NY - Family of four found dead in basement of their Irondequoit home, 31 Aug 2024

[iamshadow21]

<modsnip - quoted post was removed> Usually, when you hear the information about the circumstances we have heard, it IS a domestic violence murder, but they're being clear that this one ISN'T. That means that something about the crime scene shows this was very clearly homicide by an outside party. And that is a point of interest when discussing this case.

MOO

 

[kkdj]

Yes. It seemed an odd statement. It caused me to wonder what he was into.

I'm not sure what the Chief meant by this statement, but it caught my attention.

 

[otto]

Firefighters had to put multiple fires - arson. Two possibilities: the husband, a third party.

Husband sounds unlikely. If a third party, what's the connection? Husband through friends and work associates? Media gives the impression that he was a good man. It's still possible that he knew someone who had strange thoughts of murdering children. Bundy looked like an intellectual.

Accident? Someone killed a family in the wrong house?

 

[Rita7]

Sounds as if one or more adults in the home had involvement with violent people.

Definitely. And I have a guess who it might be.
IMHO

 

[otto]

Definitely. And I have a guess who it might be.
IMHO

Two adults and two children were killed at home, arson destroyed the house.

The two adults were, by all accounts, a friendly couple with 2 pre-school children who invited neighbourhood children to attend their birthday parties.

<modsnip - not victim friendly>

 

[ttjo]

<modsnip - Usually, when you hear the information about the circumstances we have heard, it IS a domestic violence murder, but they're being clear that this one ISN'T. That means that something about the crime scene shows this was very clearly homicide by an outside party. And that is a point of interest when discussing this case.

MOO

I agree, if it was a murder suicide, why would they need to cover up the crime wth a fire. It's not like they will have to answer to anyone if they are also deceased.

 

[iamshadow21]

I agree, if it was a murder suicide, you wouldnt need to cover up the crime wth a fire. It's not like they will have to answer to anyone if they are also deceased.

It's not unheard of. The Broken Arrow case from a couple of years ago, for example. Some annihilators want to burn the scene, perhaps to make the appearance of an accidental fire scene. Ego and image are important to those guys, and they want to destroy everything but not have people think badly of them after they're gone.

But I think we're dealing with something different, here. Using fire to obscure a murder scene is something that isn't unheard of, or even that uncommon. The unsolved Freeman/Bible multiple murder/abduction, for example. People don't realise just how much evidence remains after a fire. Sure, a lot is lost, but much remains, and what remains often is plenty to secure convictions.

MOO

 

[Poedelini]

Processing of the crime scene took 2 days. That combined with the reaction of LE in the presser sounds like no ordinary crime scene. What a tragedy.

Jmo

 

[ttjo]

It's not unheard of. The Broken Arrow case from a couple of years ago, for example. Some annihilators want to burn the scene, perhaps to make the appearance of an accidental fire scene. Ego and image are important to those guys, and they want to destroy everything but not have people think badly of them after they're gone.

But I think we're dealing with something different, here. Using fire to obscure a murder scene is something that isn't unheard of, or even that uncommon. The unsolved Freeman/Bible multiple murder/abduction, for example. People don't realise just how much evidence remains after a fire. Sure, a lot is lost, but much remains, and what remains often is plenty to secure convictions.

MOO

and there's that... so I can't disagree. Just seems like that would be more rare. I dont know anything about this family. Now I feel like Im totally speculating but Its a bit unnerving that torture was mentioned as well as the dad not being with the other 3, if it is true, I hope it wasnt that he had to watch. (oh that sounds terrible.) I watch too many movies.

 

[iamshadow21]

Processing of the crime scene took 2 days. That combined with the reaction of LE in the presser sounds like no ordinary crime scene. What a tragedy.

Jmo

The fire would have complicated things. There would have been abatement that had to go on to prevent flare ups, but the air quality would have also restricted when or how long investigators could spend in the scene.

But I agree, I think they were being meticulous, here. When two of the victims are preschoolers, it does change how things are done. It makes people angry, makes them more determined than they might otherwise be to dot every I, cross every T.

And all eyes are upon them.

MOO

 

[Poedelini]

The fire would have complicated things. There would have been abatement that had to go on to prevent flare ups, but the air quality would have also restricted when or how long investigators could spend in the scene.

But I agree, I think they were being meticulous, here. When two of the victims are preschoolers, it does change how things are done. It makes people angry, makes them more determined than they might otherwise be to dot every I, cross every T.

And all eyes are upon them.

MOO

Yeah understandable. Do you know if the fire was also in the basement?

 

[Rita7]

Two adults and two children were killed at home, arson destroyed the house.

The two adults were, by all accounts, a friendly couple with 2 pre-school children who invited neighbourhood children to attend their birthday parties.

Was one of the parents living a double life of friendly neighbour and family man or woman, and criminal?

Who knows. Not all that glitters is gold. Thus, I hope further investigation will show the truth. I can only hypothesize.

 

[iamshadow21]

Yeah understandable. Do you know if the fire was also in the basement?

I don't think we know anything at this point except that there were multiple ignition points throughout the home.

No idea if any were in the basement.

No idea if any of the residents were alive when the fires were lit.

MOO

 

[statt#1]

After some thought, I'll opine once again, for the entire family residing at this home to be brutally murdered seems to point to either extremely enraged actors, a score that needed settled, a revenge, or possibly a message. There's just too much violence in this one, the kids being murdered in such brutal fashion, the mother trying to do what mothers do, defend her children, there was abject terror in that home. Somebody appears to have gone in there with a mission. I've seen no reports of any stolen merchandise, just murder, and set the place on fire, in several places, indicating to me a true desire for the place to burn to the ground.

IMO, this reeks of brutal gang related stuff to me.

 

[iamshadow21]

After some thought, I'll opine once again, for the entire family residing at this home to be brutally murdered seems to point to either extremely enraged actors, a score that needed settled, a revenge, or possibly a message. There's just too much violence in this one, the kids being murdered in such brutal fashion, the mother trying to do what mothers do, defend her children, there was abject terror in that home. Somebody appears to have gone in there with a mission. I've seen no reports of any stolen merchandise, just murder, and set the place on fire, in several places, indicating to me a true desire for the place to burn to the ground.

IMO, this reeks of brutal gang related stuff to me.

Maybe, but it could just as easily be some kind of injustice collector known to the family. I'm thinking of the McStays. No fire there, but one of the most brutal killings of a family of four with two preschoolers that I've ever heard of. And my knowledge of brutal crimes is pretty extensive.

If there are other similar crimes within a reasonable distance, though, a serial offender can't be disregarded. I know The Man from the Train is a theoretical serial offender from a long time ago, but the crimes were very real and at least some (if not all) were more than likely committed by the same offender. Notably, The Man from the Train used extreme violence, sexual assault of children, posing of bodies, and often, fire to obscure the scene.

MOO

 

[wvmoonangel]

After some thought, I'll opine once again, for the entire family residing at this home to be brutally murdered seems to point to either extremely enraged actors, a score that needed settled, a revenge, or possibly a message. There's just too much violence in this one, the kids being murdered in such brutal fashion, the mother trying to do what mothers do, defend her children, there was abject terror in that home. Somebody appears to have gone in there with a mission. I've seen no reports of any stolen merchandise, just murder, and set the place on fire, in several places, indicating to me a true desire for the place to burn to the ground.

IMO, this reeks of brutal gang related stuff to me.

This is just my honest opinion....I agree,I just took the time and translated some of his FB post and it seems like he was having trouble with maybe some neighbors or someone close to them. I do wonder if maybe this was a hate crime considering he had made it public on his profile that he is a Muslim.

 

[legomonster]

Remember that just three miles away, eight years ago, four others were murdered and it's still unsolved. Seven years later: Quadruple homicide in Rochester unsolved

 

[phi1ip]

and there's that... so I can't disagree. Just seems like that would be more rare. I dont know anything about this family. Now I feel like Im totally speculating but Its a bit unnerving that torture was mentioned as well as the dad not being with the other 3, if it is true, I hope it wasnt that he had to watch. (oh that sounds terrible.) I watch too many movies.

Where did you see torture mentioned and the Dad not being with the other 3? I thought during the PC the chief said they were all found in the basement.

 

[realanastasia]

Where did you see torture mentioned and the Dad not being with the other 3? I thought during the PC the chief said they were all found in the basement.

The chief said (paraphrasing) that the mother was trying to protect her children, but he “ couldn’t say” for sure what the adult male was doing when the crime occurred. You can interpret this as meaning he was just physically in a different location/part of the house than the rest of the family, or you could interpret in a different way (which implies something very different).

 

[red carpet fiber]

This is just my honest opinion....I agree,I just took the time and translated some of his FB post and it seems like he was having trouble with maybe some neighbors or someone close to them. I do wonder if maybe this was a hate crime considering he had made it public on his profile that he is a Muslim.

Interesting. Very rare for a Dominican/Puerto Rican family to be Muslim. Wonder if Dad was a recent convert...