GUILTY NV - Tammy Meyers, 44, fatally shot at her Las Vegas home, 12 Feb 2015 - #6

[RANCH]

We agree, lol!! Exactly, It is what LE presented to GJ to get an indictment. LVDA is trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. That is why we are all complaining. Can't change the story once AGAIN to convict 2 people. Charge the Meyers too for carrying a gun and on a stupid chase instead of staying home. Whats good for one or two should be good for all involved!

I understand what your saying but the District Attorney has to believe that he could get a conviction when charging someone with a crime. Charging and convicting Brandon with some kind of weapons charge when his mom was murdered in the same incident may be considered unwinnable by the DA and that's why there have been no charges.

JMO

 

[RANCH]

I had edited it to include the information because, I too was confused about full metal jacket, so DH went and got a bunch of bullets and demonstrated.

Its a full metal jacket or a hollow point on the market.

Incidentally, full metal jackets are what are supposed to be used in warfare in the geneva convention because they cause the least amount of damage. They can, however,go in and out a person and hit someone behind that person.

Full metal jackets are good for target practice because they make a nice clean hole so you can see where your bullet went.

The hollow point is what is used more for personal protection. They cause more damage and the energy is dispersed within the one body so the tend not to hit bystanders. But the person they hit gets messed up bad.

BBM

In general terms a full metal jacket bullet will leave a similar "hole" in a paper target that a hollow point bullet will. A wadcutter or semi-wadcutter bullet will leave a nice circular "hole" in a paper target that is easy to see.

JMO

 

[jjenny]

I understand what your saying but the District Attorney has to believe that he could get a conviction when charging someone with a crime. Charging and convicting Brandon with some kind of weapons charge when his mom was murdered in the same incident may be considered unwinnable by the DA and that's why there have been no charges.

JMO

And why would DA want to charge one of the main witnesses anyway? DAs have a wide discretion on whether to charge someone or not. And in this particular case, evidence suggests that BM didn't shoot at the first scene, and tried to run away at the second scene. EN admits he was shooting at someone running away because he didn't want that person to get away. So given these circumstances, it would make no sense to charge BM.

 

[SStarr33]

I've missed WS and you guys are the best at sleuthing, which I enjoy! I am also grateful they still have the ignore button. :happydance:

Ignore is beautiful.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

BBM. KM seeing the road rager drive by their street (after they had "escaped" from the alleged road rager) was in the arrest affidavit as well as in numerous media reports.

But it wasn't in KM's GJ testimony.

I think the bit about KM seeing the car again near their house is another example of how KM's story mirrors & matches BM's story. After TM & KM got home, KM saw the silver car coming south on Carmel Park. After TM & BM got home, BM saw the silver car coming north on Carmel Peak.

Some things just are not making sense. As far as I know the Buick through all this remained unscratched and it sounded like Mogg testified that the Buick was unscratched, yet the one place where EN thought he hit someone was in the car. I've looked at pictures of the car and they show the car parked at an angle (not straight, though I understand how it could have been moved) and more importantly there are no bullet holes in any of the windows and this was secret GJ sworn testimony so Mogg couldn't lie about the condition of the car if they had removed a window for evidence and replaced it with a new one). Per KM's testimony it sounds like she's saying that EN told her that someone was able to run into the house while EN also saw another person running as well as people in the car. With Mogg's testimony of EN's confession it also says he saw heads in the car as well as at least one person running and also EN says when he arrived the driver's side door was already open. I'm just not seeing how based on EN's confessions that the events he described could have only been done by two people and it sounds like he was mistaken in thinking he shot a passenger in the car when it was really one of the ones described by EN as a runner from the car.

 

[SStarr33]

Conspiracy to Commit Murder does not require a murder to happen. By Moggs own testimony he said EN was trying to retreat to his home, but for some reason ended up on Mt Shasta:

According to Detective Mogg EN directed Andrews to his home because he was concerned about that but Andrews ended up on Mt Shasta. This would just be Andrews taking the left too soon by mistake on Mt Shasta instead of Cherry River. EN trying to get Andrews to drive him home but ending up on Mt Shasta is no conspiracy.

Hilarious.

 

[RANCH]

And why would DA want to charge one of the main witnesses anyway? DAs have a wide discretion on whether to charge someone or not. And in this particular case, evidence suggests that BM didn't shoot at the first scene, and tried to run away at the second scene. EN admits he was shooting at someone running away because he didn't want that person to get away. So given these circumstances, it would make no sense to charge BM.

Your right that it wouldn't make any sense for the DA to charge him. I'm not sure that Brandon committed any crime. A possible brandishing case from the testimony of defendant Erich is all I can see. That's pretty weak in my opinion.

 

[jayme1133]

Whatever the DA is doing, I think they're very reluctant to charge the Meyers. The most I could see the DA at some future point is getting out of these existing cases rather than bringing charges against any of the Meyers unless there was some earth-shattering reveal. More than likely what the DA is doing is trying to get these cases settled via plea.

I bet you're right BUT I hope you're wrong! Claus might not accept plea....fingers crossed!

 

[SStarr33]

The LVDA is going to have a problem with the story on record for the grand jury and the complaint story by KK before that because it adds to the idea that LE doesn't believe the Ms story (and BOB was complaining about them) (no damage to car) (no longer looking for road rager) (road rager not associated with EN).

In the complaint for the arrest of EN, The star witness KK stated to LE that EN said the green buick went to the park and waited for EN and flashed a gun at him which started the events in motion that led to a car chase.

This suggests BM was in the car the whole time. It also suggests EN,TM and BM had some kind of business transaction or the elusive back story we don't know about.

The LVDA suggests they are going only deal with the EN killed TM story, which they really can't do because:

EN gets a defense, has competent defense attorneys and will be able to present an alternate story where the road rage never happened and that TM and BM went to the park to confront EN with a gun.

What exactly did Tammy expect to happen then?

TM and BM conspired to commit crimes on EN.

BM should be brought up on charges. In the least, he was conspiring to commit a crime in which his mother was killed during the course of the ONE event.

This one little piece of info from KK that was left out of the GJ testimony changes everything.


I wonder if is possible for Claus to get the charges DISMISSED against EN based on any lies any of the Meyers told in the GJ testimony. (If they can prove it, which they may be able to).

There is still the problem too that DerrickA doesn't own (and the neighbors have never seen) a grey or silver sedan associated with him or his house. So he may not even be involved in the main story and may be able to corroborate EN's story.

I'm sure TM's toxicology will be admitted as part of the trial. That will be interesting.
MOO and all of that.

http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/pdf/00_2015/02-2015/Nowsch-Erich-15F02612X-declaration-&-complaint_Redacted.pdf


MOO TM never went home the first time. Once TM (and presumably BM) went to the park, it was all a one-event story. MOO

I think the Claus brothers will be able to prevent such an alternative story that makes sense that (if the charges don't get dismissed) EN may very well be acquitted because the jurors are going to trust the defense and not the prosecution.

I thought before this would be a plea bargain, but now I'm not so sure. Claus may want the whole story told.

Claus only wants ENs real story told if he wants to lose his place as a media hound.

 

[SStarr33]

Sometimes I think the fact that the deceased was a middle-aged "soccer-mom" type clouds perceptions of what she was purportedly doing in the moments before her death. If someone were threatened in a road rage altercation, went home and got a gun, drove around looking for the road rage perpetrator, and ended up dying in a shootout- AND if that deceased person looked like EN instead of KM - well, I wonder if the public would find a person like that to be totally innocent in what transpired.
JMO

Normal people would find a person like that innocent.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

Hilarious.

I don't know what you find funny about Mogg testifying that EN was concerned about his home and wanting to go there.

 

[SStarr33]

Its been mentioned but I didn't realize until today that there were comments (now closed) to the story.

That sure backfired on the family based on the comments. Poor BM didn't know any better and said a person involved in at least two road raging incidents and who seemed to be a hot head was the kind of mother everyone wanted to have.

No one seemed to buy that.

One poster here said something like: oh look how nice TM seemed that the gang banger apologized to her. I replied that maybe he recognized her and who he was dealing with and her affiliations when she followed him home.

(I wondered how the "gang banger" feels to have been pointed out by BM who even said supposed gang banger went to TM's vigil. I suppose LE will want to interview this gang banger, as gang activity is illegal and a problem in las vegas)

It seems like many of the Ms stories have multiple possible interpretations.

Same as with GZ. Exactly the same.

People couldn't see past their GZ Derangement Syndrome to see the truth.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

I bet you're right BUT I hope you're wrong! Claus might not accept plea....fingers crossed!

Plea deals are sometimes the best for all involved given how juries can be unpredictable either way. Unless there's some big piece of evidence yet to be uncovered or revealed, I'd think it would be in EN's best interest to take a plea to Voluntary Manslaughter if such a deal was offered...actually it wouldn't surprise me if some sort of plea deal is being offered to whoever talks first between EN/DA getting the so-called Prisoner's Dilemma. At this point I'm not sure one way or the other about Andrews given how the DA has said he wasn't the road rager, which for him I don't know if it's in his best interest or not to take a plea or to look for a plea to only very minor charges. I'd have to know of what was actually in the text messages rather than just knowing they existed and were deleted.

 

[SStarr33]

I don't know what you find funny about Mogg testifying that EN was concerned about his home and wanting to go there.

That wasn't the part I found amusing. It was the part where it was said that he took a wrong turn on Mt Shasta despite the fact that we know the rest of what he said.

 

[MzOpinion8d]

He just got shot at a short time prior. He saw the same car coming. Should he have expected the guy to come out and give him flowers?

Well since that one gang banger apologized to his mom for the road rage, maybe he thought the car was coming back so they could apologize for shooting at them.

 

[RANCH]

Sometimes I think the fact that the deceased was a middle-aged "soccer-mom" type clouds perceptions of what she was purportedly doing in the moments before her death. If someone were threatened in a road rage altercation, went home and got a gun, drove around looking for the road rage perpetrator, and ended up dying in a shootout- AND if that deceased person looked like EN instead of KM - well, I wonder if the public would find a person like that to be totally innocent in what transpired.
JMO

Normal people would find a person like that innocent.

I agree with you Starr. I'm not sure why some feel that Tammy contributed in her own death because of alleged actions she may have done earlier in the evening.

As far as I know neither Tammy or anyone in her family assualted someone before she was shot to death. And even if they did, a revenge killing is not justifable homicide.

JMO

 

[SStarr33]

Plea deals are sometimes the best for all involved given how juries can be unpredictable either way. Unless there's some big piece of evidence yet to be uncovered or revealed, I'd think it would be in EN's best interest to take a plea to Voluntary Manslaughter if such a deal was offered...actually it wouldn't surprise me if some sort of plea deal is being offered to whoever talks first between EN/DA getting the so-called Prisoner's Dilemma. At this point I'm not sure one way or the other about Andrews given how the DA has said he wasn't the road rager, which for him I don't know if it's in his best interest or not to take a plea or to look for a plea to only very minor charges. I'd have to know of what was actually in the text messages rather than just knowing they existed and were deleted.

I have a feeling DA is going to tell everything he knows. He did turn himself in, right?

 

[SStarr33]

Well since that one gang banger apologized to his mom for the road rage, maybe he thought the car was coming back so they could apologize for shooting at them.

Doubtful since that other gang banger didn't try to slaughter them.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

That wasn't the part I found amusing. It was the part where it was said that he took a wrong turn on Mt Shasta despite the fact that we know the rest of what he said.

We have the whole transcript of what Mogg said, we also have K (twice) and A as well as public statements by LE, DA the Meyers and now their attorney. The closest anyone of them get to EN giving any direction was to go to his house while at the same time DA/LE and even the Meyers themselves as recently as yesterday had said EN wasn't on Mt Shasta to go to the Meyers but instead thought the ones involved were in some gang. If both the DA who it is his job to prove the elements of the crimes that he charges as well as Mogg whose job has been to work on 130 homicide cases had statements from EN that he directed Andrews beyond his house that would have been the time to introduce them...it's not like what was said in them would be any big secret to EN/DA's defense. So far even with the GJ testimony, the closest that has been rumored to any conspiracy was the way Andrews drove into Mt Shasta and that they deleted records afterwards - nothing about any discussions about going to Mt Shasta while at the same time there's an outright denial that either of them intended to go to the Meyers.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

I have a feeling DA is going to tell everything he knows. He did turn himself in, right?

Perhaps I should have been more clear in what I meant. By talks I meant turning state's evidence.