NY - $250m fraud against Former President Donald Trump, Trump Org., Eric, Donald Jr., Sept 2022, Trial 2 Oct 2023

[JerseyGirl]

Judge Rules Trump Committed Fraud, Stripping Control of Key Properties (Published 2023)

The decision in a lawsuit that could go to trial next week is a major win for Attorney General Letitia James, who says former President Donald J. Trump overvalued his holdings by as much as $2.2 billion.

www.nytimes.com

Justice Engoron’s ruling granted one of the biggest punishments Ms. James sought: the cancellation of business certificates that allow some of Mr. Trump’s New York properties to operate, a move that could have major repercussions for the Trump family business.

The decision could terminate his control over a flagship commercial property at 40 Wall Street in Lower Manhattan and a family estate in Westchester County. Mr. Trump might also lose control over his other New York properties, including Trump Tower in Midtown Manhattan and his golf club in Westchester.

The order will not dissolve Mr. Trump’s company itself, which is a collection of hundreds of entities, but the decision could nonetheless have a sweeping impact on the company’s New York operations. If Justice Engoron’s decision is not reversed by an appeals court, it could shut down an entity that employs hundreds of people working for him in New York, effectively crushing the company.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

If any Trump businesses shut down, I do feel really sorry for any employees.

 

[SkyBoomer]

If any Trump businesses shut down, I do feel really sorry for any employees.

I mean, your life choices have consequences. I cannot imagine any sentient human would choose to work for a Trump business and have zero idea how truly horrific the namesake is, nor realize the moral bankruptcy of anything he touches. Side with evil, live in Hell.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

I still feel sorry for any employees if they find themselves out of a job at a Trump business.

They haven't been found guilty of anything and no matter what I don't think they deserve to be punished or shoulder any blame.

The ones who knowingly commited fraud, now that's a whole other story, I have no sympathy for them.

 

[SkyBoomer]

I still feel sorry for any employees if they find themselves out of a job at a Trump business.

They haven't been found guilty of anything and no matter what I don't think they deserve to be punished or shoulder any blame.

The ones who knowingly commited fraud, now that's a whole other story, I have no sympathy for them.

Unless they were forced to work for him, and assuming they are all adults, they made a moral and ethical choice and hopefully it will be a life lesson for them. But probably they would still vote for him.

 

[Inthedetails]

I still feel sorry for any employees if they find themselves out of a job at a Trump business.

They haven't been found guilty of anything and no matter what I don't think they deserve to be punished or shoulder any blame.

The ones who knowingly commited fraud, now that's a whole other story, I have no sympathy for them.

As a New Yorker, I'd be happy to see him go and take his ugly signs with him. The ruling will likely be appealed and the business process will probably be complicated, perhaps giving employees time to figure out what to do.

jmo

 

[PommyMommy]

Trump's 'corporate death penalty' explained: Veteran Manhattan fraud prosecutors describe what's next

A judge canceled the Trump Organization's New Yorker charter, dissolving the company. Two Manhattan financial-crimes prosecutors describe what's next.

www.businessinsider.com

[...]

The penalty, awarded on behalf of New York attorney general Letitia James, is so extreme, that Trump may fight James and the judge for years before anything actually happens.

[...]

"It's a staggering judgement," said John Moscow, a former financial crimes prosecutor for the Manhattan district attorney's office.

"It means you are no longer a company, and the judge is appointing someone to take over the assets and distribute them as the court sees fit."

[...]

The ruling by New York Supreme Court Justice Arthur Engoron spends more some 35 pages describing Trump's frauds, and disassembling his lawyers' arguments. Then it yanks the corporate charter in two short paragraphs.

The first paragraph orders the immediate cancellation of any "certificates," meaning corporate licenses, that are held by Trump, his two adult sons, Trump Organization, and its underlying LLCs.

The second orders that "within 10 days of the date of this order, the parties are directed to recommend the names of no more than three potential independent receivers to manage the dissolution of the canceled LLCs."

[...]

Trump continues to own his buildings, agreed Moscow and another veteran Manhattan financial crimes prosecutor, Diana Florence, now also in private practice.

Florence likens it to losing a driver's license – it doesn't change that you own the car, but it changes everything about what you can and can't do with it.

[...]

"Usually, when a corporation goes away, it's because of bankruptcy," Florence said.

"This is the same thing, but it's called a judicial dissolution," she said. "It's something that is almost never done. It's a big mess, actually," she said.

In theory, the receiver would continue to collect rents, pay taxes, pay the bills and the company salaries until the assets are sold off, with Trump, who is Trump Organization's sole beneficiary, receiving what's left over after any debts and liabilities are met, Florence said.

Those debts may include a $250 million judgement the attorney general will seek when the case goes to trial next month.

[...]

"The receiver will be in charge, and they are answerable to the court. Trump can't tell the receiver what to do," she said.

Still, "I think nothing will happen for a long time. It'll be years, I think," she said.

[...]

Lawyers for Trump and the attorney general are back before the judge Wednesday for a final pre-trial hearing.

 

[Smelly Squirrel]

Something about James is not ringing true. I guess they have no real estate comps or valuations from that time but the value goes up with Trump's name so this will be interesting

James just won a big judgment in the case. See any of the recent posts about it.

 

[kaen]

Something about James is not ringing true. I guess they have no real estate comps or valuations from that time but the value goes up with Trump's name so this will be interesting

With banks, he inflates the value to secure larger loans. With property taxes, he shrinks the value of the property to pay less taxes, often after he has negotiated a lower tax rate prior.

The valuations are based on his documents not brought in from thin air. I have lived in two states where these businesses have been active. Vendors were not paid in AC or bullied to accept lower than what they contracted for (in a bid process). His tower in NYC has inflated sq footage for bank purposes --he is a real estate guy so he knows how to measure. They tore down the historical facade of Bonwit Teller to avoid having to function based on the landmark status. Sure we can say that all businesses seek to get their best deal.But in this case it is not the fudging of the numbers but the blatant changes to those numbers and the work to hide the information. This isn't just exploiting loopholes. It is an orchestrated attempt to take advantage and hide the books from the state and everyone else.

 

[kaen]

I still feel sorry for any employees if they find themselves out of a job at a Trump business.

They haven't been found guilty of anything and no matter what I don't think they deserve to be punished or shoulder any blame.

The ones who knowingly commited fraud, now that's a whole other story, I have no sympathy for them.

There are many in NYC who play the game like the Trump Org has done. It is important to bear in mind that Trump Org like many companies have a smaller workforce with lots of contract workers from trades to janitorial to clerical. In this scenario the lower level workers will be hit the hardest because they are lowest paid, most vulnerable based on outside contractor status and not part of the inner circle.

I agree the fallout for these workers will be big. The higher ups will have severance agreements or move to other divisions of the firm.

I think all who skirt the law should be held to account. JMHO.

 

[Arkay]

There are many in NYC who play the game like the Trump Org has done. It is important to bear in mind that Trump Org like many companies have a smaller workforce with lots of contract workers from trades to janitorial to clerical. In this scenario the lower level workers will be hit the hardest because they are lowest paid, most vulnerable based on outside contractor status and not part of the inner circle

In the late 70s, early 80s, my ex-husband worked for a financial institution that was housed at 40 Wall St.

This was decades before Trump bought the building, but even if he’d owned it, I believe Trump would’ve just been the landlord, not the employer.

There are a multitude of companies at this address, primarily banks as this is the Financial District, and I’m quite sure that the mid-level employees have nothing to do with the landlord. Nor do the lower-level employees, as you have pointed out.

IMO they are not evil people who chose to work for Trump. The majority of employees are not in any way part of the Trump Organization but rather employees of the corporations that hired them.

Also IMO it would not follow that everyone in a Trump-owned property would vote for him, either.

Trump falsifying his tax records and lying about his properties are just more ways in which we see how little he cares about anyone but himself. Ordinary people will lose their jobs, but that is immaterial to him.

IMO

 

[Inthedetails]

In the late 70s, early 80s, my ex-husband worked for a financial institution that was housed at 40 Wall St.

This was decades before Trump bought the building, but even if he’d owned it, I believe Trump would’ve just been the landlord, not the employer.

There are a multitude of companies at this address, primarily banks as this is the Financial District, and I’m quite sure that the mid-level employees have nothing to do with the landlord. Nor do the lower-level employees, as you have pointed out.

IMO they are not evil people who chose to work for Trump. The majority of employees are not in any way part of the Trump Organization but rather employees of the corporations that hired them.

Also IMO it would not follow that everyone in a Trump-owned property would vote for him, either.

Trump falsifying his tax records and lying about his properties are just more ways in which we see how little he cares about anyone but himself. Ordinary people will lose their jobs, but that is immaterial to him.

IMO

I'm curious what will happen with Ivanka's involvement. She wasn't part of this suit because she appealed (based on statute of limitations) and won her appeal.

Is she still part of Trump Org? If so, is her portion protected from today's decision? Will everything just be transferred to her?

jmo

 

[Niner]

Wednesday, Sept. 27th:
*Final Pretrial Conference Hearing (@ 10am ET) – NY - New York vs. Donald J. Trump, Donald Trump, Jr. & Eric Trump & the Trump Organization, Inc. (Allen Weisselberg & Jeffrey McConney) is being sued by Letitia James, the New York Attorney General, who is leading a civil investigation (which cannot result in criminal charges filed on 9/21/22) & has spent years looking at whether the company committed various acts of fraud over several decades. In the civil case, Ms. James has filed a lawsuit against Trump & two of his children accusing them of "astounding" fraud & deception.
New York is seeking $250 million in financial penalties & asked the court to ban Trump, Donald Trump Jr. & Eric Trump from serving as an officer or director in any corporation registered or licensed in New York. James also requested the court ban the former president & his business from acquiring real estate in New York or from applying for loans from any New York financial institution for five years. James's civil case accuses Trump of lying from 2011 to 2021 about asset values at the Trump Organization, as well as his own net worth, in order to obtain better terms from lenders & insurers.
All charges against Ivanka Trump were dismissed.
New York Supreme Court (Manhattan) #452564-2022
Judge Arthur F. Engoron presiding / NY State Attorney General Leticia James / Defense attorney Alina Habba & Christopher Kise / Robert & Robert PLLC for Donald, Jr. & Eric / New York State Supreme Court, Appellate Division, 1st Dept, No. 2023-00717.
Bench Trial set to begin 10/2/23.
Case & court info from 9/21/22 thru 9/21/23 reference post #136 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ump-org-and-executives-oct-2023.673964/page-7
9/22/23 Update: Judge Engoron heard arguments Friday from lawyers for James, who are asking the judge to issue a summary judgment that Trump, his adult sons & his business are liable for fraud ahead of the scheduled Oct. 2 start of the $250 million financial fraud trial. Trump’s lawyers also argued in court that the judge should dismiss all the charges against the defendants, saying that most of the charges fell outside the statute of limitations & that there was insufficient evidence to bring the case to trial. Judge Engoron, who has said he expects the New York trial to last three months, is expected to rule on the motions Tuesday, 9/26/23. Claiming Judge Enroron is biased against Trump by not granting a request to delay the trial, Trump’s lawyers have also sought to get the judge removed from the case. After an appellate court judge temporarily halted the trial, a five-judge appeals court will rule next week on whether it should continue. Why it matters: A ruling by Judge Engoron or the appellate court in Trump’s favor could quash or limit the charges against him. A summary judgment that finds the defendants liable, however, could cost Trump hundreds of millions of dollars & prevent the Trump Organization from operating in New York. Judge to rule on what charges AG can proceed with. After judge rules on charges, appeals court to rule on lawsuit.
9/22/23 Update: Prosecutors on Friday unveiled a piece of evidence in Trump's civil fraud case. Included among the many examples of allegedly fraudulent accounting practices by the Trump Organization, argued prosecutor Andrew Amer, was listing business deals between Trump Organization entities as deals with outside companies. Investigators found that Trump duped insurance companies by lying about his stash of cash,". "They claimed that the Trumps inflated the value of Trump Tower in Midtown Manhattan by an estimated $178 million by incorrectly declaring funds as 'stabilized income' when it wasn’t." “There was rampant fraud in preparation of Trump’s personal financial statements,” Amer argued to the court. “The defendants used those fraudulent statements repeatedly and persistently with banks & insurance companies in transactions seeking financial benefits.”
9/26/23 Update: Summary Judgement. New York State Court Judge Engoron has granted partial summary judgment to the New York attorney general, finding that Trump is liable on top fraud count of NYAG business fraud lawsuit. Trial is still set to go next week with a narrower scope. Judge Engoron wrote that the documents uncovered in the case “clearly contain fraudulent valuations that defendants used in business,” and none of Trump’s defenses hold up, including his claim that he could always find a “buyer from Saudi Arabia” for one property or that measuring square footage is a “subjective process.” The judge pointed to several Trump properties that were overvalued, including Mar-A-Lago, a building on Park Avenue, an estate in Westchester County & his penthouse in Trump Tower—which had an inflated square footage even after Forbes asked him about the exaggeration, Engoron notes. As a result, Judge Engoron canceled several of Trump’s business certificates & ordered the dissolution of Trump-related LLCs. The second orders that "within 10 days of the date of this order, the parties are directed to recommend the names of no more than three potential independent receivers to manage the dissolution of the canceled LLCs." Judge Engoron also sanctioned several of Trump’s attorneys $7,500 for making arguments the court had repeatedly tossed out. The trial against Trump & his business allies is set to begin on Monday, 10/2/23 & run until December, though that date remains slightly up in the air. An appeals court temporarily delayed the trial earlier this month amid a lawsuit between Trump & the judge—the appellate judges will hear arguments this week, and could let the trial proceed as scheduled. Next final pretrial conference hearing on 9/27/23 @ 10am.

 

[Cool Cats]

Trump Freaks out After Judge Finds Him Liable for Fraud: ‘I AM WORTH MUCH MORE THAN THE NUMBERS SHOWN’​

Trump Freaks out After Judge Finds Him Liable for Fraud: ‘I AM WORTH MUCH MORE THAN THE NUMBERS SHOWN’

"I DIDN’T EVEN INCLUDE MY MOST VALUABLE ASSET, MY BRAND," he insists. The post Trump Freaks out After Judge Finds Him Liable for Fraud: ‘I AM WORTH MUCH MORE THAN THE NUMBERS SHOWN’ appeared first on TheWrap.

www.yahoo.com

 

[Inthedetails]

Trump Freaks out After Judge Finds Him Liable for Fraud: ‘I AM WORTH MUCH MORE THAN THE NUMBERS SHOWN’​

Trump Freaks out After Judge Finds Him Liable for Fraud: ‘I AM WORTH MUCH MORE THAN THE NUMBERS SHOWN’

"I DIDN’T EVEN INCLUDE MY MOST VALUABLE ASSET, MY BRAND," he insists. The post Trump Freaks out After Judge Finds Him Liable for Fraud: ‘I AM WORTH MUCH MORE THAN THE NUMBERS SHOWN’ appeared first on TheWrap.

www.yahoo.com

Trump should read the document written by the judge as these items are addressed. But he probably didn't read it and he's sure his followers didn't bother to read it either.

The judge's decision is here: https://s3.documentcloud.org/docume..._of_the_state_of_decision___order_on_1531.pdf

 

[Inthedetails]

The judge's decision was so strong against Trump's defense that he even sanctioned Trump's lawyers.

"In his order on Tuesday, he took the unusual step of fining each of Mr. Trump’s lawyers $7,500, writing that their continued assertion of arguments he had previously rejected was 'indefensible.'

That sum was more than what Ms. James was seeking when she asked the judge to penalize them."

NYTimes allows subscribers to share links to articles. This link will be good for two weeks:

Six Takeaways From a New York Judge’s Ruling Against Donald J. Trump

Justice Arthur F. Engoron’s finding that the former president committed fraud has major implications for his businesses. But Mr. Trump still has cards left to play.

www.nytimes.com

 

[Vern]

Trump should read the document written by the judge as these items are addressed. But he probably didn't read it and he's sure his followers didn't bother to read it either.

The judge's decision is here: https://s3.documentcloud.org/docume..._of_the_state_of_decision___order_on_1531.pdf

I am so sick and tired of him claiming "THERE ARE NO VICTIMS!!" (besides him of course ).

At least 250 million of unpaid taxes to the citizens of New York that would have went towards maintaining critical-to-life infrastructure such as fire, police and paramedics, towards transportation services, towards services benefitting the lower middle class and the poor etc etc.

There are MILLIONS of victims in NY City alone let alone throughout the entire state due to the Trump Orgs fraud. White Collar crime is not victimless and is perpetrated by those who don't need to commit crimes to survive & thrive --- it's all about personal greed and not giving a single wtf about anyone but themselves.

 

[Inthedetails]

I am so sick and tired of him claiming "THERE ARE NO VICTIMS!!" (besides him of course ).

At least 250 million of unpaid taxes to the citizens of New York that would have went towards maintaining critical-to-life infrastructure such as fire, police and paramedics, towards transportation services, towards services benefitting the lower middle class and the poor.

There are MILLIONS of victims in NY City alone let alone throughout the entire state due to the Trump Orgs fraud. White Collar crime is not victimless and is perpetrated by those who don't need to commit crimes to survive & thrive --- it's all about personal greed and not giving a single wtf about anyone but themselves.

Right, and business fraud is illegal. Imagine if it weren't!

His supporters praise Trump for "telling it like it is" when he's a life-long fraud. He does not, in fact, tell it like it is. He lies. The supporters either don't bother listening to facts about him or don't care - or both.

jmo

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

I'm so sick of him and his entire family. Wahhh, the judge hates me!! I swear, the whole clan of 'em. It's just so UNFATHOMABLE that a judge sided with the law. They can never be wrong, it has to be a personal hatred for them that would make any court not side with them. Everything they do is so dramatic, it just makes me want to set myself on fire.

 

[Inthedetails]

I'm so sick of him and his entire family. Wahhh, the judge hates me!! I swear, the whole clan of 'em. It's just so UNFATHOMABLE that a judge sided with the law. They can never be wrong, it has to be a personal hatred for them that would make any court not side with them. Everything they do is so dramatic, it just makes me want to set myself on fire.

I have come to the conclusion that the Trumps really do not understand honesty or that people actually can be honest and WANT to be honest. I'm being serious.

jmo