GUILTY NJ - Carolyn Byington, 26, killed inside her home, Plainsboro, 10 June 2019 *Arrest* #2

[Seattle1]

Me too. There must have been a lot of her DNA mixed in the sample, and maybe a trace of his (and perhaps, another male). I'm also unsure that it was found "under her fingernails" as has been reported. This popped up the other day with the reporter quoting from the probable cause statement:

Police: Lindenwold man's 'demeanor' changed after co-worker's murder

(BBM) According to the probable cause statement, after DNA samples were taken from “numerous individuals,” investigators learned Saal “could not be excluded as a match” for DNA material found “in the area of the victim’s fingernails.”

Will this matter to jurors if case goes to trial? IDK. Sometimes, all it takes is that one juror who absolutely needs that conclusive DNA. He did lie to investigators though, stating that he had only seen her in passing at the office that day:

From link above ^^

When police questioned Saal on June 19, the statement says, the suspect said “he worked with the victim but had only seen her in passing on the date of her death."

I suppose defense could argue transference of his DNA onto her from the office, but there appears to be a lot of circumstantial evidence against him, and I'm hoping for even more.

Thinking that she MAY have been romantically involved with another coworker at office who was eventually eliminated as being responsible for her murder.

He may have been wearing gloves, though that did not protect him from cutting his knuckles & hand, but perhaps cut down on amount of his DNA left at the crime scene.

Leaving this here for those who may be more scientifically inclined than I:

(BBM) New Details As Co-Worker Charged In NJ Woman's Lunch-Break Murder

On Aug. 19, the lab that conducted the testing told the prosecutor's office that Saal "couldn't be excluded as a match for Y-STR DNA" that was found under Byington's fingernails, according to a copy of the complaint provided by the Middlesex County Court.

About Y-STR DNA:

Forensic use of Y-chromosome DNA: a general overview

The male-specific part of the human Y chromosome is widely used in forensic DNA analysis, particularly in cases where standard autosomal DNA profiling is not informative. A Y-chromosomal gene fragment is applied for inferring the biological sex of a crime scene trace donor. Haplotypes composed of Y-chromosomal short tandem repeat polymorphisms (Y-STRs) are used to characterise paternal lineages of unknown male trace donors, especially suitable when males and females have contributed to the same trace, such as in sexual assault cases. Y-STR haplotyping applied in crime scene investigation can (i) exclude male suspects from involvement in crime, (ii) identify the paternal lineage of male perpetrators, (iii) highlight multiple male contributors to a trace, and (iv) provide investigative leads for finding unknown male perpetrators.

My understanding is that there are four categories and not excluded is the second category. It isn’t an exact match but it’s not inconclusive either.

Does saying "cannot be excluded" a way of preventing a lawsuit if it turns out there was a legit reason for his DNA to be found under her fingernails. Or on the off chance there was a mistake. I doubt these things. I remember hearing that saying DNA is a perfect match or saying with "scientific certainty" it is a match isn't quite as simple or accurate as crime shows would have us believe. Unless most of the population can't be ruled out, it says a lot that Saal a coworker can't be. It might be a more honest way of saying it's likely his DNA unless he has a brother that would want to kill her.

I don't believe the terminology used here is cause for concern (because the criminal complaint citation does not include the actual statistical analysis of the DNA test results).

Numerous searchable appealed cases are available where the actual quantifiable results prove more convincing. (None overturned for DNA).

For example - 2015 Texas case:

DNA evidence also linked Petitioner to Holik's home. Petitioner could not be excluded as a match to biological evidence from Holik's left hand ... Russo, 228 S.W.3d at 789-90. A DNA expert called by the State testified "the coincidental chance of obtaining the same [DNA] profile in this case is one in 12.9 million people."

I believe what the experts will present in court re. the statistical odds will leave no reasonable doubt the DNA profile belongs to KS.

MOO

 

[cluciano63]

How did he get into her apartment in order to be waiting for her?

 

[kbpirate]

How did he get into her apartment in order to be waiting for her?

I wonder this also. How did he know she was going home for lunch? Did he break in to steal something?

 

[GraceVPrice]

She could have spilled coffee on her outfit, gotten her period, had a package delivered. He could have followed her there. He could have had something delivered that needed to be signed for.

This was my first thought. If it didn't normally go home for lunch but got my period in the morning, i'd head home for lunch.

 

[ilovechili]

Anything is possible but I find it curious with regard to computer disks and phone info, etc. I am just guessing but thinking the phone will show a call to draw her home, flowers delivered, package, lunch, maintenance call... Who hears much of computer disks anymore? I mean perhaps these things taken did not end up mattering, it is hard to say.

I get that businesses will back up on a hard drive, etc. but a disk? I am drawing a blank, do we know if these are from work or from his home or hers?

We still have confusion in articles of whether he was waiting for her in her apartment or followed her, etc., whether he was inside or outside.

If he was a stalker, he certainly could have gotten some type of key as mentioned above.

If they knew each other, he could have had a key. I do not want to sully Carolyn by suggesting a relationship but simply saying it is possible. I do not think this is most likely however.

I think a work thing or issue is more likely as also is the stalker situation. As an accountant, he would definitely more than likely have her address right down to apartment number.

What throws me is if anyone was home below her, from the size of this man, someone would hear him lumbering up the outdoor steps over their doorway etc. We have a petite woman and a huge man.

For the months of this case though and it looking like it would go nowhere, I still am overwhelmingly happy there has been an arrest!

 

[GraceRose]

I think a work thing or issue is more likely as also is the stalker situation. As an accountant, he would definitely more than likely have her address right down to apartment number.

Finding Carolyn's address is as easy as searching her name on sites like Mylife.com or Whitepages.com. The accessibility of information on the internet is frightening and dangerous in the wrong hands.

 

[njlady]

When I grew up, an address was always available in the phone book. It's not that new.

 

[Inthedetails]

When I grew up, an address was always available in the phone book. It's not that new.

True. The local phone book in my neighborhood growing up also had the names of children listed and their ages! Crazy.

(My parents never listed our names, which I thought was so mean. Now I understand.)

jmo

 

[ilovechili]

While it is true he could have gotten her address various places, seeing it at work would not be an obvious search, etc. on a home or work computer, etc. (if he had any common sense of covering his tracks which remains to be seen for sure). I also still think it takes being there or stalking to know she was the back side of which building, etc., where to park, where the approach was, the stairwell, etc. Jmo though.

 

[borndem]

I’ve wondered if he went to her apartment to look for something and she walked in on him unexpectedly. However, I believe most of the reports early on stated there was no forced entry.

If he was indeed inside when she arrived, 1) she didn't (or forgot to) lock her door, 2) he used a tool or a credit card to get into her apt
If her door was locked, there probably wasn't a locked deadbolt lock on her door, i.e., poor design for a complex. I would insist on a deadbolt. A deadbolt would stop most people, but not all. There are ways to "copy" a deadbolt lock and make a key.
Was there a sliding glass door into her apt? Was it locked? With no secondary locking mechanism, it may have been easy for him to enter that way.
Did he find a window to enter? That would have been mighty "nervy" during daylight, and probably difficult for a man of his size and girth.
This unforced entry obviously has me baffled and very curious.

 

[borndem]

Now that’s a good question. I wonder what the answer is.

I sure wouldn’t want to work around him at all.

ETA: This is quite the conundru6m as I see it. He hasn’t been found guilty of the crime yet, so I wonder if the employer would have to allow him back to his job until he goes to trial; but then the employer has to provide a safe working environment for their workers. Would anyone feel safe at work with him there?

bbm
And would he feel safe around his co-workers? I wonder how well he was liked at work? Was he easygoing and friendly? Was he shy and did he keep to himself?

 

[DAB]

If he was indeed inside when she arrived, 1) she didn't (or forgot to) lock her door, 2) he used a tool or a credit card to get into her apt
If her door was locked, there couldn't have been a locked deadbolt lock on her door, i.e., poor design for a complex. I would insist on a deadbolt.
Was there a sliding glass door into her apt? Was it locked? With no secondary locking mechanism, it may have been easy for him to enter that way.
Did he find a window to enter? That would have been mighty "nervy" during daylight, and probably difficult for a man of his size and girth.
This unforced entry obviously has me baffled and very curious.

The side of the building where the door was had no windows. The back of the building had a patio & sliding glass door. She was on the second floor.

 

[borndem]

What made LE consider him a suspect? Interviews with his or her co-workers? That he went out for lunch on the same rare day that she did? Emails? Did she speak with her boss or the H/R dept about him? Did an apt resident or employee report someone riding or snooping around the complex and describe the driver, vehicle (license tag), etc.?? Was he their prime suspect from the get-go?

 

[realanastasia]

This was my first thought. If it didn't normally go home for lunch but got my period in the morning, i'd head home for lunch.

I don’t know if the alleged perp’s job responsibilities had anything at all to do with the company’s payroll, but I wonder if he told Carolyn that he needed her to bring in her passport or social security card to complete or update an I-9/W4 type form (for those not in the US, people starting new jobs are typically required to complete these forms verifying their identity and citizenship status). Although these are almost always completed at the start of a person’s employment, it’s plausible that they could get lost or misfiled and thus would require a current employee to fill them out again...Or if their agency has clients in other countries, I could envision a scenario where she might’ve been told to go home and grab her passport so an airline ticket (for work-related international travel) could be booked for her. It’s hard to imagine that any employee could really push back against such a request—if your client or your boss wants you to travel for work, and needs your passport information to make travel arrangements, then you’d likely dash home on your lunch break to grab it.
Total speculation on my part—just trying to figure out a reason that would both force her to change her daily lunchtime routine (which typically didn’t include going home) AND which might have provided the perp with an innocent-sounding excuse to be at her door (or inside the unit—I’m still not sure what the consensus is on the perp’s whereabouts immediately prior to the attack) when Carolyn arrived...

IMO/MOO

 

[bears10]

If he was indeed inside when she arrived, 1) she didn't (or forgot to) lock her door, 2) he used a tool or a credit card to get into her apt
If her door was locked, there probably wasn't a locked deadbolt lock on her door, i.e., poor design for a complex. I would insist on a deadbolt. A deadbolt would stop most people, but not all. There are ways to "copy" a deadbolt lock and make a key.
Was there a sliding glass door into her apt? Was it locked? With no secondary locking mechanism, it may have been easy for him to enter that way.
Did he find a window to enter? That would have been mighty "nervy" during daylight, and probably difficult for a man of his size and girth.
This unforced entry obviously has me baffled and very curious.

She may have had a deadbolt but didn’t lock it. My best friend and I never, ever, locked our top locks when we left the house, only while we were inside the apartment. When we left, we’d just turn the lock on the knob inside and shut the door. Then we got broken into and started locking the deadbolt when we left.

 

[bears10]

Sometimes (a lot of times IME) companies over inflate job titles. I wouldn’t be shocked if that was the case here too. Not putting anyone down at all, but I just don’t put much weight on job titles without an actual description of what the employee does. Job title =/= job role. Jmo

 

[acutename]

bbm
"already in her home," hmmm, interesting. I wonder how that was determined and who determined it. LE, I assume. Did he just use a credit card type thing to get into her apt? If so, everyone in that complex ought to raise hell to mgmt.
If he were in there waiting for her, it does make the most sense for the suspect -- he wouldn't have to hide somewhere and wait for her to show up; he wouldn't have to knock on the door and have her possibly not invite or let him in; he would be ready to attack if that was his plan. If she rebuffed his advances, etc., he would get the jump on her and have his weapon ready to use.
I'd like more info on this, but if it is a LE investigative tool of sorts, I doubt there will be any additional info.

maybe followed her into her apt, right behind her, but she would have been alarmed immediately. he would have had to arrive before her and hide near the stairs or somewhere. not familiar enough with the layout to imagine exactly where. the level of creepiness involved in this is extreme. wouldn't she also be immediately alarmed if she just found him in her apt? I wonder if she ever had a party and invited lots of coworkers (open house type thing) so he had been there legitimately at least once before?

 

[MissyMom]

Hopefully, we will find out additional information today as he is due back in court for his detention hearing.

 

[MissyMom]

I know some of the news stations have stated he was waiting for her inside her apartment, but I don’t see how that is possible unless he somehow had her key. There was no forced entry and it was in the middle of the day. I find it easier to believe he showed up at her apartment and she opened the door for him not knowing his intentions.

 

[Kittybunny]

Even without knowing the exact layout of her hallway, door, stairs, etc., it's not that hard to imagine that he could gotten there before her (which implies at a minimum a friendship in which he knew at least a bit in advance that she was going home for lunch that day) and lurked/hidden in a stairwell or around a corner until she got there and when she was getting her keys out or opening her door, he either pounced or snuck up behind her (perhaps with a knife in her back?) and forced her inside once the door was open.