NY - Jordan Neely, killed by chokehold in subway during mental health crisis, Manhattan, 1 May 2023 *arrest*

[angelainwi]

10of Rods said it much better than me on propensity and how we cannot know someone's propensity. <modsnip>

 

[Sundog]

An anonymous source to the NY Post I would take that with a big grain of salt.

Assistant DA interviewed witnesses who reported that Neely was making threats and the passengers were fearful.

Marine veteran who fatally choked NYC subway rider Jordan Neely is freed pending trial

A U.S. Marine veteran who used a fatal chokehold on an agitated New York City subway passenger was freed from custody hours after surrendering on a manslaughter charge

abcnews.go.com

 

[angelainwi]

Assistant DA interviewed witnesses who reported that Neely was making threats and the passengers were fearful.

Marine veteran who fatally choked NYC subway rider Jordan Neely is freed pending trial

A U.S. Marine veteran who used a fatal chokehold on an agitated New York City subway passenger was freed from custody hours after surrendering on a manslaughter charge

abcnews.go.com

I was aware of the making threats and passengers were fearful. Still not sure how that justifies an immediate chokehold from behind. I have yet to see reports that he was trying to attack anyone.

 

[MassGuy]

I was aware of the making threats and passengers were fearful. Still not sure how that justifies an immediate chokehold from behind. I have yet to see reports that he was trying to attack anyone.

He thought this guy was going to go through what it appeared he was going to go through. His read was at least partially right,<modsnip>

I. Want. A. Guy. Like. This. On. Every. Subway. Car.

No one should ever be afraid. I can’t believe there’s an argument here.

 

[kittythehare]

He thought this guy was going to go through what it appeared he was going to go through. His read was at least partially right, <modsnip>

I. Want. A. Guy. Like. This. On. Every. Subway. Car.

No one should ever be afraid. I can’t believe there’s an argument here.

I'd prefer one who followed the rules but here we are.

 

[kittythehare]

<modsnip - quoted post was removed>

Mr. Penny approached Mr. Neely from the back, “placed him in a chokehold, taking him down to the ground” and held him “for several minutes” until the train arrived at the next station, Mr. Steinglass said. He emphasized that Mr. Penny had continued to choke Mr. Neely even after he stopped moving. The chokehold was captured in a four-minute video.

Daniel Penny Arraigned on Manslaughter Charge in Jordan Neely’s Killing (Published 2023)

The Manhattan district attorney’s office charged Mr. Penny with second-degree manslaughter for choking Mr. Neely to death on the subway.

www.nytimes.com

 

[MassGuy]

<modsnip - quoted post was removed>

Mr. Penny approached Mr. Neely from the back, “placed him in a chokehold, taking him down to the ground” and held him “for several minutes” until the train arrived at the next station, Mr. Steinglass said. He emphasized that Mr. Penny had continued to choke Mr. Neely even after he stopped moving. The chokehold was captured in a four-minute video.

Daniel Penny Arraigned on Manslaughter Charge in Jordan Neely’s Killing (Published 2023)

The Manhattan district attorney’s office charged Mr. Penny with second-degree manslaughter for choking Mr. Neely to death on the subway.

www.nytimes.com

Why? Was this random? Or was he trying to protect passengers?

That’s what humors me. Everyone passing judgement would freak out in this situation. We have a bunch of calm Navy Seal type folks, who are unflappable.

 

[kittythehare]

LIVE | Family of Jordan Neely, NYC subway chokehold death victim, makes statement

The family of Jordan Neely, the 30-year-old Black man who died after he was put in a chokehold on a New York City subway train, will hold a press conference ...

www.youtube.com

 

[kittythehare]

Why? Was this random? Or was he trying to protect passengers?

That’s what humors me. Everyone passing judgement would freak out in this situation. We have a bunch of calm Navy Seal type folks, who are unflappable.

Well if he had stopped moving he was no threat to anybody.
That's the crux, he kept holding on.
His training apparently never kicked in or he ignored it.

I don't know why.

 

[angelainwi]

Why? Was this random? Or was he trying to protect passengers?

That’s what humors me. Everyone passing judgement would freak out in this situation. We have a bunch of calm Navy Seal type folks, who are unflappable.

I am not unflappable but I have been through some serious situations that have gotten quite dicey. I have had ceramic pots thrown directly at my head. I have had someone have a seizure in my vehicle on the way to treatment from shooting too much cocaine. I have went to Skid Row to rescue a client. I did bring a male with me but neither of us were armed, we made it out alive. I could go on and on. When you work in the field of interventions you are gonna see some $hit! It is not for the faint of heart. I have had to work with a security team to go directly to the firearms once we enter a house. I have had police on standby a block away. I have walked into homes where people where in acute psychological distress not knowing what I would encounter. Just two months ago I did a high stakes intervention where we rescued someone who was being a useful idiot to the cartel. Police refused to get involved when the family repeatedly begged for help. Thankfully one of his friends was a chief of the Fire Dept and he and some colleagues did surveillance on their own time to determine a safe time for us to swoop in. You have no idea what some of us have dealt with.

Someday I will tell my story of survival that will blow your socks off.

Edited for grammar

 

[Sonny Crockett]

She said there are more videos of the altercation that led up to the chokehold that she believes will absolve Penny of wrongdoing.

'So I believe that those videos are going to come forward, maybe people will do it anonymously.

'I hope he has a great lawyer, and I’m praying for him. And I pray that he gets treated fairly, I really do.

'Because after all of this ensued I went back and made sure that I said, "thank you" to him.'

She said Neely brought on the chokehold by threatening the entire train and many of them took the threats seriously.

'He said, "I don’t care. I’ll take a bullet, I’ll go to jail" because he would kill people on the train.

'He said ‘I would kill a motherf***er. I don’t care. I’ll take a bullet. I’ll go to jail.'

'This gentleman, Mr. Penny, did not stand up. Did not engage with the gentleman. He said not a word. It was all Mr. Neely that was… threatening the passengers. If he did not get what he wants,' she said.

Eventually, Penny stood up and pulled him to the ground. Two other men helped subdue him.

This is extremely interesting & relevant to this case. So, JN was actually directly threatening others on the subway car. Hopefully the other videos will be released & the truth will be made obvious to everyone.

 

[Ontario Mom]

I haven't read every article on this case so if this has already been covered my apologies.

I'm just wondering why the other 2 men who helped hold Neely down are not being charged with anything. Not that I believe anyone should be charged with anything at all as it was an unfortunate accident, but it does seem curious 3 men held him down and only 1 man is being charged.

 

[Dotta]

I haven't read every article on this case so if this has already been covered my apologies.

I'm just wondering why the other 2 men who helped hold Neely down are not being charged with anything. Not that I believe anyone should be charged with anything at all as it was an unfortunate accident, but it does seem curious 3 men held him down and only 1 man is being charged.

I guess because they didn't use chokehold.

JMO

 

[Trebor5591]

I can't believe people are trying to call that marine a hero. He executed someone in distress. He held him in a killing choke hold for 15 minutes. Think about how long that is. He did it with the help of two other people. Why didn't they just stop when he was down and subdued? He wasn't attacking anyone.

He was hungry, tired, at the end of his rope and yes he was yelling out in despair. Yes, I can imagine it was scary. But the marine guy took him out from behind, unprovoked. This was a murder, as far as I am concerned.

Anyone who argues in favor of summary execution because someone was being disorderly in a public space, I have to wonder what other kinds of extra judicial, vigilante justice they're in favor of.

We have people being killed or shot at for coming on to the wrong porch, or entering the wrong vehicle. And now this. Where is this paranoia and hate coming from?

IMO, he was protecting the other people in the subway car from a threatening and dangerous man. He is a hero because he decided to take action instead of shrinking away from danger like 99.9% of the cowed subway riders. Imo, it is disgraceful he is being charged with a crime. IMO, no NYC jury is going to convict him because every working person and every normal person just trying to live their lives in NYC knows how unsafe the NYC subway system is and they are tired of the lack of protection by the NYPD.

 

[IceIce9]

I can't believe people are trying to call that marine a hero. He executed someone in distress. He held him in a killing choke hold for 15 minutes. Think about how long that is. He did it with the help of two other people. Why didn't they just stop when he was down and subdued? He wasn't attacking anyone.

He was hungry, tired, at the end of his rope and yes he was yelling out in despair. Yes, I can imagine it was scary. But the marine guy took him out from behind, unprovoked. This was a murder, as far as I am concerned.

Anyone who argues in favor of summary execution because someone was being disorderly in a public space, I have to wonder what other kinds of extra judicial, vigilante justice they're in favor of.

We have people being killed or shot at for coming on to the wrong porch, or entering the wrong vehicle. And now this. Where is this paranoia and hate coming from?

The difference is that the people who were shot on the wrong porch, wrong driveway, wrong front door, were not threatening anyone. They did nothing wrong.

The passengers on the subway obviously felt threatened. It is easy for Monday morning quarterbacks to say that they themselves wouldn’t have felt threatened by the actions but the passengers who were actually there felt that he was threatening and dangerous, so they considered Daniel to be a hero for protecting them.

JMO

 

[imstilla.grandma]

He was on a list informally known as the Top 50, a roster of people in a city of eight million who stand out for the severity of their troubles and their resistance to accepting help. The list is overseen by a task force of city agency workers and social-service nonprofits; when homeless-outreach workers see someone in the subway who is on the list, they are supposed to notify the city and try to get that person to a shelter.

Despite that, and an open arrest warrant, Mr. Neely was out on his own on May 1, when he began ranting at passengers. A Marine veteran, Daniel Penny, grabbed him and choked him to death; Mr. Penny has now been charged with manslaughter.

In the wake of Mr. Neely’s death, the administration of Mayor Eric Adams has been criticized by advocates for homeless people and left-leaning political opponents who say the killing highlights deep problems in the city’s support systems for homeless people and those with mental illness.

Jordan Neely Was on New York’s ‘Top 50’ List of Homeless People at Risk (Published 2023)

Mr. Neely, who was killed by another subway rider, was on a watch list for a city task force that kept track of the New Yorkers of most concern.

www.nytimes.com

 

[RANCH]

Towards the end of the extended video it sounds like a guy off camera questioned the chokehold and one of the two guys who were assisting the marine in keeping Neely held down responds with something along the lines of “he (marine) is not squeezing anymore”. They let Neely go soon after that and he does appear to move before the video cuts out.

I see a lot of comments here stating the marine kept Neely in a chokehold for 12-15 minutes… was this 100% confirmed?

In the video recorded by Vazquez, Neely and Penny are seen on the floor of a subway car with Penny's arm wrapped around Neely's neck. The two men were on the floor for about seven minutes, Vazquez said, adding he started recording about three or four minutes after the chokehold began.

Man who held Jordan Neely in fatal chokehold on NYC subway 'never intended to harm' him: attorneys

Daniel Penny, 24, has been identified by his attorneys as the US Marine veteran who held down Jordan Neely on Monday afternoon while they were aboard the train in NYC.

abc7chicago.com

 

[mooseandcoffee]

He thought this guy was going to go through what it appeared he was going to go through. His read was at least partially right,<modsnip>

I. Want. A. Guy. Like. This. On. Every. Subway. Car.

No one should ever be afraid. I can’t believe there’s an argument here.

Someone monitoring behavior on a subway? Okay.

Someone killing someone for yelling? No thanks.

 

[mooseandcoffee]

I'm curious as to how people might look at this case if it were a homeless veteran who was attacked and killed on the subway. Would his trauma and service to the country overshadow his outbursts? Would there be more of a call for his need for services rather than the threat he posed to riders?

I guess we don't know, because that isn't how it played out.

 

[LaborDayRN]

<modsnip: quoted post was snipped> Did these passengers not have the option to move to a different car? I'm not familiar with the NY subway system but in my city you can move cars.