NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - # 8

[Skigirl]

I wouldn't have figured that maura waited until she woke up the next day to tell her father about the wreck. (As I understand the story) She was given a ride back to Fred's hotel from her wreck site by the tow truck driver and fred's crashed new car was also dropped off at the hotel. But the wreck was listed on the accident report as taking place at approximately at 3:33 a.m. so she was likely not getting to the hotel anytime before 4 or 4:15 a.m after police got done with her and issued her a citation (operator inattention) and cleared her and the scene.

In the statement by Fred Murray on Renner's blog, he says that she was not given a ticket. The police report does mention "driver inattention". It's a small thing, but I thought I'd mention it.

 

[OldSteve]

Not sure where all this is going - while the events of MM life prior to her disappearance make for interesting story telling, I don't think it really gets us closer to what happened that night in Haverhill. The more I now read the more I appreciate Fred's wisdom when he said something to the same effect.

 

[scoops]

In the statement by Fred Murray on Renner's blog, he says that she was not given a ticket. The police report does mention "driver inattention". It's a small thing, but I thought I'd mention it.

Good Catch.

I have busted out all my old records of the maura murray case and in a release from the Whitman Hanson Express, it clearly states that Maura was not cited that evening.

I think what got me confused was that in the police report the officer notes driver inattention and that got me to believe that the officer found fault with maura.

The police officer may have still found fault and decided to go easy on her. Maura may have been an emotional wreck, or the officer realizing the car was brand new, may have known what kind of an ordeal it was going to be for maura to have to break the news to her father.

 

[nitram]

No you are wrong.

I provided a timeline of FACTUAL information and did not bring up that 12:40 a.m. phone call at all because it has never been released publically and for all we know may have never existed in the first place.

You were the one to criticize me for saying what is fact and what isn't by bringing up a phone call that has never been proven to be true or not.

The times that you have provided for the two phone calls are factual but the timeline is incomplete. We do not have records for any landline calls and cannot be sure when Maura became distraught to the point of needing to be relieved. Without complete information dismissal of a potential call is not factual.

Thanks for posting the flickr photos.

 

[telemag]

I find Fred's statement and how it was written very odd. He explains how the girls where going to a party then out of no where he says, and when I woke up at 10:30 Maura was still sleeping, HUH? Um so how did she get in? Did she have a key and if so why? If not did Fred let her in? By the way he words it, it seems that she just appeared out of thin air, no real detail as to how she got there and if he even spoke to her. Your daughter comes in unexpectedly to your hotel room in the wee hours of the morning and you don't even bother to say hi? You don't even hear her talking on your phone?

I get the feeling even more than ever that Maura was EXTEMELY!!!!! unbalanced and capable of just about anything after she wrecked again the night she disappeared. Maura was a heavy drinker who was also a thief and also had many personal problems. Sorry as I do feel bad to say that, but those are the facts and I would bet there is even more to her behavior and theft and drinking that we know, probabley just the tip of the iceberg.

A lot of people think that what ever happened to Maura had nothing to do with the events that led up to her disappearance. Personally I could not say with certainty that they didn't, especially after what I have learned thus far.

Think about it, if this was your daughter and she did all that then lied to her school about a death, took a car that supossedly she was afraid to drive on a very long trip by herself and told NO ONE!! This is not just one of those stories of a girl who gets abducted walkng to her car never to be heard from again. There is a lot of weird stuff that surounds this case.

 

[Unscripted]

This is not just one of those stories of a girl who gets abducted walkng to her car never to be heard from again. There is a lot of weird stuff that surounds this case.

In fact, she hasn't been heard from in eight years. The SAR dogs lost her scent in the middle of Route 112 just 100 yards down the road from her car. There was no evidence that she walked into the woods from the crash site. A well respected resident of the area witnessed a suspicious truck lurking in the area just minutes prior to her disappearance. Her running gear, toiletries and expensive jewelry were left in her car indicating that she wasn't planning to be away from her vehicle for long. The gas tank was nearly full, despite having driven 130 miles from Amherst, MA, indicating she probably topped it up when she got off the Interstate. Her bank account and credit cards have been dormant since she disappeared. The NH AG's Homicide Unit has been investigating this case since she disappeared in February, 2004.

If she wasn't abducted, then what do you think happened to her?

 

[scoops]

The times that you have provided for the two phone calls are factual but the timeline is incomplete. We do not have records for any landline calls and cannot be sure when Maura became distraught to the point of needing to be relieved. Without complete information dismissal of a potential call is not factual.

Thanks for posting the flickr photos.

The times I posted are factual and that is what I based a timeline on plus I fused in the statements made by Maura's supervisor from that night from when she was first notified to go check on maura to when she actually got to the dorm maura was working at and encountered her.

My whole point is (I am saying) I highly doubt that there was another phone call that night in question and while that is opinion, I provided excerpts from stories that back it up, I think pretty clearly.

The UMASS Police have been quoted in one article as saying they have discovered the source of the phone call that upset maura. (Back then in the early days of maura going missing, they were probably still working out the fact that maura talked to her sister that night and probably just discovered the number and that explains their quote. It was a developing story back then.
Whereas now a days, we all know that maura talked to her sister and even most of us know exactly at what time and know that maura talking to her sister happened three hours plus before she was found upset. So to go back and read a quote (IN THE PRESENT TIME) from a police officer that says (IN THE EARLY DAYS OF THE INVESTIGATION) that they have discovered the source of the phone call that got maura upset (can get confusing), because it was in a different context then.

Hope that made sense.

Just three days after the UMASS police stated that they knew the source of the phone call that upset maura, they came right back and said the source of the phone call was maura's sister.

We know now that (even if there was a land-line on campus call to another campus phone that night that maura received) it would be impossible that the call would come from her sister who was hours away from UMASS.

 

[telemag]

In fact, she hasn't been heard from in eight years. The SAR dogs lost her scent in the middle of Route 112 just 100 yards down the road from her car. There was no evidence that she walked into the woods from the crash site. A well respected resident of the area witnessed a suspicious truck lurking in the area just minutes prior to her disappearance. Her running gear, toiletries and expensive jewelry were left in her car indicating that she wasn't planning to be away from her vehicle for long. The gas tank was nearly full, despite having driven 130 miles from Amherst, MA, indicating she probably topped it up when she got off the Interstate. Her bank account and credit cards have been dormant since she disappeared. The NH AG's Homicide Unit has been investigating this case since she disappeared in February, 2004.

If she wasn't abducted, then what do you think happened to her?

A guy named Rick Forcier(sp?) said he saw a girl fitting Maura's description and few miles down the road while he was driving home, supposedly she had on a backpack. Also and I may be wrong on this one, they used a pair of Maura's gloves to get a scent and I think Maura's dad was to have said that the gloves where pretty new so he wasn't even sure Maura had worn them. So, maybe the dogs just lost the scent and maybe Rick did see Maura.

No sure what your point is about her gas tank. Guess she needed gas so she stopped to get some.

As far as what she didn't take with her, I think it more important to ask what DID she take? Obviously she couldn't take everything. If she didn't think her jewelry was safe in her dorm behind a locked door add to the fact that no one knew she was gone so no reason for anyone to try to steal anything, so why would she leave it in an abandon car for ANY length of time thinking it was safe from theft and when the police came?????? She obviously didn't care too much about the jewelry.

I don't think what she left behind gives us any indication as to how long she thought she would be gone. I mean ask yourself, did she think that she would be able to come back later to get her stuff? She high tailed it out of there knowing full well the police were coming and the car would be towed.

I also heard about the red truck story. Not sure why the lady thought the truck was suspicious, but you never know. I just don't think that there is enough to go on to think that this truck was out on the prowl looking for someone to kill.

As far as what I think happened to her I have no clue.

 

[Unscripted]

A guy named Rick Forcier(sp?) said he saw a girl fitting Maura's description and few miles down the road while he was driving home, supposedly she had on a backpack. Also and I may be wrong on this one, they used a pair of Maura's gloves to get a scent and I think Maura's dad was to have said that the gloves where pretty new so he wasn't even sure Maura had worn them. So, maybe the dogs just lost the scent and maybe Rick did see Maura.No sure what your point is about her gas tank. Guess she needed gas so she stopped to get some.As far as what she didn't take with her, I think it more important to ask what DID she take? Obviously she couldn't take everything. If she didn't think her jewelry was safe in her dorm behind a locked door add to the fact that no one knew she was gone so no reason for anyone to try to steal anything, so why would she leave it in an abandon car for ANY length of time thinking it was safe from theft and when the police came?????? She obviously didn't care too much about the jewelry. I don't think what she left behind gives us any indication as to how long she thought she would be gone. I mean ask yourself, did she think that she would be able to come back later to get her stuff? She high tailed it out of there knowing full well the police were coming and the car would be towed.As far as what I think happened to her I have no clue.

I don't believe it has been reported that RF saw the "mysterious figure" with a backpack. But I would be interested in seeing a link to that effect.

She may not have abandoned the car (or high-tailed it) except to walk a few yards to get cell phone reception to call AAA. Perhaps she was grabbed or cajoled by the driver and passenger of the mysterious, unrecognized Red Truck seen lurking in the area a few minutes prior to her disappearance? The police say her car was locked when they responded to the scene, but in the SOCO article (April, 2011) a local resident says the doors to the Saturn were open when she drove by at 19:50, i.e. not locked at all. Some believe that the Saturn may be the crime scene.

As for the topped up gas tank, if you were going to meet up with a secret lover in the mountains and disappear, why bother refuelling?

Apparently the Bloodhound got a hit from the glove but the scent trail ended 100 yards up the road. Is it possible that the vehicle, that Maura might have been in, turned around at that point and headed back into Woodsville or up Route 302 to Lisbon or Littleton?

 

[telemag]

I don't believe it has been reported that RF saw the "mysterious figure" with a backpack. But I would be interested in seeing a link to that effect.

She may not have abandoned the car (or high-tailed it) except to walk a few yards to get cell phone reception to call AAA. Perhaps she was grabbed or cajoled by the driver and passenger of the mysterious, unrecognized Red Truck seen lurking in the area a few minutes prior to her disappearance? The police say her car was locked when they responded to the scene, but in the SOCO article (April, 2011) a local resident says the doors to the Saturn were open when she drove by at 19:50, i.e. not locked at all. Some believe that the Saturn may be the crime scene.

As for the topped up gas tank, if you were going to meet up with a secret lover in the mountains and disappear, why bother refuelling?

Apparently the Bloodhound got a hit from the glove but the scent trail ended 100 yards up the road. Is it possible that the vehicle, that Maura might have been in, turned around at that point and headed back into Woodsville or up Route 302 to Lisbon or Littleton?

Definitely been verified about Rick and what he saw. He went to the police himself about a month later when he realized the date. Don't have a link sure someone can find it though.

See, the thing is about this case is that no one seems to be able to prove or disprove an abduction or a runaway or anything for that matter. I doubt Maura had any intentions of calling AAA. That would mean that she would have needed to wait for them to arrive and I think she already knew that BA probably called the police. Plus she had been drinking so again she took off and fast. Maura had plenty of chance to grab any small item she thought she thought important to take because of it's value.

There is no doubt that Maura could have met with foul play. Would be very much a coincidence if she did. If I had to guess I would sa she is no longer with us, but I also really do think that given all that I have read about this case that she may be alive somewhere and couldn't care less about anyone knowing she is alive. This scenario has occurred before.

 

[Unscripted]

Definitely been verified about Rick and what he saw. He went to the police himself about a month later when he realized the date. Don't have a link sure someone can find it though. See, the thing is about this case is that no one seems to be able to prove or disprove an abduction or a runaway or anything for that matter. I doubt Maura had any intentions of calling AAA. That would mean that she would have needed to wait for them to arrive and I think she already knew that BA probably called the police. Plus she had been drinking so again she took off and fast. Maura had plenty of chance to grab any small item she thought she thought important to take because of it's value. There is no doubt that Maura could have met with foul play. Would be very much a coincidence if she did. If I had to guess I would sa she is no longer with us, but I also really do think that given all that I have read about this case that she may be alive somewhere and couldn't care less about anyone knowing she is alive. This scenario has occurred before.

I am unclear what you mean by "verified" as to what the witness "saw". After being interviewed by police, a private detective and others (including Professor R. McDonald's wife) in the weeks following Maura's disappearance, this witness offered no information regarding this sighting.

Eleven weeks later (late April) he told the owner of the local convenience store that he might have remembered something. The store owner relayed this information to Maura's father who then told police and requested that they interview the man. It has been reported that on May 8, 2004 an extensive search by NH F&G in that area yielded no clues.

 

[Jane Birch]

Scoops - I think his statement contains oddities which are covering something up
Saturday night he is dropped back to his hotel and maura and Kate head back to the dorm to party and sleep
After drinking alcohol in the early hours of sunday maura crashes the car , has it towed , goes to the fathers hotel and sleeps there even though she was supposed to be at her dorm

Calls were made and received from /to Freda cell phone at 5am sunday
Fred says he didn't learn of the accident til 10am.

Id say something's off But he could just be covering for her drink driving. It's a weird relationship where your grown up daughter arrives at your hotel room at 3am and you either don't notice or don't ask her why the heck she isn't in her own bed at the dorm

Link to statement and cell records
http://mauramurray.blogspot.co.uk/2012/03/police-obtained-fred-murrays-cell-phone.html?m=1

Unless she has your car and would have had to pick you up in the morning anyway, and there's crap all over the bed in her dorm room because she hasn't unpacked, in which case it would make total sense: "So I'll just see you later tonight and crash on the other bed, so we can get a quick start in the morning and you don't have to come get me."

 

[scoops]

Unless she has your car and would have had to pick you up in the morning anyway, and there's crap all over the bed in her dorm room because she hasn't unpacked, in which case it would make total sense: "So I'll just see you later tonight and crash on the other bed, so we can get a quick start in the morning and you don't have to come get me."

I have been thinking about fred's statement a lot lately.

And it just doesn't add up.

Fred and maura show up at the amherst brew co. have dinner (maybe a few drinks) then they leave momentarily to go down the road to the dorms and pick up maura's friend Kate who was just returning from a track meet.

Then they go back to the ABC, (most likely for some more drinks) and about an hour or so later the girls talk about wanting to go to a dorm party, while fred says he wants to return to his hotel.

So, the million dollar question then is why didn't fred just drop the girls back off at the dorms and go on his way to the hotel and then everyone is where they are suppose to be????????? (Girls don't need a car, they are at both the party location and place where they live)

And fred can go back get a good night's sleep and then in the morning come say goodbye to maura and be on his way to his next work site.

Maybe Fred had drank too much at the ABC and needed one of the girls to drive him back to the hotel. (I am not insinuating anything wrong or negative by that, in fact that would be the responsible thing to do if that is in fact what happened and were the case). It would definitely clear up some of the confusion.

But it is also possible that maura was in fact staying with him at the hotel all along. The hotel is in the next town over from UMASS (Although it's less than 10 miles away) maybe that was the arrangement all along for maura to stay with her father while he was visiting her).

 

[McSpy]

I have been thinking about fred's statement a lot lately.

And it just doesn't add up.

Fred and maura show up at the amherst brew co. have dinner (maybe a few drinks) then they leave momentarily to go down the road to the dorms and pick up maura's friend Kate who was just returning from a track meet.

Then they go back to the ABC, (most likely for some more drinks) and about an hour or so later the girls talk about wanting to go to a dorm party, while fred says he wants to return to his hotel.

So, the million dollar question then is why didn't fred just drop the girls back off at the dorms and go on his way to the hotel and then everyone is where they are suppose to be????????? (Girls don't need a car, they are at both the party location and place where they live)

And fred can go back get a good night's sleep and then in the morning come say goodbye to maura and be on his way to his next work site.

Maybe Fred had drank too much at the ABC and needed one of the girls to drive him back to the hotel. (I am not insinuating anything wrong or negative by that, in fact that would be the responsible thing to do if that is in fact what happened and were the case). It would definitely clear up some of the confusion.

But it is also possible that maura was in fact staying with him at the hotel all along. The hotel is in the next town over from UMASS (Although it's less than 10 miles away) maybe that was the arrangement all along for maura to stay with her father while he was visiting her).

Did she have extra clothes and a tooth brush with her? If not, I doubt she was staying there. Maybe Fred was just tired, so he told her to take the car, because he was too lazy to drive at the time. It may have been a momentary gesture, which he regrets now.

 

[McSpy]

The times I posted are factual and that is what I based a timeline on plus I fused in the statements made by Maura's supervisor from that night from when she was first notified to go check on maura to when she actually got to the dorm maura was working at and encountered her.

My whole point is (I am saying) I highly doubt that there was another phone call that night in question and while that is opinion, I provided excerpts from stories that back it up, I think pretty clearly.

The UMASS Police have been quoted in one article as saying they have discovered the source of the phone call that upset maura. (Back then in the early days of maura going missing, they were probably still working out the fact that maura talked to her sister that night and probably just discovered the number and that explains their quote. It was a developing story back then.
Whereas now a days, we all know that maura talked to her sister and even most of us know exactly at what time and know that maura talking to her sister happened three hours plus before she was found upset. So to go back and read a quote (IN THE PRESENT TIME) from a police officer that says (IN THE EARLY DAYS OF THE INVESTIGATION) that they have discovered the source of the phone call that got maura upset (can get confusing), because it was in a different context then.

Hope that made sense.

Just three days after the UMASS police stated that they knew the source of the phone call that upset maura, they came right back and said the source of the phone call was maura's sister.

We know now that (even if there was a land-line on campus call to another campus phone that night that maura received) it would be impossible that the call would come from her sister who was hours away from UMASS.

As far as her sobbing, while working as a dorm monitor, I'm thinking that if the credit card fraud is true, then maybe she got a dirty look from a student or two while they came into the dorm building. Stuff like that gets around. Another thought is maybe she was thinking about the possibility of being kicked out of school and all the ramifications. It is something she wouldn't want to share with her supervisor.

I'm just throwing out thoughts here. To me, it is possible a phone call was not the cause of her being upset that night. She could have been just ruminating about something and it came to a head that evening. JMO

 

[Unscripted]

James Renner wrote on his blog on Mar 22, 2012:
"I think the evidence clearly supports Maura getting into a vehicle in the small window of time she was alone. My hunch is that she was traveling in tandem with someone to another destination."

Over the years there has been much speculation that Maura might have been going to meet another man in New Hampshire, someone she met over the Christmas break, a married man who lived in NH but worked in MA, or possibly a long-time friend (former boyfriend) to whom she turned to for solace.

Can anyone shed some light on any of these possibilities?

 

[scoops]

James Renner wrote on his blog on Mar 22, 2012:
"I think the evidence clearly supports Maura getting into a vehicle in the small window of time she was alone. My hunch is that she was traveling in tandem with someone to another destination."

Over the years there has been much speculation that Maura might have been going to meet another man in New Hampshire, someone she met over the Christmas break, a married man who lived in NH but worked in MA, or possibly a long-time friend (former boyfriend) to whom she turned to for solace.

Can anyone shed some light on any of these possibilities?

It's a theory. And until they truly discover what happened to maura, it can't be ruled out as a possibilty that she was meeting someone.

I personally think it is a weak theory.

Way too many things lead towards maura not having a mystery partner to meet up with

for starters, maura had a frenzy of destination searches she was making on the night before and day of that she went missing for locations to head to (spanning different states and hours apart from one another).

There is no known trail of communication between maura and some mystery acquaitance. Keep in mind, if maura was just planning on disappearing for a week to meet up with someone at a destination, would she really have the foresight to carefully avoid all traces of contact with this person getting out. (No one would be searching phone records, computer correspondence etc.. if maura was only gone a week and then back to school to resume her normal life so she would have no reason to hide emails for instance with a secret lover.

It can't even be proven whether maura got into a car after her wreck or not. The dogs used to search for maura's scent really didn't have much to work with and weren't expected to yield a long trail of maura, just a starting point (they traced her around 100-yards east from her car accident).

 

[scoops]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NortheastAppalachiansMap.jpg

I've posted this before, but I will post it again, maybe it will resonate with someone this time around.

If you click on this link, you will go to a wikipedia page and get a small fancy little colored box that shows up.

In this fancy colored box is a bunch of different locations (mountains seems to be the common theme here and yes I am typing with a little sarcastic tone, I apologize in advance)

Anywhoo, the mountains in this box all have one thing in common, even though many of the locations are hours apart from one another.

The common theme that this box of mountains has is that (Drumroll please ......)


Every mapquest search and hand written search for directions done by maura murray the night before and day of that she went missing, leads to one of the places in this box.


Now I am not Detective Columbo or no big city slicker like the NH assistant state's attorney Mr. Strezlin, but There might be something to this as far as figuring out where maura is or where maura was headed.

What do y'all think?

 

[Skigirl]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NortheastAppalachiansMap.jpg

I've posted this before, but I will post it again, maybe it will resonate with someone this time around.

If you click on this link, you will go to a wikipedia page and get a small fancy little colored box that shows up.

In this fancy colored box is a bunch of different locations (mountains seems to be the common theme here and yes I am typing with a little sarcastic tone, I apologize in advance)

Anywhoo, the mountains in this box all have one thing in common, even though many of the locations are hours apart from one another.

The common theme that this box of mountains has is that (Drumroll please ......)


Every mapquest search and hand written search for directions done by maura murray the night before and day of that she went missing, leads to one of the places in this box.


Now I am not Detective Columbo or no big city slicker like the NH assistant state's attorney Mr. Strezlin, but There might be something to this as far as figuring out where maura is or where maura was headed.

What do y'all think?

I'm not sure I follow. Are you saying that all of her searches are contained in the box that represents all of the mountain ranges in the Northeast? That doesn't narrow it down much, so I'm sure I'm misinterpreting what you said - can you clarify?

 

[scoops]

I'm not sure I follow. Are you saying that all of her searches are contained in the box that represents all of the mountain ranges in the Northeast? That doesn't narrow it down much, so I'm sure I'm misinterpreting what you said - can you clarify?

it was a long-winded way of saying maura was looking to head off to a mountain. That is what all of her searches have in common.

Mt. Greylock --- Considered to have highest point (tallest mountain in Massachusetts) ===== in the berkshires area

Mt. Mansfield --- Mountain with highest peak in vermont =====In the Stowe/Green Mountains area


Mt. Washington --- Tallest mountain in New Hampshire ====== White Mountains and coincidentally enough if you were to do a map search on a computer from amherst (maura's college campus) to Mt. Washington it would appear on the map search that you could take a shortcut at the wells river exit from I-91 cut through the 302 to the 112 and get to Mt. Washington faster than driving I-91 up and around and back to mt. Washington.