NJ - Sarah Stern, 19, Neptune City, 2 Dec 2016 *Arrests* #2

[BunnyHop]

@Oller. It's been determined that it's LM in the search video.

After watching many of their videos, I can tell them apart.

 

[Veronica27]

My opinion only, but I believe that is LM and not his twin brother being interviewed in that video. I spent way too much time on the SixJigglyMoobs and LM's YouTube pages, analyzing LM: facial expressions, sound of voice, mannerisms. Now if I see a video of one of the M twins, or both of the M twins, I'm willing to bet a lot of money that I know who is who.

That "kisses" video is indeed an M sibling. You can hear LM call that sibling by name in the video. That sibling is also featured in a SixJigglyMoobs video that features LM, twin brother, and PT. (Twin brother is the one who is holding M sibling's hand, not LM.)

You know, it's none of my business, but I want to understand WHY LM and PT did what they have been accused of doing to SS. Why was LM so desperate for her money? I don't think we ever got an answer for that, and we probably never will, but I just don't get it.

I also agree that LM is a psychopath, rather than a sociopath. There is a pretty distinct difference between the two: Psychopaths are genetically predisposed to be that way. This is why personality disorders, as well as developmental disorders, used to be on their own axis (axis II) in the DSM-IV; they are incredibly hard to treat because simply put, they are a part of who the person is. Sociopaths almost always become that way based on their upbringing, and their life has usually been full of trauma. I'll make a generalization, but please note this is not the end-all, be-all for defining psychopaths versus sociopaths... Sociopaths learn to disassociate over time in order to protect themselves from their feelings, and psychopaths never had feelings to begin with. (Source: I'm a MICD therapist, currently pursing my doctorate degree in clinical psychology, and I reference my DSM-V more than any other book I own.)

How ironic that Liam was a Psychology major? Ugh


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[BunnyHop]

View attachment 110957

Is this the frame you were wanting Bunny? I grabbed what I could but I am not sure its clear enough to tell any details.

@V27, I'm referring to this pic. PT has jeans and dark jacket, to the right is LM with hoodie (looking at phone). Behind PT and the sign is someone in tan pants. Then to right of LM is another possible friend with dark jacket.

I watched it full screen. Maybe we can a shot that's more clear.

 

[Veronica27]

@V27, I'm referring to this pic. PT has jeans and dark jacket, to the right is LM with hoodie (looking at phone). Behind PT and the sign is someone in tan pants. Then to right of LM ia another possible friend with dark jacket.

I watched it full screen. Maybe we can a shot that's more clear.

I actually think it's the opposite. Preston did not speak in the video, the friend did (who I think is Sean, with jeans & dark jacket). I think Preston is behind the sign with tan pants. JMO


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[Swervinonthat]

<modsnip>

I have the same question. If it was just about money then what's with the "personal" act of strangulation? I don't buy money as the only motive here. If that was the case they could have robbed any neighbor's house.


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[inmyhumbleopinion]

We know Sarah came into an inheritance and so far it seems like that has been the motive ie money. I wonder if Mr. Stern was aware that she kept money in a safety deposit box because I don't think it's something a 19 yr old would commonly do.

What if that money belonged to LM and TP? LM (along with TP's knowledge) asked Sarah to hold that money for him so that it could not be tied to him in any way. Maybe they did not want to keep it in their apartment if at one time they (LM and TP) where low level dealers or it was stolen cash from a family business or somewhere/someone else. Sarah might've been kind enough to hold it for them as well as smart enough not to have that kind of money laying around so she got the security box.

If this could be a possible scenario, LM would have had no problem getting Sarah to go to the bank and get the cash. In fact it would make complete sense why they went together. Sadly she might've been the only witness to the boys having that money and that is why they killed her. They planned it all out to make it look like a robbery by having "their" money in her security box which would make that money untraceable to them and however they might've gotten it. I hope family, friends, places of work ect have checked their finances with a fine tooth comb.

JMO

The money belonging to LM and/or TP is definitely possible, IMO. I was actually wondering about this possibility yesterday (thus being kind of a pest trying to figure out why she would have such a large sum of money in a safe deposit box, rather than in a savings account, etc.; I never suspected Sarah was involved in something illegal herself), but couldn't come up with a reason as to why they would ask her to safe-keep it for them. I do get the impression, however, that the funds belonged to Sarah, given the fact that LM -at least for the time being- has been charged with robbery.

I think it is also possible that the money came from the fundraisers for Mrs. Stern and perhaps Mr. Stern and/or Sarah did not feel comfortable keeping donated money in an interest-bearing account, but why not at least in the form of a cashier's check? Or maybe they did (i.e., had a cashier's check made out to Sarah kept in a safe deposit box), and LM was somehow able to get Sarah to cash it at the bank. If LM was indeed able to talk Sarah into lend him money, I wonder just what kind of story he could have been telling her ... starting up a movie production company ?

LM seems like such a manipulative spin-doctor, I'm just having a very hard time with the supposed facts of this case, especially with regard to Sarah's location . I want her found so badly, not only for the sake of her loved ones -her poor dad, especially- , but for prosecutory purposes also. I feel strongly that these are very dangerous individuals, and if either one of them -LM, especially- were to be back on the streets ever again, they would re-offend. They just can't help themselves, unfortunately.

 

[Veronica27]

I thought that was PT, if not sure looks like him. Can you get a clear shot @00:18 of the four of them? You get great shots!

This is the best I can grab...

 

[Gardenista]

This is the best I can grab...

Interesting how they are standing apart from the group.

 

[Oller]

@Oller. It's been determined that it's LM in the search video.

After watching many of their videos, I can tell them apart.

Thank you, BunnyHop! Glad we know! Was that information in the sealed record information that was released yesterday? I admit that I only skimmed the documents!

 

[BunnyHop]

Thank you, BunnyHop! Glad we know! Was that information in the sealed record information that was released yesterday? I admit that I only skimmed the documents!

It's been posted in court.

 

[jellybean96]

Yep that's it. How did you upload? Maybe I can learn. :thinking:

I screenshot it, saved it as a jpeg in photoshop to my desktop. Then click ' go advanced' where you normally would click reply. At the bottom of that screen it says manage attachments. Insert the file there.

 

[ParentPerspective]

Hi. New poster here. I am deeply saddened by the loss of Sarah. I have been following your posts and your insights. I am grateful you have continued your conversations.

 

[spaz1959]

Welcome!

 

[spaz1959]

Do people think A.C. was in on it? Or was asked by LE for help?

 

[Greater Than]

Mod Note:

Sarah's family and friends are off limits to sleuthing.

The defendants' family and friends are off limits to sleuthing.

Comments on SM and under articles are off limits, as they are considered rumor.

No other suspects or POIs have been named, so please do not attempt to identify anyone (other than the two who have been arrested) who appear in photos or videos from the searches. Unless and until LE states otherwise, these are innocent people searching for Sarah.

Posts have been removed.

Failure to post in accordance with The Rules may result in the loss of posting privileges.

:tyou:

 

[Oller]

How ironic that Liam was a Psychology major? Ugh

I don't want to say that it's common for people with mental health conditions to study psychology or psychiatry, but it kind of is.

I apologize if this has already been discussed, but what was SS studying in school? She is a talented designer / artist. I saw a pair of shoes that she made design modifications to on her FB and thought she has natural artistic ability.

 

[Dolphin8]

The money belonging to LM and/or TP is definitely possible, IMO. I was actually wondering about this possibility yesterday (thus being kind of a pest trying to figure out why she would have such a large sum of money in a safe deposit box, rather than in a savings account, etc.; I never suspected Sarah was involved in something illegal herself), but couldn't come up with a reason as to why they would ask her to safe-keep it for them. I do get the impression, however, that the funds belonged to Sarah, given the fact that LM -at least for the time being- has been charged with robbery.

I think it is also possible that the money came from the fundraisers for Mrs. Stern and perhaps Mr. Stern and/or Sarah did not feel comfortable keeping donated money in an interest-bearing account, but why not at least in the form of a cashier's check? Or maybe they did (i.e., had a cashier's check made out to Sarah kept in a safe deposit box), and LM was somehow able to get Sarah to cash it at the bank. If LM was indeed able to talk Sarah into lend him money, I wonder just what kind of story he could have been telling her ... starting up a movie production company ?

LM seems like such a manipulative spin-doctor, I'm just having a very hard time with the supposed facts of this case, especially with regard to Sarah's location . I want her found so badly, not only for the sake of her loved ones -her poor dad, especially- , but for prosecutory purposes also. I feel strongly that these are very dangerous individuals, and if either one of them -LM, especially- were to be back on the streets ever again, they would re-offend. They just can't help themselves, unfortunately.

That's the tricky part of the theory I was trying to describe (and again, it's just a theory) LM would naturally be charged with robbery because that's exactly what it would look like because the money came from Sarah's safety security box, leaving only 3 people knowing the truth SS, LM, and PT as to whose money it was.

I agree with you, all of the supposed facts about this case are very hard to swallow and have bent my mind into a pretzel. But in no way am I suggesting Sarah played any willful part of anything illegal. If the boys did though, Sarah could've be an unknowing and innocent participant to something and that would give more credence to the motive behind the murder.

I know people have killed for a lot less and I know LM is a sociopath/psychopath. It's entirely possible it was a thrill kill but the facts of this case raise so many questions that it's hard not to speculate. It just seems like there's more. JMO.

 

[Dolphin8]

Hi. New poster here. I am deeply saddened by the loss of Sarah. I have been following your posts and your insights. I am grateful you have continued your conversations.

:Welcome1:

 

[Dolphin8]

My opinion only, but I believe that is LM and not his twin brother being interviewed in that video. I spent way too much time on the SixJigglyMoobs and LM's YouTube pages, analyzing LM: facial expressions, sound of voice, mannerisms. Now if I see a video of one of the M twins, or both of the M twins, I'm willing to bet a lot of money that I know who is who.

That "kisses" video is indeed an M sibling. You can hear LM call that sibling by name in the video. That sibling is also featured in a SixJigglyMoobs video that features LM, twin brother, and PT. (Twin brother is the one who is holding M sibling's hand, not LM.)

You know, it's none of my business, but I want to understand WHY LM and PT did what they have been accused of doing to SS. Why was LM so desperate for her money? I don't think we ever got an answer for that, and we probably never will, but I just don't get it.

I also agree that LM is a psychopath, rather than a sociopath. There is a pretty distinct difference between the two: Psychopaths are genetically predisposed to be that way. This is why personality disorders, as well as developmental disorders, used to be on their own axis (axis II) in the DSM-IV; they are incredibly hard to treat because simply put, they are a part of who the person is. Sociopaths almost always become that way based on their upbringing, and their life has usually been full of trauma. I'll make a generalization, but please note this is not the end-all, be-all for defining psychopaths versus sociopaths... Sociopaths learn to disassociate over time in order to protect themselves from their feelings, and psychopaths never had feelings to begin with. (Source: I'm a MICD therapist, currently pursing my doctorate degree in clinical psychology, and I reference my DSM-V more than any other book I own.)

I think we all want to understand why LM and PT did this to Sarah. LM and PT have a narrative for their actions from the get go and it raises more questions than it does answers. Even the defense atty said the confessions sound scripted which begs the question, why? Is there another aspect in all of this that hasn't come to light yet? Other players, other reasons, we don't even know for fact that LM was desperate for money.

I could continue to pick this apart until the sun comes up but one thing that has also bothered me, which you could probably relate to or add to with your studies, is the aspect of control. According to MSM this was a planned robbery and murder for six months. Why six months, were they just waiting for the right moment within that six month time frame or was it because they knew Sarah's plans and that she would be alone in the house in November, so it was more of a waiting game.

Was that money taken from someone or somewhere six months ago and the boys were waiting until things blew over to get it back (re the theory that Sarah might've been innocently holding for them) But back to the aspect of control, if they planned this all out so cunningly, why would they risk throwing her body into the river where it was more than realistically possible it could've been found the next day risking evidence and cause of death form the ME. There's a lack of control with that, so it doesn't fit to me. It seems more likely they would have buried her in an area that would be fairly close by in which they would have been able to retain control by being able to monitor the location of her body. Sadly though, if is was as they say, a few days after the murder we had about 3 or 4 days have heavy rain and wind with a huge surf. I figured then, that would've either swept her out to sea or pushed her further into Shark river.

As far as a true diagnosis, if there isn't already one in either of their medical records from anything relating to their past, to properly diagnosis sociopath or psychopath along with any other traits would take hours and hours of interviews with not just them but in this case family members as well. But ya know what.. it IS your business, it's ALL of our business. We're here because we want to support Mr. Stern, his family, all of Sarah's friends and most importantly justice for Sarah.

 

[Swervinonthat]

Sarah was studying art (I forget what type) and TV production. I saw that in an early article when this all first happened.

As for the money, her father would probably know if she had that much or not. At 19 without a full time job and with being a student, she wouldn't have had a steady income that he didn't know about. Think about it. She was driving her grandmothers car and it was old and beat up. If she had a steady income she probably would have bought something herself. And the rumors about her buying a used car are just tumors because in the interview her father gave at his home he said he didn't know what she was taking the money out for. (This was before LM and PT were arrested and she was still just missing).

Now as far as LM and PT go, I don't see them being desperate for money. They don't look unhealthy or like they are on drugs. If they are in serious drugs, they haven't been for a full 6 months when they started planning this. It's also safe to assume those two are not affording an apartment at the shore all on their own. Sorry but working at restaurants on the off season just won't cover it. Especially since they were both in school at the same time. I think the reason they needed the money is important to this case because as we have all said before, the storyline just leads to more questions and a lot doesn't add up. I know people have killed for a lot less, but not with premeditation and no real motive. IMO that's what is missing here.


Now one final point. I re watched the videos of LM and PT from the court cases last night and I would like some help from anyone on here that may have another opinion. If you just watch their faces as the prosecutor talks through the story of what supposedly happened. You can see parts where LM and PT have clear facial expression reactions to what she is saying. They also have eye movements that indicate recalling a memory vs thinking of a story. I'm interested in if anyone has more experience in "decoding" these expressions. In the first hearing with both LM and PT present, LM actually looks terrified to the point where it looks like he is trying to conceal hyperventilating. He's sweating, he's red, and he's looking straight at the ground where to me just analyzing his reaction, and even if you turn the volume off and just watch him, it looks like he's really trying not to have a freak out. But in the second video of LM in his detention hearing his body language is completely different. At one point he closed his eyes and looks depressed. At other points it looks to me like his disagrees with points of the story line that the prosecutor is saying. Almost like he wants to say something.

In on of PTs hearings he waved his attorney over and I shut the volume off to read his lips. It looks like he said "can I ask for an l...." And I couldn't make out the rest.

Thanks for any help or insights everyone!


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