NH NH - Allenstown, Adult Female & 3 Children, found Nov'85 & May'00

[puzzleme]

True Alleykins!

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[coppehead]

This is very interesting, thank you. I am still trying to catch up with whole thread. According to your calculations, can you check then if this would be correct - if we put cut off date end of 1980 and trying to see what ages they all were in 1977 when RE got Waumbeck Mill job in Manchester.

- child #4 was born between 1977 and 1979 (estimated age 2-3 years) - in 77 - heavily pregnant or just conceived?
- child #3 was born between 1976 and 1978 (estimated age 3-4 years) - 77- she would be around 1 year or just born
- child #2 was born between 1970 and 1972 (estimated age 9-10 years) - in 77 -she would be around 6 - 7 years old

White Female - Estimated age: 23-32 years old in 1980, so around 19-29 in 1977. (I think I would scrap 19 as that would make her 12-13 when having her 1st child, but who knows)

It would make it quite interesting if adult female was heavily pregnant with her 2nd child in 1977 (child 4 above in chart) and RE was around, as the same was happening with Denise in 1981. His own child was not probably with him yet in 77, so people could remember only 1 child at this point, the eldest?

I'm not sure if it's possible to be that precise with these numbers, but I did try and here are the results. If we assume they died close to the end of 1981, then the youngest child would have been concieved between March 1977 and Marh 1978. The middle child would have been concieved between March 1976 and March 1977 (here again the possibility of them being the exact same age). And during 1977 the oldest child would have been 5 to 6 years old. If we assume they died closer to the end of 1980 then everything shifts backward by a year.

Edit. Also, I just read the messages written since I last logged in. If we assume they died between June and October in 1980 then the the youngest child could have been conceived already in January 1977. (And all the other dates can be shifted by a couple of months too.)

(Sorry about the delay, the site generates some suspicious looking pop ups for me so I won't be here as much as I've been until I take care of that.)

 

[Aycheff]

I'm not sure if it's possible to be that precise with these numbers, but I did try and here are the results. If we assume they died close to the end of 1981, then the youngest child would have been concieved between March 1977 and Marh 1978. The middle child would have been concieved between March 1976 and March 1977 (here again the possibility of them being the exact same age). And during 1977 the oldest child would have been 5 to 6 years old. If we assume they died closer to the end of 1980 then everything shifts backward by a year.


Edit. Also, I just read the messages written since I last logged in. If we assume they died between June and October in 1980 then the the youngest child could have been conceived already in January 1977. (And all the other dates can be shifted by a couple of months too.)

(Sorry about the delay, the site generates some suspicious looking pop ups for me so I won't be here as much as I've been until I take care of that.)

It's not just you, the suspicious pop up ads are a problem for a lot of us. 🙁 I haven't been on much lately either because of it.

 

[Owutatangledweb]

This may be an out there suggestion, but has Megan Ginevicz been ruled out? https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/3894/

Her thread here: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?31277-MT-Megan-Ginevcz-2-St-Ignatius-30-April-1980

Megan was playing in her yard unattended in May 1980. Local LE concluded she wandered off in the woods and died from the elements or animals but her father believed that she was abducted. Megan's parents were divorced and living in different states. Of course it seems really unlikely--not only because she probably wandered away in the woods-- but also because it would mean the Megan's father was not her biological father and for some reason RE was her father and he knew it and came back to take her. But since this case is already so convoluted and crazy it feels like anything is possible. Megan has the gap in her teeth and possibly an overbite just looking at her picture...

I think Megan looks like Carl's rendering of the youngest child but what relationship would there be with an older child? The oldest victim and is Megan's mother and any older siblings via mother accounted for?

 

[Gardener1850]

I think Megan looks like Carl's rendering of the youngest child but what relationship would there be with an older child? The oldest victim and is Megan's mother and any older siblings via mother accounted for?

I was suggesting Megan for the middle child. The one that is RE's biological daughter and unrelated to the others. She was estimated to be 2-4 years old and had an overbite. Although upon further thought, her isotopes would not make sense. Quoting from Namus: "She likely was born and spent the majority of her childhood in a more northern and inland location such as northern New Hampshire, northern Vermont, upstate New York and further inland." Megan went missing from Montana. :facepalm:

https://identifyus.org/en/cases/2175

 

[Alleykins]

I was suggesting Megan for the middle child. The one that is RE's biological daughter and unrelated to the others. She was estimated to be 2-4 years old and had an overbite. Although upon further thought, her isotopes would not make sense. Quoting from Namus: "She likely was born and spent the majority of her childhood in a more northern and inland location such as northern New Hampshire, northern Vermont, upstate New York and further inland." Megan went missing from Montana. :facepalm:

https://identifyus.org/en/cases/2175

I think the isotopes also indicate a swatch of land through the upper mid-west, if I recall her map correctly, which would put Montana somewhat in there. It extended from ND south to the northeast corner of Colorado, I think.
However, I think Megan has DNA available, which would have matched already if she were the middle child. They would have also run her DNA against all other Jane Does and MPS, too, so if her mother's DNA was in CODIS, it would have also had a hit.
I went looking for adult female MPs from that area that didn't have DNA and came across Carlene Brown as a possible mother of the middle child, who was adopted so no DNA profile. One of the other reasons I took notice of her is that her friend, who also went missing with her but whose body was later found with blows to the head (RE's MO).
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/b/brown_carlene.html

 

[coppehead]

It's not just you, the suspicious pop up ads are a problem for a lot of us. 🙁 I haven't been on much lately either because of it.

Thanks for veryfying this. I wasn't quite sure which site those were from.

 

[coppehead]

From RE's thread I found this

•(February 1980) – New Hampshire, Manchester- Robert T/C “Bob” Evans (DOB 6/22/44) - Arrested for worthless checks; listed spouse as Elizabeth; Referenced having a 2 years old and a 6 Month old

This would give that child #3 was born in 1978 and was 1,5 years older than child #4 who was born in September 1979 and conceived close to January 1979. So she'd be about nine months younger than my estimates.

 

[carbuff]

There isn't any evidence that RE ever kidnapped anybody off the street to murder them, though. All of his known and suspected victims appear to be domestic.

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[Gardener1850]

There isn't any evidence that RE ever kidnapped anybody off the street to murder them, though. All of his known and suspected victims appear to be domestic.

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This is true. I was thinking he might have kidnapped his own daughter, however, as he would have had a previous relationship with the child's mother. He DID kidnap Dawn/Lisa. So I don't think it's out of line to look at missing babies/toddlers that may have been abducted. JMO.

 

[carbuff]

This is true. I was thinking he might have kidnapped his own daughter, however, as he would have had a previous relationship with the child's mother. He DID kidnap Dawn/Lisa. So I don't think it's out of line to look at missing babies/toddlers that may have been abducted. JMO.

Sorry, the quote didn't come through. I meant in relation to Carlene Brown and her friend, who were almost certainly murdered shortly after disappeared.

I suppose he might have taken his daughter without permission, which would be kkidnapping.

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[Gardener1850]

Sorry, the quote didn't come through. I meant in relation to Carlene Brown and her friend, who were almost certainly murdered shortly after disappeared.

I suppose he might have taken his daughter without permission, which would be kkidnapping.

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Oh, yes I agree. I don't think he kidnapped the woman and her 2 children. It also would not make sense for him to have a relationship (abduction type or consensual) with the woman BEFORE she had those children since those were not his biological children. I think she had her children already when she met RE.

 

[Owutatangledweb]

From RE's thread I found this


This would give that child #3 was born in 1978 and was 1,5 years older than child #4 who was born in September 1979 and conceived close to January 1979. So she'd be about nine months younger than my estimates.

I am very confused because there are only three children. ?????

 

[Owutatangledweb]

Focusing on the native american angle, I found the following headline and link but cannot access the article. Anyone else want to give it a try?

Katonah mother and 2 kids disappeared in 1977 - The Journal News
www.lohud.com/story/news/crime/2014/11/11/...mom-kids-disappeared/18860597/
Nov 11, 2014 - Katonah mom disappeared with 2 kids in 1977; Bedford police still ... got the case significant attention in the New York media, all to no avail.

 

[Gardener1850]

Focusing on the native american angle, I found the following headline and link but cannot access the article. Anyone else want to give it a try?

Katonah mother and 2 kids disappeared in 1977 - The Journal News
www.lohud.com/story/news/crime/2014/11/11/...mom-kids-disappeared/18860597/
Nov 11, 2014 - Katonah mom disappeared with 2 kids in 1977; Bedford police still ... got the case significant attention in the New York media, all to no avail.

The article is about Leslie Guthrie. Her kids were a 3 year old boy and a 6 year old girl. More info here: http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/g/guthrie_leslie.html

 

[Alleykins]

Carlene Brown caught my eye because she went missing from WY, where RE claimed he was born (if he's to be believed). I was thinking maybe they knew each other, or each other's families, since RE claimed he came from a big family.

 

[Al Ka]

Focusing on the native american angle, I found the following headline and link but cannot access the article. Anyone else want to give it a try?

Katonah mother and 2 kids disappeared in 1977 - The Journal News
www.lohud.com/story/news/crime/2014/11/11/...mom-kids-disappeared/18860597/
Nov 11, 2014 - Katonah mom disappeared with 2 kids in 1977; Bedford police still ... got the case significant attention in the New York media, all to no avail.

Mother was Leslie Guthrie
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/g/guthrie_leslie.html
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ie-6-amp-Timothy-Guthrie-3-Katonah-6-Feb-1977

 

[Owutatangledweb]

Five months pregnant at the time of her disappearance in 1978. I can see RE being in Utah.

https://bci.utah.gov/2015/03/26/linda-h-peterson-aka-gustke-and-hanoian/

 

[carbuff]

I am very confused because there are only three children. ?????

I think s/he means the three deceased children plus DB's daughter?

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[Owutatangledweb]

The article is about Leslie Guthrie. Her kids were a 3 year old boy and a 6 year old girl. More info here: http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/g/guthrie_leslie.html

Thank you!!!!