Found Deceased NY - Jennifer Ramsaran, 36, Chenango County, 11 Dec 2012 - # 8

[Abigail]

so if he had intended to run only one way to the y, went in the suana, showerd.... did he bring fresh cloths. did he have spare clothing at the y? did he carry them with him on his run. or did he get back into his sweaty stinky clohting?
none of these senerios make sense. unless he did not run,and had pre changed..
think about this.a 5 k race or run converts to 3.10 miles .he has ran alot of 5k races. so that day for no reason what so ever he claims he ran almost 3x that amount.
so i think running back home is not even a possability off thought for him.and he would have brought clothing or had clothing there?
so my qeustion is? did he leave in the same clothing he came in with? and if so, as a seasoned runner would have been prepaired, (clothing wise) i can only deduce he infact did not run at all!

It would perhaps not be unusual for him to run 8 or 9 miles as he frequently ran in marathons, and I think even a 50 mile super marathon once. So...the distance would not be unusual.

What is odd...
...he set out for a long run on a rainy day with weather in 40's (maybe lower 50's)
...he did his running BEFORE the workout (not a good idea after a long run)...why didn't he have Jenn drop him off at the Y on her way out of town, then he could have had a nice workout and then ran home.

 

[dansmom]

Here's the "official" version of the alibi from his PR representative (posted here on WS):

I've already ruled out GR.
First...he couldnt run from APT to Y in that time-frame and go unnoticed by cameras coming in from wrong direction.
His cell phone is an automatic GPS tracker as it pings continually off towers so PD has the forensics to where he was in approx vicinities.
His home office work and conference calls are via a VPN which is tracked and logged with his company.
His entire alibi is accounted for. Even strangers who saw him running...to people at Y...to people who saw after.

I have an Iphone and in order for it to be able to use the gps to pinpoint my location, the phone asks to be allowed to .It can be disabled.

He has set out a timeline but can it truly be verified:
Took kids to school ( yes, bet is he said Hi to someone or walked in to the school ( I hear he does that often to the point parents have commented).OK AM ( 8 or so).

What time did he go to Y. This time can be verified by swiping his Y card. Is there a gap?

My guess, he was trying to tighten his alibi times. However, I think there are cameras and there are missing times in between.

If, in fact he was home after dropping off the kids and ran to Y directly there were at least 6 cameras that would have recorded him ( SFCU, Benedicts, Quickway and Nice and Easy). If that were the true scenario- he would have been publicly cleared by now.

Think about all the things that haven't been said, that's where the clues are. And LE holds those close.


Just because he has run 5K and marathons in the past, it was months ago. Maybe he isn't as in shape due to cooler weather. Takes longer to run slower.

 

[Abigail]

Here's the "official" version of the alibi from his PR representative (posted here on WS):

I've already ruled out GR.
First...he couldnt run from APT to Y in that time-frame and go unnoticed by cameras coming in from wrong direction.
His cell phone is an automatic GPS tracker as it pings continually off towers so PD has the forensics to where he was in approx vicinities.
His home office work and conference calls are via a VPN which is tracked and logged with his company.
His entire alibi is accounted for. Even strangers who saw him running...to people at Y...to people who saw after.

I think we've proven that he could have run from the apartment to the Y and not been caught on camera if he cut through the soccer field across from the apartments, and then took the back roads to Broad Street. What strangers saw him running? Where were they?

Did he have his cell phone with him when he ran from his home to the Y? Most runners don't like to carry stuff in their pockets -- they get too sweaty, and the phone might fall out.

If he took time out during the day to supposedly run to the Y, spend some time at the Y, and then call E to give him a ride home, that's a pretty good chunck of time when he wasn't logged on to his work computer. It would take LESS time to dispose of Jenn's body, park the van at the apartments, and run from there to the Y than it would to run from his home to the Y.

 

[Foxfire]

Good call!!! It reads just about like this case...with more detail...but in my own mind, I believe he (her husband) helped her off the road...can I prove it?...sadly...NO...but in the case of JR and GR...she forgot to take a vehicle and her clothing with her, when she went off of the road...to me it is all about being "gaslighted"....can I prove it?....not yet...thanks for adding that case...Gail was beautiful too:seeya:

'Gail Palmgren's remains would have been located much sooner, imo if there had been more info released to the public'.. A neighbor had noticed a bolder on the side of the road that had been relocated, but didn't piece it together with Gail's disappearance due to the silence..


http://www.wrcbtv.com/story/16176591/mother-nature-speeds-up-search-for-gail-palmgren

Dec 02, 2011 6:04 PM EST
By Nick Austin, Meteorologist / Reporter - bio | email


An aerial photo of the area where Gail Palmgren's Jeep Rubicon was discovered. / courtesy HCSO
SIGNAL MOUNTAIN, HAMILTON COUNTY (WRCB) -- By the time North Carolina's CUE Center for Missing Persons joined the search for Gail Palmgren in late September, the Signal Mountain mom and her red Jeep Rubicon had been missing for almost five months.

 

[JTKirk]

Here's the "official" version of the alibi from his PR representative (posted here on WS):

I've already ruled out GR.
First...he couldnt run from APT to Y in that time-frame and go unnoticed by cameras coming in from wrong direction.
His cell phone is an automatic GPS tracker as it pings continually off towers so PD has the forensics to where he was in approx vicinities.
His home office work and conference calls are via a VPN which is tracked and logged with his company.
His entire alibi is accounted for. Even strangers who saw him running...to people at Y...to people who saw after.

Thanks deoneta for the reminder of his alibi from his PR rep! :floorlaugh:

A - how do we know he even brought his phone with him? If it has a GPS tracker, he could leave it at home. Then, deciding not to run all the way home, perhaps he called ES from a phone at the Y?

B - If he's out running to the Y and hanging out in the sauna with his trooper friend, was he SUPPOSED to be working? I know that when I log onto VPN from my work, I'm logged in, etc, but doesn't mean I couldn't walk away from the computer for an hour.

Is there a 'swiss cheese' icon for his alibi?

 

[cjwoods]

Here's the "official" version of the alibi from his PR representative (posted here on WS):

I've already ruled out GR.
First...he couldnt run from APT to Y in that time-frame and go unnoticed by cameras coming in from wrong direction.
His cell phone is an automatic GPS tracker as it pings continually off towers so PD has the forensics to where he was in approx vicinities.
His home office work and conference calls are via a VPN which is tracked and logged with his company.
His entire alibi is accounted for. Even strangers who saw him running...to people at Y...to people who saw after.

yes he could run from the apts to the y and not be noticed.
run up over the hill and via canasawacta st, newton st, howard st,summit st, prospect st,pellet st, north broad st, tillman st down to the rail road track that are on the west side of the y as is his house, from witch he said he ran,
also what time frame is she speaking of? morning? night? the 11th 12th 13? 14?
no one knows when the van was parked!
for all we know he left his cell phone at home, or had it the hands of a freind, and we have no cocnclusive time frame, for the known crime scenes.
( also did the LE make her privy to his cell phone info?)
his confrence calls? he said he was away from home for long part of the day, so what does that have to due with anything when no one knows a exact time the van was parked? or she vanished?
were did they see him running? strangers seen him? at what point did LE ask for help from strangers?
ok so people seen him at the Y and after ......we still dont know .when the van was parked. and gusse who seem him after!
also did LE officialy say he was not a suspect? or just this novice represinative? i dont think she was qualified to make such a statement.:waitasec::waitasec:
LE should make such a statement before anyone else,
do you fellow sleuthers :twocents:agree?

 

[Foxfire]

Here's the "official" version of the alibi from his PR representative (posted here on WS):

I've already ruled out GR.
First...he couldnt run from APT to Y in that time-frame and go unnoticed by cameras coming in from wrong direction.
His cell phone is an automatic GPS tracker as it pings continually off towers so PD has the forensics to where he was in approx vicinities.
His home office work and conference calls are via a VPN which is tracked and logged with his company.
His entire alibi is accounted for. Even strangers who saw him running...to people at Y...to people who saw after.

If pre-planned, and in my opinion JR's murder was. Alibis would be expected, as part of the plan.. The alibis in this case, coupled with motive, opportunity, means, as well as the deflection, creativity, manipulation of the investigation/searches, and the character assassination of the innocent victim , etc... etc..

'' Raises more red flags than the singing of the Soviet Union's National Anthem''..

Soviet Union National Anthem - YouTube

 

[Bettylou4you]

If the gps watch was part of his 'constructed' alibi, obviously he would have been aware of its significance and could leave the watch where ever he wanted it to show him being. Easily manipulated evidence, just like him having access to her online accounts; nothing is for certain.

Also, perhaps he found out 2nd hand that his LE buddy went to the Y at a particular schedule and made sure he showed up there. The alibi would mean nothing if he was alone in the sauna.

And of course people saw him running, that was part of the plan.

All of his 'alibi' and 'evidence' he provided to LE is potentially tainted by his premeditation and manipulation. It's not worth anything against real evidence.

 

[Sharoneonta]

Just had a thought: RB told us that GR and the trooper weren't really "friends" but more of a friend of a friend...
Wondering if ES is the friend and she knew that the trooper would be in the sauna?

Random, but a thought...

p.s. I miss RB. :-(

 

[cjwoods]

do we know when he left the ymca?

 

[Sharoneonta]

I didn't explain that well .... some cultures do not treat their sisters and daughters in the same manner in which we are taught to regard and protect our sisters and daughters.

(I also do not believe much of what he says in this matter)


ETA: Here in Oz we have girls with Indian backgrounds who are born in Australia and yet are still forced into arranged marriages (at very young ages) .. despite this being against the law here.

This really bothers me, the post, not the poster.

First, we don't know the spiritual beliefs of the Ramsaran family, I believe GR either is or has raised the children as Catholic. I know Muslim & Hindi men who are some of the kindest, most gentle men I know.

I know some Caucasian men who are simply evil.

IMO we should leave this argument out of the conversation.

 

[csleuth]

that is a very good question? i have not been told of anything by any locals regarding a police presence that said (troopers) just (sheriffs)

I believe they are involved. In one of the many interviews GR stated that the Sheriffs Dept. And NYS Police were involved in the search of his home.

 

[epiphany]

that is a very good question? i have not been told of anything by any locals regarding a police presence that said (troopers) just (sheriffs)

Snipped

Chenango County Sheriff Ernest R. Cutting Jr. said law enforcement agencies, including the New York State Police, New York State Park Rangers, Sheriff’s Office and New Berlin and Norwich police departments are “making some headway,” but admitted the process is both slow and tedious. Ramsaran’s family, including her husband and three children, have all been interviewed, and Cutting said he hoped to have the search of the family’s home and surrounding 18 acres wrapped up sometime today.

http://www.evesun.com/news/stories/...days-Still-no-sign-of-missing-New-Berlin-mom/

 

[robinsj2]

And that being the case, I don't see that there is any way in heck that ES didn't know something was up.

If she didn't figure out his nervousness then, she sure would have figured it out in the days to come when Jen never returned.


(Runners also run out and run back, they don't run in one direction and call for a ride home.)[/QUOTE]

They might if the route TO the Y was only 1 mile, but the route FROM the Y to home was 8 miles.

:waitasec: How did he call her? Did he use a phone at the Y, or did he use his own phone? (and who takes their phone with them when running 8 or 9 miles?)

I always take my phone with me in runs, especially anything over 3-5 miles. Also, it was very common for him to run to the Y and then get a ride home. Although... I would not want to put my running clothes back on after sauna. Assuming he went in the sauna in a towel and not his running clothes.

 

[Foxfire]

Snipped

Chenango County Sheriff Ernest R. Cutting Jr. said law enforcement agencies, including the New York State Police, New York State Park Rangers, Sheriff’s Office and New Berlin and Norwich police departments are “making some headway,” but admitted the process is both slow and tedious. Ramsaran’s family, including her husband and three children, have all been interviewed, and Cutting said he hoped to have the search of the family’s home and surrounding 18 acres wrapped up sometime today.

http://www.evesun.com/news/stories/...days-Still-no-sign-of-missing-New-Berlin-mom/

Feb 27, 2013 http://www.stargazette.com/article/2...henango-County

Woman's body discovered in Chenango County
PHARSALIA — The body of an unidentified woman was recovered Tuesday by the Chenango County Sheriff’s Office off Center Road in the Town of Pharsalia.

The body was taken to the Onondaga County Medical Examiner’s Office in Syracuse for an autopsy. The woman’s identity is unknown to investigators and the investigation is continuing, Sheriff Ernest R. Cutting said.

The Chenango County Sheriff’s office was assisted at the scene by the New York State Police and Chenango County Bureau of Fire.

 

[Foxfire]

I always take my phone with me in runs, especially anything over 3-5 miles. Also, it was very common for him to run to the Y and then get a ride home. Although... I would not want to put my running clothes back on after sauna. Assuming he went in the sauna in a towel and not his running clothes.

RE: Also, it was very common for him to run to the Y and then get a ride home


'And you know this how, robinsj2'?

 

[Kimster]

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[Foxfire]

robinsj2, please apply for verified local.. Your info is very interesting..TIA

 

[zwiebel]

I might be wrong, but I kind of think it has something to do with a web link (along the lines of http or something like that) used in some Asian countries.

I can't find it anywhere on a list of Indian names.

Thanks, that's really been irritating me. I've tried dutch, french, portuguese,spanish and some very obscure ones too! Nothing. Even with Ramsaran, it didn't work, except to get me back to WS, and in dutch, to take me to that Ramsaran charged in the multi-million dollar fraud. That's very far away from this case though.
http://www.stabroeknews.com/2009/archives/04/29/polar-beer-scam-fourteen-charged-with-fraud-forgery/

 

[Foxfire]

http://www.myfoxny.com/story/21650826/woman-dies-after-carjacking-at-syracuse-area-mall

Woman killed, child raped after carjacking at mall

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8
Posted: Mar 15, 2013 9:08 AM EDT
Updated: Mar 15, 2013 12:41 PM EDT
By LUKE FUNK, Senior Web Producer -
NEW YORK (MYFOXNY) -
Police say a man fatally stabbing a school librarian and raped her child after carjacking them at a New York mall.

The New York State Police say the events started unfolding at about 9 p.m. Thursday at the Great Northern Mall in Clay.

Police say the 47-year-old woman was leaving a gymnastics class with her 10-year-old daughter when the attacker stopped them.



Read more