NV NV - Steven Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - #22

[george14]

The conversation with the man on the street or at the wrong house (I'm not sure which it is) has never been verified by law enforcement, it came from a guy who was interested in this case and decided to go around the neighborhood himself years after Steven disappeared. Sorry, but I don't buy it, I've interacted with this guy a long time ago on Facebook and I don't believe him.

What is there not to buy? That someone in the neighborhood said Steven knocked on his door by accident, and asked if they needed money?

Seems like a silly thing to lie about. Steven was clearly in that neighborhood for a reason. You’ve made it clear you disagree with the pill delivering theory. I suggest you watch Arrin Stoner’s videos, he covered the case better than anyone. The work he did was fascinating and he even interview the roommate Steven lived with.

FYI, the realtor was cleared. Does that mean she 100% wasn’t involved? No, but they already examined her and she had an alibi. The other guy….not so much. He left town abruptly.

 

[Glovey]

The conversation with the man on the street or at the wrong house (I'm not sure which it is) has never been verified by law enforcement, it came from a guy who was interested in this case and decided to go around the neighborhood himself years after Steven disappeared. Sorry, but I don't buy it, I've interacted with this guy a long time ago on Facebook and I don't believe him.

I'm sorry to burst your bubble Moonbeam, but it has been verified by police on a body cam on Nov. 15, 2022, Steven and this neighbor had a very short conversation on the day Steven disappeared. This interview will be entered in the official police record. I was there and I witnessed it myself. My worry is police will not follow up on this new evidence. And you are right about someone, not a private investigator, being the first person to approach this neighbor much later. Can you share with me via private message who "this guy" you interacted with was?

 

[Ignorant_Bystander]

I'm sorry to burst your bubble Moonbeam, but it has been verified by police on a body cam on Nov. 15, 2022, Steven and this neighbor had a very short conversation on the day Steven disappeared. This interview will be entered in the official police record. I was there and I witnessed it myself. My worry is police will not follow up on this new evidence. And you are right about someone, not a private investigator, being the first person to approach this neighbor much later. Can you share with me via private message who "this guy" you interacted with was?

Many thanks Glovey for all your hard work

Its very unfortunate, and rather odd to me, that Steven (apparently) did not ask the homeowner on Savannah Springs his name that day, like "Hey, are you ____?" which would break the case wide open as now there would be a specific name of someone involved (without speculation I mean. I'm 100% sure its MD he was delivering to at 2260 Evening Lights, but this would provide concrete evidence). If I were delivering something (like a lot of money) to someone, I would at least make sure it's going to the correct person, unless he was just told "go to this address on Evening Lights and drop off the package with the guy that lives there". I might be jumping to conclusions, but this indicates to me there was only going to be one person at that house that day (on Evening Lights), and Steven was not told his name. Either that, or he did have instructions and a name written down and lost them, which doesnt seem likely, since he drove so far one would think he would be extra careful, but this might explain why he went to the wrong house at first

 

[BethAnn777]

Many thanks Glovey for all your hard work

Its very unfortunate, and rather odd to me, that Steven (apparently) did not ask the homeowner on Savannah Springs his name that day, like "Hey, are you ____?" which would break the case wide open as now there would be a specific name of someone involved (without speculation I mean. I'm 100% sure its MD he was delivering to at 2260 Evening Lights, but this would provide concrete evidence). If I were delivering something (like a lot of money) to someone, I would at least make sure it's going to the correct person, unless he was just told "go to this address on Evening Lights and drop off the package with the guy that lives there". I might be jumping to conclusions, but this indicates to me there was only going to be one person at that house that day (on Evening Lights), and Steven was not told his name. Either that, or he did have instructions and a name written down and lost them, which doesnt seem likely, since he drove so far one would think he would be extra careful, but this might explain why he went to the wrong house at first

Sorry if I am misunderstanding or forgetting something but isn’t this the last time Stephen was seen? How would anyone know what Stephen said to the guy if he was never seen again?

 

[lonewanderer]

So, the only new piece of information I see is this "conversation" he had with the fellow on the street asking if he wanted money. Odd that's never been mentioned before. But, I'm curious how this is what sealed his fate. What's the thinking here?

I really do wish that St. George would be more assertive in their investigation. I still strongly believe whatever happened to Steven started there.

Listening to TrailWentCold, Robin makes a suggestion.

Perhaps when SK went to the correct house, he mentioned how he accidentally stopped at the wrong one first. If SK didn't know he was wrapped up in illegal activity (or was just really naive due to his lifestyle) this could have infuriated the person recieving and it could have lead to his demise.

 

[lonewanderer]

Listening to TrailWentCold, Robin makes a suggestion.

Perhaps when SK went to the correct house, he mentioned how he accidentally stopped at the wrong one first. If SK didn't know he was wrapped up in illegal activity (or was just really naive due to his lifestyle) this could have infuriated the person recieving and it could have lead to his demise.

Yes, I realize I am replying to my own post, but I have a slightly different theory that is really similar to this one though.

In mine, SK still goes to the wrong house but that doesn't necessarily cause an issue for him. Its the item he's delivering that does.

It is believed that SK is carrying a folder or envelope type thing. In Robin's theory, SK is delivering (most likely) drugs. But what if it wasn't drugs? What if what he is carrying is something like enlarged photos? This was 2009 so its much more plausable.

In my theory, SK does not know what is in the package and his landlord sent him to deliver it. Landlord told him not to look inside so he didn't. SK assumes that it is just a normal delivery, but the person that opens the door invites SK in, not knowing who SK is. The pictures inside the envelope are blackmail material. Extra-maritial, driug exchanges, comprosing situations (just use your imagination). The person who this is delivered to goes absolutely ballistic "WHO ARE YOU AND HOW THE DID YOU GET THESE?????". SK is terrified and dealt with, hence the damage inside the house.

 

[Ignorant_Bystander]

<modsnip: discussing moderation>

Its very unfortunate and somewhat odd to me that Steven (apparently) did not ask the homeowner on Savannah Springs his name that day, like "Hey, are you ____?" This would have broken the case wide open as now there would be a specific name of someone involved, though I believe 100% that MD at 2260 Evening Lights was responsible for his murder, but this would have removed all speculation. If I were to deliver something important as a lot of money, I would at least make sure the right person was receiving it. He could have just been told "drop this off at the guy that lives at 2260 Evening Lights" and wasn't told his name. This leads me to believe no one else was going to be at that residence that day. maybe he did have his name and address written down but misplaced it before he got there, which is unlikely, considering how far he drove that day, one would think he would be extra careful not to lose it..but that might explain why he went to the wrong house at first

 

[PommyMommy]

DEC 19, 2022

Last-known person to see missing man alive details odd conversation moments before he vanished from Las Vegas-area neighborhood

Last-known person to see Steven Koecher alive in Las Vegas-area neighborhood details odd conversation moments before he vanished. “I can’t forget that,” the person believed to be among the la…

www.8newsnow.com

[...]

Between 11:54 a.m. and noon, Koecher spoke to the neighbor who, for the first time, is publicly speaking about that conversation. The neighbor requested the 8 News Now Investigators conceal their identity as suspects in Koecher’s disappearance and presumed death have not been identified nor arrested.

“I need money,” is what the neighbor remembers Koecher saying to them after they opened the door.

As the 8 News Now Investigators reported last month, Koecher was 3 months, or $1,500, behind in rent at the time of his disappearance, records said. Money from his family, meant to help pay the rent, went undeposited, records showed.

In the days before his disappearance, financial statements put Koecher in St. George; then Washington, Utah; then Mesquite, Overton and finally the Las Vegas valley.

On the day of his disappearance, records show Koecher was in the Las Vegas valley for several hours before ultimately parking his car at the end of Savannah Springs Avenue and walking toward his destination, which is unknown.

“I didn’t see him coming out from the car,” the neighbor said.

In those six minutes between the time Koecher parked his car and he appears on video walking out of view, he rang the neighbor’s doorbell. By the time the neighbor got to the door, Steven was walking on the other side of the street.

“I need money,” the neighbor said he remembered Koecher saying. “There’s no walkway on the other side, but he is walking on the side that doesn’t have the walkway. I just shut the door and that’s the last that I saw him.”

[...]

 

[laytonian]

DEC 19, 2022

Last-known person to see missing man alive details odd conversation moments before he vanished from Las Vegas-area neighborhood

Last-known person to see Steven Koecher alive in Las Vegas-area neighborhood details odd conversation moments before he vanished. “I can’t forget that,” the person believed to be among the la…

www.8newsnow.com

[...]

Between 11:54 a.m. and noon, Koecher spoke to the neighbor who, for the first time, is publicly speaking about that conversation. The neighbor requested the 8 News Now Investigators conceal their identity as suspects in Koecher’s disappearance and presumed death have not been identified nor arrested.

“I need money,” is what the neighbor remembers Koecher saying to them after they opened the door.

As the 8 News Now Investigators reported last month, Koecher was 3 months, or $1,500, behind in rent at the time of his disappearance, records said. Money from his family, meant to help pay the rent, went undeposited, records showed.

In the days before his disappearance, financial statements put Koecher in St. George; then Washington, Utah; then Mesquite, Overton and finally the Las Vegas valley.

On the day of his disappearance, records show Koecher was in the Las Vegas valley for several hours before ultimately parking his car at the end of Savannah Springs Avenue and walking toward his destination, which is unknown.

“I didn’t see him coming out from the car,” the neighbor said.

In those six minutes between the time Koecher parked his car and he appears on video walking out of view, he rang the neighbor’s doorbell. By the time the neighbor got to the door, Steven was walking on the other side of the street.

“I need money,” the neighbor said he remembered Koecher saying. “There’s no walkway on the other side, but he is walking on the side that doesn’t have the walkway. I just shut the door and that’s the last that I saw him.”

[...]

Something seems "offi

DEC 19, 2022

Last-known person to see missing man alive details odd conversation moments before he vanished from Las Vegas-area neighborhood

Last-known person to see Steven Koecher alive in Las Vegas-area neighborhood details odd conversation moments before he vanished. “I can’t forget that,” the person believed to be among the la…

www.8newsnow.com

[...]

Between 11:54 a.m. and noon, Koecher spoke to the neighbor who, for the first time, is publicly speaking about that conversation. The neighbor requested the 8 News Now Investigators conceal their identity as suspects in Koecher’s disappearance and presumed death have not been identified nor arrested.

“I need money,” is what the neighbor remembers Koecher saying to them after they opened the door.

As the 8 News Now Investigators reported last month, Koecher was 3 months, or $1,500, behind in rent at the time of his disappearance, records said. Money from his family, meant to help pay the rent, went undeposited, records showed.

In the days before his disappearance, financial statements put Koecher in St. George; then Washington, Utah; then Mesquite, Overton and finally the Las Vegas valley.

On the day of his disappearance, records show Koecher was in the Las Vegas valley for several hours before ultimately parking his car at the end of Savannah Springs Avenue and walking toward his destination, which is unknown.

“I didn’t see him coming out from the car,” the neighbor said.

In those six minutes between the time Koecher parked his car and he appears on video walking out of view, he rang the neighbor’s doorbell. By the time the neighbor got to the door, Steven was walking on the other side of the street.

“I need money,” the neighbor said he remembered Koecher saying. “There’s no walkway on the other side, but he is walking on the side that doesn’t have the walkway. I just shut the door and that’s the last that I saw him.”

[...]

I do not believe this.
Why?
Because Steven's brother and father Rolf knocked on the doors in that neighborhood, asking for help. This was never mentioned by them NOR did this "witness" mention talking to them.

ALSO. We've all seen the videos. He doesn't walk from across the street. He's walking straight down SS from the car, asking the sidewalk toward EL

 

[Ignorant_Bystander]

This isn't making sense at all.

So <modsnip> the resident on Savannah Springs said Steven asked him "Do you need money?" and they had a brief conversation. Now, this year when he was interviewed again, he said Steven was already across the road when he opened the door and heard him say (to himself out loud apparently) "I need money". Well, which is it?

Given the amount of time that's passed, I don't think he remembers the details accurately. Also wondering how this was not discovered when the Koechers and the police investigated the neighbors in 2009

"We've all seen the videos. He doesn't walk from across the street." He (and his car) are off camera for 6 minutes after parking his car. He could have easily left his car, walked across the road to the second last house on Savannah and then walked directly back to where his car was, and then walked straight toward Evening lights

 

[jinger]

The thing is, if he was killed in one of the houses, why wouldn’t the perp move his car ? Dump it somewhere? Then he likely never would have been tied to that neighborhood

 

[lonewanderer]

The thing is, if he was killed in one of the houses, why wouldn’t the perp move his car ? Dump it somewhere? Then he likely never would have been tied to that neighborhood

If Steven and the perp did not know each other, then he would have had no idea what kind of car Steven drove.

If the keys were in Stevens pocket and the perp noticed it, that seems like a really risky move to aimlessly wonder through the neighborhood searching for Steven's car, plus, the perp would have been recognizable in the neighborhood when searching for it and driving away in it.

I don't think they knew each other previously and I think Steven was set up, either on purpose of accidentally.

 

[lonewanderer]

This isn't making sense at all.

So <modsnip> the resident on Savannah Springs said Steven asked him "Do you need money?" and they had a brief conversation. Now, this year when he was interviewed again, he said Steven was already across the road when he opened the door and heard him say (to himself out loud apparently) "I need money". Well, which is it?

Given the amount of time that's passed, I don't think he remembers the details accurately. Also wondering how this was not discovered when the Koechers and the police investigated the neighbors in 2009

"We've all seen the videos. He doesn't walk from across the street." He (and his car) are off camera for 6 minutes after parking his car. He could have easily left his car, walked across the road to the second last house on Savannah and then walked directly back to where his car was, and then walked straight toward Evening lights

I had also heard that Steven had asked "Do you need (some) money?"

But what if he had said "need some money" and it was up for interpretation?

So "need some money" as a statement is pronounced in a different cadence than "need some money" as a question. Both of them have polar opposite meanings. One being a proclamation that the person needs money, the other being a question for the other person if they are in need of some money.

 

[Ignorant_Bystander]

Anyone else think this picture of the damaged doors at the casita look like someone's head was bashed into them?

Unfortunately no luminol or dna testing was done from what i know. Its going to take a miracle for this case to finally reach a resolution..its been since September 2021 since the last episode of Eyeson Justice, where it was announced the landlord was interviewed for 3 hours. Can understand why its taking so long to put up the episode.. i realize a lot of editing is needed for a podcast, but wow

 

[buyerninety]

@Ignorant_Bystander​

What's the source of the photograph of the casita
(I assume that's MD's casita)? I understood that MD's
parents owned that property (don't they still?), so how/
when was a photograph of the inside of it obtained?

 

[Ignorant_Bystander]

@Ignorant_Bystander​

What's the source of the photograph of the casita
(I assume that's MD's casita)? I understood that MD's
parents owned that property (don't they still?), so how/
when was a photograph of the inside of it obtaine

I believe it was taken by a private investigator after MD moved out, late 2009, early 2010 possibly. i think its mentioned on one of the Eyeson Justice episodes

 

[Glovey]

@Ignorant_Bystander​

What's the source of the photograph of the casita
(I assume that's MD's casita)? I understood that MD's
parents owned that property (don't they still?), so how/
when was a photograph of the inside of it obtained?

Indeed, it is the Casita MD lived in. We have very good reason(s) to believe MD trashed the Casita himself. The photos were given to investigators by the then current owner. A request was made to, and denied by, the then current owner of the property, to allow a cadaver dog to go over the property. Their reasoning is selfish. We believe the possibility exists; SK is buried there. That property should at least be ruled out as such, and I believe the owner should step up in the name of Justice and the Koecher family. We've tried to make further contact with the owner to no avail.

 

[Glovey]

Anyone else think this picture of the damaged doors at the casita look like someone's head was bashed into them?

Unfortunately no luminol or dna testing was done from what i know. Its going to take a miracle for this case to finally reach a resolution..its been since September 2021 since the last episode of Eyeson Justice, where it was announced the landlord was interviewed for 3 hours. Can understand why its taking so long to put up the episode.. i realize a lot of editing is needed for a podcast, but wow

Yes, the landlord has been interviewed at least twice. It is highly unlikely another podcast will be made. I am aware of a book, currently being self-published, containing everything that is known about this case, and many things that have remained unknown about the case, until now.

 

[Baddux]

Yes, the landlord has been interviewed at least twice. It is highly unlikely another podcast will be made. I am aware of a book, currently being self-published, containing everything that is known about this case, and many things that have remained unknown about the case, until now.

While I understand and empathize with the desire to find answers in Steven's case, we must ensure that all investigative actions respect individuals' rights and adhere to legal procedures. It is encouraging to note that investigators have taken your information seriously and likely have it at their disposal. Should new evidence emerge that establishes the legal grounds for a search, they can then consider deploying resources like cadaver dogs. In the meantime, it's essential to respect the rights of property owners and avoid drawing conclusions without substantial evidence.

I noted your mention of a forthcoming book about Steven's case, which is said to contain previously unknown information. While I appreciate the effort to shed light on this case, I hope that all steps have been taken to ensure that this new information does not inadvertently hinder ongoing investigations or provide potential perpetrators with information that could help them evade detection. It's crucial that any new information first be shared with law enforcement, and that its public release be coordinated in a manner that respects ongoing investigative efforts. Transparency is important, but so too is ensuring the integrity of the investigation.

I also noticed the involvement of George Knapp in this case. While Mr. Knapp's work has certainly been significant in other areas, it's important to remember that the investigation of a missing person case requires a different approach than other subjects he might be more familiar with, such as UFO phenomena. It's crucial to ensure that any speculation or unverified claims do not detract from or compromise the ongoing efforts of law enforcement to solve this case. So while it's valuable to bring attention to Steven's disappearance, let's also remember the importance of maintaining the integrity of the investigation, respecting the rights of individuals involved, and working in harmony with law enforcement.

 

[Glovey]

While I understand and empathize with the desire to find answers in Steven's case, we must ensure that all investigative actions respect individuals' rights and adhere to legal procedures. It is encouraging to note that investigators have taken your information seriously and likely have it at their disposal. Should new evidence emerge that establishes the legal grounds for a search, they can then consider deploying resources like cadaver dogs. In the meantime, it's essential to respect the rights of property owners and avoid drawing conclusions without substantial evidence.

I noted your mention of a forthcoming book about Steven's case, which is said to contain previously unknown information. While I appreciate the effort to shed light on this case, I hope that all steps have been taken to ensure that this new information does not inadvertently hinder ongoing investigations or provide potential perpetrators with information that could help them evade detection. It's crucial that any new information first be shared with law enforcement, and that its public release be coordinated in a manner that respects ongoing investigative efforts. Transparency is important, but so too is ensuring the integrity of the investigation.

I also noticed the involvement of George Knapp in this case. While Mr. Knapp's work has certainly been significant in other areas, it's important to remember that the investigation of a missing person case requires a different approach than other subjects he might be more familiar with, such as UFO phenomena. It's crucial to ensure that any speculation or unverified claims do not detract from or compromise the ongoing efforts of law enforcement to solve this case. So while it's valuable to bring attention to Steven's disappearance, let's also remember the importance of maintaining the integrity of the investigation, respecting the rights of individuals involved, and working in harmony with law enforcement.

As someone who has followed this case for some time, I am very appreciative of any feedback surrounding it. And I consider myself a constitutionalist regarding rights and proper procedures too. However, if, just if, a potential homicide had occurred on your property, or my property, to which we certainly were not the offender, and considering ourselves to be on the side of justice, do we not have a civic duty to help investigators, who only seek to assist law enforcement anyway? As you may be aware, cold cases have been solved with the help of private investigators.

You mention your appreciation of efforts to shed more light on this case, but that it may hinder an “ongoing investigation.” In a cold case such as this, an ongoing investigation isn't taking place, or the jurisdictions involved would not have released police reports via FOIA requests. Experience tells me thus far, HPD is not pursuing this case. I could be wrong though. And any integrity in it has waned, unless of course you know something I don't. In addition, it is apparent, isn't it, the perpetrator most certainly has already evaded capture and subsequent prosecution so far? In other words, the perpetrator has gotten away with murder. Unless you believe Steven is not dead.

Regarding Mr. Knapp, the only involvement Mr. Knapp had in this case, was his willingness to help get this story on the air, again. His credentials speak for him by themself. Once more, you speak of an “ongoing investigation” as if there is one. You fear speculation, and unverified claims, may distract from, or compromise it. Can you verify for all of us here there is an “ongoing investigation?” Your concern for integrity in the case is valid, but untimely. One only has to recall how this investigation was handled from the beginning, almost 14 years ago. A rather disharmonic investigation if you ask me. I have first-hand knowledge that the actual investigation was delayed for two weeks. Recall, it was very near the Christmas holiday. To conclude, I stand ready and willing to entertain an audience of law enforcement personnel to discuss this case. My question is, are they?