NY-LI 10 bodies found on Beach-Poss. SrlKlr-12/10-4 id'd; more found 3/11 #5

[twocuriouscats]

One thing that makes me think this isn't a pimp is the careful planning. I imagine pimps as being spontaneous and opportunistic. There are so many things that show this guy planned carefully. I watched a video of Joel Rifkin where he talks about reading about other serial killers. I would almost guarantee this guy did as part of his planning.

Hi Redbird,
I have to agree - there has been so much info re: SK's and their MO over the years, and how THEY GOT CAUGHT...I coulda been a SK operating for 20+ years, and I have read most books and lit on other SK's. Doesn't take much to figure this SK (and others with an oz of intelligence) would have "boned up" on the subject. (Bad pun)

 

[KAYTOM]

Has LE ever given any reason why they waited 7 months till they started searching for SG? Its seems like a giant window of opportunity was missed.

I've been following this for the past week and juggling some different theories.

At first I thought SG and the Other victims were related, but now I am not so sure . It just seems like it would be too risky to go after her. Its getting light out; its May, so more people are probably on the island, and there are a lot of witnesses. If the SK was affiliated w/ JB it would be really hard to pull off with out him knowing or neighbors seeing. Then you have the fact that police are coming and a gate to contend with.

It also seems like one of the witnesses has got to be lying, unless the SK lives in the neighborhood and was able to befriend her and offer her safe haven. Or she slipped and fell into the Ocean like GC said. Did the driver say he just gave up at the point where GC started talking to him? Also, do we know for a fact that PH saw her last?

There is also the fact that she is bipolar and hallucinations, delusions etc, are all possible with bipolar disorders.

Can anyone offer some insight into PH? I can't keep his part straight. Did he see her running? Did he call SG's mom? It kind of makes me wonder if the phone call part is fabricated by SG's family in an attempt to get the police to pay attention.

Is there any good breakdown of the phone call she had with the dispatcher? It thought I remember reading that the call ended w/ male voices in the background telling her to calm down. If the call did end abruptly then the slip into the ocean is more plausible.

 

[twocuriouscats]

BBM

Dead on about the power and control thing, imo. But I believe that also extends to sexual sadism. I believe he sees many girls, and most of them don't end up dead. If that's true, then which one's DO end up dead? The ones who somehow insult him...make him feel weak, rob him of his power and control. Maybe Melissa was the one that never cowered or begged, and so he couldn't get closure with her without making those calls.I think the compelling fantasy for him is to be what he isn't in his ordinary life...strong, domineering, in control, a bad *advertiser censored*. He's nothing like that in real life, imo.

Don't know if I'm 100% sold on what I just wrote...I'm thinking as I type, really.

I'm pretty much with u - but there is a possibility that her sis was seen by the perp...Many of the missing girls had contacts in the area of LI(for years maybe)...I think he lives in the LI area and works in NY. He may have known his vics b4...scary huh?

 

[kikid]

just reading through the Michael Taus thread, and this I found interesting....

posted by Seifert79

"Islip
I was born and raised in Islip, and still live very close by (my parents still live there too.) This case scares me to death, and Elmont is a very good distance away from Islip. As far as "Dog friendly" dates, the beach is a good theory, although there is a popular dog park in Bayshore (next door.) Any questions regarding the area, I'm happy to help! "

regarding the bolded above... perhaps he did meet someone at the beach and they saw something they should not have? how do the dates match up to this case? I'm going to go do a little research.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

Now you tell me.:waitasec:

Naw, I am not being serious and that's a very serious situation. I'd never click those sites. However, Miss Izzy who posts over on Crimes Against Kids is brave enough to do so. You ever need someone to get in there and reveal the most unimaginable things she's the woman to go to.

No thanks. Don't even want to hear second hand. I can handle just about anything consenting adults can throw at me, usually don't even pass judgement, but my mind would just come completely unglued if I stumbled upon a kiddie site.

 

[RiverRat]

Yep... officer Mallia and his amazing dog Blue were on a roll there in December. He also found the body of Nicole Tessa in Patchogue.

"In a matter of 10 days, a Suffolk police dog named Blue and his handler, Officer John Mallia, successfully discovered abandoned human remains in separate, prominent cases in Suffolk: the four still-unidentified bodies wrapped in burlap and dumped as long as two years ago off Ocean Parkway in Gilgo Beach, and Nicole Tessa, of Patchogue, who was found in the woods near..."

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/suffolk/canine-team-works-high-profile-crime-cases-1.2576378

This Dog has more than earned his diploma already!

Be careful out there, WebSleuthers...There is some Excellant work going on here and Hat's Off to all ~ especially those brave enough to go the extra mile.

RR

 

[twocuriouscats]

JMO Many girls have regular customers (did any work for businesses that accepted charge cards?) These girls are not streeters but if they were to run into a regular client while out and about, they probably would trust them and not call usual safety precations.
There are plenty of stalker -i'll save you -or - you'r dirt or- i want to be your friend -or the list goes on.
These girls are wise enough not to work without a safety system

Love it Nao, just what we've been thinking.

1) SG did all the right things to be as safe as she could
2) MW disappeared from a parking lot at a hotel in Hauppage (sp?) NY - they are all NOT outcalls (as some have said) IOW, some of the girls MAY HAVE /MUST HAVE been picked up on the street?
Here's the biggie: to quote you "if they were to run into a regular client while out and about, they probably would trust them..."
I think they may have known him - either as a regular john or maybe a friend/associate?
How about their connects for drugs - They should really look more deeply into that connection IMO ( methinks it's a regular who parties)
Pls correct if I'm wrong, but I think that's why Ridgeway was successful for so long...the girls had been with him b4 and not gotten hurt so they thought he was safe
Could be he has already seen/met MB's little sister...that's a possible reason for taunting her on the phone...
Forgive if we are blunt (yes, it is me and mom) but we are too old to "beat around the bush!) so creepy..I feel bad just writing this.

 

[artlover]

I'm sorry but I don't see any reason JB would be the SK. WHY would he hire an escort that would have a driver waiting for her just outside his house? or outside the gate which is only a short distance...its not like the driver doesn't know who JB is for goodness sake. It makes no sense whatsoever for him to do that if he was interested in killing someone and not being caught and that's obviously not the case with the SK.

 

[goathairjones]

just reading through the Michael Taus thread, and this I found interesting....

posted by Seifert79

"Islip
I was born and raised in Islip, and still live very close by (my parents still live there too.) This case scares me to death, and Elmont is a very good distance away from Islip. As far as "Dog friendly" dates, the beach is a good theory, although there is a popular dog park in Bayshore (next door.) Any questions regarding the area, I'm happy to help! "

regarding the bolded above... perhaps he did meet someone at the beach and they saw something they should not have? how do the dates match up to this case? I'm going to go do a little research.

Kikid,

If it was a dog date, then they definitely went to Gardiner's Park in West Bay Shore!

And if that is the case, he may have been summoned to the dog park by someone other than a blind date. I know that Michael Taus had a Pit Bull. And I know there is at least one very shady person at that park with Pit Bulls. I had a fight with one guy with tattoos who had 3 Pit Bulls and he was walking through the woods and they were unleashed. My daughter freaked out and I asked him to put his dogs on leashes. The guy came up to me and stared me down and said "If you got problem with me than do something about it!" He was looking to fight me right in front of my wife and kids. I just ignored him and kept on walking but I wonder if the Pit Bull thing has anything to do with Michael's disappearance.

This is a good angle to investigate. Thanks!

 

[Wondergirl]

Hi guys, new to posting, although I've been reading all your posts for a while. I think this guy started using Craigslist only in recent years. Maureen Brainard Barnes (2007)was last accounted for at Port Authority where she spoke to her friend over the phone and said she was headed home because she had been robbed. I think she encountered the SK there and saw the opporunity to perhaps recoup her losses. I don't think its a coincidence that 20 year old Jessica Taylor whose body was found in Manorville in 2003, was last seen at Port Authority as well. I think the SK used to troll that part of the city frequently or still does as well. Even though Taylor was dismembered and the four girls identified on Ocean Parkway were not. I think Taylor's head which was never found along with her hands might be among the remains that haven't been identified.

Thanks for your post, Draculette.

What you are saying here about the Port Authority is an interesting angle.

The only time have heard of the Port Authority, is because of 9/11.

Forgive my ignorance, but, what exactly does the Port Authority do?

Is there a connecting ferry to be taken to Long Island, and are there highways/bridges etc.?

If the escorts/victims are travelling back and forth using this method, then maybe the SK is familiar with them through this way?

Thank-you to the locals for any help, and please excuse the lack of knowledge here. Just trying to understand the locale.

 

[RIGHTEOUS1]

I thought this was interesting and I am no Fox fan.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/04/15/serial-killers/

 

[twocuriouscats]

JB is such a dirtbag! I just went by his house in West Islip and it is a MESS!! All of the houses on the block are in nice condition and keep their lawns nice and there landscaping is nice. But JB's house is a wreck. What is wrong with these people? They obviously have money with all of the properties they own and the liquor store. Why can't they keep their property clean?

OOOhhh, that's a clue!

From what I've read, most SK's are disorganized and sloppy. (but they can usually pull it together enough to hold a job).

 

[artlover]

Thanks for your post, Draculette.

What you are saying here about the Port Authority is an interesting angle.

The only time have heard of the Port Authority, is because of 9/11.

Forgive my ignorance, but, what exactly does the Port Authority do?

Is there a connecting ferry to be taken to Long Island, and are there highways/bridges etc.?

If the escorts/victims are travelling back and forth using this method, then maybe the SK is familiar with them through this way?

Thank-you to the locals for any help, and please excuse the lack of knowledge here. Just trying to understand the locale.

Hi the port authority oversees the ferries buses trains etc...but they are referring to the port authority bus station that sees about 7000 buses a day and over 200000 people go through..you can also go underground there to take the subway...

 

[artlover]

Hi the port authority oversees the ferries buses trains etc...but they are referring to the port authority bus station that sees about 7000 buses a day and over 200000 people go through..you can also go underground there to take the subway...

200 000 a day...its a mass of moving people every day...

 

[carbuff]

Saw that the other day and thought that one sad, sad, sad photograph. Who does that? At a funeral?

ALC's numbers were landlines? Belonging to one of those guys I bet.

Special thanks for all that work SR.

I can't get to the whole article because I'm not a subscriber. What's wrong with the photo?

 

[revampz]

Interesting Gus makes interesting comments in the video, that after he called 911 she ran and spotted a car looking for her, she ran and hid under the boat (which was in his yard) Gus stopped the vehicle and asked the guy what are you doing?

The man said we were having a party at brewers house and the young girl got upset and left, the man said he was trying to find her and bring her back. Gus told the man he had called the police already and they were on the way.
All of the sudden she took off again and he (the man) took off after her. (Reporter) While you were still talking to him? (Gus) Yeah

(Gus) So I walked up to the gate up to the gatehouse, when they arrived I let them in and I told them the last they went that way.

Gus goes on to what he thinks may have happened to her but it's a good video to watch.[/QUOTE/]


I still think this is where it all has happened. I know the LE have said that JB is not a suspect, but I have also seen cases where they have said that about others, who in fact were the main suspect but the LE did not want to publicize and spook main suspects into ceasing activities and going into hiding. I personally think it was one at this party and Shannan got away .......at first....way too many coincidences

 

[scandi]

I can't get to the whole article because I'm not a subscriber. What's wrong with the photo?

I can't find the link. We're doing good, eh? :floorlaugh:

 

[RIGHTEOUS1]

Has LE ever given any reason why they waited 7 months till they started searching for SG? Its seems like a giant window of opportunity was missed.

I've been following this for the past week and juggling some different theories.

At first I thought SG and the Other victims were related, but now I am not so sure . It just seems like it would be too risky to go after her. Its getting light out; its May, so more people are probably on the island, and there are a lot of witnesses. If the SK was affiliated w/ JB it would be really hard to pull off with out him knowing or neighbors seeing. Then you have the fact that police are coming and a gate to contend with.

It also seems like one of the witnesses has got to be lying, unless the SK lives in the neighborhood and was able to befriend her and offer her safe haven. Or she slipped and fell into the Ocean like GC said. Did the driver say he just gave up at the point where GC started talking to him? Also, do we know for a fact that PH saw her last?

There is also the fact that she is bipolar and hallucinations, delusions etc, are all possible with bipolar disorders.

Can anyone offer some insight into PH? I can't keep his part straight. Did he see her running? Did he call SG's mom? It kind of makes me wonder if the phone call part is fabricated by SG's family in an attempt to get the police to pay attention.

Is there any good breakdown of the phone call she had with the dispatcher? It thought I remember reading that the call ended w/ male voices in the background telling her to calm down. If the call did end abruptly then the slip into the ocean is more plausible.

You Bring up all the points we do not get. The simplest being why did it take LE so long to get to SG last known location? A few things SG Sister said I think are important. SG never ever behaved this way before. that doesn't mean she could not have had some kind of Breakdown that night if you believe in coincidences, I don't. Has anyone asked LE why it took them so long to start a proper investigation? The Call made by someone claiming to be a DR from SG last known is really strange. I keep coming back to we must know less then we think. If we only know X percent of what's going on it's impossible to come to any kind conclusions. Which drives me nuts, none of it makes any sense at this point.

 

[scandi]

You Bring up all the points we do not get. The simplest being why did it take LE so long to get to SG last known location? A few things SG Sister said I think are important. SG never ever behaved this way before. that doesn't mean she could not have had some kind of Breakdown that night if you believe in coincidences, I don't. Has anyone asked LE why it took them so long to start a proper investigation? The Call made by someone claiming to be a DR from SG last known is really strange. I keep coming back to we must know less then we think. If we only know X percent of what's going on it's impossible to come to any kind conclusions. Which drives me nuts, none of it makes any sense at this point.

I think the time for response was due to the dispatcher having to call a marine PD officer and it took half an hour for him to get to the site. Who is dispatched to a call at what time is pretty well worked out between the counties. Even tho there might have been an officer closer by, he might not have been the proper one to send on the call. Really different IMO I read that on a cop site that was posted here.

 

[carbuff]

I can't find the link. We're doing good, eh? :floorlaugh:

Yeah. It might be bedtime.

This is the link: http://www.newsday.com/long-island/suffolk/gilgo-victim-a-natural-helper-1.2664602

But the only photo I can see is a couple of Amber's friends with a scrapbook of photos of her. It's very said but there's nothing creepy or unusual about it. Very very sad, is all.