that G & A are still working in concert, regardless of appearances otherwise.

No doubt A is watching the video. Bet Sha gives her an update each day as well. I wonder if Sha has yet figured out how evil her mother is. Denial can really overtake a person who's desperate to believe.

 

[NCEast]

Seems they have a lot to pack in next week to get the case to the jury. The following are people I'm wondering about as witnesses: forensic anthropologist, the Chapel Hill ME (Radish?), Ginger Calloway (psychologist for the custody case), witnesses who saw G & A loading the U-haul at the apt complex, Laura's attorney (would that be allowed with client privilege and all?). And then the big question: what about Karen Berry??

I still think the prosecution is holding her back b/c the defense wants her to be called so they can twist things to blame it all on AH. But certainly they could call her themselves, yes? There's some strategy around Karen Berry testifying (or not) which I can't totally figure out. But if the defense doesn't get to question KB, then GH has zero defense! Who else could say "Amanda did it" other than KB or GH? And I don't think GH wants to testify, b/c he's a coward. But according to peeps, he does thunk he's smooth and smart. Sha even said he was charismatic. But that jury's gotta despise him by now. By the way, I don't believe (yet) the alleged AH version of what happened ("I hurt her bad," implying accident). If she said that, it was just a cover story so she didn't appear to be an intentional murder and to get her sister's sympathy and help.

Also, where is Detective Jerry Faulk? He was the lead RPD detective, yet we have not heard from him. Isn't that odd?

And then there is the defense case. Supposedly they will have some kind of psych witness (remember the defense struck a juror who didn't buy into "psych stuff"). Is that Calloway or someone else?

I can't imagine who else could testify for GH.

I do recall from Boz's opening his saying the Dr. Jennifer Calloway will testify, I had forgotten about her. I think there may be supporting testimony about the ME's report from area university scientists per Boz in his opening. Have no idea where Detective Faulk has been, good point.
I can't for the life of me come up with anybody the defense can call unless they are saving their bomb in the form of Karen Berry. But if she has protection under an agreement with the State I can't see how she could help the defense.
I have a really awful headache so if I'm not thinking clearly you guys won't hurt my feelings to call me out on anything. I may be overthinking everything but I just cannot connect the dots quite yet and I feel that I should.

 

[SurfieTX]

I really think G is going to testify. That's about the only thing the defense "has" in terms of a defense...similar to Casey Anthony. I mean, why not? All of the evidence points to him and/or Amanda, same as Casey and George. It seems like that is the only thing his lawyers can do or use to create reasonable doubt.


ETA: Not to mention, I think G WANTS to testify, his ego being what it is.

 

[NCEast]

I really think G is going to testify. That's about the only thing the defense "has" in terms of a defense...similar to Casey Anthony. I mean, why not? All of the evidence points to him and/or Amanda, same as Casey and George. It seems like that is the only thing his lawyers can do or use to create reasonable doubt.


ETA: Not to mention, I think G WANTS to testify, his ego being what it is.

I don't see any defense other than himself either. Plus, once again, that EGO--he thinks he can charm his way through anything. I hope, hope, hope he does testify and I hope Boz Z. whups the you know what out of him

 

[SurfieTX]

Even though I do believe Grant is guilty as sin, they do have a few things to work with. After all, it was Amanda who called Matt about the hitch. It was Amanda who called Sha to borrow the vacuum. It was Amanda who called Sha to pick up the kids. It was Amanda's sister's house in Texas. It was Amanda disposing of the acid. All they have to do is create reasonable doubt.

Also, has the psychologist testified yet or have the reports/interviews been entered into evidence yet (the ones from the custody case)? I seem to recall Boz alluding to that in his opening statement.

ETA: If the defense has half of a brain, they would STOP throwing Laura under the bus and seriously throw Amanda underneath it. That's Grant's only hope. Disparaging the victim of this horrific murder would pi$$ off even the most sympathetic person.

 

[Marilou]

I went back & listened to the last pre trial hearings where they dealt w/ whether or not the defense on cross could try to elicit the statement from KB that AH made to her about hurting LA. Apparently the defense can't call her but can cross her if prosecution calls her. At the pre trial hearing the prosecution said they planned to call KB but it has been stated here that she is not on witness list. There was a discussion by judge Stephens about whether hearsay rules would apply. Also was discussion about whether AH would be available if called. Maybe someone else can go back & listen to these motions & provide a better understanding of it.

 

[al66pine]

A big THANK YOU to the diligent trial watchers who post here and point out many angles that had not occurred to me.

 

[Coldpizza]

New thread:

NC -*ARREST MADE* - Laura Ackerson, 27, Kiniston-Raleigh, 13 July 2011 - #3 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community