NV NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - #20

[believe09]

Holly, I am not seeing this reference:

Lady LEO;6462043]In SK's church speech, he states, "My brother drowning."

Did SK have a brother that drowned?

If so, when did this happen, how old was SK when it happened, what were the circumstances, was the brother younger or older and by how much?

there has been a lot of long thoughtful posts recently, so I would appreciate the reference to the post number. Many thanks.

 

[believe09]

:truce:


OK, I think we need a truce here. We are all on the same side-we all want Steven to be found. Yes, differing opinions are welcome here, but dont expect your thoughts and ideas to be unchallenged.

Please, let's challenge one another respectfully. If you see a post that you believe to be outside of TOS, please alert it with the red triangle button in the top right corner and move on. Dont quote it, dont reply to it. It creates more work for the moderators if you do.

Please link to your information whenever possible. Please quote the post you are referencing. The quote button is in the bottom right corner of the post you want to respond to.

There is a tremendous amount of work that has been done, so if you are newer it is possible that your idea or belief regarding what you read or saw may be corrected, respectfully, by someone who has been here from the beginning. Please dont take it personally.

If you have questions, PM whatever moderator you are comfortable with.

:grouphug:

 

[hollyblue]

Holly, I am not seeing this reference:

Lady LEO;6462043]In SK's church speech, he states, "My brother drowning."

Did SK have a brother that drowned?

If so, when did this happen, how old was SK when it happened, what were the circumstances, was the brother younger or older and by how much?

there has been a lot of long thoughtful posts recently, so I would appreciate the reference to the post number. Many thanks.

Posts on this thread of 556 and 557. I had trouble with the quotes when posting and had to edit to fix.

 

[believe09]

In SK's church speech, he states, "My brother drowning."

Did SK have a brother that drowned?

If so, when did this happen, how old was SK when it happened, what were the circumstances, was the brother younger or older and by how much?

(Thank you Holly)

Do you have a link to this speech? I dont think I have heard it, but I am not as plugged in as the rest here.

 

[Lady LEO]

I knew Webrocket was a man (insert smiley here, because I can't figure out how to put the silly thing on here!) What this tells me is that my insight into how men and women view things and express themselves is much better than my sleuthing skills. I still haven't figured out what this elephant's name is (I think I'm on the right track -who, not what?!) Argh...

Here is a thought, though: After reading the several posts above about the various things that the Koecher's have said after SK's disappearance, one little fact does stand out and it's something I noticed in the beginning. Often when people go missing family members and friends will say "so and so would NEVER just disappear. They simply would not do so. So and so would NEVER commit suicide." I've heard these kinds of categorical statements many, many times regarding missing people, and that's what often convinces LE to look into the possibility of foul play.

However, that's not at all what the Koecher's and SK's friends have said. They may have said that they don't think he would just up and walk away or commit suicide, but they've never, that I can remember, been categorical about it. Just a thought.

Outstanding observation! Investigations look at what is there, but also it is just as important to evaluate what isn't there! :clap:

 

[Fairy1]

(Thank you Holly)

Do you have a link to this speech? I dont think I have heard it, but I am not as plugged in as the rest here.

Actually, I've never heard it either. I'd be very interested to know where this speech can be heard.

 

[SheWhoMustNotBeNamed]

Now might be a good time for some to review our TOS. Thanks.
Rules Etiquette & Information - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community



Inviting outside contact or alluding to "private" additional information:

“Inviting” is termed as a post where you invite other members to contact you to find out more information, rather than post it in the forum. This is not allowed and any posts with emails or invitations to contact for more information will either be edited or deleted entirely. This includes use of the Private Message system via comments such as “Check your PMs” or “PM me” posted in discussion threads. Think about it - it's like whispering into someone's ear while you are at a table full of other people. If you want to have a private conversation just have it, don't announce it. Additionally,please don't drop hints or post on the board that you know something or are privy to inside information but you won't or can't post it.
If you can't post it, don't.


Baiting /Trolling / Inciting Conflict:

&#8220;Trolling&#8221; or making posts with the intention of creating problems on the forums is obviously against the forum guidelines. <snip> We have zero tolerance for members that create posts with the sole purpose of antagonizing other members.

 

[Mia]

I wasnt being snarky, Lato-you know I respect you so I apologize if my post wasnt well written.

I dont know about the scar, but it is a valid question. Head trauma, even from childhood, can affect people and their behaviors.

FWIW I was a HUGE fan of the schizophrenia angle early on because of a case I had just worked on in the months prior. SK reminded me, superficially, of the missing man. But my missing man was much much younger. And, you could see in the series of photos of him from teens to early 20's the lights going off in his eyes. And, his behaviour had noticibly undeniably changed...although not enough to cause an intervention.

He was located, deceased, after stuffing himself up a drain pipe completely naked. Fairy worked on his threads too-she knows how emeshed I became in that theory here!

Hi guys! Even though I don't post here much anymore I'm still following along!

Believe are you speaking of Jody King? I think he was 28 years old versus Steven's 30, so I wouldn't say that's much much younger. Also, was he schizophrenic? I know he suffered from a chronic addiction to hard drugs, which I think was the reason for his deterioration and odd behavior over the years; also, a bad reaction to drugs he had bought that night caused him to enter the drain pipe.

Thanks for bringing that up. Such a sad case, I remember his poor wife searching day and night for him for a long time before he was found.

Ok back to Steven.

 

[SassyBenton]

:truce:


OK, I think we need a truce here. We are all on the same side-we all want Steven to be found. Yes, differing opinions are welcome here, but dont expect your thoughts and ideas to be unchallenged.

Please, let's challenge one another respectfully. If you see a post that you believe to be outside of TOS, please alert it with the red triangle button in the top right corner and move on. Dont quote it, dont reply to it. It creates more work for the moderators if you do.

Please link to your information whenever possible. Please quote the post you are referencing. The quote button is in the bottom right corner of the post you want to respond to.

There is a tremendous amount of work that has been done, so if you are newer it is possible that your idea or belief regarding what you read or saw may be corrected, respectfully, by someone who has been here from the beginning. Please dont take it personally.

If you have questions, PM whatever moderator you are comfortable with.

:grouphug:

Thank you for posting this!!

It is a little off putting when people on here consider themselves an “expert” or the “go-to” person on this case and are quick to tell you your theories are wrong. If someone knew everything about this case, wouldn’t this mystery be solved by now? I have a lot of respect for the people who have gone to great lengths to study this case, but how about giving other people a chance before you just tell them they are wrong?

 

[laytonian]

Actually, I've never heard it either. I'd be very interested to know where this speech can be heard.

Me, too.

I checked with Steven's cousin KC. Here are her exact words:

"When they were younger one of the Koecher boys was drowning and the other saved him. I don't remember the specifics of the story, but I do remember hearing it. I think I remember seeing a news article about it too. "My brother's keeper" something like that... "

KC doesn't have a copy of the speech. Apparently, only Mrs Koecher does (this would be the speech found in Steven's book).

 

[sophieness]

Me, too.

I checked with Steven's cousin KC. Here are her exact words:

"When they were younger one of the Koecher boys was drowning and the other saved him. I don't remember the specifics of the story, but I do remember hearing it. I think I remember seeing a news article about it too. "My brother's keeper" something like that... "

KC doesn't have a copy of the speech. Apparently, only Mrs Koecher does (this would be the speech found in Steven's book).

There is a still of part of a page of it on the ID show. Maybe if one was to go through and pause it parts could be read. The only part that stood out to me was the drowning bit as well, seeing it quickly. The family was referencing it bc they said it was a speech that had to do with how much he loved his family and considered home a peaceful place, and they saw it as one sign he would not disappear from them forever of his own volition. I think he read this in a religious service just a week before he disappeared.

__________________

did steven know his landlords were going to be coming to the house on the 14th? considering she said she only saw him once or twice prior to that, it seems like a coincidence he disappeared exactly one day before they were there. he was obviously avoiding their phone calls, maybe they mentioned it in a message? changing the locks would be illegal w/o a formal eviction I believe, but maybe they implied they were going to start that process? it seems like if steven really had a plan to pay them back by jan and both sides understood this, they would not be calling so much. they obviously did not feel satisfied with that or did not believe it? not that I blame them...

 

[hollyblue]

sophieness;6466973]There is a still of part of a page of it on the ID show. Maybe if one was to go through and pause it parts could be read. The only part that stood out to me was the drowning bit as well, seeing it quickly. The family was referencing it bc they said it was a speech that had to do with how much he loved his family and considered home a peaceful place, and they saw it as one sign he would not disappear from them forever of his own volition. I think he read this in a religious service just a week before he disappeared.

__________________

did steven know his landlords were going to be coming to the house on the 14th? considering she said she only saw him once or twice prior to that, it seems like a coincidence he disappeared exactly one day before they were there. he was obviously avoiding their phone calls, maybe they mentioned it in a message? changing the locks would be illegal w/o a formal eviction I believe, but maybe they implied they were going to start that process? it seems like if steven really had a plan to pay them back by jan and both sides understood this, they would not be calling so much. they obviously did not feel satisfied with that or did not believe it? not that I blame them.....

BBM

Exactly. They wouldn't have called his parents if the alleged deal they had was working. ...theoretically. I tend to believe she talked to SK and the other roomy often, as she and her family kept the master bedroom locked and would use it when they were in the area. She stated that SK would always answer his phone prior to the end of Nov.

The landlord's hat here was StillLooking if you want to search her posts.

 

[laytonian]

Thank you for posting this!!

It is a little off putting when people on here consider themselves an &#8220;expert&#8221; or the &#8220;go-to&#8221; person on this case and are quick to tell you your theories are wrong. If someone knew everything about this case, wouldn&#8217;t this mystery be solved by now? I have a lot of respect for the people who have gone to great lengths to study this case, but how about giving other people a chance before you just tell them they are wrong?

I know!
That happens to me a lot here. It happens to everyone.
Thanks for mentioning it.
We're here to help find Steven, and that's pretty important.

Do we take everything as a purposeful insult, or consider that someone's trying to add information to the mix?

How would you suggest handling a post that has two pieces of false information in it, that could easily have been checked before posting?

If it's challenged, the person gets angry and believes they were attacked.
If it's not challenged, the other readers will believe it.

I've seen no one check into it here, nor mention the errors.

:banghead:

 

[believe09]

Hi guys! Even though I don't post here much anymore I'm still following along!

Believe are you speaking of Jody King? I think he was 28 years old versus Steven's 30, so I wouldn't say that's much much younger. Also, was he schizophrenic? I know he suffered from a chronic addiction to hard drugs, which I think was the reason for his deterioration and odd behavior over the years; also, a bad reaction to drugs he had bought that night caused him to enter the drain pipe.

Thanks for bringing that up. Such a sad case, I remember his poor wife searching day and night for him for a long time before he was found.

Ok back to Steven.

Hi, Mia-you are correct and I am wrong. I remembered Jody being 23. Sorry for the confusion. Yes, I think Jody was schizophrenic and I think he showed classic signs early on. Things were harder and harder for him to maintain-his reaction to the drug he was alleged to have consumed was just a symptom. With or without drugs, Jody was volatile. He is at peace now, I think in a way he hadnt been for a while in life.

 

[believe09]

You make good points sophieness. TY.

 

[cocomod]

Hi, Mia-you are correct and I am wrong. I remembered Jody being 23. Sorry for the confusion. Yes, I think Jody was schizophrenic and I think he showed classic signs early on. Things were harder and harder for him to maintain-his reaction to the drug he was alleged to have consumed was just a symptom. With or without drugs, Jody was volatile. He is at peace now, I think in a way he hadnt been for a while in life.

People with mental conditions - even depression or ADD - will take illegal drugs to treat themselves. These illegal drugs can and do often make their conditions worse. RIP Jody.

 

[sophieness]

I know!
That happens to me a lot here. It happens to everyone.
Thanks for mentioning it.
We're here to help find Steven, and that's pretty important.

Do we take everything as a purposeful insult, or consider that someone's trying to add information to the mix?

How would you suggest handling a post that has two pieces of false information in it, that could easily have been checked before posting?

If it's challenged, the person gets angry and believes they were attacked.
If it's not challenged, the other readers will believe it.

I've seen no one check into it here, nor mention the errors.

:banghead:

I guess just come out and say it? people do take things personally sometimes but they will get over it. the only times I get into trouble are when I have a "tone" to my post or people perceive that I do. I am working on sounding more neutral and I think it is working lol. also some things seem like they would be easy to look up but with 20 threads and thousands and thousands of posts and it is soooo easy to miss something or take a long time to catch up. I think when I first started posting I just felt like I was expected to know everything already and I still don't! trust me, your information *is* helpful, esp the timeline etc but it can be hard at first when you have questions. also sometimes people have read bits of info given out but they still question how thoroughly something was checked, or they just see it differently?? like phone records etc being checked, stuff can always be missed so even though I know they were checked, I find it hard to believe there are not some major clues there.

 

[believe09]

People with mental conditions - even depression or ADD - will take illegal drugs to treat themselves. These illegal drugs can and do often make their conditions worse. RIP Jody.

What kind words-not to hijack the thread.

 

[believe09]

I guess just come out and say it? people do take things personally sometimes but they will get over it. the only times I get into trouble are when I have a "tone" to my post or people perceive that I do. I am working on sounding more neutral and I think it is working lol. also some things seem like they would be easy to look up but with 20 threads and thousands and thousands of posts and it is soooo easy to miss something or take a long time to catch up. I think when I first started posting I just felt like I was expected to know everything already and I still don't! trust me, your information *is* helpful, esp the timeline etc but it can be hard at first when you have questions. also sometimes people have read bits of info given out but they still question how thoroughly something was checked, or they just see it differently?? like phone records etc being checked, stuff can always be missed so even though I know they were checked, I find it hard to believe there are not some major clues there.

BBM. It seems counter-intuitive right? But there dont seem to be any major clues whatsoever. I am also a fan of the "bat phone" theory IE disposable cell phone where Steven's actual plans and calls might have been communicated.

Now, we did find out he used the library computers, which *appear* not to have been checked for his activity. Forgive the astericks-it is because I am not 100% sure

 

[laytonian]

I guess just come out and say it? people do take things personally sometimes but they will get over it. the only times I get into trouble are when I have a "tone" to my post or people perceive that I do. I am working on sounding more neutral and I think it is working lol. also some things seem like they would be easy to look up but with 20 threads and thousands and thousands of posts and it is soooo easy to miss something or take a long time to catch up. I think when I first started posting I just felt like I was expected to know everything already and I still don't! trust me, your information *is* helpful, esp the timeline etc but it can be hard at first when you have questions. also sometimes people have read bits of info given out but they still question how thoroughly something was checked, or they just see it differently?? like phone records etc being checked, stuff can always be missed so even though I know they were checked, I find it hard to believe there are not some major clues there.

I understand. I'm frustrated, too.

But I think we have to trust that a thorough job was done, when the records were searched. We'll never have access to those records. We'll never have access to the computer, nor his emails.

As the general public, have no "need to know" nor a justification outside of our wanting to help. And our curiosity.

What we can do, is delve into whats publicly available. We know where he lived. We know who he worked for. We've seen the FB page for his ward, so "see" his friends. We really have lots of information.

...and if we see links, we can call in tips, contact the PI (he is still working the case, per KC), and do what we can to make our information worthy of investigation.