NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - #11

[Lolacat]

If Maura had ONLY been drinking at college parties then I would agree with you. But she had 2 car accidents in the space of two days and there is evidence to suggest she was drinking both times. That is a red flag to me. JMO.

 

[Jane Birch]

Some perspective. I owned a 1995 Saturn — essentially the same model and vintage as Maura's. (Purchased it used in 1998 and it ran until 2011.) In the many years that I owned it, the car experienced two fender benders — in a manner of speaking. Keep in mind — those Saturns were not Pontiacs; Saturns were made of plastic.

The first accident we had with the car resulted in a crack to the front bumper. A crack. The car that hit us (hard enough to spin my car about 90 degrees) was more substantially damaged. My insurance company assessed the damage to my Saturn at around $700.

Many year's later, a car bumped my Saturn from the rear. The other person's vehicle wound up with a dented fender. My Saturn's plastic rear bumper showed hardly a scratch.

Oh Pontiacs are plastic by now too. Can you say "crumple zone" ? And I'm sorry if I wasn't clear--we're talking about the accident to her dad's Corolla. Since it was brand new, the parts are going to be more expensive.

It does make an interesting point for Maura's own accident, though. Her front end was bashing in pretty good. Which must mean, from your description, she hit something pretty hard.

 

[Jane Birch]

Oh--haha, sorry, hadn't seen this when I wrote that!

 

[Vox_Veritas_JT]

ETA: this is in reply to this post by Vox_Veritas_JT, which didn't quote for some reason.

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i hate to keep harping on this fact, but every time i check in here i see someone talking bout how much alcohol maura had with her, and then this post suggest alcohol was abused at this party... and of course there was a ton of alcohol consumed at this party, most likely by each person in attendance. the residential area where the dorm party was held was known as the party area. and they were in college. i regularly saw people get drunk past the point of functioning there. is it a great idea? no, but that is the common college experience for many. and i have to reiterate, at 21, the amount of alcohol maura had with her was not really a lot. especially if she was planning to stay in a condo for a few days. most kids who "partied" (drank etc) at UMass when we went there could have easily consumed that much in the course of a day.

i am not arguing that she didn't have a problem, i have no way of knowing that, just that the known facts we have - that she went to a liquor store on her way out of town and that she drank at a college party - don't raise any red flags if put in context.

I spent 4 years at University personally, left after finally getting my M.A in 2004 so I believe I am well aware of the amount of alcohol consumption that goes on. And having studied in both England and spent half a year in Wisconsin Eau Claire I saw and did a great deal of drinking. From Keg parties to English 'drink the bar dry' events. The prevalence of alcohol is, as you indicate, not unusual for any student. But what you neglect to mention is the context in which alcohol use crops up with Maura Murray and how it even has central involvement in the car crash which leads to her disappearance.

I have no idea how much Maura drank specifically but her friends around her mentioned the volume of her drinking specifically, which is a red flag in itself (seeing as this is a college where heavy drinking is the norm). Of course the main red flag is that Maura wrecked two cars. She very clearly was drinking when she had her penultimate crash and drinking red wine while driving is reckless behaviour and certainly not normal college behaviour. The circumstantial signs are also compelling that Maura was also drunk when she had her first crash and one of Renner's contacts said this was told to him by her father. Two crashes involving alcohol is not normal behaviour, it is reckless dangerous behaviour, I think most would agree on that.

Both accidents aside alcohol does objectively occupy a key place in this case. This is because one of the last things Maura does before she vanishes is purchase a very large amount of alcohol for one person. I certainly consider a box of wine and two large bottles of liquor a large amount for one person. Drinking this amount would certainly render most people unconscious and if drunk quickly could likely kill or injure a girl the size of Maura. So the key question involved becomes one of volume and intent. If this alcohol was all for Maura then it seems a high possibility that suicidal intent be contained in this. However if the alcohol was purchased for Maura and another person then this becomes a more standard amount. I find this last point of particular interest considering the latest findings that Renner has explored on his blog concerning the amount of intimate relations Maura had. The possibility that Maura went to meet a guy that night, perhaps one she had already been intimate with should accordingly be given more thought.

Of course the other key significance of the alcohol (as I have repeated in other posts) is the importance it had for Maura the night she vanished. Maura surely doesn't take all the alcohol with her to throw the cops off the scent as she leaves the box of wine in the back... Yet Maura leaves all her other worldy possessions including jewellery in the car. Why was taking the bottle of vodka and other liquor of prime importance at that point in time? Was the decision to take the bottles linked to despair or to the lubrication of a imminent meeting with a mystery somebody?

 

[dogperson]

Maybe Maura only took the opened alcohol with her so LE wouldn't suspect she was driving drunk? If she was consuming mixed drinks she may have opened 2 or more bottles already. That would explain why she felt comfortable leaving the boxed wine because it hadn't yet been opened and therefore couldn't have contributed to the crash. I forget right now just how much alcohol LE thinks she took with her.

 

[Vox_Veritas_JT]

Maybe Maura only took the opened alcohol with her so LE wouldn't suspect she was driving drunk? If she was consuming mixed drinks she may have opened 2 or more bottles already. That would explain why she felt comfortable leaving the boxed wine because it hadn't yet been opened and therefore couldn't have contributed to the crash. I forget right now just how much alcohol LE thinks she took with her.

In actual fact the box of red wine which was left in the back seat had been opened. It was also pretty clear that she had been drinking the red wine as she was driving as red wine was splashed over the interior of the car (an amount had stained the roof as well as elsewhere, if memory serves me). Maura seemed to be drinking this red wine from a plastic coca cola bottle, this was found either outside or inside the car and responding LE who found it noted a strong smell of alcohol from it. It also seemed that Maura had tipped out the remainder of what was in the bottle after the crash, the evidence being pink pour stains in the snow beside the car.

It was also said that LE could not be sure how much of the box of wine was consumed as the box had leaked on the back seat, accordingly the box was empty. If Maura did want to hide evidence of drink driving then she would have had a hard time considering the spillage in the car but surely the first thing to do would be to remove the empty box? Not only that but Murray also leaves the bottle she was drinking the wine from.

In regard to how much alcohol she took with her, details are elsewhere in the thread but I'm pretty sure it was a couple. One was a large bottle of Vodka and the other was a bottle of Kalhua, as others have pointed out these are two thirds of the ingredients for a white or black Russian. If one was going to going to drink suicidally it seems a rather odd choice but is clearly in the realm of possibility. On the other hand, if Maura was going to meet someone at another location it might be quite likely that they would at least have milk there - thus completing the white Russian cocktail.

 

[CircuitGuy]

This is because one of the last things Maura does before she vanishes is purchase a very large amount of alcohol for one person. I certainly consider a box of wine and two large bottles of liquor a large amount for one person. Drinking this amount would certainly render most people unconscious and if drunk quickly could likely kill or injure a girl the size of Maura.

Suppose she was going for a few days and wanted different drinks, e.g. red wine, brandy, and vodka. A 1.75L bottle isn't that much more expensive than a fifth (0.75L), so it feels wasteful to buy smaller bottles. On my last trip to the north woods, I bought a 1.75L of Scotch although I knew wouldn't consume more than a fifth on the trip.

 

[Fireweed]

Based upon my very cursory research, it seems that there is only one state-run liquor store in Bartlett, perhaps not a place that someone like Maura would want to patronize in her state. Maybe, since she was used to visiting NH as a minor, she was not sure where to buy booze up there. I think she bought a lot of booze at her local liquor store so that she could "stock up" a little.

If she took some of the alcohol with her when she left, then to me, as a recovering alcoholic, the explanation for that is simple: alcoholics never leave alcohol behind, especially if they are in a bad situation.

 

[Fireweed]

Oh hey, btw, there has been a lot of talk here over the years that Maura would surely have been spotted by now if she was alive. Abigail Hernandez came home in the same spot she disappeared, wearing the exact same clothes, merely nine months later, and apparently no one spotted her. Just putting that out there.

My strong suspicion is that if a person dyed their hair, dressed a little differently than usual, and went somewhere no one knew them, then it would be very easy to just disappear forever.

 

[Simply Caustic]

I emailed James Renner about the Nate Kibby arrest (see Abigail Hernandez found, thread). Although he did make a blog post about it, he seems to find any connection to MM unlikely.

I'm hesitant to write-off the possibility of a common thread, myself.

What do you all think? North Conway is close by Maura's Accident location...and this guy Kibby was able to keep AH hidden for 9 months... in some manner - details not released yet - but speculation from neighbors state that he had a soundproof shed/shipping container/etc behind his trailer.

Maura was 21 and he 24 when she went missing.

JMO it should be explored as a possibility. If even just to rule it out.

Via Kindle, like a true Amazon junkie

 

[takeitfromme412]

I reported it to the AG yesterday to look into or keep Maura in mind while they are conducting the search in Gorham.... I wouldn't say Haverhill is close to Conway but its not far enough away that it couldn't be a possibility... personally I DO think Maura was abducted and Kibby very well may be a suspect, but until that's confirmed there are no POI in Maura's case.... Please rest assured he is being looked at very closely in all facets and personally I think it is very likely that Kibby has done this before

 

[Steleheart]

I reported it to the AG yesterday to look into or keep Maura in mind while they are conducting the search in Gorham.... I wouldn't say Haverhill is close to Conway but its not far enough away that it couldn't be a possibility... personally I DO think Maura was abducted and Kibby very well may be a suspect, but until that's confirmed there are no POI in Maura's case.... Please rest assured he is being looked at very closely in all facets and personally I think it is very likely that Kibby has done this before

Unsure if it's ok to post here but J. Renner speculated about this in his mauramurray BlogSpot 7/29. Not that it adds anything (it doesn't). But IMO everyone including LE is looking at it since every time a "boogeyman" pops up, LE likely gets calls about Maura.

Having said that, since Kibby was obsessed* and even did jail time for assaulting a young 16 yo girl when he was only 18, at 24 he was certainly capable of grabbing a woman off the street given the opportunity.

"Kibby was found guilty of assaulting 16-year-old [S.M. B.] of Bartlett, who was in ninth grade at the time. Kibby grabbed "[B.] with his hands, and holding on to her jacket around the neck area preventing her from leaving."

"While awaiting trial on the assault charge and others, Kibby spent 42 days incarcerated, most of which was spent in the psychiatric unit of the state prison because he had threatened to harm himself"
http://www.conwaydailysun.com/newsx...-went-to-kennett-and-had-brushes-with-the-law

* "he was a talented sketch artist who always obsessed about girls with dark hair and drew them with their hands tied behind their backs. "
http://www.conwaydailysun.com/newsx...ten-to-the-core-according-to-former-classmate

I think LE got to him this time before he had time to swallow the quick lead pill.

:cow:

 

[Murkywaters]

Conway is apparently just a a straight shot down Rt. 112 from where Maura vanished. As Renner stated on his blog, It's VERY interesting to note that he was in trouble last March for rear-ending a vehicle and then assaulting the driver. He really needs to be looked into, the New Hampshire State Police probably are already aware of this.

 

[Kristin83]

Wow. I'm really hoping this could be a break in Maura's case.

 

[mommylicious]

It would be nice if the other case could help clear up Maura's, too, but I think there are enough other things happening in Maura's case that may be contributing factors in her disappearance that for her to have somehow ran into Kibby, along with everything else, just seems too.... out there?

 

[Kristin83]

The chances of Maura meeting with foul play in that brief window of time is slim to none....but as we've seen on Websleuths over the years.....stranger things have happened!

 

[OldSteve]

Used to follow this case years ago, and it's what brought me to WS... so from time-to-time I look to see if there's anything new.... sadly nothing....

That video on Youtube by Human One is haunting:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvH41yylgq8

Can't picture a young gal in poorly running car on that lonely road.

Which brings me to the questions I've asked but have never gotten answers to -
-did she run in the past at night?
-if she was a night runner, did she use a flashlight?
-did her emergency kit in the car have a flashlight?
-if so, wast the flashlight there or missing?
-was her car ever tested to see just how poorly it ran?
-did it (her car) make noise, like backfiring?
-did it smoke?
-was she known in the past to be slow to unpack in her dorm?

 

[jc8825]

Oh Pontiacs are plastic by now too. Can you say "crumple zone" ? And I'm sorry if I wasn't clear--we're talking about the accident to her dad's Corolla. Since it was brand new, the parts are going to be more expensive.

It does make an interesting point for Maura's own accident, though. Her front end was bashing in pretty good. Which must mean, from your description, she hit something pretty hard.

Saturns, until MY 2009, used polymer body panels that would resist dents, but all other GM brands used steel body panels.

As far as the damage to Maura's Saturn as it was found on the roadway in Haverhill, NH is interesting. From what I can tell, the damage to the hood was done without paint damage. This would indicate that the car did not impact a tree. It would however be consistent of an impact with a hard packed snowbank. Furthermore, from the angle of her approach into the curve on Wild Ammonoosuc Rd., to the position of the Saturn relative to the roadway is inconsistent with an impact to the LF of the vehicle. Not to mention that a LF impact would cause the Saturn to deflect right - into the other trees, not back into the roadway opposite of the moving force. What is more likely and would be consistent with the damage to the Saturn, would be if Maura impacted the snow bank on the inside of the curve. A LF impact at that point would cause the vehicle to deflect to the right, making a 180 and coming to a stop on the opposite side of the roadway, as the car was found.

 

[jc8825]

Which brings me to the questions I've asked but have never gotten answers to -
-did she run in the past at night?
-if she was a night runner, did she use a flashlight?
-did her emergency kit in the car have a flashlight?
-if so, wast the flashlight there or missing?
-was her car ever tested to see just how poorly it ran?
-did it (her car) make noise, like backfiring?
-did it smoke?
-was she known in the past to be slow to unpack in her dorm?

From what I have determined during my research and investigation of the case, it is likely that a runner like Maura would have run recreationally in the early morning or later evening before dawn or after dusk. In any case, this is irrelevant to this case, as on the evening of Maura's disappearance, the sky was clear with a near full moon, and a sky full of stars. Anyone from a rural area will tell you that night is anything but pitch dark. Maura would have had more than sufficient light to run down that roadway.

From what I can find, the Saturn has never been tested for its running condition. There is no evidence that the Saturn ran poorly, and as a matter of fact the evidence that is present is to the contrary. The Saturn passed Massachusetts safety and emissions inspection last in October, 2003 as evidenced by the inspection sticker on the windshield. The car would not have passed if it ran poorly. The exhaust system was removed for evidence to the possibility of a crime from the Saturn by LE in NH due to the strange finding of the rag in the tailpipe. There are no publicly available witness statements that can attest to the Saturn running poorly, making noise, backfiring, smoking, etc. This is a narrative started by Fred Murray after the disappearance. I can tell you that a car running as poorly as the Saturn was claimed to have been running, would never have made a 4+ hour drive to a mountainous locale. The Saturn is in the possession of the NH State Police, and is currently parked behind the Troop F barracks in Twin Mountain, NH. The police have never had the keys, and the car has not been started since it was abandoned by Maura Murray on 02/09/04.

Maura's packing habits are unknown, but she was known to be a neat person. The week of 02/01/04-02/07/04 was the first week of classes for UMASS Amherst, and it is unknown if Maura packed her room before her departure on the 9th or if she simply didn't unpack upon returning. If she was in a depressed state upon returning, she likely would not have unpacked immediately.

 

[jc8825]

In actual fact the box of red wine which was left in the back seat had been opened. It was also pretty clear that she had been drinking the red wine as she was driving as red wine was splashed over the interior of the car (an amount had stained the roof as well as elsewhere, if memory serves me). Maura seemed to be drinking this red wine from a plastic coca cola bottle, this was found either outside or inside the car and responding LE who found it noted a strong smell of alcohol from it. It also seemed that Maura had tipped out the remainder of what was in the bottle after the crash, the evidence being pink pour stains in the snow beside the car.

It was also said that LE could not be sure how much of the box of wine was consumed as the box had leaked on the back seat, accordingly the box was empty. If Maura did want to hide evidence of drink driving then she would have had a hard time considering the spillage in the car but surely the first thing to do would be to remove the empty box? Not only that but Murray also leaves the bottle she was drinking the wine from.

In regard to how much alcohol she took with her, details are elsewhere in the thread but I'm pretty sure it was a couple. One was a large bottle of Vodka and the other was a bottle of Kalhua, as others have pointed out these are two thirds of the ingredients for a white or black Russian. If one was going to going to drink suicidally it seems a rather odd choice but is clearly in the realm of possibility. On the other hand, if Maura was going to meet someone at another location it might be quite likely that they would at least have milk there - thus completing the white Russian cocktail.

The box of Franzia blush wine was the only alcoholic item found in the car. The box was somehow damaged and had leaked the contents into the seat, onto the floor, and as a result of the impact, splattered onto the ceiling. All other alcoholic items, as shown on the liquor store receipt that was left in the car, were missing, presumably Maura took the remaining items. Maura's drink of choice seemed to be that Franzia blush wine mixed with vodka. Now, according to the police report, the empty Coke bottle found inside the vehicle had a "strong alcoholic odor", Maura most likely had mixed some of the wine with vodka to create this odor, as Franzia blush wine has very little alcoholic odor.