NY NY - Irondequoit, WhtFem 14-23, 122UFNY, skeletal in shallow grave, front teeth overlap, Jul'88

[CarlK90245]

When I was in upstate New York for the Tammy Jo Alexander memorial back in June, I was staying in a hotel in Rochester. In the morning on the day of my return flight, I drove to the location where this Irondequoit Jane Doe was found.

A few things are immediately obvious when standing at the location.

First of all, it is a very secluded site in sort of a gully below what is otherwise a well-populated residential neighborhood. The killer could have spent a week in that field burying the body, and nobody would have noticed him. The field is surrounded by large thick trees and extends a few hundred yards off Newport Road, which runs down a hillside toward a small marina in Irondequoit Bay. A couple of hundred yards into the field, the field makes a sharp turn to the left. After turning into that dog-leg in the field, a person would be completely surrounded by trees and a steep hillside, and the ground is very swampy and waterlogged. Nobody would go through that field unless he or she had a reason to. (And very few people would have a reason to.)

You can get into the area from above (on Bay Knoll Road, which is a Cul-de-Sac), but you would have to go down a very steep hill through thick trees. You can also get into the area from below on Newport Road. But either way, it is not someplace where someone not familiar with the area would just end up randomly.

I took a few photos of the area. Here is one of the photos I took:

The field is not along any beaten path. You can see the area from the Irondequoit Bay Bridge, but you can't get into the area from the expressway. You have to go through a well-populated neighborhood, and the killer must have known the area. I found it with my GPS; however, I would have never found it just driving through.

 

[Dogface]

Wow, that picture is beautiful! Sad to think why such a beautiful picture is posted here....

I did some snooping on the name Franolich in regards to the area and found an interesting possible link.

 

[CarlK90245]

When I was in upstate New York for the Tammy Jo Alexander memorial back in June, I was staying in a hotel in Rochester. In the morning on the day of my return flight, I drove to the location where this Irondequoit Jane Doe was found.

A few things are immediately obvious when standing at the location.

First of all, it is a very secluded site in sort of a gully below what is otherwise a well-populated residential neighborhood. The killer could have spent a week in that field burying the body, and nobody would have noticed him. The field is surrounded by large thick trees and extends a few hundred yards off Newport Road, which runs down a hillside toward a small marina in Irondequoit Bay. A couple of hundred yards into the field, the field makes a sharp turn to the left. After turning into that dog-leg in the field, a person would be completely surrounded by trees and a steep hillside, and the ground is very swampy and waterlogged. Nobody would go through that field unless he or she had a reason to. (And very few people would have a reason to.)

You can get into the area from above (on Bay Knoll Road, which is a Cul-de-Sac), but you would have to go down a very steep hill through thick trees. You can also get into the area from below on Newport Road. But either way, it is not someplace where someone not familiar with the area would just end up randomly.

I took a few photos of the area. Here is one of the photos I took:

The field is not along any beaten path. You can see the area from the Irondequoit Bay Bridge, but you can't get into the area from the expressway. You have to go through a well-populated neighborhood, and the killer must have known the area. I found it with my GPS; however, I would have never found it just driving through.

Here's an overhead of the area, with the red arrow pointing to the approximate location where she was found.

 

[carbuff]

That's farther back than the location I had. I thought it was at the back of the yard of one of the houses on Bay Knoll Road, near the place with the swimming pool. And my bad, that's not really the area where the cliffs are. It's been several years since I was there and I guess my memory's getting fuzzy.

You can't get to that field off the expressway and the bridge, but you can get there from 509. It's only a couple of turns off Ridge Road after you leave the highway. We always turned left to get to a pizza joint my son liked; I don't remember it being quite as built up as the map shows now. I wonder how much was there in the late 80's?

 

[CarlK90245]

You can't get to that field off the expressway and the bridge, but you can get there from 509. It's only a couple of turns off Ridge Road after you leave the highway. We always turned left to get to a pizza joint my son liked; I don't remember it being quite as built up as the map shows now. I wonder how much was there in the late 80's?

Yes, it is only a couple of turns, but one still needs to know which turns to make to get through the residential neighborhood, down the hill toward the marina and across the field (or alternatively, through to the end of the cul-de-sac on Bay Knoll Drive and between two houses, and down the steep hill). Looking at the houses, they are nice homes, but they don't look like they have been built recently.

Also, someone driving through would probably not know about the highly secluded portion of the field. You can probably see some of the open field from the expressway, but the secluded portion is completely invisible from the expressway.

 

[carbuff]

I wasn't thinking of that field being a known goal. I was thinking along the lines of "I'm almost to the bridge. I'll have to get off here. But all I see are houses. Damn. I'll have to turn around and go back--no, wait, that looks like a field ahead, and there aren't any houses around. Bingo!"

 

[EmmaliLucia]

I wonder if the person who buried her was involved in the construction of those houses. I have no idea how they would find that place or go looking for it if they were not either living there or directly involved with it being built.

No wonder she wasn't found for over ten years, I wouldn't even know how to get there just looking at the map.

 

[Dogface]

One thing I do know is that Ericas husband did some sort of cable installation which resulted in them traveling a lot. I do agree someone had to have had knowledge of the area, if not, did they ever get incredibly lucky. Is that lake popular for fishing?

 

[carbuff]

It's not a lake, it's a bay of Lake Ontario. There's a fairly large marina near where she was found, so somebody could have been familiar with the area just from visiting a boat.]

eta: I'm not sure about fishing on the bay itself. I've seen ice fishing shacks out on the ice in the winter, though.

 

[CarlK90245]

Is that lake popular for fishing?

Irondequoit Bay is an extension of Lake Ontario (i.e., one of the five Great Lakes). So yes, Lake Ontario is popular for fishing, although I don't know about Irondequoit Bay.

 

[Dogface]

Lake...bay...lol it's all the same to me LOL!

Just trying to think of people who might be familiar with this area.

 

[Eddie99]

I live very near this area. Irondequoit bay, is popular for boating, and fishing. I doubt either of those activities had anything to do with this crime.

I wasn't aware they found her, so deep into the woods. I had always taken it that she must have been linked to the house that is listed on the report.

I think it's reasonable to conclude she probably was somehow linked to one of the houses that back up to this area.

Perhaps not directly, but connected somehow.

They list the cause of death as homicide, I would be interested in knowing how they concluded she was killed.

 

[carbuff]

I live very near this area. Irondequoit bay, is popular for boating, and fishing. I doubt either of those activities had anything to do with this crime.

I wasn't aware they found her, so deep into the woods. I had always taken it that she must have been linked to the house that is listed on the report.

I think it's reasonable to conclude she probably was somehow linked to one of the houses that back up to this area.

Perhaps not directly, but connected somehow.

They list the cause of death as homicide, I would be interested in knowing how they concluded she was killed.

We've seen a number of cases where the connection was somewhat indirect -- near a relative's place, a former home, not far from a workplace, things like that. It wouldn't surprise me if it was something like that.

And yeah, I thought it was much closer to the yards, too. Knowing it's way down in that field is making me re-think some things.

 

[CarlK90245]

For anyone who interested in Barbara Bruno as a possible for this Jane Doe, or any others (e.g., WCJD, Princess Doe, etc), here is another pic of Barbara from the 1977 Brockport (NY) High School yearbook. She attended Brockport HS as a freshman, but wasn't there as a sophomore, junior or senior.

She looks much different in this pic, compared to the other one (where she is obviously very young)

The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs)

By bringing people, information, forensic science and technology together, NamUs helps resolve cases.

www.namus.gov

 

[carbuff]

Cross posted from Denise Beaudin's thread

I found this woman: The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs) This is the unidentified woman known as "Irondequoit Jane Doe." The main thing that caught my eye was the apparent severe overbite in Irondequoit's sketch.

View attachment 109237

The rest isn't real close. She was found in 1988 but her estimated date of death is 15 years earlier, which actually makes their estimate a bit before Denise went missing. But with a body that old, there's a lot of room for error. There's not a lot of identifying information about her; they were unable to get DNA for profiling. She has dentals but Denise doesn't, so it would be a difficult match to make.

Denise's Namus and thread: url]https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/36410/0/[/url] Denise's Namus
NH - NH - Denise Beaudin, 23, Manchester, 26 Nov 1981

 

[madamx]

I really have to agree with carbuff, I think Judith Anne Brown is a really good match here

The main thing I'm noticing is the matching gap/twisted tooth on the upper right (viewer's left).

Eyebrows match. Hairline and part match. Cheekbones and chin match.

 

[folieadeuxnola]

Cross posted from Denise Beaudin's thread

I found this woman: The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs) This is the unidentified woman known as "Irondequoit Jane Doe." The main thing that caught my eye was the apparent severe overbite in Irondequoit's sketch.

View attachment 109237

The rest isn't real close. She was found in 1988 but her estimated date of death is 15 years earlier, which actually makes their estimate a bit before Denise went missing. But with a body that old, there's a lot of room for error. There's not a lot of identifying information about her; they were unable to get DNA for profiling. She has dentals but Denise doesn't, so it would be a difficult match to make.

Denise's Namus and thread: The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs)
NH - NH - Denise Beaudin, 23, Manchester, 26 Nov 1981

Carbuff have you received any feedback on this potential JD match


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[carbuff]

Carbuff have you received any feedback on this potential JD match


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No, but Irondequoit was ruled out as another missing woman recently, so apparently her case is still active.

 

[Romulus]

Cornelia Enright?

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Y-Cornelia-Enright-18-Rotterdam-24-April-1969

 

[theshadow45]

Rule out:
Barbara Aleksivich 1949 New York
Bonita Bickwit 1958 New York
Sandra Breed 1948 New York
Linda Britton 1944 Ohio
Judith Brown 1957 New York
Rosemary Buck 1953 New York
Cynthia Constantine 1954 New York
Charlotte Heimann 1954 New York
Lynn Luray 1948 California
Denise Sheehy 1954 New York
Rebecca Triska 1943 Pennsylvania

https://identifyus.org/en/cases/2607

Added: Lynn Bandringa 1945 California, Marie Blee 1964 Colorado, Niki Britten 1953 Oregon, Barbara Bruno 1961 New York, Sylvia Lwowski 1953 New York, Robyn Pettinato 1960 Montana, Mary Robinson 1953 New York, Sheryl Tillinghast 1956 New York, and Mary Wesolowski 1958 New York.