NY-LI 10 bodies found on Beach-Poss. SrlKlr-12/10-4 id'd; more found 3/11 #11

[shadowraiths]

I would add that the killer suffers from psychosexual arrest and the childlike behaviors he exhibits when living out his fantasies are a result of this deficiency.

 

[Seaslug44]

Money fueled drug habit

Amber Costello's rule about staying out of a john's car came after a brutal lesson.

Her roommate Schaller, who helped her with clients, said he could recall her getting into a man's car only once -- after their session was over and he offered her a ride to a convenience store.

"She called me from the side of the Southern State Parkway. Her head was bleeding," Schaller recalled. "He had punched her three times in the face and left her on the side of the road."

Costello told her boyfriend, Bjorn Brodsky, 26, that sex work had been part of her life since she was 17. She was also a heroin addict, according to Schaller, Brodsky and her relatives.

A Wilmington, N.C., native, Costello did not graduate high school, married and divorced twice and bounced around jobs in North Carolina and Florida before moving to New York in late 2009. Schaller, a friend of Costello's sister Kimberly Overstreet and then a commercial fisherman, said he paid for her plane ticket.

She attended a 28-day rehab program at St. Charles Hospital in Port Jefferson, where Brodsky said he met her. Both of them relapsed into drug use by the following spring.

Costello bought a prepaid cellphone and uploaded a Craigslist post advertising herself as a private dancer named Carolina, Brodsky said.

"That phone never stopped ringing," he said.

Schaller allowed her to work from his home. He and Brodsky say they did not act as pimps for Costello. But one of them was usually in another room when she had clients over. There were rules: Clients came to her and paid $200 an hour; she went only as far as she wanted to; and if a client demanded more, she called out for Schaller or Brodsky. The men would make the client leave -- in some cases physically removing him.

"It was a very controlled environment," Schaller said.

By midsummer, Brodsky said, Costello was earning $7,000 a week.

"She would lay the cash down on the table and say, 'Here, you can have $3,000 and I'll take four,' " Brodsky said.

By August, Brodsky was back in rehab. Costello kept living with Schaller until her disappearance the next month. Her vanishing didn't immediately cause alarm, since she had left at other times as well.

But in December, when Costello was finally reported missing by her sister after remains were discovered at Gilgo, a homicide detective called Schaller. The investigator wanted details about her clients, especially regulars, and the last caller who persuaded her to go for a ride.

"It had to be somebody she was comfortable with," Schaller said. "Or maybe all that money just got her in the head."

from Newsday

 

[Peter Brendt]

Not sure how you deduced this, since the pimp's claims are more of an, "oh, btw, the pimp said he got calls, too" In any event, I take issue with the fact that he claims he was called 30 times over eight months, whereas LE confirms that seven calls were made over a period of six weeks immediately following Melissa's disappearance ( link ).

Those seven were the ones to the sister. The calls to the pimp started later. But as I understood the articles dealing with the phone calls, the Mickey Mouse phone was found tracing one of the pimp calls.

As for the Mickey Mouse bit? LE tracked down the calls of Melissa's clients, and one of her clients had registered their phone to "Mickey Mouse." In other words, perhaps M-squared is the killer, perhaps he's not.

That's the first time, I hear the version that Mickey Mouse was found in the client list. It was always reported in connection to the phone calls from Melissa's cell phone used by the killer. However, I will recheck when I find the time.

I respectfully disagree. There are reasons to concoct the story, the least being the celebrity angle. He's getting attention, the reporter is telling his story. Moreover, there's the one-upmanship. The sister received 7 calls over a period of six weeks. He claims he received 30 over a period of eight months. That's just over the top. I don't buy it.

Nobody forces you to buy it, it's an estimation thing anyway. But I would estimate the urge of a guy to draw attention in a serial killer case whose business is to draw no attention as pretty low. Unless of course, he would try to prevent to become a suspect in the first place. The problem is, to believe him or not changes the whole profile.

Agreed. One only need consider Eminem, to see that sort of thing. My point is not about race per se, rather, dialect being in conflict with alleged age. In other words, the sort of dialect conveyed in that story is more recent and not something that supports the "older white male" claim.
Well, the FBI profile of usual mid-20s white loner over-generalizes with no basis in science, anyway. *shrugs*

Agreed in both points, Ebonics on an older white guy is hard to believe and thus, either the white or the older part must be wrong. Since I see the victimology similar to serial rapist cases I know, I tend to say, it's the white part that is wrong in here. You appear to tend to the age part. Unfortunately, we have nothing to pin a nail into that detail, so we have to leave it open for now.

That being said, I'll play. Let's say the pimp is telling the truth... even if it's a bit exaggerated. You rightly ponder, why would the perp call the pimp? Calling the family is obvious but why the pimp? The answer to that Q, imnsho, is fairly simple. The perp is marking his territory, so to speak. Letting the pimp know that not only does he have the pimp's girl but he knows enough about the pimp he could show up anytime he pleases. While arguably a veiled threat, the real message is about power. It's the sort of puffing up that males of our species often engage in, even in non-threatening, peace-space.

Okay, lets join that play then. It would be estuary behavior as usually in all male mammals. Only to a exaggerated point, which includes also ownership of the female and even threatens the personal space. Which reinforces it, as you already said, from estuary behavior to generalized domination behavior. However, there is a sublt difference between power and control and the addition out of them is domination. This extreme domination behavior would indicate a narcissistic (NPD) complex or simply a big inferiority complex that needs over-compensation. Given the fact, that all four connected victims are white females but have otherwise not much in common as far as it comes to their appearance and that the pimp is also Caucasian, that paints a pretty ugly picture. Did you look up the Waldo guy?

 

[waltzingmatilda]

Welcome to WS Bemo12! Here's a link for you. Hope this helps.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=133062"]NY-LI-4 bodies on Beach-Possible SK, 4 more found 3/11 NO DISCUSSION - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

There's a case archive album too but I cannot find the link at this time. Will try and locate it for you.

wm

 

[shadowraiths]

But as I understood the articles dealing with the phone calls, the Mickey Mouse phone was found tracing one of the pimp calls.

The "Mickey Mouse" bit originated from the April 24, 2011, Daily Beast article ( link )

Detectives and family members combed through her phone records. Lynn discovered that a few calls were made to the escort service James Bond Entertainment. Lynn's fiancé Jeff called the number and spoke to a man who told him that Barthelemy had worked with him on a number of occasions. "He was prickly, like Jeff was bothering him," said Lynn.

A few of the numbers belonged to her regular clients, one of whom was a married man who told police that Barthelemy didn't show up for their scheduled date at a motel in Jersey City.

"He was more worried about his wife finding out than being a suspect in a serial killer case," said the Long Island law-enforcement source. "Her clients were regular Joes. She wasn't working for Heidi Fleiss."

Other numbers were traced to throwaway phones purchased in Manhattan. One of the phones was linked to the name Mickey Mouse.​

The problem is, to believe him or not changes the whole profile.

At best, his claim, if true, further cements the suspected psychological markers of the perp. Specifically the dominance-submission dyad. Otherwise put, the validity (or invalidity) of the profile does not hinge on whether (or not) this guy is telling the truth.

 

[minazoe]

I have one thought.

Leather Pants.

 

[Peter Brendt]

The "Mickey Mouse" bit originated from the April 24, 2011, Daily Beast article ( link )

Detectives and family members combed through her phone records. Lynn discovered that a few calls were made to the escort service James Bond Entertainment. Lynn's fiancé Jeff called the number and spoke to a man who told him that Barthelemy had worked with him on a number of occasions. "He was prickly, like Jeff was bothering him," said Lynn.

A few of the numbers belonged to her regular clients, one of whom was a married man who told police that Barthelemy didn't show up for their scheduled date at a motel in Jersey City.

"He was more worried about his wife finding out than being a suspect in a serial killer case," said the Long Island law-enforcement source. "Her clients were regular Joes. She wasn't working for Heidi Fleiss."

Other numbers were traced to throwaway phones purchased in Manhattan. One of the phones was linked to the name Mickey Mouse.​

Right, OTHER numbers. As far as I understand it some numbers lead to clients, OTHER numbers (as in not the same) were traced to throw away phones, one of them registered by a "Mickey Mouse". But maybe, since English isn't my first language, I understood it wrong and "other" here the same meaning as "and"?

At best, his claim, if true, further cements the suspected psychological markers of the perp. Specifically the dominance-submission dyad. Otherwise put, the validity (or invalidity) of the profile does not hinge on whether (or not) this guy is telling the truth.[/QUOTE]

This is the point that worries me. The whole dominace-submission-scheme is always seen under the point of view of an offender who is primarily sex offender. But there had been always a number of serial killers who weren't sex offenders at all and an even bigger number, who were something else plus sex offenders. And the group normally out of consideration are those, who use sex as weapon to gain dominance but are forced by other motives than pure fun of sex to the deed in the first place.
The point is, if we look for a sadist 101 in one of the many variations to the subject, the pimps claim doesn't change a thing, in that point, I agree. But if we look for another kind of perpetrator, then this changes a lot. So the decision whether the profile hinges on this claim depends on what you have in the profile in the first place. Calling the pimp, being an older white dude using a little ebonics, those are things in contradiction with the classic torture idea. Because in that case, the unsub looks for the weakest target, also for the phone calls. That's the sister, not the pimp.

On another subject: What do you think about the victimology, especially appearance of the victims? This subject appears to be always avoided, regardless how often I try to get an opinion here. Four women, different in size, age, outer appearance, there is no type. Since Craigslist works like an a la carte restaurant, the killer was able to take his pick. So why them if they have nothing else in common but being on Craiglist like some thousand other escorts?

 

[Seaslug44]

Those seven were the ones to the sister. The calls to the pimp started later. But as I understood the articles dealing with the phone calls, the Mickey Mouse phone was found tracing one of the pimp calls.



That's the first time, I hear the version that Mickey Mouse was found in the client list. It was always reported in connection to the phone calls from Melissa's cell phone used by the killer. However, I will recheck when I find the time.



Nobody forces you to buy it, it's an estimation thing anyway. But I would estimate the urge of a guy to draw attention in a serial killer case whose business is to draw no attention as pretty low. Unless of course, he would try to prevent to become a suspect in the first place. The problem is, to believe him or not changes the whole profile.



Agreed in both points, Ebonics on an older white guy is hard to believe and thus, either the white or the older part must be wrong. Since I see the victimology similar to serial rapist cases I know, I tend to say, it's the white part that is wrong in here. You appear to tend to the age part. Unfortunately, we have nothing to pin a nail into that detail, so we have to leave it open for now.



Okay, lets join that play then. It would be estuary behavior as usually in all male mammals. Only to a exaggerated point, which includes also ownership of the female and even threatens the personal space. Which reinforces it, as you already said, from estuary behavior to generalized domination behavior. However, there is a sublt difference between power and control and the addition out of them is domination. This extreme domination behavior would indicate a narcissistic (NPD) complex or simply a big inferiority complex that needs over-compensation. Given the fact, that all four connected victims are white females but have otherwise not much in common as far as it comes to their appearance and that the pimp is also Caucasian, that paints a pretty ugly picture. Did you look up the Waldo guy?

We've been through this over and over again months ago in the older discussions. I do not have the desire (nor the time) to go back and dig up all of the actual references so you'll have to take the word of those of us who did the research. Here are the facts that you will uncover if you do the due dillegence;

• One of DOZENS of numbers on her cell phone were traced back to throw-away phones.
• ONE of the throwaway phones was even registered to the name "MICKEY MOUSE"
• The calls to the boyfriend/pimp were never substantiated by law enforcement as being harrassing phone calls.
• Law enforcement has never released a statement confirming or denying that they are aware what phone number the SK made those calls from. (so we do not know if the Mickey Mouse registered phone was the one used to call the pimp/boyfriend).

As far as motive for lying, about these calls, there is clearly an obvious reason;

What if the pimp/boyfriend KNOWS the serial killer on a friendly and/or business-related basis?

And what if he has received up to thirty "friendly" or business-related phone calls from the serial killer after his girl went missing (rather than tormenting)?

And what if he was afraid that the SK was sloppy and may have used the same throw-away phone (or the victim's phone) to make all of those calls to him?

Would not a perfect cover up to explain to police why the Serial Killer's phone number is on the pimp's phone records is to fabricate this nonsense story about the calls being tormenting?

Think about it!

 

[Peter Brendt]

We've been through this over and over again months ago in the older discussions. I do not have the desire (nor the time) to go back and dig up all of the actual references so you'll have to take the word of those of us who did the research. Here are the facts that you will uncover if you do the due dillegence;

• One of DOZENS of numbers on her cell phone were traced back to throw-away phones.
• ONE of the throwaway phones was even registered to the name "MICKEY MOUSE"
• The calls to the boyfriend/pimp were never substantiated by law enforcement as being harrassing phone calls.
• Law enforcement has never released a statement confirming or denying that they are aware what phone number the SK made those calls from. (so we do not know if the Mickey Mouse registered phone was the one used to call the pimp/boyfriend).

As far as motive for lying, about these calls, there is clearly an obvious reason;

What if the pimp/boyfriend KNOWS the serial killer on a friendly and/or business-related basis?

And what if he has received up to thirty "friendly" or business-related phone calls from the serial killer after his girl went missing (rather than tormenting)?

And what if he was afraid that the SK was sloppy and may have used the same throw-away phone (or the victim's phone) to make all of those calls to him?

Would not a perfect cover up to explain to police why the Serial Killer's phone number is on the pimp's phone records is to fabricate this nonsense story about the calls being tormenting?

Think about it!

So let me bring this to the point: You don't like thinking about the possibilities of other theories and therefore jump in and sell yours as fact with which I have now to agree. Because the last part of your sermon, beginning "there is one reason, he knows the SK" is pure assumption. From there, it goes to the calls (you otherwise claimed that they didn't even happen) were all friendly business calls from your resident SK. Yeah, right! And I really love this "perfect cover" part. Wouldn't it been a perfect cover for an SK to join some amateur boards and smack down any theory that could lead in another way than the usual already proven as wrong theories by insulting and arrogant posts? Tell me, Seaslug, wouldn't it?

 

[Peter Brendt]

I bet a Honda Ridgeback would be the perfect truck to dump those bodies in the bramble and not get stuck. That is one amazing truck!

Never had one, but I think, a Sierra all wheeler can do it too. Or a F-150. Doesn't look that steep ... wait are we really buying cars by their ability to drop bodies???

 

[bemo12]

Hello all,

After extensively reading the forums I decided to make a chart of some of the interesting points about each subject. I'll start with my personal prime suspect, the doctor.

Feel free to add more


Doctor Hackett-

- Suspicious Activity- Confirmed

o The phone calls to Gilbert’s family, including to the younger sister.
o Inconsistent story to the press.
o The strange letters to 48 hours.
o The odd timing of the cross country trip (possible to dispose of SG’s body)
o The fact that the area behind his house was to be renovated and he adamantly opposed this.
o The discovery of the 4 bodies in close proximity to his house.
o Everyone in the development seems to look up to him.


- Points in other direction

o Supposed alibi by wife for SG
o Missing leg might hinder strength needed
o Lives in tight-knit community
o Taunting phone calls from NYC don’t seem to tie to him
o Lives next to member of SCPD


- Other points of interest

o Daughter is a park ranger, also vivid artist
o Doesn’t seem to practice medicine anymore
o House was searched by LE
o Collection of Hemingway novel (I just find it an interesting choice of reading material)

 

[shadowraiths]

What do you think about the victimology, especially appearance of the victims?

Acutally, this is the primary reason I am leaning toward the outlier scenario. Simply bc there is not much notably in common between the victims. I do believe he has a type but I do not think it has to do with looks, or even age, for that matter. Moreover, while they may use social networking to connect to their marks, they do not use classifieds, online or otherwise. Nor do they pick up street walkers. The primary reason being, they are hunting for a particular type. Hence, their hunting ground is generally sex-related events. Said events can be anything from your G-rated meet and greets, to X-rated sex parties, and everything in between (i.e., classes, exhibits, clubs, etc). It is these sorts of places where they identify and case their marks. Outliers prefer sex parties and to some extent, sex clubs over the G-rated events. Primarily bc their prospective marks are unknowingly auditioning for them. The outlier not only gets to see their potential marks IRL, they see them in the raw... where they can evaluate other criteria. Except that, the criteria has nothing really to do with physique, body type, etcetera. They're looking for other stuff. For example, is she into kink? And if so, what kind? Is she an exhibitionist? Importantly, is she a screamer? That's the sort of thing outliers look for. And that is the sort of thing that cannot be truly discerned from online, or even over the phone, interaction.

 

[Peter Brendt]

Acutally, this is the primary reason I am leaning toward the outlier scenario. Simply bc there is not much notably in common between the victims. I do believe he has a type but I do not think it has to do with looks, or even age, for that matter. Moreover, while they may use social networking to connect to their marks, they do not use classifieds, online or otherwise. Nor do they pick up street walkers. The primary reason being, they are hunting for a particular type. Hence, their hunting ground is generally sex-related events. Said events can be anything from your G-rated meet and greets, to X-rated sex parties, and everything in between (i.e., classes, exhibits, clubs, etc). It is these sorts of places where they identify and case their marks. Outliers prefer sex parties and to some extent, sex clubs over the G-rated events. Primarily bc their prospective marks are unknowingly auditioning for them. The outlier not only gets to see their potential marks IRL, they see them in the raw... where they can evaluate other criteria. Except that, the criteria has nothing really to do with physique, body type, etcetera. They're looking for other stuff. For example, is she into kink? And if so, what kind? Is she an exhibitionist? Importantly, is she a screamer? That's the sort of thing outliers look for. And that is the sort of thing that cannot be truly discerned from online, or even over the phone, interaction.

Agreed in all points. But that makes the outlier a kind of stalker, only not in the daily life world but the club scene. However, over all cases I have seen in the past, visual appearance and be it by pic in the web was the first selection criteria before even outliers went into a more thorough checking. Which in itself was the reason, outliers or even SKs with a partial outlier behavior (for example Albright) either had a type or a very limited area as hunting ground. And the odds were always in type. Only sometimes the type can be very hidden, I agree to that. I had some hard time to figure it out with Alcala but then, he was a narcissist in the first place.

 

[Seaslug44]

So let me bring this to the point: You don't like thinking about the possibilities of other theories and therefore jump in and sell yours as fact with which I have now to agree. Because the last part of your sermon, beginning "there is one reason, he knows the SK" is pure assumption. From there, it goes to the calls (you otherwise claimed that they didn't even happen) were all friendly business calls from your resident SK. Yeah, right! And I really love this "perfect cover" part. Wouldn't it been a perfect cover for an SK to join some amateur boards and smack down any theory that could lead in another way than the usual already proven as wrong theories by insulting and arrogant posts? Tell me, Seaslug, wouldn't it?

Never said I did not like your theories. I was only confirming what others have already written about your misconception that someone with the phone registered to Mickey Mouse was making tormenting phone calls.

 

[Reannan]

Hey guys!!!! Been uber busy with RL stuff. Glad to see everyone is still here. This case can be - and MUST be solved! There will be... or has already been..... additional murders associated with this case. Keep up with the good work, and the vigilence. You guys are all awesome!

 

[Sillybilly]

Are we to believe that both Terry AND Amanda are wrong? They both believed the caller was a "white guy" (unless Terry somehow gleaned that information from Amanda prior to him speaking with LE).

It is interesting that Terry supposedly told LE he could pick out the house on LI that he used to drive Melissa to, but LE failed to take him up on that offer.

 

[Pinkhammer]

Did anyone watch "Blue Bloods" last night? Their case was about a serial killer of prostitutes gotten from a service like "Craig's List". The girl cop went undercover and caught the killers. It was the mother of a prostitute and her son. They were "saving" the girls from a life of sin.

Fiction, yes...but who knows?

 

[Sistah Sleuth]

I admittedly never bought the pimp's claim. After all, he claims an older "drunk" white male called him 30 times over a period of six months, and among other things, said, "I know where you be at." ( link ) Yeah, right. Older white males regularly resort to ebonic-like vernacular. Sure they do. For reference, from July 12th through August 26th, the killer made weekly calls to Melissa's little sister. Calls which LE confirmed, btw. Otherwise put, is the pimp's claim believable? Imnsho? Not in the least little bit.

I took "I know where you be at..." as the pimp paraphrasing what was said and not necessarily giving a direct quote.

 

[goathairjones]

I really don't think SCPD is taking this case seriously at all. I made a tip 2 weeks ago and there has been absolutely no indication that it was followed-up. I think I am going to turn it over to the FBI. Or maybe the private investigator for SG's disappearance.

 

[minazoe]

I sent a tip to Pat Brown, I hope she got it.